Career Alternatives for Attorneys: Law Librarian
As we announced yesterday, we're doing a series of open threads on career alternatives for attorneys. If you have a law degree, but can't get into / aren't interested in Biglaw or contract attorney work, what are some other good options?
We kicked off the series with a post about job opportunities with accounting firms. If you have a suggested career path, please email us (subject line: "Career Alternatives"), and include some basic info about the field that you're nominating (e.g., how to get into it, pluses and minuses, salary data, etc.).
Back to law librarians. Longtime ATL readers know that they're hot, as reflected in our law librarian hotties contest (male nominees here, female nominees here, and winners here). And it sounds like their profession is, too. From an enthusiastic law librarian, who works for a university:
Don't forget law librarianship. Great hours, low stress, academic lifestyle, and the chance to abuse law students at will. Nothing could be finer.Seriously, this a great profession. The work is interesting, law students and professors are intelligent and fun to work with, the stress level is low, the pace is comfortable, and I feel like I'm doing positive things for people. I have fun at work every day, and get many of the benefits of the law school academic lifestyle in spite of only having been in the middle of my class at [a top 30 law school]. There are plenty of jobs, many in very nice places to live. I highly recommend it.
Sounds promising -- especially the part about abusing law students. Read more, after the jump.
We started off by asking our tipster: Is additional training needed beyond the JD? E.g., a master's degree in library science?
Yes, for the most you will need to get a masters in library science. It takes about a year, but is not nearly as challenging (or expensive) as a year in law school. There are some exceptions to needing an MLS, but not enough of them to be counted on if one is considering a career change. Library school can be done part-time and online, although as a former practicing attorney, I know that "part-time" isn't always a realistic goal for lawyers.Traditionally, law librarians with JDs (who make up about 40% of the 5000+ member American Association of Law Libraries) have worked in academic (i.e., law school) law libraries, doing reference work and teaching legal research, as well as managing the library. Directors of academic law libraries are usually considered law faculty, with all the perks thereof.
What about law librarian opportunities in Biglaw?
Increasingly JD law librarians are working in firm libraries, where rank and file pay is very good (by law library standards). Doing so can allow you to still be part of the law firm environment, if you like that sort of thing, without the long hours or having to be responsible for cases.
Finally, the $64,000 question: what's the pay like?
Overall, JD law librarians make considerably more than librarians in general. AALL does a biennial salary survey.... I have attached [some tables -- see below]. As you will see, on average, law librarian pay is fully competitive with public-sector law practice, so the cost of "education vs. pay" considerations are about the same as well.
Good stuff. We thank our correspondent for the helpful information!
LAW LIBRARIAN SALARY SURVEY -- ACADEMIC LIBRARIES
LAW LIBRARIAN SALARY SURVEY -- PRIVATE FIRMS / CORPORATIONS
Earlier: Career Alternatives for Attorneys: Accounting Firms
(46) Comments
First. Interesting series
GAY
The only unfortunate thing is that the pay is so, so much higher in BIGLAW and you'd be right back with the same assholes.
4:44 - Are you sure about the pay? The salary scales don't look THAT different (but translating between the different titles and positions is confusing).
are you going to post any series on lawyers working in finance in a non-legal capacity?
4:44--which charts are you looking at?
The ones in this post - refresh your browser, scroll up the page.
-- 4:44
Lat, You're kidding right? How about a manager position at Legal Seafoods?
Not a bad gig if you are:
-- married to a Biglaw lawyer (read: rich spouse / partner);
-- have kids that you have main responsibility for raising; and
-- want something to keep you busy, but not too busy.
Otherwise, I would pass.
4:58(2) - I'm not sure a law degree would have much relevance at all for a Legal Seafoods' manager.
I have a law degree and got turned down for a assistant manager position at Applebees.
Law school librarian is my fall back.
Kind of funny that the AALL members get paid less than the non-members.
4:53pm
The staffing chart is not showing up right now. But American Lawyer do a survey for AmLaw 200 film libraries. The one released last summer showed that there are about 16 Firmwide head librarians who earn more than $200,000/year. I don't know about any law school library director making that much.
http://www.law.com/jsp/llf/PubArticleLLF.jsp?id=1186650119943
Of course, I personally know PLL-SIS people who moved to ALL-SIS with hefty pay-cut, but they get it back with the all valuable "faculty dependent tuition waiver," which can include law school tuition. And many schools give preference to "proffsprings/faculty brats" in admission.
