I'll SECOND that.

third...

Williams & Connolly is the best firm of these in terms of prestige.

Seriously. Going five at a time just creates 20 days of content for ATL. All the while when we get down to comparing 90-95, its going to get old.

Yawn at this group

Smarties aren't tart - they're just UK M&Ms.

please, stop this feature. It's not getting any useful comments . . . because it's BORING.

just finished my summer at sidley NY. really only have positive things to say about the firm. seems like the least sweatshoppy of all the top firms- people work hard but its a very humane place to be.

and the summer program is a really awesome mix of the wild summer party (simpson) and the serious learning experience (davis).

What's the best litigation shop to interview in NYC? Cravath, Paul Weiss, Boies Schiller?

What's the best litigation shop to interview in NYC? Cravath, Paul Weiss, Boies Schiller?

What's the best litigation shop to interview in NYC? Cravath, Paul Weiss, Boies Schiller?

Can anyone compare E&Y TARAS vs Deloitte TMAS groups? Thanks.

10-11-12..... if you want a life, go for Paul Weiss. Boies and Cravath give great work of course, but much worse hours).

Okay - these posts are completely and utterly useless.

Personally, I'm looking forward to the discussion about Vault 155-160 (we're going that far, aren't we?)

Summered in Sidley Chicago and enjoyed my experience. Honestly if I was looking for a job in NY, I probably would be looking at bigger NY shops and wouldn't end up at Sidley. It all depends on what you look for in a firm though. If you want to work in Chicago, however, Sidley (and Kirkland) are the best you'll find.

There is little evidence of a slowdown and associates don't seem to be at all fearful of their jobs. Some real estate associates did switch practice groups, though this seems to be on their own initiative and not Sidley's.

I'm not sure how everyone else's browser looks, but when I go to ATL, I can scroll past anything I don't want to read. Mine also has a feature where I can enter different web addresses and go to non-ATL webpages. If you're not interested in the story, you may want to try one of these options.

The fact that some of you see an item you know you're not interested in, take the time to click the jump button, and then scroll to the bottom to let everyone know you weren't all that interested in the piece is funny. You must have a lot going on in your lives.

10:47 works at Seyfarth Shaw.

10:47--they're just trying to provide some constructive criticism, dbag... and i agree, would be much better if it was at least 10 or 20 at a time.

17, they are the same people who believe that the internet is a "series of tubes and pipes." ;-)

Are you really going to go through the entire V100 in 5 firm increments? This is BORING. Kash, you suck.

You Decide!

Kirkland SF v. Sidley (any west coast office)
Kirkland v. Sidley (generally)
Kirkland v. Sidley (IP)
Kirkland v. Paul Weiss (litigation)

14 - are you serious?!?! Paul Weiss is the sweatshop of all sweatshops. i am a litigation associate there, so please convince me otherwise. it is not a place to go if you enjoy a life outside of work.

These firms ALL suck. Why in the world would anyone want to work at one of these dumps? Have some respect for yourselves!

Good to hear you had such a great experience, #9. I'm assuming you split with multiple firms in NYC and that you haven't just blindly bought into the summer recruiting hype. Did you get interesting work? I'm sure it was representative of 1st year associate work, not the type of fun research but utterly unbillable crap those other firms give out to entice you to accept your offer before piling doc review and binder production on you when you start work.

Also, please note that those types of events happen all year round, not just over the summer and no one ever comes back to the office when they are over.

I'm not saying you should regret going there, but please be realistic about the difference between reality and recruiting.

22, as far as IP goes, work for Kirkland over Sidley.

26 (or anyone else)

So other than some obscure practice areas (e.g. international trade where Sidley is strong in), any reason to pick Sidley over Kirkland?

I know this belongs in the former threads, but can anyone comment the hours in a bankruptcy group at kirkland, skadden, or weil? What about the kinds of tasks assigned to young attorneys?

