All your internets are belongs to us!

First

What is a BJ Associate? Lat, do we need a new perk watch?

Am I missing out at my firm?

All your internets are belongs to us!!!

does anybody know if schulte matched?

not first

Sigh - still waiting for the first NY office of a non-NYC-headquartered firm to match before I can officially consider this "market" and start counting chickens.

BJ = Beijing

Can someone explain the me the whole obsession with being "first" to post a comment? I know this happens all over the Internet, but it seems rather lame.

602 - easy: www.youtube.com/watch?v=ciG-Xs7mBwU

:(!

what firms have matched so far, is there an official list?

Ah, I see -- thanks. I still think it's really lame ... though, sadly, I guess that's the point.

OFFICIAL LIST OF 2007 ASSOCIATE BONUSES AS COMPILED BY THE OFFICIAL BUREAU OF OFFICIAL BONUS ANNOUNCEMENTS AS OFFICIALLY REPORTED TO ABOVE THE LAW

Cravath
Debevoise
Simpson
DPW
Paul, Weiss
Millbank

*K&E punted until December

6:04,

That's hilarious! That kid has really good deadpan and facial expressions.

6:09 (in alphabetical order) -
Cravath
Davis Polk
Debevoise
Milbank
Paul Weiss
Simpson

I think:

CSM
STB
D&P
Paul Weiss
DPW
K&E (potentially)
Milbank

Now that Milbank has matched in DC and LA, this is now the market rate in those cities. Any firm that does not match dollar for dollar without hours restrictions is officially second tier.

List of Shame:
Latham
Gibson
OMM . . .

Does Cadwalader match?

All your FIRST! are belong to us!

You guys suck with your special bonuses. We don't get no stinking special bonuses out here in the real world. Boo BOOO BOOOOOO

all these firms are expected to match.... which are the borderline firms that may or may not match?

6:40 (2): agreed. Any firm with PPP > $1.75mil isn't making news when it matches. I'm waiting for an announcement from a Fried Frank or a Dewey Lebeeouaughff before I jump to conclusions.

And of course, getting my resume ready on the side.

I wonder what DC firms, like Hogan, WilmerHale, and Covington, will do. Do they have an incentive to give a special bonus?

Tomorrow should be a big day of matching.

whither skadden?

Skadden will match in all domestic offices.

I heard Bingham is gonna match soon

Where is Quinn Emanuel, trial lawyers extraordinaire and ppp powerhouse? Quickly losing all the hard earned cachet (or at least buzz). Instead of spending all that money on the ill-conceived Utah orgy-fest, they could have matched.

Coudert Bros. matched. so did Brobeck.

Dear Rohan,

Why do you continue to wait? You like to pretend that S&S is one of the big boys, but you sit around and hem and haw on bonuses, knowing full well that you'll have to match them. So why don't you step up and match them before the weekend?

By the way, here are the market leaders thus far:

Cravath
Debevoise
Simpson
DPW
Paul, Weiss
Millbank

Good bye and good luck!

are these special bonuses meant to end talk of raising salaries in NYC? Are they a way to only give raises in NYC w/o having to match in other cities?

where's SulCrom? anyone think they're going to raise?

you losers go back to work. Instead of worrying/guessing what firms are going to do, why don't you do something you can control: SERVE YOUR CLIENTS.

What does good standing mean?

I'm rooting for D&L...

HUGE announcement expected from S&C tomorrow
stay tuned

what do you mean by HUGE? 190 hopefully?

I think we're going to have a slew of announcements tomorrow. All of the Big Boys will fall in line: S&C, S&S, Skadden, WGM, Cleary, Fried Frank, CWT, Cahill, Willkie, Dewey & the Beef, etc. Get your acts together guys! There's no reason for a New York based high PPP firm to sit on the sidelines at this point.

these people make things up. . .i bet dollars for donuts that nothing "HUGE" about it

WILLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLKIE, WHERE AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARE YOU??

Poll: Am I an idiot for remaining at an SF firm where no bonus is paid until 2100 hrs?

