Debevoise gives higher bonuses than Cravath? Who saw that coming?

SHOW ME THE FIRST

Up on ATL in under half an hour. Nice work Lat.

...and still beat by WSJ.

2:46 - not really: class of 2000 for cravath is up for partnership. not so at debevoise so they need to provide more carrots to entice them to stay longer

Now the question who is not going to match the special bonus.

2:52 Don't be ridiculous. Very very very few ppl in Cravath's 2000 class will make partner. Long run income, you're better off going to a firm who makes more partners, but pays lower bonuses.

YES!

Thank you, D&P.

Now all firms that consider themselves among the elite MUST match or concede they are second tier.

God Bless America. I'm buying a Porche.

"I'm buying a Por[s]che."

----

Me too.

im learning to spell porch. or did you mean porsche?

I am only getting a fractional bonus, so I am going enter into a swap which gives me synthetic long exposure on a Porsche

This structure forces any firm that ties bonuses to hours to look very second tier. They may not even be motivated to match the total at year's end.

Stupid question, which I'm sure will evoke ridicule from the masses:

Does the "class" year typically correspond with year of law school graduation (e.g., an '05 grad who clerked for a year before going to the firm would get $40,000 even if s/he didn't start at the firm until 2006?)

Me fail English? Than unpossible!!

@3:02

Diversify yo' bonds, n*gga.

3:04. That's correct. Your grad year = Your class year, regardless of when you started at the firm. Likewise, your salary at the firm will be tied to your grad year: People who are in their first year as a firm associate, but who spent the past year clerking, are considered and paid as second year attorneys.

jones day? bonuses? secret system?
whats up wit dat?

3:04, generally yes, that generally corresponds with graduation year. As to clerkships, it could be case-by-case with each firm. When a firm hires you from a clerkship, it will tell you what year you are coming in at. I know people that clerked for 2 years that have only gotten credit for one year. So even though they graduated in 2005, they came in as second-years and got the 2006 class pay.

3:04, that's usually correct. If an attorney laterals into a firm, though, it's not uncommon for the firm to dock him or her a year in status as the price paid for joining a better firm and not coming up through the ranks.

What about Simpson? Will Simpson match? Will they too pay the special bonus in November? Since 2 peer firms are paying the special bonus in November, it seems like STB needs to as well.

Any dirt on STB? Thanks!

Hold your horses, guys. STB is coming soon.

Note that D&P is issuing these bonuses for the DC office in addition to NYC. Wow - big-time payday for DC folks. Questions as to whether DC-based firms will be able to match these numbers (in their DC hq, at least).

http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/us/AP-Ex-Commissioner-Sued.html

Fulbright & Jaworski sues Bernard Kerik for legal bills...

http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/us/AP-Ex-Commissioner-Sued.html

Fulbright & Jaworski sues Bernard Kerik for legal bills...

Match, bitches.

http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/us/AP-Ex-Commissioner-Sued.html

Fulbright & Jaworski sues Bernard Kerik for legal bills...

Of course they're paying it for the D.C. associates. Debevoise has one of the purest lock-step systems around - up to and including at the partner level.

@3:17

Just wait until Skadden matches this across all their offices. Some 2nd-year associate in Wilmington, Del. is gonna bring a suitcase full of Benjamins to his house closing.

Straight cash, homie!

does anyone know whether fulbright will be suing bernard kerik for legal bills?

What percentage goes to Charlie Rangel?

My guess is that Simpson will match. I don't think they want to be viewed as 2nd to anyone in compensation (except, of course, Wachtell). Given how rich the bonuses are, I would guess that base salaries will also climb. Skadden is probably non-plused that they had to follow Simpon's last raise rather than leading it, which may also put upward pressure on salary.

3:13 is incorrect. It's highly uncommon for laterals to get docked - unless they switch practice groups.

If anything, laterals get generous bonuses for switching firms as an inducement to jump ship.

