BEND OVER NOW! THIS NEW CANDY IS MAKING ME RANDY

My friend got a package from Goodwin Procter and thought it was going to be something cool. Unfortunately, when he opened it he found earbud headphones from the 99 cent store with Goodwin emblazoned on them.

The worst has got to be the firms that send "free songs" from those awful promo music websites. To get two songs, you have to register, use your "points", download some program, restart computer, then get songs. On top of all that, all the rap songs are edited and clean versions.

Also, Nixon Peabody, we know that you spent a lot of money producing that song, but 64mb usb drives??? Is it 1996? You can get a 256mb in the checkout line at Target for $2.99. At least some firms stepped it up with 1 or 2GB.

We need to compile a spreadsheet of what each firm gives out at screening, callback, and offer stages.

NO we really don't need to compile a spreadsheet of what freebies each firm gives out.

Who really cares? Are your lives that meaningless that there are entire articles written about a small plant that a law firm gives out? Or do you really care about what size USB drive you get, as if that is really indicative of the quality of the law firm?

Get a life.

Shearman and Sterling just sent iPod shuffles (the new model) to all of the summer class (not the offerees; those who actually summered there this past summer).

9:47 - I heard that some firms give you an opportunity of employment with the booty. How you will grow and develop your career in that job should be the main concern (not the size or quality of the goody bag).

killjoys and nits,

are you that dense that you actually think people base decisions off of these things?

It's free stuff. It'd be cool to know who gives what. That's it.

Stop hating fun.

I haven't accepted my permanent offer yet after summering -- so in an effort to get me to accept, my firm has flown me into town twice. On the last occasion, they bought me an iPhone (the first time I was there, I had mentioned how my friend bought one and I was thinking of doing the same).

Then again, I'm T5, electrical engineering degree, and worked for the USPTO for 4 years before law school.

9:47, say it ain't so. The IPod speakers I got from Goodwin were some of the best interview swag I had. They also sent mugs, playing cards and gift cards. 99c headphones? I hope that's an exaggeration.

9:57 & 9:58,

Please get over yourselves. This is just harmless fun.

10:14,

i don't buy it.

10:16,

he might have gotten cool stuff, and it doesn't matter since he said he's likely accepting their offer anyways (plus the offer dinner is at his favorite place).

Enjoy your iphone. It was paid for with the blood, sweat and tears of your future former colleagues...

I find it so ironic that these little "touches" that the law firms send to show that they "care" abruptly end the moment you are hired. Don't law firms get it? Rather than treating your summers with such kid gloves maybe they should concentrate on keeping the producers happy - with more pay and more appreciation.

Showering all of this attention on someone who has yet to make a dime for the law firm as an associate makes me physically ill!

10:22,

Were you physically ill when you were getting these gifts before you joined your firm?

ATL = XOXO

10:22,

It's an obvious game that we play. We know the'yre full of it when they talk about work/life balance, but we gladly eat it up in exchange for the awesome summer programs.

We aren't qualified to do anything, and they're certainly not going to have us do clerical work for the whole summer since we'd run and never look back, so this is what they're left with.

Could we get a little consistency with the ampersands, S&C?

Tacky!

It looks terrible to see two entirely different ampersands gracing the tree medallion and the candy tin.

LAME!

I want a Bonsai!!!!!!!!!!! Damnit!

I don't blame the associates, but the firms. I'd rather give you a real glimpse at associate life rather than some fantasy that no firm will uphold.

10:24, fortunately, I lateraled in from a government position in 2000 so the only gift I got was a pile of documents to review. Again, I don't blame the associates but find it rather silly that the firms think that law students are so stupid to believe that the law firm "cares" about them by showering them with gifts. The statistics bear me out - a full third of associates hired will be gone in 3 years or less from the date of hire. If you really want to know how much the firm cares, ask them how many of the associates hired in the 2003 class are still with the firm. That is the gift that will show you whether the firm cares about its folks.

Atlanta to Bonsai's!!!!

10:35: chill out. if firms gave a glimpse at what associate life was really like, nobody would join. this is how it works. live with it. sorry you were not pampered, but don't hate on those who were.

hunton & williams gave excellent nalgenes (700ml, with narrow necks) AND $10 itunes gift cards to all interviewees.

nixon gave another flash drive at the interview (in addition to the oci ones).

but did these places give me offers? noooo. oh well.

10:20, was it at the Federalist? :)

10:38, I guess I am a little bit bitter. I've had to "mentor" my fair share of associates who the firm heavily recruited only to see them leave once they "learned up". It just tends to build up the false expectation that this biglaw firm is "different". No big law firm is that different from the basic model. They didn't get to where they are by handing out Ipods.

I don't blame the law students - only the firms for not being more honest and up front to the students. I'd rather tell them if you join us, you will work extremely hard, find it frustrating, and difficult. You will have to sacrifice your family life, but you will be paid very well. And after being here a few years, you will develop the skills, talents and temperment to be eligible to be a partner. The goal is if you invest 8 years, you will probably become partner and then have what resembles a real life.