I have it on good authority that SullCrom is going to up the ante SIGNIFICANTLY on monday.

what do you mean by SIGNIFICANTLY - base salary increase hopefully?

i love this. one guy says a huge S&C announcement tomorrow, another says it will be on monday. .. do you see how ridiculous you all are

Any chance that any non-NY associates at any of the big 3 LA firms get a bonus this november?

so once again there is no benefit to working in ny...some guy in dallas or houston is getting the same bonus as a ny associate?

Skadden to 200!

i am thinking there is no chance that a NY associate at any of the big 3 LA firms gets a bonus this November. By the way, why the hell is OMM considered a big boy. its a crap firm.

what's wrong with OMM?

Besides Skadden, what firms pay the same base, bonus, (and special bonus?)across offices?

Cadwalader has not matched. I guess they are waiting to finish the attorney layoffs before announcing.

Go DLA!

seriously...why work in ny if i can make the same amount of $$ in houston?

Vault Based List of Shame -

(Wachtell ommitted because, come on, seriously, they got more than this in their mid-year bonus)

Vault Rank / Firm / 2005 RPL (if known)
1
2
3 Sullivan & Cromwell LLP / $1,627,000
4 Skadden, Arps, Slate, Meagher & Flom / $997,000
5
6
7 Cleary, Gottlieb, Steen & Hamilton LLP / $913,000
8 Latham & Watkins LLP / $875,000
9 Weil, Gotshal & Manges LLP / $954,000
10 Covington & Burling LLP / $774,000
11 Kirkland & Ellis LLP / $987,000
12
13
14 Shearman & Sterling LLP / $992,000
15 Wilmer Cutler / 846,000
16 Williams & Connolly LLP /
17 Sidley Austin LLP / $774,000
18 Gibson, Dunn & Crutcher LLP / $1,011,000
19 O'Melveny & Myers LLP / $828,000
20 White & Case LLP / $600,000
21 Arnold & Porter LLP / $816,000
22 Jones Day / 602,000
23 Morrison & Foerster LLP / $735,000
24
25 Clifford Chance LLP /
26 Cadwalader, Wickersham & Taft / $940,000
27 Hogan & Hartson LLP / $735,000
28 Mayer, Brown, Rowe & Maw LLP / $750,000
29 Fried, Frank, / $891,000
30 Ropes & Gray LLP / 841,000
31 Paul, Hastings, Janofsky & Walker / $766,000
32 Willkie Farr & Gallagher LLP / $859,000
33 Akin Gump Strauss Hauer & Feld LLP / $779,000
34 Winston & Strawn LLP / $718,000
35 Dewey Ballantine LLP / $782,000
36 Wilson Sonsini Goodrich & Rosati / $752,000
37 Linklaters /
38 Orrick, Herrington & Sutcliffe / 767,000
39 Freshfields Bruckhaus Deringer LLP /
40 Proskauer Rose LLP / $745,000

* Note the RPLs I could find are a little dated, so that's changed in the last 2 years for some firms, and for CWT, pretty dramatically.

* Note that some/most of these firms might have bonuses tied to hours - an thus they might never match this bonus.

"Besides Skadden, what firms pay the same base, bonus, (and special bonus?)across offices?"

Weil does

I'm only going to bill 1800 this year - I LOVE market bonus!

What the hell is "RPL"?

Revenue per lawyer.

8:28 - wow

I have it on good authority

I love Cravath, so far no separation has been created and it doesn't look like any meaningful separation will be created. Thanks for the xtra dinero and will gleefully wait to see who tries to raise the bar next.

What's worse than being at VT11 K&E and knowing you'll get no special bonus in November?

Being at VT10 L&W and knowing you'll get no bonus at all until February, when everyone will have forgotten about "special" bonuses or, the market having gone to Hell, have thought more about giving you more money with prospects not looking so good. This, AFTER you've busted your butt for a full 12 mos.

Who goes with a California-based firm in NYC?

preach on 9:22

8:14,

Because you'd have to live in Houston.