27, I've never worked for Sidley but I'm going to guess that bonuses at Kirkland are better than at Sidley. Other than that I would say that you need to decide what city you want to work in and then evaluate those specific offices of each firm.

After 16-20, can we start doing them in groups of 10? This will otherwise take forever....

25-
did i personally work at every other firm? no, thats true. in fact, thats an excellent point. until I have the time to work at all of sidley's competitors, i really should keep my opinion to myself. what do i know? furthermore, i was clearly WAY out of line for reporting on my experience as a summer- another mistake. i should keep my mouth shut until im at least a 3rd year before sharing any impressions of the firm whatsoever. only those who have worked at all the firms for multiple years can share their insights. i stand corrected.

everyone else- i'm not sure how else to articulate that I had a good experience other than to simply report that i had a good experience. take that for what its worth- especially considering many of my classmates did NOT have such great experiences at the firms they were at, considering i summered elsewhere during my 1L year and considering that i have nothing to gain by relaying to you this very basic, unexciting point.

bonuses are definitely better at kirkland, but silly to not mention that those better bonuses are tied to much longer hours- if you work Sidley-bonus hours at Kirkland, do you get a bonus at all?

28 -

bankruptcy associates at KE work a ton. by far they have the highest average billable hours - somewhere in the 2,500/year range.

that being said, the work is really interesting and substantive. there aren't just mega-bankruptcies, but lots of smaller ones as well (meaning that they're leanly staffed). several first year BK associates have already presented motions/argued in court.

31/32:

The bonuses are bigger at Kirkland for working the same hours as Sidley - that's what bigger bonuses mean. I do think there is less of an expectation that everyone bill 2300+ at Sidley, but many do. They are both great firms; for certain departments Sidley is better, for some Kirkland is better. But if your goal in life is to bill lots of hours and get huge bonuses, go to Kirkland. Either way, though, you will work a lot and be paid well.

27: Sidley bonuses are smaller, but overall people at Sidley are more content. If you want to grind it out for a few years and leave the firm, pick Kirkland. If you want a satisfying and challenging, but sustainable career pick Sidley.

There's no reason not to share an opinion of summering somewhere, but it is definitely not the same as having worked at a firm for a couple years. My summer at one of the above-listed firms was great; I got home around 7, went to fancy lunches a couple times a week, went to parties and after parties paid by the firm, worked on interesting research memos which were supervised directly by a partner, sat in on interesting conference calls, watched an argument at court, etc. As a junior associate, I was getting home around 8:30pm-sometime the next day, working weekends, spending days or weeks out of my home in another state, leaving parties and dinners to go back to work after I got a bbery message, reviewing documents for 12 hours a day, working on briefs with multiple other associates which were supervised by busy senior associates, etc. I liked the firm a lot, but it was not quite the same.

re: Kirkland bonuses

They're based on hours and merit. For the hours part, I don't believe that there's a minimum. If you bill above the firm average billables, then your bonus goes up. For some reason, the number 2,050 sticks in my head as the average Kirkland hours a year or two ago. That being said, your bonus goes up a lot more if you're work is reviewed as being better than your peers.

Actually, if you get reviewed as being far superior to your peers at Kirkland, your base salary can jump a year or two forward - so you'd make more than people in your class (as a base salary).

37: what type of work qualifies as much better? I think an open thread about making yourself stick out from the pack at a firm would be a good idea. It seems like most people end up in the mushy middle of "they're all right."

35:

I wouldn't say people at Sidley are "more content" when bonus memos come out, and they get lower bonuses for doing the same work as their friends at Kirkland.

Your generalizations are ridiculous. I worked at Sidley and had a great time, but plenty of people burned out. And I know a few people who are on track to be partners at Kirkland. It's pretty dependent on who you end up working with and whether you end up enjoying Big Law. There are a lot more similarities than differences between big law firms.