@3:23

In what world does your comment make sense? Don't get me wrong, it's not that I wouldn't like to believe that salaries will rise, I just don't see how high bonuses increase pressure to raise salaries. I'd say the opposite is true.

for predicting who will match (westlaw cites).....

profits per partner- 6/2007 AMLAW 151

revenue per lawyer- 6/2007 AMLAW 147

Laterals may get docked in class year for partnership, but not in pay.

256: actually anyone at cravath who has lasted to class of 2000 probably has a good chance at partnership since hints are given along the way about their odds of making election

I WANT YOUR BOOOONNNUSSSSESSSS!!!!!

The special bonus is clearly an alternative to raising salaries. Give 'em an extra $10k because we had a good year. But next year may be different because of the credit crunch / subprime mortgage market. It's a lot easier to change the bonus pay than base pay. In fact, firms don't reduce base pay, they lay people off.

Agree w/ 3:26.

So every associate for these years gets the exact same bonus, regardless of hours worked, etc.?

BUT WHEN WILL SIMPSON ANNOUNCE? LATER TODAY? TOMORROW??

Not that it isn't fascinating to see which BigLaw firms pony up the big bonuses and in what order, and not that it isn't fascinating to hear about the small-penis-compensating car the associate receiving said big bonus will buy, but how about a thread that relates to (what I assume is) a larger portion of the legal community -- the bonuses that are typically given at smaller sized firms? I.e., it would be interesting to hear what the average bonus is for firms with 1-15 attorneys, 15-50 attorneys, 50-200 attorneys, etc. or whatever delineated group you want to choose.

3:17: How soon will STB announce???? We need to know

I wonder whether Kirkland's famous above market bonuses will top these recent announcements. Any thoughts?

Now that Debevoise has match (and even topped for senior associates) every firm that does not want to be deemed second tier must do so as well. Skadden, STB, DPW, Cahill, Milbank, CWT, etc., all must all match. None of these firms want to been seen as inferior to Debevoise in terms of prestige or status. Even if if few of these firms, if pushed, would admit that they are not quite equal to Cravath, none will allow themselves to be seen as beneath Debevoise. That would be too embarassing.

P.S.: they must also match in their branch offices - as Debevoise did.

3:38 -- I can tell you what most 1-15 attorney firms will hand their associates as a bonus: a $20 gift certificate good at any Olive Garden location (excluding alcoholic beverages, of course.)

Since I have been here (several years) I have been told, repeatedly, that the firm will always "do the right thing" when it comes to comp. So far, so good.

I officially bestow the title of TTT on any firm that does not match.

How many times will you people ask whether bonuses are linked to hours? Are you all under the same rock somewhere, or are there several rocks around the city? Just wondering.

What kind of bonuses do Lewis Hamilton-loving London firms pay their associates?

341-
Is that what your firm gave you last year? Interesting. Perhaps if you spent more time working and less time blogging, the firm would have given you more. By the way, you should post which firm it is, so the rest of us know to avoid that firm if we look to lateral. Seriously though, I'd like to hear from people who have something meaningful to say. Your comment, not meaningful.

Weil just matched

@3:22

"Benjamins"?? "Homie"???

Hi, 1997 called - It wants it's slang back.

What is taking Simpson so long? It just got showed up by Debevoise! Are you f'ing kidding me?

They need to announce TODAY.

What kind of bonuses do Lewis Hamilton-loving London firms pay their associates?

What kind of bonuses do Lewis Hamilton-loving London firms pay their associates?

Pls clarify on the lateral bonus info--suppose you lateralled in August 2007, and the firm's fiscal year ends June 30. Would you be included in this bonus round prorated for Aug-Dec 2008 (like the stubs), or is it zilch until 2008?

What kind of bonuses do Lewis Hamilton-loving London firms pay their associates?

What kind of bonuses do Lewis Hamilton-loving London firms pay their associates?

@3:22

"Benjamins"?? "Homie"???

Hi, 1997 called - It wants it's slang back.

Sorry at 3:48 I meant prorated Aug-Dec 2007 (not 2008).