Dewey also pays the same base and bonuses across all offices (at least prior to LeBoeuf). Anyone know what LeBoeuf does with bonuses?

Correction, 10:02: Dewey Class of 2007 doesn't even get pro-rated, they get a flat $5k, same as last year...if they're going to play with the big boys they'd better start paying like the big boys.

Does this mean $190K is out?

The $5k that the class of 2007 gets at Dewey is $5k more than the same people would get at Latham. That's right, you get $Jack as a stub.

Thoughts on Magic Circle in NY? My predication is at least Links NY will match sometimes next week.

10:08:

Sucks to be you.

...On the other hand, D&L '07 took jobs with firms that no longer exist and now are dealing with merger hell...

10:08 - but you get a bar bonus, not a bar loan. $10K>$5K

how's the merger going? Is it merger hell?

pssssst.....S&C to raise base salariesall years...imho...ho ho ho...merry christmas

I think Clifford Chance matches before Links.

S&C's announcement will be interesting no matter what. Let's not forget that they already announced a form of special bonus to senior associates. If they match Cravath's special bonus in addition, then they would be paying higher bonuses to their senior associates than the peer firms that have announced so far. Would Cravath, DPW and STB be fine keeping their bonuses as they are if S&C matches?

When will DC firms like WilmerHale, A&P, Covington etc announce new bonuses? The NYC firms should say the bonus applies to their DC offices as well to pressure the DC firms a bit more.

Looks like no Chicago-based firms have given a special bonus.

schulte won't announce (i don't think) until later in the year b/c usually their bonuses are tied to specific billable hours (which they won't know for sure, obviously, until later in the year)

I am poor.

Now that Milbank, Simpson, Debevoise and DPW have matched (or upped for seniors) the bonus numbers in their branch offices as well as NY, Skadden must do the same or it will look cheap.

Clifford Chance will match on Monday. Shhhhh!

The race to the bottom is raising the first year base to $180K and moving the first year bonus floor to $25K. Then in good years move the bonus number up. All-in comp MUST get to >$200K guaranteed if the top 10 or so firms want to separate themselves from the Sidley's of the world.

Here is a list sorted by the most recent RPL numbers. Some of these firms simply had a good '06 or received a large contingency fee and obviously will not match. The RPL numbers flatten drastically after the top few firms. Where will the line be drawn???

Rank 2006 in revenue
by revenue Revenue per lawyer
per lawyer Firm Per Lawyer from 2005
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1 Wachtell ABOVE MARKET $2,455,000 2.5%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
2 Sullivan & Cromwell $1,565,000 1.3%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
3 Wiley Rein $1,520,000 162.1%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
4 Cravath MARKET $1,355,000 5.9%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
5 Davis Polk MARKET $1,200,000 4.8%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
5 Simpson Thacher-MARKET $1,200,000 6.7%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
7 McKee Nelson $1,190,000 1.7%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
8 Milbank, Tweed MARKET $1,110,000 10.4%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
9 Skadden $1,095,000 10.1%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
10 Cahill Gordon $1,075,000 8.6%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
11 Fragomen, Del Rey $1,070,000 26.6%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
12 Gibson, Dunn $1,050,000 4.0%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
12 Irell & Manella $1,050,000 9.9%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
14 Kirkland & Ellis PUNTED $1,035,000 5.1%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
14 Paul, Weiss MARKET $1,035,000 0.5%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
16 Munger, Tolles $1,025,000 18.5%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
17 Quinn Emanuel $1,020,000 28.3%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
18 Shearman & Sterling $1,010,000 2.0%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
19 Debevoise & Plimpton MARKET $1,005,000 8.6%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
20 Cadwalader $1,000,000 6.4%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
21 Boies, Schiller $980,000 3.2%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
21 Weil, Gotshal $980,000 2.6%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
23 Cleary Gottlieb $975,000 7.1%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
24 Willkie Farr $970,000 12.8%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
25 Williams & Connolly $955,000 2.7%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
26 Finnegan, Henderson $945,000 11.2%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
27 Townsend and Townsend $940,000 6.2%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
28 Fried, Frank $930,000 4.5%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
29 Schulte Roth $925,000 6.9%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
30 Latham & Watkins $920,000 5.1%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
31 Wilmer Cutler $890,000 5.3%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
32 McDermott Will $875,000 12.9%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
33 Kaye Scholer $865,000 7.5%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
34 Arnold & Porter $855,000 4.9%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
34 Ropes & Gray $855,000 1.8%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
36 Choate, Hall $850,000 10.4%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
36 Kramer Levin $850,000 6.3%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
38 Heller Ehrman $845,000 5.0%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
39 Akin Gump $840,000 7.7%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
40 Hughes Hubbard $835,000 12.1%

