Actually Staff Attorneys have all the same credentials as associates. We are all JDs, all passed at least one bar exam, etc. We just aren't associates. We also DO get in trouble, possibly more than associates, because $hit flos down hill, so if a partner comes down on an associate, the associate scape goats us. It just happened to me in fact. And even worse, the associates expect us to be here the same just as much as they are despite the fact that we don't get their salary, or even close to it. Associates get the big bucks at big law to be available 24/7. Staff Attorneys are only paid for human availability usually. So before anyone says staff attorneys don't have associate credentials, you best think twice. At my firm more than half the staff attorneys have more experience than most associates.

Often they help out with large-scale document review. Some firms rely upon them very heavily. They occupy an ambiguous space in between "associate" and "paralegal."

A staff attorney is somewhat like a non-partner track associate. Every firm uses them differently. In general, the work is limited to litigation matters, specifically document review and production. Staff attorneys will take over the dreaded jobs of document review, contract attorney supervision and the like. Occasionally the work is more substantive, but it tends to be in the discovery arena most of the time.

Staff attorneys are licensed just like associates and partners. They are full fledged attorneys. They are just not associates. They get paid considerable less than associates, while often working just as many hours.

Another faction of attorneys who resent big-firm associates surfaces during bonus week... how interesting.

I think by "credentials," Lat means something else beyond whether you have a JD. If you're an associate at Wachtell, most likely you either went to Harvard or Yale, or you went to one of five other law schools and were in the top 5 in your class during 2L recruiting season. A staff attorney at Wachtell certainly has a JD, but might not have similar "credentials."

I always had the impression that staff attorneys didn't work the same hours as associates at most places. Is that not so?

On the other hand, staff attorneys don't appear to be as limited by the oppressive rules of sentence structure, spelling, and punctuation.

another notable attribute of many (read: all) staff attorneys is the mind-boggling desire to hold a job with essentially no upward mobility.

sure, after a few years, a staff attorney might graduate to "senior" status, but essentially, the position is one that leads nowhere. to be sure, no staff attorney ever becomes an associate.

therefore, staff attorneys can only be perceived as a gluttons for punishment lacking the ambition (or good sense) to get a real job.

another notable attribute of many (read: all) staff attorneys is the mind-boggling desire to hold a job with essentially no upward mobility.

sure, after a few years a staff attorney might graduate to "senior" status, but essentially, the position is one that leads nowhere.

to be sure, no staff attorney ever becomes an associate.

therefore, staff attorneys can only be perceived as a gluttons for punishment lacking the ambition (or good sense) to get a real job.

Actually, I know a staff attorney who was "promoted" to associate.

you do not.

and, please do not call me "Actually."

I also know a staff attorney who was promoted to associate. After three conseccutive years of billing the most hours in the (300 attorney) firm, they were promoted to first-year associate!

Why would a staff attorney want to do that? I don't see "promotion" as an SA's goal in life.

Most of the staff attorneys I know do the job because it's a good way to make $$$ while keeping reasonable hours (at least in theory). Many of them have outside interests that they pursue, which regular associates would not have the time to do (e.g., writing, acting, film, etc.).

well, as is sometimes said: "the sun even shines on a dog's ass now and then."

nothwithstanding the small percentage of staff attorneys who have successfully crossed over and become associates, staff attorney positions remain, at best, for the unmotivated, and, in far more cases than not, for the talentless.

such employment should be avoided assiduously.

Why the heck would you want to be a biglaw staff attorney? It sounds like you would have to deal with all the pricks with "credentials", work the same hours, deal with the same stress and not be compensated for it. If you are "licensed" and have actual skills, why not go work for a smaller firm and actually take control of your life? You'd probably make good money and you would have a chance at success. Or, why not go in-house somewhere?

For some context...see this listing from the Paul, Weiss webpage:

Paul, Weiss staff attorneys are hired on an as-needed basis to assist with specific assignments. Staff attorneys initially sign three-month contracts, which are renewable depending on their performance and the needs of the assignment.

The starting salary for staff attorneys is $87,500. Staff attorneys are evaluated biannually and are eligible for merit-based bonuses.

Staff attorneys also receive the following benefits: medical, dental, disability, and life insurance; 401(k); bar registration; American Express Corporate Card; health club reimbursement; training (firm-sponsored CLE, PLI, Lexis/Westlaw, etc.); business cards; firm holidays and vacation time; and inclusion in department and firm events.

Paul, Weiss is currently accepting applications for staff attorney positions in our New York and Washington, D.C., offices.

Candidates for New York positions must be admitted to practice in the State of New York.

Who cares if staff attorneys have J.D.'s and have passed the bar? They're just document monkeys who are stuck in BigLaw purgatory doing glorified paralegal work. Anyone who would rather be a staff attorney at Paul Weiss versus being a real associate at a mid-size or a small firm (which, gasp, might actually mean looking beyond NYC) is insane and probably deserves the long hours, shitty pay, and diminished career prospects.