Simpson Thacher & Bartlett llp

MEMORANDUM TO ALL ASSOCIATES AND COUNSEL

On behalf of the partners of the Firm, I am pleased to announce both a Special Bonus for 2007, as well as the year-end bonuses for associates and counsel. Associates in good standing will be paid as follows:

Year End Bonus
Special Bonus

Class of 2007 $35,000 (pro-rated) -
Class of 2006 $35,000 $10,000
Class of 2005 $40,000 $15,000
Class of 2004 $45,000 $20,000
Class of 2003 $50,000 $30,000
Class of 2002 $55,000 $40,000
Class of 2001 $60,000 $50,000
Class of 2000 $65,000 $50,000
Class of 1999 $65,000 $50,000

Bonuses for counsel and other attorneys will be determined on an individual basis and communicated separately. Special Bonuses will be paid on November 30, 2007 and the year-end bonus will be paid on December 28, 2007. Associates and counsel who were on leave or worked part-time during any part of this year will be eligible for a pro-rated bonus.
On behalf of the Firm, thank you for your continued dedication and professionalism. You have all contributed to the Firm's extraordinary success this year.
Pete Ruegger
October 31, 2007

The jerk store called. They're running out of 2007 son.

Weil has NOT matched.

3:50(2): You need to get out of the office more.

Simpson matched

Shall we assume that 3:46(3)'s post is bogus?

Simpson matched

Simpson Thacher & Bartlett llp

MEMORANDUM TO ALL ASSOCIATES AND COUNSEL

On behalf of the partners of the Firm, I am pleased to announce both a Special Bonus for 2007, as well as the year-end bonuses for associates and counsel. Associates in good standing will be paid as follows:

Year End Bonus
Special Bonus

Class of 2007 $35,000 (pro-rated) -
Class of 2006 $35,000 $10,000
Class of 2005 $40,000 $15,000
Class of 2004 $45,000 $20,000
Class of 2003 $50,000 $30,000
Class of 2002 $55,000 $40,000
Class of 2001 $60,000 $50,000
Class of 2000 $65,000 $50,000
Class of 1999 $65,000 $50,000

Bonuses for counsel and other attorneys will be determined on an individual basis and communicated separately. Special Bonuses will be paid on November 30, 2007 and the year-end bonus will be paid on December 28, 2007. Associates and counsel who were on leave or worked part-time during any part of this year will be eligible for a pro-rated bonus.
On behalf of the Firm, thank you for your continued dedication and professionalism. You have all contributed to the Firm's extraordinary success this year.
Pete Ruegger
October 31, 2007

stb just matched

Franks & Beanz LLP just matched.

Weil has matched.

Stupid Debevoise. Now that they've matched, every firm in the V15 HAS to match; they have no choice. Kills all the suspense. Talk about your all time bone head play...

Simpson just announced - matched Debevoise all the way.

stb just matched.

Simpson Thacher & Bartlett llp

MEMORANDUM TO ALL ASSOCIATES AND COUNSEL

On behalf of the partners of the Firm, I am pleased to announce both a Special Bonus for 2007, as well as the year-end bonuses for associates and counsel. Associates in good standing will be paid as follows:

Year End Bonus
Special Bonus

Class of 2007 $35,000 (pro-rated) -
Class of 2006 $35,000 $10,000
Class of 2005 $40,000 $15,000
Class of 2004 $45,000 $20,000
Class of 2003 $50,000 $30,000
Class of 2002 $55,000 $40,000
Class of 2001 $60,000 $50,000
Class of 2000 $65,000 $50,000
Class of 1999 $65,000 $50,000

Bonuses for counsel and other attorneys will be determined on an individual basis and communicated separately. Special Bonuses will be paid on November 30, 2007 and the year-end bonus will be paid on December 28, 2007. Associates and counsel who were on leave or worked part-time during any part of this year will be eligible for a pro-rated bonus.
On behalf of the Firm, thank you for your continued dedication and professionalism. You have all contributed to the Firm's extraordinary success this year.
Pete Ruegger
October 31, 2007

Simpson has matched.

