Kash, too long, did not read. You should have, instead, brought in an outside expert to tell me what kind of suit to buy for OCI.

What happens if you accept a cold offer? (i.e., show up for the job). Do you get fired on the spot?

Cold offers are just misleading to prospective employees, and have no real value. The problem is the "everybody else is doing it wo we have to also" attitude. If firms were more honest, maybe they wouldn't have such high turnover.

2 out of 7 summer associates at Sidley LA received offers. 2 out of 7.

Cheers.

Thanks for posting this thread. I've always wondered about cold offers.

I think I could take the letter at face value and work in a cubicle like Milton if I was paid $160,000 per annum.

5's joking, right? RIGHT?!

I actually know someone who accepted a cold offer.

AWKward...

"Please note, however, that what appears in the comments is unverified. So caveat lector."

So apparently Kash learned a thing or two from her royal debacle with the OCI cancellations yesterday.

A summer associate at Alston & Bird was no-offered despite having been given no indication that he had anything to worry about. Quite the opposite, actually. Apparently the reason was something about him choosing practice groups that had too high of an interest and too few of slots (even though general litigation was on his list). In fact, the firm told the summer associates earlier in the summer that this wouldn't happen. As long as work was decent, and you didn't make an idiot of yourself at summer events, the firm would find a place for you--even if that meant putting a litigation person in a transactional group. Not even a cold offer.

OHAI WE NEEDZ U TO MOVE TO DA BASEMENT MMKTHX

you cant really accept a cold offer, as the so called offer will be terminated faster than you can say i accept

Cold offers are very explicitly AGAINST NALP RULES. Law firms could get NALP sanctions if they made a cold offer and NALP found out about it.

I think the cold offer makes sense as a way of dealing with summers who aren't a good fit, but aren't staggeringly incompetent, stupid, or evil. It's a good way to differentiate between, "No hard feelings, but we think you should look elsewhere," and "We don't want you, and we think you'll discredit any profession you work in."

"You should have, instead, brought in an outside expert to tell me what kind of suit to buy for OCI."

If you don't already own a couple appropriate interview suits, you went straight through to law school from college. And no law firm is going to hire you, sorry.

But I will recommend Brooks Bros, they've never let me down.

I'm a 2L at CWT in Charlotte and they gave me an offer AND a former associate's wife, car, house, and suit!

#16 - you're an idiot. Just because you had some terrible job a Citigroup before law school doesn't make you a genius.

Go back to banking.

I will gladly put up with blatant in your face disrespect and a windowless cubicle with doc review type work if I have a job that pays $160,000 per year.

- Loyola 2L

Latham is a total class act.

5:01(2) - Which NALP provision?

How does the provision get enforced?

Shearman gave up 135 offers? If that's true, certainly many of them were cold.

I think that Latham is doing better than CWT these days.

16: Hey, it's #2. If I went to like IU-I or something like that, then yes, I'd be fucked.

/I'm @ a T6
//And, yes, since no one from Stanford, Harvard or Yale refers to the T6, that means I go to CCNB.

Hooray, L2L is back!

I know someone who got a cold offer at a pretty top law firm and accepted. Funny thing is, he did a great job and they ended up loving him. When he left 3 years later they threw a huge goodbye party.

#15

What makes a summer associate "evil?"

Both.

SHEARMAN???? NOT TRUE. YOU SHOULD DIG A LITTLE MORE NO THIS

Cahill gave all 48 summers an offer. Great summer experience. Anyone know the verdict at White and Case?

SHEARMAN???? NOT TRUE. YOU SHOULD DIG A LITTLE MORE ONTHIS

SHEARMAN???? NOT TRUE. YOU SHOULD DIG A LITTLE MORE ONTHIS

Er, make that 15. Wait, am I really arguing on the internet? Time to coax my testicles to drop and let it go.

Cahill gave all 48 summers an offer. Great summer experience. Anyone know the verdict at White and Case?

#26, clearly you have never met Summer Associate Patrick Bateman.

SHEARMAN???? NOT TRUE. YOU SHOULD DIG A LITTLE MORE ONTHIS

13 is right, cold offers are against NALP guidelines. See http://www.nalp.org/assets/library_2/526_0607offers.pdf

I say report that shit to NALP and your school's office of career services.

Guys in my high school used to accept cold offers all the time. It was no big deal.

I'm not sure if #5 is telling the truth or not but if he is that really sucks.

Although it isn't surprising. Sidley LA is a bad place to work anyway. Maybe they are really doing them a favor?

I got an offer - then I think it became cold (although I didnt quite know for sure) when I tried to transfer to another firm location and couldnt. Still went to the firm, ignoring this minor inconvenience -- They treated me fine and I made it work. Two years later I left on good terms for a good job with the government (after moving to the office i wanted that is). Sometimes you just gotta make it work for you and plow through any obstacles.

Cold offers are herpes of the law firm world. You have a chance of getting them if you're not careful, but should you get it, it never really goes away, no matter what you do.

Solution: VALTREX!

There were plenty of A&B SAs who made associates of themselves sufficiently enough to warrant no offers.

The CHLT office summer program was a train wreck.

How about a post on which firms are not giving all (or substantially all) of their summer associates offers? Especially if that was the practice at the firm before, that would indicate a great deal about the health and/or management of the firm.

SHEARMAN???? NOT TRUE. YOU SHOULD DIG A LITTLE MORE ONTHIS

4 - "Cold offers are just misleading to prospective employees, and have no real value. The problem is the "everybody else is doing it wo we have to also" attitude. If firms were more honest, maybe they wouldn't have such high turnover."

Abouth the whole high turnover thing - firms in the law/finance/accounting industries may pretend that their high turnover bothers them, but high turnover is an integral part of their business model. They need to keep the revolving door moving since there is not enough room or need for higher level associates and even less for those seeking to make partners. Firms don't work associates so hard despite the fact that it drives most of them elsewhere within a few years - they do it for that very reason.

IS the Shearman news true, or wha?

I'm going to the market. For lemons.

The Sidley LA thing really doesn't make sense since their NALP directory says they were shooting for 22 summers. 22 to 7 is a pretty solid jump.

Hey Morons -

Cold offers are GOOD FOR YOU.

As a law student, your choice is not between an offer or a cold offer such that if you tell on your firm, suddenly you'll have an offer. The choice is between no offer or a cold offer.

In making you a cold offer, the firm is decently allowing you to slink away, maintain a little bit of self-respect, and apply for other jobs without being branded as an undesirable slacker/social moron/idiot/you name the problem.

