First WGWAG.

Is London or Manhattan cheaper?

So, should NYC salaries be a floating rate based on USD to GBP exchange rate? Anyone want to invest their salary in a currency derivative?

NY to £96,000!

This will not make London more attractive due to the cost of living and cultural issues. However, it will push NY salaries up. Over the last decade we have seen more and more firms have standard pay rates across all domestic offices. Hence, a pay raise in one market (usually Silicon Valley or NY) created upward pressure across all other offices (Chicago, D.C., etc.). Over the next decade, it will conform internationally (perhaps with the exception of Asia where no one is doing a lot of business).

Apparently, no, since London is 26% more expensive than New York.

http://money.cnn.com/2007/06/15/pf/most_expensive_cities/index.htm

Cultural issues? If anything, cultural issues, as in the presence of, makes London more attractive by far.

£90K will get you about as far in London as $90K in NYC...

The London pay raise is interesting because it seems to imply some correlation between cost of living and salary levels, a topic of much debate on this blog and elsewhere.

Who is the idiot who said no one is doing business in Asia? I guess China is not largest exporter to the U.S. I guess American companies are no longer aggresively trying to penetrate the world's largest market. I guess nothing is made in Taiwan anymore.

"Cultural issues? If anything, cultural issues, as in the presence of, makes London more attractive by far."

what does this mean, NYC has no culture?

$180,000 in London is like making $90,000 in NYC. the cost of living over there is insane.

Atlanta to £17,246.55!

Yeah, that cultural issues comment is odd. I haven't lived in London, but given its history, I'd suspect it at least matches if not betters NYC on that scene. And its also better located. In London you can get on a train heading south and a couple hours later you're in Paris. In NYC you can get on a train heading south and a couple hours later you're in Philly.

i like cheese

The leading causes of death in the United States are:

1. Heart Disease
2. Chuck Norris
3. Cancer

PH please be a national firm and raise your only office not at 160K.

Yes that office is Atlanta.

Chicago to £100,000!!!

Merck is a God...

NYC has no culture. Guys from Jersey scratching themselves and Yankees games aren't culture.

Charles Bronson could kick Chuck Norris's ass.

then don't hang out in the meatpacking district, 4:36. or, on second thought, stay there.

Anyone have advice on how a recent grad/current fed'l clerk goes about applying for a job in London? Do you apply to the NYC office or directly to London?

4:00 pm -- I'm pretty sure the "no one" in the comment about no one doing business in Asia was a reference to law firms, not businesses in general. Calm down. (And yes, I know global firms have been opening many offices in Asia, but they're not really making much of a dent there yet).

The "cultural issues" comment -- it's a vague comment at best. I certainly wouldn't read it to mean that the poster was saying London has a lack of cultural attractions. So again, relax people. If anything, I would say there are some "law firm culture" issues that make moving from US to London difficult.

And, please don't be so d*ckless as to make the "NY has no culture" comments.

4:19, if you're trying to argue that London's in a better location, you're doing nothing to strengthen your arg by comparing Paris to Philly. Paris sucks. Philly rocks.

Clearly, the Paul Hastings Transformers cameo is paying dividends.

Perhaps we'll see Mayer Brown rehabilitate itself in next summer's blockbuster Batman sequel?

Let's not forget that London (or some place nearby) gave us the Spice Girls and Mr. Bean.

Cheyenne Wyoming to 60k!

TRANSFORMERS!

MORE THAN MEETS THE EYE!

TRANSFORMERS!

ROBOTS IN DISGUISE!

My cat's breath smells like cat food.

My law firm plays a cameo in a porn flick.

You're all right, La Russo.

London has always been more attractive as a place to live than New York. New York is the pale imitation; London is the Real Deal. Plus, their accents are a billion times more pleasant.

My cat's breath smells like pussy.

Do you get it? Like PUSSY! You know, because it's a cat?

HA HA HA!

London's expensive, dreary and full of pasty looking, fat people with a chip on their collective shoulders about US power and influence.

how come cost of living is only taken into account when it is the difference between london and new york? new york has a much higher cost of living than all the other us cities that have jumped to 160k.

what is a NQ? And what are trainees? Trainees get paid practically nothing. Are NQs the equivalent of people a year or two out of law school?

What are horse shoes?

Are their horse socks?

Is anyone listening to me?

Heheh...lesbians.

Funny how lots of people are picking on London for the alleged cost of living, yet everyone here feels comfortable working in NY despite it having a much higher cost of living than the other states who also pay 160k.

This double standard talk makes me think that the arguments against London are simply brought up in a pale attempt to feel comfortable, instead of it being a real decisive factor in choosing where to work. This impression I have is reinforced by the lame arguments brought up (such as the criticism on British culture).

Before bitching about the cost of living in London and everything, you need to sit down one minute and think.

Normally you will not spend your whole salary. If you get £90k, you will probably set aside something like £45 at least (half of your salary).

With the current exchange rate, 1£ will go a long way to reimburse your debt in $. You just need to save £45.000 to pay back a $90.000 debt.

In NY, saving half of your salary would only bring you 80k, which is much less.

The bottom line is that you have more money in the bank.

So I think that a junior US lawyer would be a fool not to consider London.

