Associate Life Survey: Fear of Firings
We received roughly 850 responses to last week’s ATL / Lateral Link survey on whether you’re afraid of losing your jobs, and things are looking pretty bleak.
Overall, associates are looking much more pessimistic than they were in December, with 28% of associates afraid that they could lose their jobs this year, in contrast to only 10% of associates in December. Summer associates are even more nervous, with roughly 37% afraid that they won’t receive a permanent offer.
Are you afraid of losing your job? December 2007 vs. June 2008
| December 2007 | June 2008 | |
| Yes, and I’m afraid for others at my firm, too. | 5.19% | 16.36% |
| Yes. | 5.12% | 10.81% |
| No, but I’m afraid for others at my firm. | 11.34% | 17.35% |
| No. | 78.35% | 55.48% |
Among law students, 18.58% of respondents said they were afraid they wouldn’t receive a permanent offer, and another 18.58% said they were concerned for both themselves and others.
See breakdowns of who’s nervous by practice area, market, and seniority, after the jump.
Skittish summers might want to consider expressing an interest in bankruptcy and restructuring work, as fewer than 8% of those practitioners said they were afraid of losing their jobs. (And, as we reported last week, more than half of those practitioners said they thought their departments needed to hire more people.)
Breakdown by Practice: Are you afraid of losing your job?
| Yes, and I’m afraid for others at my firm, too. | Yes. | No, but I’m afraid for others at my firm. | No. | |
| Patent | 13.64% | 11.36% | 11.36% | 63.64% |
| Litigation | 14.48% | 8.75% | 17.51% | 59.26% |
| Tax | 3.57% | 21.43% | 14.29% | 60.71% |
| Real Estate & Structured Finance | 30.61% | 26.53% | 22.45% | 20.41% |
| Bankruptcy & Restructuring | 0.00% | 7.69% | 7.69% | 84.62% |
| Other Transactional | 20.35% | 13.37% | 16.86% | 49.42% |
| Overall | 16.36% | 10.81% | 17.35% | 55.48% |
In Charlotte, Atlanta, Miami and San Diego, respondents were particularly pessimistic, with more than 30% of associates in each city reporting that they were afraid for both themselves and others at their firms. In contrast, 85% of associates in Houston feel safe. So, if you’ve been practicing for five years and are looking for a change of scene, you might want to consider waiving into the Texas bar under Rule XIII.
Breakdown by Market: Are you afraid of losing your job?
| Yes, and I’m afraid for others at my firm, too. | Yes. | No, but I’m afraid for others at my firm. | No. | |
| Atlanta | 31.25% | 9.38% | 18.75% | 40.63% |
| Boston | 16.67% | 13.33% | 10.00% | 60.00% |
| Charlotte | 40.00% | 10.00% | 20.00% | 30.00% |
| Chicago | 10.13% | 16.46% | 21.52% | 51.90% |
| Dallas | 15.63% | 6.25% | 15.63% | 62.50% |
| Denver | 14.29% | 14.29% | 42.86% | 28.57% |
| Houston | 0.00% | 7.69% | 7.69% | 84.62% |
| Los Angeles | 16.22% | 18.92% | 2.70% | 62.16% |
| Miami | 30.77% | 15.38% | 53.85% | |
| New York | 13.89% | 13.89% | 17.06% | 55.16% |
| Philadelphia | 22.22% | 11.11% | 16.67% | 50.00% |
| San Diego | 38.46% | 15.38% | 23.08% | 23.08% |
| San Francisco / Silicon Valley | 13.11% | 6.56% | 14.75% | 65.57% |
| Seattle | 14.29% | 14.29% | 28.57% | 42.86% |
| Washington, D.C. | 18.18% | 11.36% | 14.39% | 56.06% |
| Overall | 16.36% | 10.81% | 17.35% | 55.48% |
Although, as mentioned above, this year’s summer associates are pretty worried about the job market, attorneys who graduated before 2003 — who were practicing during the last downturn — are more likely than junior practitioners to expect layoffs. Is another shoe (or Brobeck or Testa or Coudert) about to drop?
Breakdown by Seniority: Are you afraid of losing your job?
| Yes, and I’m afraid for others at my firm, too. | Yes. | No, but I’m afraid for others at my firm. | No. | |
| Before 2000 | 27.6% | 20.7% | 31.0% | 20.7% |
| 2000 | 47.1% | 11.8% | 17.6% | 23.5% |
| 2001 | 16.1% | 6.5% | 29.0% | 48.4% |
| 2002 | 22.2% | 19.4% | 22.2% | 36.1% |
| 2003 | 15.3% | 11.9% | 15.3% | 57.6% |
| 2004 | 13.4% | 10.4% | 17.9% | 58.2% |
| 2005 | 7.8% | 14.9% | 12.8% | 64.5% |
| 2006 | 16.3% | 7.8% | 16.3% | 59.5% |
| 2007 | 19.0% | 8.0% | 16.7% | 56.3% |
| Overall | 16.36% | 10.81% | 17.35% | 55.48% |
A tip of the hat to Debra Cassens Weiss and Amanda Bronstad for reporting on some of the preliminary survey results last week.
—
Justin Bernold is a Director at Lateral Link, the sponsor of this Associate Life Survey.
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first
first
Person below me who posts "first" is a loser.
Looks like the South might have wait a while before it rises again.
Another excellent survey. I love these.
FIRST to say that people who dont do anything other than troll ATL to be able to post "first" are losers.
I'm not afraid of getting fired, but I am afraid that ATL is starting to run a lolcat at least once a week.