Which would you rather market - an "offer" or no offer at all??????

Report to Career Services about a cold offer? Ha! What do you say? "My firm told me that I was a great employee but that it would probably be best to look other places next summer when it really thought I was a worthless piece of crap that soiled the office with my presence"? Cold offers work for everyone involved.

can someone explain what a cold offer is? How do you know you have just experienced a cold offer? what is this passive aggressive behavior?

A&B has ALREADY given cold offers????

cold offer = useful if the no-offer was for other than performance reasons (e.g., economic)

cold offer = misleading if the SA was an unemployable mouth-breather.

Offering the whole class means the firm must be desperate for help - not everyone can or should be a fit for every firm.

SHEARMAN???? NOT TRUE. YOU SHOULD DIG A LITTLE MORE ONTHIS

So question: How do you know you actually got a cold offer? Will you be told outright or do you have to figure it out?

No news from W&C yet...

Giving 100% offers is usually a sign that the summer process is a complete joke.

Miner's Black Lung, LLC gave only cold offers to students from Appalachain State.

Skadden: 358 of 370 SAs got offers

Sidley LA definitely has more than 7 summers. At least 20.

Was there ever any question that SA programs are jokes?

55--don't worry, the firm will make it painfully obvious. The firm doesn't want to leave you with the impression that you have any ability to accept the offer.

61: some will at least trim around the edges up front.

can u sue a firm if they cold offer u, u accept and they reneg?

55, if you can't figure out, don't worry -- you wouldn't get any offer, cold or otherwise.

Skadden hasn't even announced/extended its offers yet.

56 - W&C almost always gives out 100% "offers" (summers are not given offers during the summer, but told that they may call and request an offer in the fall - a request that is almost never denied). The idea is to help out folks whose judges prefer they not have an open offer when they start their clerkship.

Our OCI starts on Monday. I need to know, given that its the summer, can I wear a pink shirt/white collar? Or just go with the classic French Blue/white collar shirt? What about business cards? Its standard protocol among MBA kids, should I get some printed quickly?

64, ever heard of at-will employment?

"a pretty top law firm"

What the hell does this mean?

I received an offer -- of $50 from Judge Halverson for my body

69 - ever heard of detrimental reliance?

It was a decidedly HOT offer from Judge H., I might add.

68 - WOW. Go back to your dorm at Cornell and don't come out until you learn how to dress.

34 - Patrick Bateman was not a lawyer - he was a banker. He went to "Harvard and then Harvard Business School".

Is that true about Shearman?

Or should we dig a little more on this?

37, shame on you. If you are going to do the "frat stud" you have to put some time and thought into it.....TTT

"guys at my high school accepted cold offers to spite the law firm and would then fuck up large deals all the time. It was no big deal"

Now someone please Lothario that one for us. Mafia stud accepted as well, might prove to be a good trend.

I received an offer of $50 from Judge Halverson for my sandwich.

68 - you yutz. colored shirts with white collars are fine... if you want to look like central casting's version of a lawyer or investment banker. Why not just add the dollar sign suspenders to go with it? And no, pink is not fine, solid or with white collar. Jeez, go out and get a blue or white shirt, or a subtle stripe or check pattern. How hard is this? The game is not to dress like what you think is hot shit and stand out...the game is to dress professionally enough to show that you'd fit in at an office, then have your clothes be the LAST thing that makes any impression at all, one way or the other.

Oh, and business cards? Recruiters even laugh when MBA dorks give them out, law students have absolutely no need to.

72 - how the hell would there be reliance if you accept an offer, then they immediately terminate you? What would you have done in those 3.2 seconds?

75, you are boring.

Yes, clearly that fictional character could never ever fictionally decide to become a lawyer in a fictional world where we're talking about fictional hypothetical "evil" associates.

48 is spot on. A no offer is a kiss of death. No firm is goign to hire an associate that didn't get an offer as a SA. Being a SA is the easiest job in the world, and no one wants to hire someone who couldn't hack it.

It another firm had three months to evaluate you and that firm was willing to take the reputational hit that comes with givng a no offer on the nalp form - then the SA is toast.

80 - who says you gotta accept on the spot? A cold offer is held "open" indefinitely, ain't that right?

Mafia stud?

The Sidley LA post above ("2 out of 7") is definitely not true. I wasn't a Sidley summer but I met a couple of them and they had over 20 SA's in their program this summer.

68. You got to be fucking kidding? White shirt only, unless you are cousin Vinny and do not want a job.

Tool.

Business Cards, shut the fuck up.

68. You got to be fucking kidding? White shirt only, unless you are cousin Vinny and do not want a job.

Tool.

Business Cards, shut the fuck up.

68. You got to be fucking kidding? White shirt only, unless you are cousin Vinny and do not want a job.

Tool.

Business Cards, shut the fuck up.

68. You got to be fucking kidding? White shirt only, unless you are cousin Vinny and do not want a job.

Tool.

Business Cards, shut the fuck up.

68. You got to be fucking kidding? White shirt only, unless you are cousin Vinny and do not want a job.

Tool.

Business Cards, shut the fuck up.

68. You got to be fucking kidding? White shirt only, unless you are cousin Vinny and do not want a job.

Tool.

Business Cards, shut the fuck up.

Detrimental reliance? ha. Who thinks 72 is a law student and not a real lawyer?

68 = Touro 3L.

#5's nonsense about Sidley LA couldn't be further from the truth. For starters, Sidley's LA office (the one that rented out the staples center last month) has somewhere in the neighborhood of 30 summers (not 7 as #5's post indicated).

Can we get a thread on pre-clerk summers? I have SO many unanswered questions:

1. Do all firms do them?
2. Do you have to do it at a firm you've already summered with? one you haven't?
3. Do you have to accept an offer before you can pre-clerk summer?
4. If you get a clerkship after 3L OCI can you apply to a new firm to do your pre-clerk summer at?
5. If you pre-clerk summer at a firm that wasn't the firm you summered at 1L or 2L year do you lose offers to your 1L and 2L firms?

AHHHHH.... tooooo mannnnnyyyyyyy questions!!!!!!

72 is a college student who just watched The Paper Chase for the first time.

Guys in my high school used to wear colored shirts to interviews all the time. It was no big deal.