32, yes you will get a bonus. Sidley may have a better face for the work/life balance but you still have a pretty substantial hours requirement. In terms of career progression and bonus the hours needed to be put in are going to vary from office to office for each firm. Not only the hours, but the time of day you work and the type of work you do will vary from office to office as well. I'm going to speak for Chicago right now, in Chicago I would chose Kirkland over Sidley, the hours are substantial at both, Kirkland is probably a little more demanding but not much more demanding than Sidley. Both firms get great work, both firms, in Chicago, are at the top of the food chain. This is just my opinion based off of my knowledge of the Chicago offices of these firms. However if you are die hard Sidley than work for Sidley, both firms would be a fine place to begin a career.

you would pick sidley over Kirkland if you want to work with people who have and value personal lives, aren't obsessed with making equity partner, have senses of humour and stay in good temper even when things are stressful. There are very few a******s there. Also, Sidley has no such thing as non-equity partners. Go to nalp and compare sidleys ratio of partners to associates with Kirklands ratio of equity partners to associates. It's about twice as high if I remember right. Sidley Chicago has been creaming Kirkland Chicago in recruiting from top schools lately for these reasons.

38:

The basic yardstick, I think, is if you're doing work that's equal to or better than people more senior than you are. For example, if you're a second year and you're doing quality work that normally a 3rd or 4th year would do, and you're doing it well, then that could qualify you as much better.

The flip side to this is that once you get rated at the top of your class (as the superstar), woe be unto you if you don't get the same rating the next year. During the last review process meeting, we were told that the firm really looks negatively on someone going from a top of the class rating in year 1 to an average class rating in year 2.

another vote for 10 at a time

Here are some things you may not have considered about the Aon Center and Kirkland Chicago (a friend of mine works there):

1. Lack of dining options -- it's across from Grant Park, which isn't exactly a bastion of great food. Apart from their "okay" cafeteria, there isn't much else in the area.

2. Lake Michigan -- You either have a view of the Loop or Lake Michigan and the park. It's difficult to work in the summer when you can see people splashing water and enjoying themselves across from the Bean.

3. Disjointed floors -- Your supervisor could be on an entirely different floor! NYCers might not find this odd, but people from smaller markets might wonder.

44 -

you fail to mention that we at Kirkland Chicago will be the anchor tenant in a new building currently under contruction in Chicago, so the Aon center will be a thing of the past in the next year or so.

14 - ditto 23. I was a litigation associate at PW until I left last year for greener pastures. While I liked the people I met there, it is in retrospect not the place I would go expecting a life outside of work.

if anyone can, i would take Wachtell litigtion. great prestige (if that's your thing), great pay, but not such a backbreaking schedule as with Wachtell corporate; i pretty regularly get home around 8 unless there is something that really needs doing. wachtell litigation is not up there with Cravath, Paul Weiss, williams and connolly or kirkland, but the benefits more than ouitweigh the negatives.

10-11-12. Go to PW or Cravath if you want to learn how to try a case the right way. Boies shoots from the hip a little more, which might sound sexy when you're a law student but can translate into poor associate training. On balance, I'd say that PW has more interesting work than Cravath, thanks to a better white collar practice and the top securities group in the city, but that's all a matter of taste. Oh, and you're "life outside of work" at any of these places is completely irrelevant to your question, from what I can tell, so I won't speak to that (but be warned that it won't exist at any of them, per commenters at 23 and 46).

48: granted, i was only a summer associate at paul weiss before i decided to go elsewhere, but every junior atty i met there was getting drowned in paper doing doc reviews, running doc productions and priv logs. it's true the firm had a lot of high profile cases, but as far as i saw, "interesting cases" doesn't generally mean better and interesting work for juniors when the stakes are that high.

Any comments on W&C's lifestyle? How it would compare to a Cravath, S&C, or similar NYC firm?

What's a typical day in the life of an associate?

Get to the office and drink coffee?

Doc Review?

Assessing which motions to file? Which causes of action?

What's the deal with Covington? (I'm interviewing with their DC office soon.)

Does Williams & Connolly hire people out of appellate clerkships?