Its just hilarous the way these firms shamelessly copy each other. Not only with the structure, but they couldn't think of anything else besides "special bonus"? How about "Premium Bonus" or "One-time Discretionary Bonus" or "Firm Citizenship Bonus" or they could just cut to the chase and call it the "Cravath Bonus"

Stupid Debevoise. Now that they've matched, every firm in the V15 HAS to match; they have no choice. Kills all the suspense. Talk about your all time bone head play...

Simpson just matched!!!

Hi, the jerk store called - They're running out of 2007 son.

3:38,

Regardless of the size of one's penis, it is impossible not to agree that a Porsche 911 is a beautiful machine. That is a simple, indisputable fact.

Your snippy little comment is likely the result of your sadness over the equally indisputable fact that you will never drive such a beautiful machine, and certainly never have the chance to own one.

Leave your address in the comments and I will make sure to send you a few pictures of my girlfriend driving me around in the black 911 I intend to purchase.

Enjoy your Hyundai.

Weil has matched.

I work at a AMLAW 200 (not 100 firm) and I almost cried when I read this post. I'm a second year associate who only makes 135k a year. My bonus will MAYBE be around 15k tops. And the sad thing is I went to a top 14, but ended up at this TTT firm. I could be making 170k plus a 55k bonus if I had gone to NYC. Jesus, that is a 75k a year difference. Wow.

3:50(2): You need to get out of the office more.

3:38 - Go away. No one cares. Please go to an accounting blog and when people talk about PricewaterhouseCoopers, Deloitte Touche Tohmatsu, Ernst & Young, and
KPMG , you can be right there to ask questions about H&R Block and John Q. Accountant, CPA.

There's nothing wrong with midsize, small, or solo operations, but a) there are too many to talk about and b) they are not the ones that push the envelopes. When there's some trend worth talking about, you be sure to let us know. Why don't you quit your job and start a blog about it like Lat did after he left Wachtell/USA?

I hear STB matched

Simpson matched at 3:53 eastern.

Simpson has matched.

don't forget that flyout week just happened for harvard and yale and those students are all thinking about which firm to go to right now and reading this stuff.....can't differentiate between top firms anyway, so this kind of stuff might make the difference. firms clearly know this and want to step up. would make sense for one place, like stb, to go above and beyond.

simpson may have just matched

3:38,

Regardless of the size of one's penis, it is impossible not to agree that a Porsche 911 is a beautiful machine. That is a simple, indisputable fact.

Your snippy little comment is likely the result of your sadness over the equally indisputable fact that you will never drive such a beautiful machine, and certainly never have the chance to own one.

Leave your address in the comments and I will make sure to send you a few pictures of my girlfriend driving me around in the black 911 I intend to purchase.

Also, enjoy your Hyundai.

simpson may have just matched

simpson matches - see xoxo

What kind of bonuses do London loving-Lewis Hamilton firms pay their associates?

simpson matched

Simpson Thacher just matched, memo: http://www.xoxohth.com/thread.php?thread_id=709761&mc=1&forum_id=2

From: Ruegger, Pete
Sent: Wednesday, October 31, 2007 3:53 PM
To: Associates and Counsel
Subject: 2007 Bonuses

Simpson Thacher & Bartlett llp

MEMORANDUM TO ALL ASSOCIATES AND COUNSEL

On behalf of the partners of the Firm, I am pleased to announce both a Special Bonus for 2007, as well as the year-end bonuses for associates and counsel. Associates in good standing will be paid as follows:

Year End Bonus
Special Bonus

Class of 2007 $35,000 (pro-rated) -
Class of 2006 $35,000 $10,000
Class of 2005 $40,000 $15,000
Class of 2004 $45,000 $20,000
Class of 2003 $50,000 $30,000
Class of 2002 $55,000 $40,000
Class of 2001 $60,000 $50,000
Class of 2000 $65,000 $50,000
Class of 1999 $65,000 $50,000