77: Fellow students of my educational establishment were in the habit of considering, and accepting, a certain classification of offers employment that did not, in fact, offer the purported position. Said students nonetheless routinely accepted such "cold" offers, and subsequently, as "the people" would say, "stuck it to the man" by causing significant corporate transactions to go awry, with the attendant rending of garments, gnashing of teeth, and a general caterwauling that was found most pleasing by the perpetrators of same. It was not, to be truthful, a particularly auspicious or noteworthy occurrence.

--First-Time Fraternal Organization Lothario

Is a light gray suit a bad choice for interviews?

W&C (NY): 14 cold offers. Nice of them to give cold offers, at least, although no one believes they needed to hire 180 first year associates.

For the record, Sidley LA has 25 summer associates this year.

- Looking at the (Sidley LA) Summer Associate Facebook

99,

Light grey suit is perfectly acceptable.

102 - that's just cruel.

99 - no

102 -

Dark brown shoes, black, or either?

98, beautiful job on that

84, read this mornings docket you'll understand

- 77

68. You got to be fucking kidding? White shirt only, unless you are cousin Vinny and do not want a job.

Tool.

Business Cards, shut the fuck up.

@ 102: with a grey suit, either black or brown is fine. Just make sure shoes are darker than the suit.

103, what suit colors are acceptable?

51: A&B has given offers an no-offers, because their Atlanta summer program ended a few weeks ago. I don't know if they gave any cold offers. I know of at least one person who wishes they received a cold offer so they didn't receive, instead, the "kiss of death."

41: There's no question that a few of those Charlotte summers made fools of themselves at the summer retreat.

french cuffs OK for OCI?

Wow 68, there's so much wrong with your post, I don't know where to start. Nice flame if that is what you were going for. The business card bit was a very nice touch.

107: my preference with a gray suit is to go with burgundy or cordovan belt and shoes. But black or brown are also acceptable.

My firm tried to cold offer me. I think they were a little surprised when I accepted on the spot.

I start in October. I hope there's no awkwardness!

more details on W&C please

I dunno. I wore black on black with a gold tie to an interview and got the job. But then I was no-offered at the end of the summer.

Given the number of retarded questions about attire we're seeing, I feel the need to clarify 107's point:

You may choose either black or brown, but both shoes must be the same color.

68, are you asking if it is acceptable to wear a hitter shirt as a law student and therefore NOT a hitter? Don't be a fool, wear a basic white shirt.

for females do you have to wear a button down under your skirt suit or can you wear something else?

W&C got too high a hit rate and overhired -- it's as simple as that. Now that we know that a bunch of no-offers will not cause a splash given Cadwalader's recent black eyes, we're cutting as much of the non-T14 trash as we can with cold offers.

118: The less the better.

108,

The acceptable colors are as follows:

Black and charcoal gray.

Sooo, the cold offer provides a means for both the summer associate and the firm to, ummm, not quite exactly tell the whole truth during the fall interviewing sessions. What a great introduction to the profession. What a great example set by these firms. Not.

#113, go for it! But keep that resume handy.

10 - what office of A&B?

41 - you accept offer or not get one?

123 - Atlanta.

Fried Frank New York gave 100 percent offers, to 75 summers.

110: No, French cuffs are too formal. You would also need to be careful with your links. Button cuffs are universally acceptable.

wtf is a "hitter shirt"

68 here. This is no flame. Has anyone even looked what people wear outside today? Pink shirts are business standard and an alternative to the white. It has a less harsh contrast than a white shirt when used with a grey suit (I have a grey interview suit). Just wondering if I should go with the french blue shirt instead. Ciao.

121 - this color is no good?

http://www.uncrate.com/men/images/paul-smith-tonic-suit.jpg

121 - this color is no good?

http://www.uncrate.com/men/images/paul-smith-tonic-suit.jpg

whether a firm gives, and whether a summer associate received an offer is a useful bit of information for students looking at firms and potential employers, respectively. "cold offers" turns something useful into something misleading.

On repeated occasions, students at my exclusive boarding academy who were completely devoid of competence and social graces failed horrendously at a summer of cocktail parties and boat cruises and were later given faux invitations for employment out of pity. It was not a noteworthy affair.

Lothario is unfunny and annoying

128,

Just cause it is "business" standard doesn't mean its appropriate for any interview. While I would highly doubt that a firm would ding you based on what you were wearing why risk it. Just look the part--show them that you can be appropriate for the situation.

126,

Its not that french cuffs are too formal for an interview, but it makes you look like a tool.

133: ....and you are what, exactly? Other than a douchebag?

I know people that have accepted cold offers from PWSP and actually still work there almost two years later. I've heard that they cold offer about 1/2 of their summer classes.

Sorry, but frat stud is getting freakin old.

If I didn't receive an offer my 2L summer, what keeps me from telling my 3L interviewers that I did receive an offer but am choosing to look elsewhere?

68 & Others Worried About OCI attire>> You should dress such that noone remembers what you had on. Pink shirts, bad idea, even a blue shirt w/a white colar probably too flashy. Ladies, wear a skirt suit and a button-up shirt in a color that doesn't stick out. Your goal is to impress the lawyers you meet w/your personality, your ambition, and your potential. If they notice you're outfit, IT IS A BAD THING. You can jazz it up once you get an offer and show up for your first day of work.

Pre-Clerk Summer: I don't know if every firm offers them, but I know most do to the SAs that summerred at the firm as 2Ls. If you didn't summer at the firm as a 2L, you have less of a chance because the firm begins to suspect you're just doing it for the money. But, you have a better shot if you're clerkship is a one-year clerkship because the firm sees it as a legitimate recruiting expense and, therefore, worth the money. Best bet is to go back to your favorite 2L firm and maintain a good relationship there, so that option is open once you're done w/the clerkship. Or, accept your offer (if your 2L firm will let you) and just take the summer stipend many firms give.

68 & Others Worried About OCI attire>> You should dress such that noone remembers what you had on. Pink shirts, bad idea, even a blue shirt w/a white colar probably too flashy. Ladies, wear a skirt suit and a button-up shirt in a color that doesn't stick out. Your goal is to impress the lawyers you meet w/your personality, your ambition, and your potential. If they notice you're outfit, IT IS A BAD THING. You can jazz it up once you get an offer and show up for your first day of work.