How is Sidley Austin's white collar/government investigations team?

What other D.C. shops are a good place to start for white collar/government investigations?

Thanks for the smart-ass responses and serious responses.

And yes, going to 10 at a time would make sense.

Does Williams & Connolly hire people out of appellate clerkships?

How is Sidley Austin's white collar/government investigations team?

What other D.C. shops are a good place to start for white collar/government investigations?

Thanks for the smart-ass responses and serious responses.

And yes, going to 10 at a time would make sense.

re: kirkland v. sidley. don't know anything about how they match up in chicago, but at least in ny, unless sidley is billing under 2000 on average, there's no reason to pick them. kirkland's ny avg is around 2050 and you get the better-than-market kirkland bonus at that level. i suspect the billable average might be slightly less this year due to slowdown in the market as a whole. i'm on pace to bill a little under 2100 this year.

To add to #37, where you really make a killing come bonus time at Kirkland is from the merit rating. A friend figured out the extra money you make per hour above the average hours not accounting for merit and it was something like $25/hr, which is not worth it. but if you take merit into consideration, the bonuses increase dramatically. This makes sense considering they'd rather reward people for doing great work rather than just working a lot of hours.

How are the associates at Paul Weiss? Congenial? Competitive? "All-for-one . . . "? or Backstabbers?

V11-15 thread summarized so far - The ins and outs of (V10 firm) Kirkland's bonus system

57 - not too many lookers

Are the staff members of ATL to lazy to write an article? Boring! Boring! Boring!

Are the staff members of ATL to lazy to write an article? Boring! Boring! Boring!

This is pure laziness. Write an actual article. Boring! Boring! Boring!

W&C does hire straight out of clerkships, but only a few, if that (many of their summers return, almost all after having completed clerkships).

57, I didn't think associates were competitive when I was at Paul Weiss. Everyone is paid lockstep and gets the same bonus regardless of hours, so you don't need to compete for hours, and everyone pretty much knows they're not making partner, so there's no need to be a backstabber. Other than some elitist snobs (which seem to be at pretty much every firm), people were very congenial and good at mentoring and being team players.

22 (10:59 AM) what practice area? Or at least transactional or litigation?

Kirkland associates seem to have a Sidley complex if you judge by all their trolling on this thread

Two things about K&E bonuses:

1. just over 2250 or 2300 was generally regarded as the sweet spot for maximizing bonus $/hour. Maybe this isn't still true, but it held for many years.

2. If the bonuses are not higher than NYC market this year, what's the general associate reaction going to be? Are the NSPs prepared to be stiffed (relative to recent years)?

Covington DC kicks ass. NOT the place if you want to max out your bonus potential, but a great place with extremely smart people who do very good work. Any specific questions, 52?

Not to derail the Kirkland conversation, but is litigation at Debevoise as horrible as people say it is?

69 - Nobody says that.

70 - yes they do

Note the near radio silence on Covington. It's a non-player. Go there if you like nerds and flying under the radar.

re 66:

Maybe they do or maybe they don't. That doesn't change the fact that Kirkland PWNS Sidley every which way (especially $$$)

Covington is a great firm with a great reputation... but a reputation for being nerdy and intellectual. Should it really come as a surprise that Cov associates aren't reading ATL and posting comments?

Covington is a great firm with a great reputation... but a reputation for being nerdy and intellectual. Should it really come as a surprise that Cov associates aren't reading ATL and posting comments?

There are far fewer a-holes at Sidley Chicago than at Kirkland Chicago. Both of them pay enough that the difference in bonus is a drop in the bucket, IMO. I am frankly relieved when people leave Sidley to go to Kirkland, or pick Kirkland over Sidley, because it generally means I keep working with pleasant people.

I thought Covington's reputation was for being a great local firm. It's not a big deal nationally or internationally but it does well for the type of firm that it is. I've known lots of colleagues that have gone there and seemed to enjoy it.