10:14 - Is working at USPTO as bad as GAO made it sound? Sounds worse than Skadden....

look, firms send stuff because it makes a difference - it's kind of like thank you cards to someone for wedding gifts - the thank you card isn't going to make you like them anymore or (likely) any less - but still, it all leaves an impression.

personally, what's the harm??? for a lot of us arts/social sciences grads who DIDN'T go to IVY league-type schools (including my no-name Canadian university) and who DIDN'T get the chance to do two-years of high profile Management Consulting or Investment Banking or Working at High Profile International/Governmental position as an 'intern'/junior associate, the recruiting process is the first time anyone has made us feel valuable (as in we have the power to make serious money for them some day). It feels good! You're like, wow, my decision to do philosophy instead of marketing and supply-chain management didn't turn out to be a total waste of my once-idealistic life.

Pshaw(!!) to those who would take that joy away.

11:23, if you want to be loved, by a puppy.

I'd rather run the firm like the Marine corps not the air force.

11:28,

You can run the firm like the Marine Corps, but even the Marines take recruits out for lunch, (at McDonald's, I should know). Last I heard, BigLaw cannot institute a draft.

Arrrrrrr, surrender the booty, matey!

11:28, "by" a puppy? Buy a dictionary.

11:23, I couldn't agree more. I was elated when I received an iPod Shuffle back in January as a pre-summer welcome/winter gift. If only we received post-summer "glad you've accepted our offer" gifts...

"The goal is if you invest 8 years, you will probably become partner and then have what resembles a real life."

Invest eight years -- to "probably" become partner? to have "what resembles" a real life?

What a fantastic investment of eight years, without even quibbling about whether an associate will EVER become partner.

Re 10:49 -- Don't kid yourself. Being a BigLaw partner isn't as easy as you'd hope (I know - I've been one for 10 years now). It's better than being a BigLaw associate, but it still means late nights, weekends, travel, etc.

Even those of us with sizable books of business still have to work - the work may be "client development", but if it means I can't be with my spouse & kids, it's work.

Yes, I get paid more. Yes, I have somewhat more control over my life. And yes, I'd rather be in my shoes than be a 2nd year associate again.

But if you're going into this for the money alone, do us all a favor: leave now.

Shearman actually gave out the ipods to summer associates over the summer. The actual associates got I-Phones too.

12:01 I'll tell you where you can stick that Ipod Shuffle! :P

10:49, get rid of the part about being "paid very well" (you'll have to work finance to get that), and the part about having something resembling a normal life as a partner (though the partners are at least well-paid), and then I think you have it mostly right. Oh yeah, and also replace "you will probably make partner" with "you will have at most a 20% chance of making partner." I think I'm done now -- but make sure I see the next draft before it goes out.

Oh, will you stop boo-hooing, 1:59, your meager biglaw salary? OK, you are not making bank like your hedgie cousins, but check the census figures - you are in the top 3% by income, even as a first year.

What the hell is up with Dale & Thomas popcorn. I've known other Biglaw firms to send out that stuff to future Summers.

Looks like Dale & Thomas may have cornered the market.

When you think about it, there's a ton of money Biglaw spends on "gifts" that are usually of the caliber reserved for that distant relative at Christmas time whose name you don't remember. I guess someone has to keep the random business models in business.

That medallion stuck in the bonsai pot is one of the tackiest things I've ever seen. (The juxtaposition of ugly 1980s-looking corporate logoing with an item meant to connote (and give rise to) serenity and contemplation is more than a little funny--and makes S&C look like clueless ogres (maybe this was Krautheimer's idea).) Obviously, the first thing anyone's going to do with the medallion is discard it, so really--what was the point?

10:49, get rid of the part about being "paid very well" (you'll have to work finance to get that), and the part about having something resembling a normal life as a partner (though the partners are at least well-paid), and then I think you have it mostly right. Oh yeah, and also replace "you will probably make partner" with "you will have at most a 20% chance of making partner." I think I'm done now -- but make sure I see the next draft before it goes out.

The point is one that I would have thought was relatively noncontroversial -- if you're in it for the money, don't go to law school. You'll make enough to live semi-comfortably, but you will never be rich. Go into law if you want to be a lawyer; otherwise, if you've got the brain for it, go into finance.

2:07, what relevance do *national* income figures have to me? I do not live in Kansas. I do know that, even with my wife and I *both* working as biglaw associates, we cannot afford to buy an apartment in San Francisco (because the housing market is driven through the roof by (a) a bunch of people that made real money (i.e., not the petit bourgeois petty cash we toil for) in the tech boom, (b) 25 year-olds in finance who make more than big law partners, and (c) the japanese and hong kong uber-rich who are snapping up third and fourth homes here because of the weak dollar).

The point is one that I would have thought was relatively noncontroversial -- if you're in it for the money, don't go to law school. You'll make enough to live semi-comfortably, but you will never be rich. Go into law if you want to be a lawyer; otherwise, if you've got the brain for it, go into finance.