Bonuses for counsel and other attorneys will be determined on an individual basis and communicated separately. Special Bonuses will be paid on November 30, 2007 and the year-end bonus will be paid on December 28, 2007. Associates and counsel who were on leave or worked part-time during any part of this year will be eligible for a pro-rated bonus.
On behalf of the Firm, thank you for your continued dedication and professionalism. You have all contributed to the Firm's extraordinary success this year.
Pete Ruegger
October 31, 2007

@2007 Son

Yo, beeyatch, a semi-retarded African boy called. He wants his poor Internet skills back.

Did Simpson match? Why won't anyone say??

From: Ruegger, Pete
Sent: Wednesday, October 31, 2007 3:53 PM
To: Associates and Counsel
Subject: 2007 Bonuses

Simpson Thacher & Bartlett llp

MEMORANDUM TO ALL ASSOCIATES AND COUNSEL

On behalf of the partners of the Firm, I am pleased to announce both a Special Bonus for 2007, as well as the year-end bonuses for associates and counsel. Associates in good standing will be paid as follows:

Year End Bonus
Special Bonus

Class of 2007 $35,000 (pro-rated) -
Class of 2006 $35,000 $10,000
Class of 2005 $40,000 $15,000
Class of 2004 $45,000 $20,000
Class of 2003 $50,000 $30,000
Class of 2002 $55,000 $40,000
Class of 2001 $60,000 $50,000
Class of 2000 $65,000 $50,000
Class of 1999 $65,000 $50,000

Bonuses for counsel and other attorneys will be determined on an individual basis and communicated separately. Special Bonuses will be paid on November 30, 2007 and the year-end bonus will be paid on December 28, 2007. Associates and counsel who were on leave or worked part-time during any part of this year will be eligible for a pro-rated bonus.
On behalf of the Firm, thank you for your continued dedication and professionalism. You have all contributed to the Firm's extraordinary success this year.
Pete Ruegger
October 31, 2007

FIRST!

simpson matched

Lat -

The site is screwed up. Double postings on the main page, missing pages, etc. do we all need to click an advertisement so you can get an upgrade?

Has anyone heard whether Simpson matched?

I heard Latham is matching soon

What about Simpson? are they going to match?

When is LW going to match?

FILTER THESE COMMENTS PLEASE

I think Lat murdered the site on his way to the gay cruise. Terrible timing. What a mongoloidal move.

I heard Simpson may be matching at some point in the next 3 months!

Rumors of a Dewey & LeBoeuf match?

I'm going to call the Chairman on my AmLaw 50 firm and tell him I want my special bonus paid in gold bars.

3:04, apparently not a dumb question at all, since there seems to be a lot of confusion on the matter. At most firms, "class year" refers to the class/level which firm considers an individual attorney, not that attorney's grad year. That said, some firms may not make a practice of hiring candidates who aren't on par with their YOG.

3:26, Laterals commonly get docked - both in salary and class year/partnership consideration - for a variety of reasons.

Interesting - what do you think about the big names in DC matching? Covington? WilmerHale? WC?

Rumors of a Dewey & LeBoeuf match?

One point I don't think anyone has touched upon:

All three firms are paying both bonuses prior to the end of 2007. Did they also pay their 2006 bonuses in calendar year 2006, or are associates getting all three boni within 12 months?

Will all firms match this as well? And what are the tax implications? God help me if I land in a higher bracket.

What is Debevoise ranked on PPP? This would be a better metric to determine who absolutely must match.

21 Debevoise & Plimpton $1,805,000 7.8%

400(#4)/404,
The Porsche is a very nice car (though I prefer the Lexus SC08), but I live in NYC, so I don't own any car at this point. I don't need a car, nor do I have a desire to compensate for other shortcomings by blowing $80 grand on one. And you can save the picture of your skank girlfriend. You'll need it to wack off to when she realizes why you bought the Porsche.