There are no doubt crappy staff-attorney jobs and less crappy staff-attorney jobs. Some people just want to make a 9-5 living, and make a calculation that in exchange for the money, they'd rather have the autonomy to pick their own hours to do document review, be able to take vacations, and have a life outside the office. It's considerably less stressful to be a fungible cog without a Blackberry. Not a life I'd choose for myself, and the dead-end thing would make me nuts, but I could see the appeal if I had kids and didn't aspire to more than low six digits a year. You always see these polls saying associates would trade X less salary for Y fewer hours, well, staff attorneys are actually living that dream.

For the most part, though, the revealed preferences are pretty clear; associates don't see staff-attorney jobs; staff-attorneys take associate jobs on the rare occasions they're offered; the sorting mechanism is pretty indicative of where people's skills are, though there are certainly outliers.

A lot of staff attorneys have outside interests that they're pursuing - e.g., painting, acting, writing - as I mentioned in my earlier comment. Many are far more "interesting" people than those of us who are regular associates.

But if you're a staff attorney at a firm that doesn't respect the limitations on your time, then you're getting the worst of both worlds. You get the hours and stress of an associate gig, but without the pay and prestige.

In that case, you should probably start looking for a staff lawyer position somewhere else.

Or if that's not possible, maybe you need to make a clear decision to pursue your legal career OR your outside interest full-time (instead of splitting the baby, trying to have it both ways, etc.).

God forbid someone who failed at (but presumably did try) getting a biglaw job went on to take and pass the bar! What was he/she thinking?!

What an idiot! Only high LSAT scorers should be allowed to enter - or strive to enter - the oh so prestigious world of biglaw, where you deserve the big bucks for being available, unlike everyone else. Those fools.

Do you all really think like this? I'm astounded...

I would not want anyone who didn't get a high LSAT score to be my attorney, unless I was the plaintiff in some personal injury case in a hick town.

To "Wow," was the LSAT really that hard for you? Wow.

I am a staff attorney at the biggest of the big law. You may now gasp in astonishment that we can not only read, but type and spell as well. (Did I mention that we occasionally rhyme as well?)

In my case a staff attorney position at big law seemed preferable to an associate position at a med or small firm. I make less than an associate; but, I only make less than a big law associate. As a first year I will earn between 120 and 130, depending on my ending bonus. That's not to shabby.

I work long hours, it's true. In many cases longer than the associates. I may not get the prestige or the pay, but at least, in the end, I'm not a prick.

Things must be different in NY than it is in LA. I am a 1st year staff attorney at a big law firm. I make more than a 3rd or 4th year associate here because of overtime and double time. The first year I made $175,000 and this year I will make around $190,000. How much I make is completely up to me. I can work 20 hours some weeks or I can work 80 hours other weeks. No one tells me what to do. Actually they ask politely if I have the time to help them out. I work from home at least 2-4 days a week. Show up at whatever time I like. Every year I get a raise, a bonus, and a 401k match. Best of all, my life is stress free. No one to anwer to or kiss ass. I can get substantive work or just busy billing work. Just depends on how aggressive I am at pursuing it. I do admit, however, when you can get paid this kind of money for doing such easy tasks, one tends to take the easy tasks. This is the downfall of my job. It is too confortable. I am torn. Should I take a less paying but more stressful job at a mid-size firm and start my career or just keep living the lazy rich dream?

Which firm do u work for?

I've been out of the law for about 10 years (before that I was an associate at large law firms). I'm now working in IT, but extremely bored with it.

Ite seems like Staff Attorney at a large firm is one of the few options available to me. I'm not gettting lots of bites on associate positions at most firms, as they look askance at my 10 year absence from practicing.

Anyone see an issue with using the Staff Attorney position to obtain a foothold in the law again?

If I hate it, I can at least see being more successful in moving on to another, smaller firm (as a full-fledged associate), once I have worked as a Staff Attorney for a while.

Is anyone out there a staff attorney in the Boston area and can you share your experiences?

I'm curious about staff attorney experiences at big firms in Texas. As far as I have heard, here, a staff attorney only bills slightly less hours and makes slightly less than an associate. I also know that the firms here are interested in candidates with better "credentials" than say a mid or small-sized firm would be. Any thoughts?

Has it occured to those of you deriding staff attorneys that many of them don't plan to do the job forever? A post grad job search can take months so why not take a staff attorney position to pay the bills while you look for the permanent job? This is coming from a TT graduate with a gpa just a shade under the magical 3.0 (2.9).

And lets be serious, biglaw attorneys are in it for the paycheck too, if they really wanted to practice law they'd take DA positions instead of sitting in an office copying and repasting text from old purchase agreements all day for the first 5 years of their careers. Staff attorneys may not get much respect but its not as if first year associates get the royal treatment.

Ironically I first learned about opportunities as a staff lawyer from an associate who used to be a staff lawyer. I wouldn't bet the farm on transitioning a staff attorney position into a biglaw associate position (I can imagine how annoying biglaw lawyers find brownosing staff attorneys) but who says you can't move onto to a federal agency or a smaller firm after a little while?

Can anyone share their experience as a staff attorney in the Seattle area? What is the difference between a staff attorney and a contract attorney in the northwest region?