the comments section should have a filter to automatically remove comments about TTT firms

Any idea what is the lowest firm on 1:56am's RPL list that doesn't tie bonus to hours?

1:59 . . . LOL, haven't heard "TTT" since the Princeton Review boards years ago.

My guess is California firms won't come close to matching these boni. They were already whining about the raise to $160K earlier this year.

FIRST!

Heard D&L partners may meet on Monday...shhhh

It's not bullsh&#.

Whatever. You will see...

It takes Latham forever to make any decisions like this because everything has to go through the Associates Committee process. Huge time delays in putting together a bonus grid when you don't go lockstep.

Background Question:

Have NY offices historically paid more than other offices, and is the current state an exception, or was the last couple years the exception.

Thanks for taking the call

Every firm has an associates committe (or something similar)...it is no excuse to hold up a decision. If LW wants to save face they would have to match and pay a special bonus before year end. It is bad enough that they wait until February to pay out regular bonuses...as earlier posters have said, it is really second tier to tie bonus to hours.

Chicago firms should start matching (at a minimum) without hours tying.

What will S&C do? thats the only question left. they promised they would continue to match bonuses, and then would give seniors the supplemental. obviously though, they didn't anticipate cravath abandoning the 5,000 dollar a year bonus increases.

if they do that this year -- the senior associates will make a killing. A sixth year would make 130,000 in bonuses alone.

If D&L wants to be considered on par with the other big boys, it needs to act quickly.

As a Dewey associate, I sure hope they move soon, but stop being so melodramatic. "It needs to act quickly"?! Five or six firms have announced. I guess that since S&C hasn't announced, it's not one of the "big boys." Get a grip.

Rude

Chicago based firms will match. At least the big boys -- Kirkland, Sidley, Mayer, Winston.

I'm so glad no first years asked what Brobeck or Coudert Brothers were in response to the funny post yesterday. That would have made me feel quite old.

Cravath clearly wanted to start a war for the top 5% students at the top 6 (or 7, depending on how one reads the US News rankings) and has drawn a line in the sand, which only a few firms have thus far crossed. (Individuals with mere mortal credentials heading to or already at such firms are simply riding a wave intended for others, which is perfectly fair, given the fact that they end up doing the same work and billing just a many, if not more, hours.)

Expect S & C to move today.

Other leading firms simply don't need to modify their bonus announcement schedules. They're content with recruiting the top third (if not lower) from the T6 and the top 5% from the T25. Waiting until their normal announcement period will not harm them in that endeavor. (Such firms must, however, match the new NY market bonuses when they do announce.)

Leading non-NY-based firms will match in NY offices (Latham, Sidley, etc.). Kirkland will likely increase the incremental rate at which it pays its vaunted meritocratic bonuses, and will top all but WLRK in total average associate comp.

You have too much time on your hands.

Skadden, wherefore thou art?

Cleary better match - they should be embarrassed that they haven't already.

No large Chicago based firms will match because their bonuses are tied to hours/merit.

And it doesn't matter for Chicago associates anyways since the 160 + eventual bonus goes WAY further in Chicago than these bonuses go in NY. Plus Chicago streets don't smell like the garbage that is always piled up on them.