401(#3),
Why would I care about what is said on an accounting blog? I am a lawyer at a non-BigLaw firm. While I agree that there are too many small/mid-size firms to get a real representative sample, the discussion is still worth having. Here's why: (1) it will show those of you in BigLaw the options that are out there if you choose to leave for a small/mid-size firm. As this is a threat (promise?) that is repeated on these pages frequently, I would think you would want some sense of what the financial picture is at a smaller-sized firm. (2) The small firms do push the envelope - only its a slightly different envelope. Just like there is competition among the BigLaw firms for the best associates, there is competition among the small firms as well. When I took the job I accepted, I had other offers from similar size firms and I consulted with friends at firms of comparable size. I wanted to know whether the money was consistent with the small market. In essence, it's the same thing as someone in Atlanta, Seattle, or Tulsa having a thread for discussion.

I suppose the best way to find out if the discussion is worth having is for Lat to start a thread and see the response. Once you remove the idiots who cry "FIRST" and the denigrating comments from the BigLaw snobs, there might actually be some meaningful discussion. Or maybe not. Maybe no one from a small firm reads the blog, wants to post, or has the time. Only one way to find out.

Franks & Beenz LLP just matched!

screw DC and every other market other than NY. There is no way other cities should be matching NY.

Thoughts on whether firms that tie bonuses to hours will match this compensation scheme? As most don't pay bonus until the next calendar year, maybe we can look forward to a President's Day "special" bonus!

4:33-

do you know how the income tax works? if it bumps you into a higher tax bracket, that higher rate will apply only to the excess that bumped you into the higher bracket.

400(#4)/404,
The Porsche is a very nice car (though I prefer the Lexus SC08), but I live in NYC, so I don't own any car at this point. I don't need a car, nor do I have a desire to compensate for other shortcomings by blowing $80 grand on one. And you can save the picture of your skank girlfriend. You'll need it to wack off to when she realizes why you bought the Porsche.

401(#3),
Why would I care about what is said on an accounting blog? I am a lawyer at a non-BigLaw firm. While I agree that there are too many small/mid-size firms to get a real representative sample, the discussion is still worth having. Here's why: (1) it will show those of you in BigLaw the options that are out there if you choose to leave for a small/mid-size firm. As this is a threat (promise?) that is repeated on these pages frequently, I would think you would want some sense of what the financial picture is at a smaller-sized firm. (2) The small firms do push the envelope - only its a slightly different envelope. Just like there is competition among the BigLaw firms for the best associates, there is competition among the small firms as well. When I took the job I accepted, I had other offers from similar size firms and I consulted with friends at firms of comparable size. I wanted to know whether the money was consistent with the small market. In essence, it's the same thing as someone in Atlanta, Seattle, or Tulsa having a thread for discussion.

I suppose the best way to find out if the discussion is worth having is for Lat to start a thread and see the response. Once you remove the idiots who cry "FIRST" and the denigrating comments from the BigLaw snobs, there might actually be some meaningful discussion. Or maybe not. Maybe no one from a small firm reads the blog, wants to post, or has the time. Only one way to find out.

One point I don't think anyone has touched upon:

All three firms are paying both bonuses prior to the end of 2007. Did they also pay their 2006 bonuses in calendar year 2006, or are associates getting all three boni within 12 months?

Will all firms match this as well? And what are the tax implications? God help me if I land in a higher bracket.

Why would you ever let your girlfriend drive your new Porsche? That's an awful idea.

Thoughts on whether firms that tie bonuses to hours will match this compensation scheme? As most don't pay bonus until the next calendar year, maybe we can look forward to a President's Day "special" bonus!

does anyone know how the prorated bonuses for ppl who worked for part of the yr work? and im not talking about first yrs. i worked for the first 1/2 of this yr at a V10 nyc firm that HAS to match DP and STB but then left to clerk. will i get anything or do you have to be still assoc with the firm at yr end to get any piece of the bonus?

LAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAATTTTTTTTT!!!!