I've heard that you can bill 1900 at Covington and still come out alright. True?

66 nailed it, and 73 serves as a perfect example.

As someone noted in the V 6-10 thread, K&E people couldn't resist posting in the V 1-5 thread and certainly couldn't resist posting in the V 10-15 thread (because, for the most part, it's a Sidley thread).

I'm quite content as a third-year at another big Chi office (which, contrary to the V20philes on ATL, is plenty "prestigious"), but if I had to choose between the two top Chi firms, though infamously "market shattering" bonuses would be tempting, I'd likely opt for infamously "collegial." (As did two people with whom I graduated.)

The D.C. firms at this (and lower) levels are vastly more "prestigous" than their NY counterparts. If your school is anything like mine -- that is, if you went to a good school -- you'll understand the difference between the kid that went to Covington and the kid that's going to Sidley. That's not to say that Sidley isn't an excellent firm; I'm making the point that the top D.C. firms are notoriously intellectual and tend to attract top 5% types.

i was at a top school, i went to sidley, and i agree with 80. DC is just a more intellectual/harder to get a job place- NY firms wanna make sure they like you, have OK grades, and thats all the care about.

skadden, sullivan, paul weiss, sidley- you do not need As from top schools to wind up there. you need to be semi-likable. DC is all about your transcript.

I agree, being from the east coast, that Covington is a unique and incredibly prestigious firm. But people outside of the DC legal market do not distinguish between someone from Sidley and somebody from Covington.

I truly believe that the "prestige" rankings only matter to law students. In the real world, nobody cares about the difference between V12 and V15, and you're an idiot if you go to a marginally higher ranked firm that's a poor fit, personality-wise.

Covington to pocket protectors free with offer!!!

I'm surprised to hear nothing but love for Covington. My understanding is that there are some pretty significant cultural negatives in the DC office. Is the intensity and level of nerdiness the same at Cov and W&C?

Disclaimer - I'm at Kirkland. That said, I don't think I had a complex because people specifically asked about K&E vs. Sidley, so I think it's fair to weigh in.

Here's the newsflash - Kirkland and Sidley are not that different. I know many people over at Sidley, and their experience is roughly the same as mine. Sure, they're a bit more dissatisfied at bonus season, but for the most part, we all recognize that we work with demanding partners and demanding clients, and that firm management is not soft & cuddly. Sacrifices will be made to make partner at either place. Sidley has the benefit of the single tier system, while K&E offers the easier-to-make non-equity partner (and with salaries around $500k, it ain't that bad).

So I think it depends on the practice area, and more importantly, how you get along with the people at a firm. Truthfully, you're probably only going to work at one of these places for 1-4 years before getting a job that offers civility and a personal life, so you might as well make it bearable. Whether you're getting a $20k bonus or a $50k bonus sounds like a lot to the law students out there, but that difference shrinks after taxes, and if you're making yourself miserable for an extra $20k, you're an idiot. I would happily give up my bonus entirely if it meant I didn't have to work weekends (and I even hear there are places where one doesn't have to monitor one's Blackberry all weekend).

Speaking of law students, a word of advice to the just-finished summer associates -- your experience is irrelevant. At every biglaw firm, a summer associate position is law firm fantasy land. You bill 15 hours a week, take long lunches, are invited to partner houses and dinners (where the partners pretend to give a sh!t about you), and you stuff a bunch of cash in your pocket for the trouble. Your experience can be telling, but only if you make a point to view everything with a cynical eye. Otherwise, the summer is as real as Santa Claus.

Ok, to de-mystify the Kirkland bonus system. There are 2 components - rating and hours. The ratings are on something like a 10 point scale, but for each year it's different. To give an example, a "4" for a 2nd year is "with the class," but for a 1st year is "ahead of the class," and for a third year is "behind the class." That said, almost all 1-3 year associates get "with the class." If you get "behind the class," no bonus, and your salary doesn't go up (though there is a 6 month review in this case which can rectify that by January, so no salary harm done. But still, no bonus). "Ahead of the class" brings a larger bonus than "with the class."