No large Chicago based firms will match because they're all cheapskates. There's a reason NYC is tops, despite what K&E likes to brag about itself. At least Sidley, Mayer and the rest of those jokers don't bother contesting it anymore. The Second City is Second Tier and everybody knows it.

Where is CWT, without a market bonus, they will lose tons of associates.

Background Question:

Have NY offices historically paid more than other offices, and is the current state an exception, or was the last couple years the exception.

Thanks for taking the call

Any word on what King & Spalding might do?

10:04-- this has very little to do with recruiting summer associates. these kids should be psyched that any firm is willing to hire them in the current market. the bonus bumps have everything to do with the fact that current associates busted *ss for the first 2.5 quarters of the year and profits will be up for the year in total, although they could easily be flat to down next year. That is why these bonuses are "special" and that is why they come in lieu of a raise in base salaries across the board

CWT was very profitable and seemed to be rolling through the first six months, but it has been hit hard by the credit crunch. This will be a very tough call for them.

There's no transactional work for associates at CWT right now...first-years were transferred to litigation to do doc review...

Given the 300 hours I billed in October doing transactional work at CWT, I have to disagree that there is no work out there, but it is true about the first years

Top 5% of the top 6 or 7 law schools? You realize that's a total of less than 150 people per year, right? Don't fool yourself -- top firms aim for the top 25% of the top law schools.

Milbank does not have an hours requirement?

If the bonus is given before year-end, how do they determine total hours?

Do they just take the hours accumulated so far in '07 (ie, take into account only 10+ months), project for the whole year, or go back to Nov-Dec '06 and just calculate the last 12 months?

11:15-bonuses at these firms are not hours-based

11:20-as far as i understand, there's a minimum level of hours to get the bonus, so i'm curious about how they calculate the total '07 amount

Wondering -

My firm ends its fiscal year in October. I know other firms end in other months (september, november).

11:25 - you're wrong. There is no minimum requirement at any of these firms to get the bonus. They lawyer who bills 1500 hours gets the same bonus as the lawyer who bills 2500 hours (though billing 1500 hours might raise some questions about whether you are in "good standing" with the firm)

ok, well how about this one-i have a "friend" who's billed about 1450 so far, on pace for about 1750 for year-end. is this:

a. definitely "good standing"
b. definitely NOT "good standing"
c. completely contextual

Wondering:
Not in good standing basically means you're getting fired. "Good standing" is not a backdoor hours requirement. How many times do people have to repeat the fact that top NY firms do not have minimum hours requirements? Unless your friend has been told that people are unhappy with her work than she will get the bonus at any of the top shops. At my firm, people routinely get bonuses with 1500-1600 hours.

I don't know how true that is...at my firm, you have to bill 2,000 to get the bonus. Period.

12:02 - what firm?

11:54 - there are exceptions. For instance, some give a "bump" above the lockstep amount for particularly noteworthy years (e.g., 2600+), and some will knock a few bucks off of lockstep for associates with bad performance reviews or ridiculously low (e.g., 1500) hours unless there are some extenuating circumstances.

12:02 -- Are you at one if the firms that has announced bonuses? At one of the firms traditionally considered top firms in NY? My guess is no. I wasn't saying that NO firms have billable hours requirements. I was saying that the top firms in NY do not have billable requirements. "Wondering" seemed to be asking about firms that have already announced. Those firms do not have min. billable requirements.

Are you still "in good standing" if you give notice after bonuses are announced but not paid? (obviously one would only do this if it were impossible to wait any longer).

I'm at a top 10 NY firm where the "min" hours seems to be 1600 (obviously that's not official, but nobody at the firm seems to question it). so let's just assume this for the following question, unless somene actually KNOWS differently: would the 1600 floor be based on 2007 year to date, or prorated, or based on the last 12 months (ie, including nov-dec '06)?

Wondering,

Based on the 1600 floor you may be at Skadden. My understanding is that 1600 is the floor at Skadden to be considered in good standing (assuming you have been there for a full year). If you are at risk at falling below 1600 for a full year at Skadden I am sure they will communicate their concerns during your review.