First to say that people who don't do anything other than troll ATL to be able to post that people who troll ATL to be able to post "first" (ie 4:11(2)) are losers
Tax people apparently could not care less about their fellow employees.
4:09 seems like your the loser!
where is monday morning sports?!!
Haha. That kitty is not very emotive. Lucky his stuffed friend is more expressive.
The sorry state of affairs brings to mind the classic beer commercial: LET'S VENT!
What if the legal economy stagnates--or even shrinks?
4:22, ha, nice observation.
I'm a tax person who responded to this survey with a simple "Yes.", but it was not because I was not concerned about others. I know everyone thinks tax law is the safe route, i.e., it is easier to make partner (lie), the work is steady (lie) and you have marketable skills when you leave (lie). The fact of the matter is, the tax group is slower than every other group at my firm except litigation. Even if other groups were slow, at least they have someplace else to go with decent pay and decent hours. I'll have to take a 50-70% pay cut to work the same amount of hours as an accountant's bitch if I get canned.
Who thinks tax is a safe route? You might as well be doing space law. My firm has only two tax guys and they're both really old.
More importantly, I signed up for lateral link in order to get the free starbucks card and am wondering where it is. wtf???
Tax lawyers have a harder time making partner. Furthermore, the entire field is one of the least prestigious. A lot of tax lawyers went into it because they couldn't get any other job. Look at the number of tier 3 law students at supposedly top llm programs like NYU and GULC.
Agreed with all the comments about tax. I work in BigTex, where it has traditionally been easier to make partner (generally) than at other firms. Even here, the tax people tell me they have horrible futures. No one is going to make partner because their leverage already sucks, and their exit strategies are low-paying and unexciting. If you have the option, I wouldn't choose tax. I'm a fifth-year in corporate and getting offers for $250k (including bonus and options) in Texas.
Texas sucks. Big women with big hair, big makeup and big trucks.
"Big women with big hair, big makeup and big trucks."
You say that like it's a bad thing.
Texas blows worse than GULC.
6:00 - i guess you havent been to houston. hotter girls there than boston or dc. of course LA is probly the best
5:52 - i guess you havent been to houston. hotter girls there than boston or dc. of course LA is probly the best
6:41 - Wishes they all could be Palo Alto girls.
L.A. has nothing on Houston but attitude, and not the good kind.
Charlottesville gots y'all beat. So sorry.
Anyone in IP litigation (patent) worried about losing their job?
It's been nearly 24 hours and this is the 28th comment (five of which are "First" related) to this thread.
The sky is not falling (at least not outside of Charlotte; though things sound pretty bleak in Miami as well). Are things slow in general, very slow on the overall transactional side and especially slow in RE and finance? Yes, yes and yes. But for the most part, associates in each of those broad clusters are on track to surpass 2000, to come just short of 2000 and to come in around 1800-1900 hours for this year, respectively.
The firms that have already let people go because they were on track to be as much as 200 hours short for the year made very shortsighted decisions. Such firms stand to save between $16-30k for each associate canned. (In some cases, the severance exceeds the savings. Brialliant!) At firms where hour shortages have exceeded the 200 mark, well, that should say a lot about the overall health of such firms (such firms don't see any recovery on the horizon, they're highly leveraged, lack large litigation departments, lack bankruptcy work, have undiversified corporate practices, etc.).
Associate slowdown will be reflected on PPP's as mere rounding errors. Yes, it's much worse for senior associates right now, because they're more expensive. But most of the scrutiny as to billings v. comp should be applied to the partners. And believe me, as a partner (in one of the currently slower practice areas), I will certainly feel that "rounding error" in my reduced comp, and I do feel some scrutiny (though most non-transactional partners seem to be mindful of the fact that we were breaking billing/revenue records up until the fall of 07').
For associates well below hours, especially mid to seniors, much of the shortage can be addressed by simply paying reduced bonuses or, worst case, by paying no bonus at all this year. But no decent firm should address it with layoffs. Allow me to tell you about two law school friends of mine. One has been in-house for about 10 years, the other is married to someone who has been in recruiting (at law schools and at a firm) for about 10 years. Both recall the Shearman layoffs, which they feel reflected quite poorly on the firm. And both view the firms to have recently axed people (especially the SNR types) with great disfavor (i.e., one feels reluctant to send work to such places, the other feels that competitive students should avoid such places).
As has been the case since last fall: Write that article, complete your CLE, prepare a presentation for your firm, attend meetings/events related to your practice area, do some pro-bono, and take the time to turn in especially good work product. These are all things that associates complain they don't have enough time to do when business is jumping (along with seeing their family/friends, exercising and vacationing). They're also things essential to one's development (i.e., to become a partner). Despite the doom and gloom in the media, the anxiety of your fellow associates and the partner down the hall who keeps looking at you as if this whole mess were your (i.e., associates') fault, there are many siliver linings to be made of the current slowdown (assuming you're at a stable firm with any concern for its tradition, reputation and future).
(P.S. With all that has been happening, from the economy to the election, has the world not noticed where the two best teams in baseball reside?)
8:27, you mean the baseball teams from Japan and Cuba?
Dewey Alert: Steve Davis is giving a D&L state of firm address right now. His entire speech so far is superlatives about how D&L is making an unprecedented impact on the economy and our offices are integrating outstandingly. He says associates can make a difference by "taking ownership" of their assignments.
Between the lines = we are SCREWED
11:17, how does that mean you are screwed?
11:17, how does that mean you are screwed?