Pre-Clerk Summer: I don't know if every firm offers them, but I know most do to the SAs that summerred at the firm as 2Ls. If you didn't summer at the firm as a 2L, you have less of a chance because the firm begins to suspect you're just doing it for the money. But, you have a better shot if you're clerkship is a one-year clerkship because the firm sees it as a legitimate recruiting expense and, therefore, worth the money. Best bet is to go back to your favorite 2L firm and maintain a good relationship there, so that option is open once you're done w/the clerkship. Or, accept your offer (if your 2L firm will let you) and just take the summer stipend many firms give.

"business standard"

"french blue"

"ciao"

128 is a classic.

135 said: "133: ....and you are what, exactly? Other than a douchebag?"

testy, testy.

#68: GET A CLUE. You have awful taste in clothes. Just go against your instincts and you'll do FINE...(and try to keep your foot out of your mouth)

#119:TGET A LIFE...get over the fact that you were picked on when you were younger/had to deal with a scoliosis brace/had to go to prom with a family member, etc...(had to "push back" on your idiotic remarks)

133, Lothario is hilarious if done correctly - see 98.

ATL is a great venue for trotting out classic xoxo flame. noobs.

82 and 88, not true. Blue shirt with a blue collar is fine. I even knew someone on law review at my top-five school who had this ridiculous purple shirt and he got offers from pretty much everywhere he wanted. Grades and to a lesser extent personality are the most important things. You really have to go out of your way to get hurt by dressing inappropriately or the people you are interviewing with are tools.

And yes, a friend worked at Brobeck and they didn't get an offer and wound up at t-10 firm so you are not automatically screwed. It doesn't help but you can definitely pull it off. And I know of at least one firm (not mine) that does do cold offers. I personally think a firm is nicer to give a cold offer than not at all as it helps the person reinterviewing.

Blue, white, and pink shirts are all standard.

68/128

That ain't "business standard" in a law firm setting. Follow the advice from the posters above about which colors are appropriate. Interviews are not the place to stand out because of your attire. Law firms want conservative conformists, no matter what their websites say. Don't like it? Then, stay away from big law firms until you have a large book of business.

Business cards? Now, I would ding a law student for handing me a "card." That just screams that you are an unqualified, pompous prick.

Acceptable clothing is as follows:

Suits:
Dark Blue, Dark Gray, Light Grey. Pinstripes in these colors are also acceptable.

Shirts:
Solid light blue, solid white. Maybe some sort of simple white and blue stripe or check, maybe. Not really dark blue, french blue, or any other high fashion crap.

Don't wear french cuffs unless you want to look like a NYC Tool (note, if interviewing at certain firms in NYC, looking like a NYC Tool can be a good thing).

Ties:
Nothing crazy. "Normal" colors and patterns only please. Anything from Brooks Brothers (that doesn't have animals or other random shit on it) will work well here and aren't very expensive as long as you buy at least two.

Shoes:
Black is preferable as it will go with all of the above without issue and will never stand out. You might be able to get away with brown in some instances but why chance it? As for style, no penny loafers or tassels, you aren't 12. Again keep it simple and classic.

121. You're wrong about black. Acceptable suit colors are as follows: navy, gray, then navy with pinstripes, and then gray with pinstripes.

Cadwalader retroactively rescinded offers for 96 summers, some of which they had extended quite some time ago.

Black is OK only if it has pinstripes to break up the black. Otherwise you look like a mortician. Example:

http://feesfashn4u.com/yahoo_site_admin/assets/images/MensPinstripesuit.292204121_std.jpg

68 and others who think white collar/colored shirts or pink in general are fine for interviews... you're wrong. Even if you can wear it in a law firm daily setting, that is not the same thing as an interview. You may be lucky enough to be talking to the crusty ol' prick at the firm who thinks that only white and blue are accpetable, so why in the hell risk it? What do you really think, that your'e gonna dress so fly that you just blow them away and make them want to hire you on the spot? Conform, you tools. Show a little flare when you get a real job, if you must, but if you don't have the judgment to know when to fit in and when to be flashy, even if you look like a million bucks, you'll be remembered for poor judgment.

Here's another tip... sock colors should match the pants, not the shoes.

If my pants are striped, do my socks have to be striped too?

For a law firm interview you want to dress like an AUSA. A charcoal or navy blue suit is acceptable. Black is ok, but not ideal. Shirt should be white with button cuffs. For a tie, see the advice above about brooks brothers.

This isn't rocket science. Dress conservatively. Wearing a blue shirt, crazy tie or light gray suit isn't going to tank the interview, but it will make a bad first impression. Why choose to do that?

What if my Cole Haan shoes have Nike Air technology in them, is that too flashy? What if it is an IP interview?

Look up a presidential debates on youtube. That's the look you're going for (ignoring Hilary Clinton)

What if my Cole Haan shoes have Nike Air technology in them, too flashy? What if it is an IP interview?

If I'm beefy--like Elizabeth Halverson beefy--is it okay for me to wear pants with an elastic waistband to an interview?

150- Navy was the new brown five years ago. It is pedestrian and suggests that you have less than stellar ambition. I agree that it is acceptable, but I think it gives off more of a contract attorney-vibe than a summer associate-vibe.

I prefer anything in a medium to dark grey. True black does seem to be too much.

If you're interviewing for patent prosecution, I suggest a circuit board-themed tie, or one with equations on it.

Does this work for IP?

http://imagecache2.allposters.com/images/pic/CMAG/956-037~Albert-Einstein-Posters.jpg

Does this work for IP?

http://imagecache2.allposters.com/images/pic/CMAG/956-037~Albert-Einstein-Posters.jpg

"If they notice you're outfit, IT IS A BAD THING. "

If they notice your grammar IT IS A BAD THING.

omg. Is this an uptight east coast thing? I do interviews for my Los Angeles firm and could not give a flying fuck whether you're wearing a white shirt with black suit or a bright blue shirt and gray suit. In fact, if I find your clothes to be boring, that might suggest to me that YOU are boring, which in turn makes me less likely to want to work with you.

You guys have to keep in mind that associates do a lot of the OCI screening interviews. Associates just like the sarcastic, angry, bitter people who whittle away billable hours on this site every day. There is a handful of tools who will care that you're willing to dress like a boring conformist. However, us normal associates (like, the ones you might actually enjoy working for) aren't so OCD. Obviously, make sure your clothes are clean, ironed, good quality, etc. But anyone who would no-offer you for wearing a purple tie or a ruffly pink blouse isn't worth working for anyway.

What do you wear if you're interviewing with AIPAC?

If you are interviewing patent prosecution or IP, don't shower (you do not want to cover up the inmistakeable scent of a patent/IP lawyer). Also, I'd suggest locking yourself in a closet for six days prior to the interview to accentuate your already existing Ausbergers.