As a law librarian without J.D., I had been thinking about that option for a while. But after unless I change career, the difference in salary does not justify the expense. There are some "indenture servitude" programs out there. For example this program at Williams and Mary.
http://www.wm.edu/law/prospective/admissions/fellowships.shtml
But they all require relocation for me. So I am passing on those.
For people who are really interested. Here is an recent article by Mary Whisner at LLRX.
http://www.llrx.com/features/lawlibrarianship.htm
Can't beat the low level of stress, comfortable surroundings, great benefits (at a univeristy or a big firm). However, given yesterday's critics who said don't work at an accounting firm if you want to practice law, why would you be a librarian if you wanted to be a lawyer. If you don't want to be a lawyer, it is a great job.
@5:13pm.
A lot of law firm librarians are members of Special Library Association rather than PLL-SIS of AALL. So the AALL number is dragged down by all the ALL and SCCLL-SIS members. But one have to figure in the benefits such as above mentioned dependent tuition waivers. Or for the SCCLL-SIS members, the value of defined benefit pension. I even heard of rumor someone at DA's office is on the 3@50 public safety formula!
The choice is this:
(a) work in BigLaw for asshole attorneys; OR
(b) work in academia for wannabe-asshole attorneys.
For $50-80k and another year of school? No wonder these vacancies are hard to fill.
The law librarians at my biglaw firm in NYC sit in on many of the CLEs... to keep their bar active? What's the pro/con in that? Discuss.
There are also quite a few legal jobs in various legisatures: code reviser's office, committee services, house and senate rules, caucus positions, etc.
I'm surprised that no one has chimed in with a job in that setting.
I like to smell books, both new and old. I open the book, flip through the pages rapidly with my nose against the pages. Ahhhhhhhhhh. I also like the smell of fresh Westlaw printouts; there's something about the fresh ink on the page.
Librarians to 60,000!
what exactly is interesting about pulling cites and showing people where the tax books are??
Before I went to law school, I worked in a law school library. Most of the librarians were former lawyers but wanted a less stressful career. They were generally happy with their jobs, with the exception of the circulation librarians who had to deal with a lot of nonsense from student employees and patrons. Professors can also be demanding prima donnas as well, but for the most part they appreciate library staff. One caveat though--MLS programs can be expensive and scholarships are few and far between. Trying to pay off loans from both a JD and MLS program on a law librarian salary can take a long, long time. MLS classes are notoriously dull as hell.
I know 6:42 was just being snarky, but that's not an accurate representation of what law librarians do. They do a fair amount of real research for professors, they teach research & writing classes, and some of them publish.
Will this job exist in ten years? Doubtful
My firm's librarian is so cute, and now that I know she likely makes more than I thought she did makes her that much cuter.
Lat (seriously), can you do a thread on dating (and "dating") people at work? Maybe a survey? I'd ask yes/no, how many, job title of the love/lust interest (summer, staff, associate, partner), whether the other person is senior or junior, whether or not the firm knows about it (and how they found out). Please?
7:32 - As long as there is information, whether it be in print or digital form, there will be librarians. The idea that technology will render librarians obsolete is rooted in ignorance about what librarians actually do. The people who shelve books and check them out to you are usually not librarians. Librarians select those books for purchase--as well as decide what databases, journals, etc. to subscribe to; teach legal research skills to students, professors, and practitioners; decide what goodies you get with your WestLaw or LexisNexis subscription; alert a professor or practioner to a newly published treatise or practice guide; tell you how to find the information you can't find on LexisNexis, WestLaw, or Google is a librarian ...
Shhh! This is my plan! I don't want the word spreading too far.
speaking of librarian hotties, i'm surprised nobody yet has said the obvious... STACK SEX!!!
From U.S. News and World Report's 2008 series on the best and worst careers:
Best Careers: Librarian
http://www.usnews.com/articles/business/best-careers/2007/12/19/librarian-executive-summary.html
Most Overrated Careers: Attorney
http://www.usnews.com/articles/business/best-careers/2007/12/19/overrated-career-attorney.html
"what exactly is interesting about pulling cites and showing people where the tax books are??"
Beats the hell out of what I did all day.
"law students and professors are intelligent and fun to work with, the stress level is low, the pace is comfortable, and I feel like I'm doing positive things for people"
-there are at least four things wrong with that statement
If you want low pressure and good hours, there's no need to go to law school or get an MLS. Just go work as a legal secretary and spend your day on eBay.