Then there is the hours component. The earlier poster is right, 2200-2300 seems to be the sweet spot, but bonuses in the last couple years have been generous for all. I think they've started at 1800 hours, and at that level, you get what they're paying people over at Sidley for 2000+ hours. More hours, more bonus.

But like I said, the money's really not worth it if you just plain don't like working here. Not to say Kirkland is harder to be at than Sidley. Frankly, I don't know, but I know a few people who aren't thrilled with things over there. The impression that Sidleyites bounce out the door at 5:15 and turn off their Blackberries is a false one. So is the impression that there aren't any jerks over there.

My best advice is to look at where you want to be in 10 years, and realistically consider the best way to get there. But don't go somewhere because you'll make an extra $20k at bonus season, or because single-tier sure sounds better than two-tier.

78: While the "benchmark" (which is still fairly new) is 1950, the average billables last year was 1850. It wasn't for want of work--unless you want a non-negligible bonus and to be on the partner track, you can bill 1800 and come out a-okay. And barring truly exigent circumstances, nobody bills 2200. The trade-off is lower (or no) bonuses--but that's a deal I think most Cov associates are willing to make.

84: The culture isn't for everyone. Socially and culturally, it is very, very low key. Not a ton of socializing outside of the office, and it's generally a quiet place. People interested in a frattier scene with more drinking and socializing might be better off at Gibson Latham etc. But people at Cov are friendly and collegial. The question to ask is what sort of environment you're looking for.

Re Cov DC.

78: While the "benchmark" (which is still fairly new) is 1950, the average billables last year was 1850. It wasn't for want of work--unless you want a non-negligible bonus and to be on the partner track, you can bill 1800 and come out a-okay. And barring truly exigent circumstances, nobody bills 2200. The trade-off is lower (or no) bonuses--but that's a deal I think most Cov associates are willing to make.

84: The culture isn't for everyone. Socially and culturally, it is very, very low key. Not a ton of socializing outside of the office, and it's generally a quiet place. People interested in a frattier scene with more drinking and socializing might be better off at Gibson Latham etc. But people at Cov are friendly and collegial. The question to ask is what sort of environment you're looking for.

For the folks who think "you would pick [S]idley over Kirkland if you want to work with people who have and value personal lives," that you would rather be somewhere more "collegial," that Sidley has noticeably lower hours, and that the difference in bonuses is "a drop in the bucket," I can speak from Sidley's L.A. office that little of the above description is consistent with our experience here, at least in many groups.

First off, there are lots of people billing 2300+ and at least one group I know of has an unofficial minimum of 2200 rather than the firm official 2000. Secondly, the difference in bonuses is huge, we're talking a double digit percentage of your total income for many people, and this is felt in morale, esp. after last year - we are already losing a lot of people, and when the economy improves, many more who are sitting tight for now will jump. As far as the atmosphere goes, there are lots of partners berating associates and who otherwise would not be described as "collegial" by the people who work for them, which is tolerated by the partnership here, and interruptions and cancellations of planned vacations and family events are normal, as are emails and phone calls at home demanding immediate action at 10pm Saturday night, etc. All this talk about how nice it is comparatively and how happy people are sounds like it's describing a different firm altogether.

I don't think are necessarily pro or con on Covington. They're ambivalent, which is to be expected.

Re: Sidley NY:

- 2000 billing req. to hit market bonus.
- Big enough to find a practice group with people you like, work you enjoy, or hopefully both (I think some poster above mentioned working for a "bigger" firm if he/she worked in NY...if that poster was referring to number of attorneys, I think Sidley is one of the 10 largest in NYC?).
- Has a strong corp practice. Capital markets/securitization/ fund work comes to mind.

I have friends who work at Sidley, some love it, some don't. It sounds like a solid place to work, but like any big firm, I'm sure it has its share of faults.