@125 Fried Frank is TTT to the TTT power.

23 - What the fuck is B? How could there be seven schools in the top six?

Brooks Brothers suits are great if you are morbidly obese. If you are not a fattie, just shop at a sale in a department store.

Cold Offers: In a vacuum, they're better than nothing. If, instead, firms actually no-offered (say) 25% of their incoming summers for reasons other than leprosy, you wouldn't need them to cover your ass. You could just say, they're shrinking my intended practice group or whatever when you reinterviewed, and there would be a reasonable chunk of your classmates in the same situation. The current system is a little silly, but i'll take it.

164, you are ABSOLUTELY correct in what you are saying.

- caring about what one wears in totally tool and childish. Expecting someone to dress to your liking is pathetic.

here is what you are missing. YOU have a job at a big law firm, the person interviewing with you DOES NOT. And since they do not know which type of person will be the one interviewing, it is better to be safe than sorry. So interviewees should suck it up dress professionally conservative and save those awesome sponge bob square pants matching tie and cuff links for when they have the job.

Should Halverson-esque women wear pants that hide their gunt?

For ladies, wearing a sweater/shell under the suit is fine. Does not have to be a button-down or have a collar. Neutral colors are good though.

164 is probably right, most associates probably won't care as much (if at all). Most of the time, I don't even notice what my interviewees are wearing, particularly during OCI where its rapid fire. But the point is, you don't know which associates do and which ones don't. And that's info you can't find on the firm website or the NALP sheet. Simply put, you'll find out the hard way if you erred in being too casual.

And, interviewing with a partner over the age of 40? You deviate from the standard business set at your own peril. It will most likely be noticed. At least at my firm.

What's the feeling on camel toe - yea or nay?

What about a thong?

A black suit is NOT appropriate business attire. Black is appropriate for a funeral only.

sorry, but "us normal associates"? not sure you should take advice from that guy

what about a white suit, black shirt, black bowtie, and white shoes?

178.....Can I hire you??? 190k starting, plus bonus. Please send your resume to webepimpin@showwttyyyy.com as soon as you can haha.

I had a white friend who went to Howard. To fit in he wore this: http://images.buycostumes.com/mgen/merchandiser/18450.jpg

A black suit is fine. Geez. It's as conservative as you can get, but it's still fine. Wear a white shirt and a decently colored tie and you don't look like a mourner.

For females, I think shells are fine, but button downs tend to stand out more.

lol @ 177, proving my point.

'Cause, you know, pointing out a typo in a blog comment is TOTALLY non-toolish. *eyeroll*

Also, I'm not a "guy," but thanks for playing!

100 does not know what he/she is talking about.

"W&C (NY): 14 cold offers. Nice of them to give cold offers, at least, although no one believes they needed to hire 180 first year associates."

W&C NY had 113 (not 180) Summer Associates. If the poster cannot even get the number of summers right, then he/she clearly does not know anything else about the offer process at the firm.

Black is not fine, unless you are in a wedding or are going to a funeral.

light blue or white shirt.

Shine your G_d damn shoes. No chunky toes. . . unless your are trying to get a slot at a dot-com firm circa 1998.

Buy a Hermes tie you cheap bastards. Like Spartacus killing his horse: if you get the job you can buy all the Hermes ties you wish, if you do not you will have no need for nice ties at all. You can borrow frayed, gravy stained ties from your fellow public defenders.

Howrey's DC office extended offers to 16 of its 17 summer associates. None were cold offers.

180 -- you sir, are a tool. so not funny.

Howrey's DC office extended offers to 16 of its 17 summer associates. None were cold offers.

#5 may have been spot on. The IP group at Sidley-LA has its own summer program....and they have....7 summer associates.

I hated the firm I summered at. Miserable bunch of tools. So I didn't go back. But people will forever assume that I didn't get a real offer. So yeah, I think cold offers are bullshit.

Maybe I'm in the minority but I absolutely do no agree that a SA should coddled throughout the summer and are entitled to an offer.

I want to know that an SA won't wash out in a year because they had no idea what "firm life" was really like. If they can't handle 10 weeks of it, how are they going to handle 10 years?

Now I also don't agree that you should take on 10 SAs knowing that you only have room for 5 but if you take 10, I want to know that all 10 have what it takes.

Of course I work for a high end boutique firm so we can't afford to take on associates with a 30% attrition rate. And my firm typically no offers a few SAs every year. They all either had a overinflated sense of entitlement ("I can't believe I have to stay until 6!", did something idiotic ("I love to pad my hours!"), or just did mediocre work. I don't feel guilty about it one bit.

In other news, I start law school in three weeks. Someone told me about this site recently. Now that I've been reading up on it, I'm starting to think 3 years at Florida Coastal Law isn't the best use of my time and money. HELP. What do I do?

192: I hear Wal-Mart is hiring.

You ADD degenerates; how did this devolve into a discussion about ties. what is a cold offer? and before you quickly distracted into hurling insults...my offer is in the bag.

You ADD degenerates; how did this devolve into a discussion about ties. what is a cold offer? and before you quickly get distracted into hurling insults...my offer is in the bag.

191 - is this your boutique firm?

http://www.papeandchandler.com/

193 -- very funny. I left a pretty good job in insurance sale to go to law school. I need real advice here.

-192

shearman has no doubt given cold offers, 2Ls beware

http://www.papeandchandler.com/floridabar.html

LOL...classic

#192, I somehow can't believe that you're being honest. There's way too much information available online about the dangers of going to lowly ranked law school and then drowning in the debt for you to be conveniently discovering it a few weeks before school begins...

But at the risk of being humiliated, I'll bite. Get out. Now. Unless you have a guaranteed spot at a firm of any size in your area, it will be all uphill from here. As in K-2/Everest uphill. I don't have inside information on Florida's legal market, but I can't imagine any firm remotely concerned about "prestige" (and yes, it's a silly concept, but it also is the rule in the legal world) hiring from Florida Coastal. If you want to do anything remotely resembling big law, you'll need to finish the first year in the top 5% of your class and transfer to a top-50 regional school. That will get you into a medium sized Florida (or other state) firm with 100-300 lawyers, paying around $100,000 a year. Otherwise, I don't see you matching the salary that you probably made in your past career until several years down the road.