7:13
A junior US lawyer can't consider London. It's the British lawyers that get paid that amount, not US lawyers in London. I assume US lawyers get the US salary + a cost of living adjustment.

4:45 said,

"Anyone have advice on how a recent grad/current fed'l clerk goes about applying for a job in London? Do you apply to the NYC office or directly to London?"

I'd like to know too. Does anyone know?

Oh, don't get your knickers in a twist.

First, the reference to cultural issues doesn't mean I think London lacks culture. I meant that working at a British firm or working in the London office of an American firm presents different cultural issues. There are things I could say to a U.S. lawyer that wouldn't be interpreted as much, whereas if I said the same thing to a British lawyer, it would be a declaration of war. Terminology is different. Work styles are different (in my humble opinion, British lawyers tend to be more collaborative, less bombastic). These are issues that you have to really consider. Its not like going from the New York office of Latham to the New York office of Weil (I work at neither). Yes, there are different corporate cultures at both firms but its a whole different ballgame going from Latham's New York office to Latham's London office (I assume they have one).

Second, as to Asia, there are a lot of firms that have recently or over the past decade set up offices in Japan, China, Singapore, etc. To my knowledge, none are bringing in big dough like a London office can. Yes, some firms like Sullivan have pulled off major deals but its not like Asian offices are bringing in serious dough or can charge huge fees. I don't picture this changing anytime soon.

Third, COL in London vs. New York is a real issue. Its not a double standard in a way that a person makes a choice about practicing in New York vs. Toledo. New York and Toledo have huge differences in their legal market. So, one chooses New York, even with a higher cost of living for the experience. London and New York have similar legal markets so COL becomes one of the decisive factors whereas in the choice between New York or Toledo (or Chicago, D.C., Atlanta, L.A. etc.) it has a lot more to do with what kind of legal market do you want to play in. If I wanted to practice corporate or bankruptcy, I woudn't go to a D.C. office. If I wanted to practice food and drug law, I wouldn't work in New York.

Finally, there is another major factor: British cuisine is horrible. (Sorry lads, I couldn't resist.) I don't mean just bad. I mean its the worst on the planet (granted London has fabulous restaurants so you don't have to eat British food all the time). Unless, of course, you're into spotted dick.

4:42 -- Charles Bronson might be able to kick Chuck Norris's ass, but Chuck Norris's ass would then clamp down on Bronson's foot, subsequently killing Bronson as the force of Chuck Norris's gluteous fleximous rippled through Bronson's body.

If peeing your pants is cool then call me Miles Davis.

Too bad London is the shittiest city in the world. You'd have to pay me 1 million pounds a year to work in London, so I could live in Paris and afford a private jet to shuttle me to and from work every day.

"Anyone have advice on how a recent grad/current fed'l clerk goes about applying for a job in London? Do you apply to the NYC office or directly to London?"

You can do both ways. Obviously if you already have a foot in the door with the NYC office, you can ask them about London then. You can also just apply to London office directly, or do both.

"Too bad London is the shittiest city in the world. You'd have to pay me 1 million pounds a year to work in London, so I could live in Paris and afford a private jet to shuttle me to and from work every day."

Seconded. London is awful.

You are either number 1 or not.
NYC is GREAT, but the NY firm need to step up or step aside.
If you are worried about COL, work in Atlanta.

Last!

Matt 19:30 But many [that are] first shall be last; and the last [shall be] first.

Matt 20:16 So the last shall be first, and the first last: for many be called, but few chosen.

so I'm FIRST!

Confirmed! S&C to $190,000 in all offices!

One of the nice things about London is that you can be drunk ALL the time. The culture almost mandates it, actually.

(Also, it seems getting laid's a lot easier there too -- See prior paragraph -- and not all the girl's look like they were reared on chips and burgers.)

I can't believe I put that apostrophe in there. I'm obviously drinking too much. Perhaps because I spend so much time in London.

White Merck With Asian Girls

God, there are some idiots on this board. London's a great city, but it's a hell of a lot more expensive than New York. Not that that has anything to do with the higher salaries.

The higher salaries are a result of US firms not being able to hire any English lawyers because with the weak dollar, there is practically no difference between the salaries paid at US firms and those paid at UK firms, and English lawyers aren't inclined to go to US firms without a financial incentive.

A NQ is a newly qualified lawyer, about equivalent to a first year associate. Trainees are roughly equivalent to people in law school in the US, since law is an undergraduate degree in the UK (you can also become a lawyer if you did your undergrad degree in something else, but you have to do an extra year's "conversion" course).

It's just a different country, that's all. I love it here, but if you expect tumble dryers, air conditioning and customer service, stay in the US.

Trainees in London (at City firms, so equivalent to Biglaw) will be on about $72k and NQs $130K. US firms obviously pay a lot more than that
the COL in London is high but when it comes to property, although it's expensive there are loads of areas nowhere near central London which are nice and affordable. Very few people live in the centre of town. And if those salaries seem low to US lawyers, the minimum salary for a trainee lawyer in London is c.$35k and there are a lot of 'high street' firms who pay that.

London is the worst city on earth.

Any truth to 10:22pm or is it just another ridiculous post?

Any truth to 8:17?! Holy shit!!!

You know why I hate this firm? They put "Hastings" in italics. Seriously, that's reason enough.