90 - True, and things are fine here in NY, but the bonus difference between someone billing 2000 in NY vs. Chicago for a midlevel was up to $70,000 or more. That's almost 30% greater overall comp here, and this difference, not to mention the difference from Kirkland and other firms, probably accounts for a big drop in associate satisfaction. People I know in other offices were VERY pissed, and have not gotten over it.

If I were a midlevel in Chicago, I'd sure as hell be looking, and I can only imagine how the associates in SF feel paying close to our cost of living and making 30% less, working the same hours. Anyone staying at Sidley outside NY now is probably a sucker unless they're up for partnership soon.

Only one thing to add--past performance is no guarantee of future bonuses.

K&E was behind Sidley on bonuses for a couple of years this decade AND until the last two (maybe 3) years paid lower bonuses in non-NYC offices every year.

Paul Weiss is a total sweatshop. I am a PW associate and want to throw myself out the window pretty much every day.

The partners suck. Complete assholes. And the quality of work sucks. If you're a junior associate, it's pretty much all managing document reviews, doing privilege logs, and creating binders. So you'll learn from here how to make a kick-ass binder, but no one will bother to spend any time on teaching you how to actually be a lawyer. Don't be fooled by people saying that PW has great work or great cases. It's a bunch of crap.

Morale here is incredibly low. Not surprising. But any summer thinking the work is going to be interesting or that you'll have a rewarding career at Paul Weiss is clearly clueless.

Really, you've got to be crazy or have no other options to accept a job at Paul Weiss. As soon as I collect my bonus, I'm out of here.

I was at Cov a few years back. I billed around 2000 hours as a second year. They paid me my annual discretionary bonus three months after I left the firm for DOJ. I always thought that was pretty cool. The people are almost uniformly nerdy and pretentious, but it is an extremely reasonable place to work.

Any thoughts on Covington NY or Wilmer NY?

93, hahaha, I too learned how to make a "kick-ass binder" while an associate at PW.

I agree with 80 and 81. It is much tougher to crack the top DC firms than many of the highly ranked prestigious NY firms. Those NY firms need a lot of warm bodies, and turn to graduates of schools like Rutgers, American, NYLS, etc; top DC firms don't.

Do not go to Sidley NY!! It's completely undeserving of the Sidley brand name and prestige, far below Chicago and DC. The work sucks there, the partners are screamers and liars, and they have absolutely no regard for junior lawyers, including summers. I spent my 2L summer there and got an offer. I told them I wanted to be in a specific group but they said they wouldn't make group assignments till April. When I finally accepted their offer, they emailed me almost right away to tell me unofficially that I wouldn't be able to get my top two choices of practice group, instead only able to pick something I have no interest in; and was advised to explore other options if I really wanted one of those two groups. I wish they'd told me this before OCI and before I accepted the offer. Now I either have to be prepared to be miserable when I start, or put together some hasty applications to other places.

98 - I've worked at Sidley NY for four years across several practice groups and have never seen nor heard these screaming/lying partners of whom you speak or the terrible work conditions of which you describe...if the place is so horrible why did you accept your offer in the first place? A top rate talent such as yourself must have many places to go.

If you work in biglaw the work will often suck and your life will not always be a utopian paradise, but you could pick a lot worse places to be than Sidley NY...I think all but the perpetually disgruntled there would agree upon that.

99 - It's interesting how you didn't fully address the substance of my earlier post. I've heard of screaming partners in at least one group (talking to associates there), and other partners I've worked with have flat out lied to me about my chances of getting into their group. I enjoyed the work I did and the atmosphere, which is why I accepted my offer, but immediately got cold feet once they informed me I was shut out of my two top choices. And given that practice group assignments are not made till April, it was highly unprofessional and tacky of them to reject me outright, especially if they were waiting until I accepted.

I'm not looking for a utopian law firm, I'm only looking for one where I'm treated with respect both personally and professionally. Sidley NY is just not one of those places.