TEH GHEY.
As a former BIGLAW associate, I can tell you that law librarianship rocks - great smart people to work with, challenging work, and hours that allow you to have a life. The work is at least as interesting as what I did as an associate. The downside (besides the substantially reduced salary): you do have to have good self-esteem in order to deal with all the ignorance and insults that are so nicely exemplified by many of the commenters here.
what happened to all the hotties contests? Bring back the hotties contests!
I'm a MidLaw librarian with no JD and I'm pretty damn satisfied with my job. Pay is solid and I get great benefits, but I leave the office at 5:30 every day and I don't work weekends. I know more about the law than 90% of the summers and first year associates I work with, and I'm not tied down to one practice group. Yeah, some of it is tedious, but so is document review.
The librarian salaries listed are higher than most of my classmates at a (lower) Top 50 law schoool.
As another former BIGLAW associate, now working at a top 15 law school, I second everything that 8:22AM said!
@ 7:34
Don't date people at work, especially the cute librarian. If you have a messy breakup, who's going to chase down your documents for you?
@ 7:34
Don't date people at work, especially the cute librarian. If you have a messy breakup, who's going to chase down your documents for you?
Wait a sec 12:10, I'm a legal secretary (we prefer assistant, thank you) and my day is only half spent online. And, as an aside, we make more than the librarian. It's a good gig, if you can get it.
2:47 - I'm corporate, so don't have too much use for librarians, but my strategy in that situation would be to use a paralegal as a go-between.
Hi, I work in NYC. Lawyer/librarian but work in finance. Look at Debevoise Plimpton. Lots of finance jobs there and they only take lawyers.
Getting to be routine to have financial analyst lawyers around the big firms ... especially with an Asian or Indian slant.
So how much to the law librarians make in NYC? I see them working over time. I work over time. Does anyone know? I think they work less than I do but they seem pretty stressed.
Low stress? Without the writer even saying it, I knew s/he was in academia. Try biglaw. I've worked in this field in three different biglaw firms for several years, and the stress is real. If Jane Partner needs a document, she needs it now, and so does Joe First-Year when he comes to you just as you're finishing her urgent email request. She's under pressure from the client, and he's under pressure from a partner, and they both need their stuff now. But wait! There are bills to pay, a subordinate who needs to be spoken to, a budget to prepare, and a legislative history to work on. But wait - there's more! Marketing needs your analysis of recent trends in a particular industry, you really need to work on those training materials for summer ass... associates, and when, oh when, willyou get to go grab some lunch?
Yes, it can be really high pressure. Low stress? Make me smile! On the other hand, I can use my JD and MLIS every day without worrying about billing a gazillion hours. And, in theory, I can walk out the door at 5 and be done with it all. The reality is that, while I do leave earlier than any of the practicing lawyers, I always work from home in the evening, but I actually enjoy it.
This is a job where you get to be creative and show off your knowledge of resources that associates will never need to know about - that's why they have us. Think it's all on Google? Think again. There will always be a need for us AS LONG AS we stay current and creative and highly responsive to the needs of anxious associates and (sometimes) pompous partners.
This is a great alternative to practicing law, and I've done both. I'll never make the truly big bucks, but I do okay, certainly better than the "low stress" academic.
I'm a law librarian in academia and the stress is not necessarily low. Lower than being a big firm atty, sure, but I'm also paid far less. I'm in an up-or-out system, so I have to do all sorts of crap to keep my job, including publishing. Law profs can be pompous and condescending. But the worst thing that nobody will tell you is that many (most?) of the people that go into law librarianship are petty, psychotic freaks who compete over ridiculous stuff, have attitude, and generally treat other people like they are dirty, rabid dogs.
Be careful what you wish for...
I'm a law librarian in a mid-size firm. I clerked and worked as an associate in a small firm briefly after law school and hated pretty much every second of it. It's like a different world from this side of the reference desk, though -- suddenly the attorneys aren't out to get you because the smart ones realize you're a valuable ally. Law librarians are incredibly encouraging and helpful to each other, which is also a shart contrast to my experience as a student, clerk, and associate.
Any estimate for the starting salary of a law librarian with there MLIS from U of I (#1 MLIS program) at a BigLaw firm in Chicago with 3-4 years research experience at a litigation consulting firm?