You may have the option of going small law or solo straight out of school, but that's not a great alternative. When I was in college, I worked for a sole practitioner: it was decidedly not glamorous. He had to take anybody that walked in the door and pray that they paid him. He made a decent living for a small town, but he sternly advised me not to go the same route.

All in all, if you're dying for a chance to be a JD, I won't tell you that you made the wrong choice (although plenty of others on the board will). Just know that it won't be easy anytime in the foreseeable future.

200 = spot on.

192, 200 is absolutely correct. Only go to Florida Coastal if you just want to be a lawyer...but not if you want a shot at bigaw...or mediumlaw...

192, 200 is absolutely correct. Only go to Florida Coastal if you just want to be a lawyer...but not if you want a shot at bigaw...or mediumlaw...

189, all of the Sidley LA IP summers are still working (except for the one that hasn't arrived yet). Sidley LA doesn't even make offers until the program ends.

I didn't get an offer last summer at a Big Law shop in D.C. and this was after receiving constantly positive oral and written evaluations at the mid summer AND exit interview with the hiring committee. The only real feedback they gave me when delivering the news was that they miscalculated their workload needs in the practice groups I worked with and therefore would not be able to make offers in either of these groups. Needless to say, this result royally screwed me over with other firms notwithstanding the fact that the hiring partner and others offered to verify the quality of my work and positive attitude. Bottom line, I am still looking for a job and the prospects are dismal to say the least. Once it became clear how fucked over I was going to be with other places, I asked if I could get a "cold offer" or at least tell people that I was given an offer...the firm said that they understood my situation but that such a practice would violate NALP rules and the firm's own internal ethics rules. They have tried to help send my resume around, but with no real results. I think I am really screwed and its not even my fault.

200 -- thanks for the advice. What are my odds of transferring to a better school? I actually had a decent LSAT score, I just decided to go to Florida Coastal cause they gave me $7,500/year and it's close to where I live, so I don't have to move.

I heard Shearman will not give offers out for the next two weeks, which would not appear to bode well for the SAs.

Appropriate attire:

Dudes - no one notices your shoes. Just don't wear too much cologne.

Ladies - I don't think you need to wear a button-down, and I won't be "more" impressed if you do. However, if you opt for something else - make sure it is clean and pressed and does not look like a t-shirt you bought in H&M because then I just don't think you're taking it seriously.

Oh yeah, and don't announce that you're going to the ladies room (while on a lunch interview) to remove your stockings. We won't notice that, but I definitely thought it was weird when a candidate told me that. Just don't wear stockings and make sure your skirt is long enough, or better still wear a pant-suit that is in lightweight summer material.

Appropriate attire:

Dudes - no one notices your shoes. Just don't wear too much cologne.

Ladies - I don't think you need to wear a button-down, and I won't be "more" impressed if you do. However, if you opt for something else - make sure it is clean and pressed and does not look like a t-shirt you bought in H&M because then I just don't think you're taking it seriously.

Oh yeah, and don't announce that you're going to the ladies room (while on a lunch interview) to remove your stockings. We won't notice that, but I definitely thought it was weird when a candidate told me that. Just don't wear stockings and make sure your skirt is long enough, or better still wear a pant-suit that is in lightweight summer material.

If the 3L interview cancellations continue apace, the concept of a "cold offer" will be completely irrelevant for most of the 2009 free agent class.

I am not sure if everyone at Shearman got an offer, but I got one today; the whole two weeks thing was more logistical than anything.

Gentleman at my preparatory academy were frequently flummoxed with respect to the appropriate attire to be worn by a gentleman when attending an employment interviews. Some preferred to be clad in ordinary knickerbockers or trousers, while others selected gaberdine wool suits. I assure you most earnestly, such occassions were inconspicous. and, in fact, rather commonplace.

-Fraternal Lothario

I become increasingly sad with each click of the "refresh" button that does not yield a new comment to read.

I think I need help.

I wish I was at Latham :(

What's HofstraMagna's take on this?

Seriously, I think he should be an editor for ATL. Maybe not the editor-in-chief, but a regular columnist.

http://abovethelaw.com/community/2008/07/this-one-time-at-hofstra.php

He's leaps and bounds better than the the ATL Idol contestants.

so what does a cold offer actually sound like? do they say, this is a cold offer?

Is a suit like this acceptable for an OCI interview?

http://shop.nordstrom.com/S/2950374/0~2376777~2374609~6015291~6015324?mediumthumbnail=Y&origin=category&searchtype=&pbo=6015324&P=2

How about a blue shirt like this?

http://www.saksfifthavenue.com/main/ProductDetail.jsp?PRODUCT%3C%3Eprd_id=845524444148223&FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id=282574490726909&ASSORTMENT%3C%3East_id=1408474399545537&bmUID=1218085098594&ev19=1:1

What about these ties? (both in black)

http://www.brooksbrothers.com/IWCatProductPage.process?Merchant_Id=1&Section_Id=212&Product_Id=841983&Parent_Id=210&default_color=Black-white#

http://www.brooksbrothers.com/IWCatProductPage.process?Merchant_Id=1&Section_Id=519&Product_Id=1257053&Parent_Id=210&default_color=Black

I also got a Shearman offer recently. So did another friend of mine.

Kash, great thread. Also, great pic of Milton and great caption.

You're the best.

192,

Kill self.

192, drop out now! (then kill self)

192: General advice to anybody is to do some serious soul searching before entering this profession. That said, I have heard that FCSL has a higher bar passage rate than any other Florida law school, including UF. Big Law in NYC, DC or any other large city may be a long shot. But there are plenty of medium-to-large firms in Florida where you will be able to have a long and hopefully successful career.

For the fashion forward going through OCI: Wear a seersucker suit to your interview. Get extra bonus points.

191: The problem is that the firms send mixed messages. They tell us repeatedly not to take work home. Come in at 9:30. Leave at 5. Go out to 90-minute lunch with people every day. Cut out for golf at 2 (or other firm-sponsored events). They often don't even give us enough projects. When are we supposed to do this quality work?

Every "mid-term" review is the same. "Good job! We hope you like us!"

I'd have no problem with no-offers if firms were upfront about their expectations instead of acting like the ugly girl trying to get a date for the prom. If you expect me to bill 7-8 hours a day, tell me. If you expect me to do six projects or 25 projects, tell me. I'll gladly do it. If I'm not meeting expectations, give me a chance to fix it. But if the hiring partners are all telling me NOT to work too hard and just enjoy the summer and city....?