Sorry for the weird half-double post -- I inadvertently hit the "back" button on my browser somewhere in there.

"The point is one that I would have thought was relatively noncontroversial -- if you're in it for the money, don't go to law school. You'll make enough to live semi-comfortably, but you will never be rich. Go into law if you want to be a lawyer; otherwise, if you've got the brain for it, go into finance."

That's good advice, except that modern law firms can't decide if they want to be law firms or businesses, and accordingly the demographics of the associate classes are schizophrenic and confused, at best. It USED to be the case that you went to law school and then became a lawyer; today you go to law school and then become a wage slave until you can't take it anymore. Those of us who hoped to get decent jobs doing work we found rewarding and intellectually stimulating, and still make enough to afford a mortgage, wasted 100k and three years of our 20s.

Part of the problem is that the middle class is all but dead. Just because I like beating dead horses, if you live in Denver or Houston and make 160k, you're sitting pretty. But those of us on the coasts are significantly worse off. Yes, we're in the "top 5%" income-wise, but that doesn't mean we're rich. We're solidly (upper) middle class. What's terrifying is the fact that SO FEW Americans are even middle class anymore. In fact, THIS sort of problem is why a lot of us went to law school -- to ensure justice for all. Unfortunately, in order to do so, we ourselves must become the paupers whose rights we intended to fight for.

Maybe I'll move to the mountains,

You really should move to the mountains to get some clarity, because living in the city has obviously clouded your view of reality. A person making $160 straight out of law school in a major city is not a "wage slave." Making minimum wage cleaning toilets might make you a wage slave, but sitting in a friggin office all day and staring at a computer screen does not.

Ditto 4:48. "Mountains" is a douche bag. Just because prepping accordions for closing is not exactly Perry Mason work, does not mean that it's wage slavery. If anything, we are overpaid.

4:48, I'm not "Mountains," but I will say that, compared to my undergrad classmates who bypassed grad school and were pulling multi-million-dollar bonuses in finance within 3 years of earning a BA -- I am (relatively) a wage slave. I certainly don't feel overpaid. But if my former colleagues and classmates were cleaning toilets for minimum wage, I agree I'd probably feel otherwise.

6:07,

That's like saying a person worth 5 million is poor compared to his billionaire friends. That might be true in his circle, but in the rest of the world it isn't. In fact, most other people would think that the idea that a person worth 5 million is poor is comical.

For those of you making the top 5% income-wise and still think that you're wage slaves: please remove your heads from your (very sheltered) asses.

The point is that if you're in a city that is a major financial center with a critical mass of these bankers and hedge-funders, your 200k (which admittedly puts you in a high income percentile *nationwide*) does not go terribly far. Especially if the city you live in has experienced huge gains (from said financial sector) relatively recently, such that people who earn far less than attorneys see the "value" of the homes they purchased for $200k all jump to $2M (due to the presence of big-spending financiers exerting market pressure). Under these circumstances, a poor bigfirm lawyer cannot afford to purchase a home, despite earning more than a large percentage of current homeowners. This is generally the situation in NYC and SF, among other places.

How do people who make less than 6 figure salaries (the vast majority of people in these cities you speak of) in NYC, SF or any other major financial center survive? If a "poor bigfirm lawyer" is barely scraping by, then how do the people who make less manage to eat, stay clothed or have shelter?

7:53, they are either (a) in their 20s and living with a ton of roommates and totally check-to-check with no chance of ever building any equity or (b) homeowners whose homes now would cost 5000% of what they paid for them (i.e., they couldn't move here now).

Milbank sent me a box of cookies

As for how you can survive in New York with less than a six-figure income, you are not obliged to live with a ton of roommates, or have to be lucky enough to be a homeowner. I know many who manage to live in an apartment (granted, not in the more "fashionable" places of Manhattan, but in neighborhoods that are perfectly safe and respectable) by themselves.
Of course, they don't hit cheesy bars or the "in" clubs in the Meatpacking District every night, and they don't collapse from fright if they can't afford a Brooks Brother suit (oh no, they might have to buy one on line!!!). But they somehow manage to survive and thrive in NY, with good friends, and people who care about them.
Then again, they aren't twentysomethings with an entitlement complex who would freak if they couldn't afford to live in the latest highrise complex in the West Village, or be able to dine at Pastis or Balthazar's every night.

If a firm is going to give freebies (and not be cheap) then they should give good ones (else it makes them look worse than not giving). The Goodwin earphones were crap - either they should be a set of computer/ipod speakers (reasonable cost) or Bose noise cancelling headphones (something a top firm like S&C would give).

1:45, be clear that these folks are renters for life and will never be able to have families (because they won't be able to afford children -- even if they're in public school). If they're happy with that, fine; but don't behave as if anything above this level of existence is suddenly $200 dinners every night. We're talking about basics here.

Get a grip 1:22,

There are people in New York (and other major cities) who are not making six figure incomes, but somehow manage to have families. They are not all on public assistance either.