I assume the tipster was joking when he said "great for mid/upper classes," right?

this is somewhat great if you practice labor and employment law.. better salary than the boutiques

(fourth!)

hard fact of life: l&e will never be as profitable as m&a; it will never be able to command the same level of compensation.

p.s. i can avoid caps too!

though if you practice L&E in a large general practice firm you'll make the same base salary, and possibly get the same bonus, as other associates... you only get screwed in L&E if you work in a large boutique or at a LE focused firm like seyfarth

And correct me if I'm wrong, but if you do L&E, your life is a little less insane, right?

It depends. L&E at a place like Paul Hastings or Proskaur is probably really intense. But at other places, yeah, it's probably generally more inhumane, but it's still a law firm and you have to bill hours and lots of people bill over 2,200 hours at some places.

Akin Gump D.C. is cheap. Third year, 2,300 hours, $25,000 bonus.

These charts are not 100% accurate -- there are more than two lists. NY is the highest (as listed). Boston, DC, and LA are slightly less. Chicago, San Fran, Sacramento are the second list above. Houston and Atlanta are lower.

L&E lawyers at PHJW enjoy the same laid back lifestyle as L&E at other big firms. If such as thing as prestige exists in that practice group then I would imagine that you would enjoy that as well.

- S&C

Definitely less hectic - most L/E associates struggle to make 2000 hrs...not from lack of effort but just the nature of the practice. Although seyfarth is not nearly as heavily L/E driven as it once was, I definitely think they struggle to keep up with this compensation race. This may be the last big raise for a while.

Re: 9:42 -- I agree that Houston and Atlanta are lower but I have confirmed that Chicago is on the same scale as DC/BOS/LA/SF. Can't speak to Sac though.

10:49 -- You are wrong. Chicago is not the same scale as Boston. Boston is higher than the above list and higher than Chicago

Why is it so hard for L & E associates to hit their hours? What is it about the nature of the practice?

You can't generalize about L&E hours like the posters above. If you're in an L&E practice that is not key to the business - i.e., it's there as a service to clients of the firm who sometimes need L&E work - then it can be feast or famine. If you're at a place that gets high quality L&E work and does it well - e.g., Paul Hastings, Morgan Lewis, Jones Day - then the work schedules are as demanding as any firm's trial practice.

The L&E associates at Seyfarth never seem to have a problem making their hours.

Jones Day = high quality L/E work??? Not quite. PHJW, MLB, and SS are probably the top 3 in the country. Jones Day's reputation in the L/E legal community has gone down considerably in recent years. Still better than boutique firms like LM and JL but certainly not an elite L/E practice.

4:48: What about Proskauer?

Holland & Knight is off the list. Venable is off the list. Not sure else is left other than McGuire Woods ....

L and E at my Biglaw firm is terrible. It is very hard for associates to make hours and many leave. Even though the firm keeps it as a service group, clients are no longer willing to pay big firm rates for L and E matters. If you are a law school student, I would definitely avoid doing L and E at a big law firm.

160 to 165? that really is pathetic with this kind of inflation

"Jones Day = high quality L/E work??? Not quite. PHJW, MLB, and SS are probably the top 3 in the country. Jones Day's reputation in the L/E legal community has gone down considerably in recent years. Still better than boutique firms like LM and JL but certainly not an elite L/E practice."

Uh... Jones Day was just named the L&E practice in the country:

"Jones Day has been named the nation's best Labor & Employment practice by The American Lawyer as part of the magazine's prestigious Litigation Department of the Year competition."

Just sayin'.

One big ERISA settlement for GM and suddenly they are the nation's best? There L/E practice only makes up about 6% of their revenue...probably in large party to a handful of big clients.

Where are they in Vault? Chambers?

JD is #7 for labor and employment in the 2007 Vault rankings.

I'm yesterday's 3:23.

Wasn't trying to give an all-inclusive list - just the AmLaw top-ranked L&E practices in the last few years. The real point of the post is that there are L&E practices that stand on their own, and there are L&E service practices that merely exist to support clients who have come to their firm for other purposes.

Though I do agree with 10:23 that it was strange that AmLaw highlighted the GM deal so much in its decision. It's not as if JD invented the VEBA.

3:23 again. Also, JD, MLB and PHWJ are the only three band one L&E practices in Chambers. http://www.chambersandpartners.com/usa/resultseditorial.aspx?cid=618&pid=1114&solbar=1&grouptype=1

At $145k, I can still buy a BMW even with my $170k in loans. Can't wait!

What do people like about being an L & E lawyer?

9:39 -- the facts are much more interesting than other commercial litigation. You have real people, not just contracts.

think twice about staying at any firm with non equity partners, often times you make less than senior associates. Also, the reality is that L&E firms can't pay associates at the high end of the scale set forth above. It is short sighted - the future is bleak if L&E firms want to keep pace with the M&A firms salary wise. If you want to make a lot of money - go somewhere else.

Its a little late, but I wanted to point out that I believe that the above salary numbers are higher than the actual salary bumps...I beliive the numbers posted were pre-approval and that the final approved salaries were about 5-10+k lower than listed.

L+E is a commodity practice that generally doesnt attract the best and brightest. Hence, a firm like SS, whose identity is based on L+E has a built a culture of mediocrity that pervades all of its practice areas.

Seyfarth wants to expand its legal footprint beyond L&E. In reality, it has a small-time mentality, as it engages in stealth layoffs and reneges on promises made regarding pay and/or bonuses.

Seyfarth is worthless. This is coming from an associate of these turd brains.