136 - regarding PWSP, I'm with you there. I was a SA back when it was just SP (the year befor ethe merge), and I heard through the grapevine that they cold offered about half our class. It was a pretty big class.

183, a typo is when you press an incorrect letter on the keyboard, such as this: dumnass. See how I pressed the "n" instead of the "b?"

When you mistakenly substitute the word "you're" for the word "your," you are not making a typo, you are showing that you are stupid.

225 - You should have used a semi-colon between the last two clauses. Ass.

Dear 225:

Good proof readers are a dime a dozen. In addition, intelligence has nothing to do with it.

Say something interesting or STFU.

HINT: Posting about another’s misspellings or misplaced punctuation in an on the fly blog post is not interesting.

222- You are crazy. FSU has the highest bar passage rates by far.

200 hit the nail pretty much on the head, except that simply going to FSU or UF and finishing in the top 1/3rd does not necessarily equate to a job, especially in the current market in FL, and that you probably can finish in the top 15 percent and transfer to UF or FSU.

192: you probably want to go to the best law school you can go to, do well (top 10%), then transfer to the best law school you can transfer to. Then you may get biglaw. Taking a measly $7500 is not enough to justify the low quality of the school. $25,000 sure.

sidley ny = everyone got offers.

Another story geared to first and second year law students. This blog has become more uninteresting every day this summer. You're serving a great function for law students who don't know shit about about law firm life and I am sure they are learning a lot, but the coverage has been overwhelming. Not so much a legal tabloid anymore.

I can confirm at least two people in the NY office of Kelley Drye did not receive offers.

does anyone know what is happening with offers at mayer brown NY?

Mayer Brown NY is closing its doors.

217. Stop being a tool and wanting to wear black ties.

For everyone posting things about Sidley's offers:

The Sidley summer program is not over. Offers are not given to anyone until after the conclusion of the program (which is NEXT week).

A&B is giving 49 out of 51 Atlanta summer associates offers (real-life come and work here next year offers). I'm on the hiring committee and I know we don't do cold offers. We're GD DisneyLand over here and (occasionally to our own peril) give offers to everyone.

223,

For the typical person that doesn't get a SA offer, there are a LOT of warning signs. Someone has talked to the summer before hand.

As for the quality work goes, it's just not a high bar. You barely have any work to do as a summer associate, so do it on time, follow instructions and proofread. It's not a complicated formula. You usually have to mess up several projects to raise any red flags.

204 and 236: Although what you are saying is probably true, it doesn't mean the decision hasn't already been made.

Jesus Christ, to everyone saying black suits are bad, clearly you wore a black suit to your 2L interviews and got no offers, but don't think its your suit. Its you. I, along with I'd say like 60-70% of the guys at my school interview process wore black suits (with nice ties that arent morbid) and everyone got jobs.

Black is boring and possibly conformist. But you will NEVER get noticed for being too conformist.. White shirt, black suit, colorful tie. Good resume. Thats all it takes.

And 192, might be too late now, but NEVER EVER take money over going to a better school (unless you have no ambitions of big law). Always take the debt. Always always always. Unless they give you a full ride + CoL, its not worth ti bcause you'll just grad with no job or a lesser job and that just blows.

Guys on my crew accepted whatever fcking offers they fckng want to, you got a problem wit dat or somthing?

- Mafia stud

Whatever. All of you anti-black suits are totally wrong. If you're a girl, you can absolutely wear a black suit.

241: Terrible. Never do that again.

Black suits are not appropriate business attire. Wearing one won't cost you an offer, but you'll look stupid to anyone who knows anything.

I had no clue when I got SA no offered from BigLaw. No one talked to me beforehand. I couldn't get anyone to talk to me about it afterward. I must have royally pissed off someone.

For about 3 months, I couldn't find another BigLaw job since I was no offered. OCI was nothing.

I have since excelled at an appellate clerkship, job at bigger BigLaw, and finally now in-house for big business.

And I already get to direct some business to law firms. Revenge is sweeeeeeeeeeeeeeet!

Paul Hastings DC = 100% offers

165, about the ruffly pink blouse. I was wanting to wear mine but the other guys in my law school class said it wasn't professional enough for interviews. What firm are you with? I want to interview there.

if 200 is still around, don't panic.

Biglaw is almost certainly closed to you coming from Florida Coastal but who really cares? this board is one giant bitch session about biglaw anyway.

You will probably end up as a DA or public defender, whether in miami or a small outlying county will depend on how you do in school. You won't make terribly much money at first, but the work will be a hell of a lot more interesting than being an insurance agent. You will see a courtroom, for instance, unlike most biglaw associates. The compensation problem will change as your career progresses and you are either promoted up the ladder or shift to private practice. Ten years out, if you thrive, you may even run for office as a local judge or council member or something.

So as long as you're in it for the interesting work rather than the compensation,and you're graduating with a manageable debt burden, you will be fine.

I'm calling BS on the "no french cuffs" thing. Button cuffs are for stylish engineers (non-stylish engineers wear short sleeves with tie). You're interviewing to be a lawyer, look like one. Also, no tab or button-down collars -- both of which look rEdiculous. Finally, tie a real knot -- no half windsors.

That will be all!

What's wrong with a half windsor?

What is wrong with black ties? Why is that toolish?

For dress shirts.... CHARLES TYRWHITT.

www.ctshirts.com

205- what firm? I think we've had a similar experience.

I'm an interviewer for a BIGLAW firm (V20), and if you wear french cuffs to OCI I will throw you out of the room on the spot. French cuffs scream "douchetard."

Black suits are OK, but gray or navy blue are best. Gray is the most commmon, I would say.

All of this meaningless, stupid focus on style won't make up for a lack of substance. Unless you're dressed ridiculously, don't expect it to make a difference either way.

180 = hillarious

217 = unless you meant to wear the tis in blue, never wear a black tie with a blue suit. also do yourself a favor and no blue shirt even from armani. go with white and either armani or brioni for suit etc.

also brooks brothers stuff suck for the slim guy, it will not have that european slim fit which is definitely the nicest classiest.

essentially, however, its not the suit its the person. just be presentable (brioni, just joking as armani will do) and make a good impression. this means try not to be a todays kid and stick in "like" etc every second.

again, though, ultimately its the person.

180 = hillarious

217 = unless you meant to wear the tis in blue, never wear a black tie with a blue suit. also do yourself a favor and no blue shirt even from armani. go with white and either armani or brioni for suit etc.

also brooks brothers stuff suck for the slim guy, it will not have that european slim fit which is definitely the nicest classiest.

essentially, however, its not the suit its the person. just be presentable (brioni, just joking as armani will do) and make a good impression. this means try not to be a todays kid and stick in "like" etc every second.

again, though, ultimately its the person.

165 - Get a life, dickwad. Seriously. Clearly I know the difference between your and you're, as evidenced by the proper use of the word three times in the preceeding sentence. Clearly, I do not proofread my posts on ATL to ensure I do not make any grammatical errors. I have a job--I don't have time to worry about grammar on an anonymous blog.

-139

And, 68, I would be more conservative. Pink might be business standard, but here in Big Law there are always certain partners and lawyers who will judge you for trying to be too flashy or high fashion-y. When I was interviewing I was SO pissed about the "dress conservative" rule. I'm a woman and I HATE skirt suits, but that is what the partners in Big Law firms expect.

But, I'm glad I followed Career Services' advice--I got many call backs and offers and am as happy as a third year associate can be. And, since crossing over the the other side, I've seen fellow lawyers give an OCI interviewee a negative review because she didn't dress conservatively (she wore red pumps with an appropriate black skirt suit). This partner's logic was, "if she's not intelligent and respectful enough to find out what is appropriate to wear to an interview or heed the overwhleming advice on how to dress even if it offends her sense of fashion, we don't want her. She won't figure out or follow advice on how to interact with clients either." And, she didn't get a call back despite LR and top 10% at a tier 1 school. This is not a something that's worth taking a risk on.

217 - Don't wear black ties to interviews. Everything else is fine, although I don't know why you are going for blue over white.

"NEVER EVER take money over going to a better school (unless you have no ambitions of big law). Always take the debt."

This only makes sense if your choices are between a top tier school and a non-top-tier school. The difference in opportunity between going to a school ranked 62 and one ranked 85 is negligible, except, possibly, on a regional basis. Once you are no longer looking at top tier schools, your best choices are (1) to skip it or (2) to go for the lowest-cost alternative.

why is this thread completely focused on men's attire? The guys seem more obsessed w/ fashion than women.

Shirts for women: button down = fine. Shell = fine. Don't show cleavage (hard for me to do even in a bikini, but if you're well-endowed, don't wear a v-neck. You don't want interviewers looking at your boobs, even if they're fabulous.)

Skirt-suits v. pants suits? IMHO, Pants suits = absolutely fine. I rarely even wear a skirt suit to court. Wearing a skirt suit in an interview probably requires hose. You won't ever need to wear them to work, but you risk inteviewing with a dinosaur partner (usually a female) who finds lack of hose obscene.
Bottom line, just don't dress like an idiot. I've interviewed on campus and on call-backs more times than I care to count, and I can't remember ever noticing an interviewee's attire. It doesn't need to be extremely expensive. Most of us undertand the life of living-on-loans student. If you look like you walked out of Neiman's or Barney's (with a stupid Heremes tie), we'll assume you have rich parents and resent you.

My two cents on #260's comment: even in tier 1/T14, I think there are times when taking the money is not a bad idea. I got into three Top 10 schools (not HYS--that might change the calculus) and three other T14 schools, with a full-ride at two of them. After weighing options, I went with the full-ride. The difference between a top 5 and a T14 is all insurance--BigLaw recruits out of the top two-thirds of a top 5 school (or so) and the top third or quarter from a T20 school. I knew I could be in the top 10%, so it made no sense to turn down a scholarship worth over $120k.

More details on A&B please.

Essentially, if you can get a full ride at any T14 compared to any non-HYS law school, its a no-brainer to take the full ride.

There are some differences between Columbia and Georgetown, but it not much if you are an above-average student. The top 25% at Georgetown probably do better than anyone at Columbia outside of the top 40%. And what that full ride can mean for you several years down the road is priceless.

Re: Sidley LA IP summer associates - Yes, it's somewhat of a separate program, but not really. Everyone is recruited specifically for IP and tends to only take IP assignments, but the rest is run through the same summer associate program. However, the 7th IP summer hasn't even arrived yet, and *none* of the IP summers have finished the program. In total there are nearly 30 Sidley LA summers, and only about 4 summers have completed their program yet. Anything that differs from what is written in this post is bogus.

"7th IP summer hasn't even arrived yet" - when's this person supposed to make an appearance? At the farewell reception?

Holland & Knight (DC) 100% offer to their class. Anyone know about Piper (DC)?

240 - Black is not boring and conformist, its boring and non-conformist. Its boring and morbid. I've worked in i-banks, in-house, and big law, and I can honestly say I only recall one single person who wore a black suit. He was also tall and skinny, and nicknamed the Undertaker. You can guess why. If there were people at law firms wearing black suits, then fine, conform, but if you actually open your eyes and look at the people you would meet if you were lucky enough to get a call back, you'd see you were wrong. They're non-existent.

And ALWAYS take rank over money? You're just showing your lack of sophistication again. I hapily took a half-ride at a top 10 school in lieu of a top 5 (non HYS) school, and saved $80k of debt in the process, not to mention quality of life while a student.

268 did you mean money over rank?

I did the same thing. Did not get into HYS. Got into roughly 6 schools from the middle of the T14 on down. Took the money at a lower ranked T14. No debt. BIGLAW.

I always go on interviews wearing a powder blue tuxedo with my dick hanging out.

I agree it can be smart to take the full ride over a higher tier school. I took this route and paid off what little student loan debt I had after 3 yrs.

I also worked at BIGLAW until I was ready to go in house. I had the choice to leave because I wasn't paying off huge student loan debt.

261 - "why is this thread completely focused on men's attire?" uh maybe because atl is made for da boyz.
you would be better working on that cleavage situation of yours

267 - I know about Piper (DC). Piper (DC) = TTT

Bingham DC gave offers to all its summers.

H+K (DC) = TTT

Is it weird that Jon Stewart is wearing the same tie tonight that #217 linked to?

I dont know about Sidley LA, but sidley NY gave its offers already- summer program ends tomorrow, and everyone in the NY office got their offers in the past week or so during exit interviews.

Latham NY did the same thing Latham DC did - Conference Room + 100% offers. All 82.

Lat,

People have been getting cold offers. You should dig more into this.

Dewey & Leboeuf New York gave 100% offers. All 90.

Weil NY- 100% :)

192 Bilzin Sumberg in Miami is looking for a full time law clerk/ paralegal that is deferring law school for a year.

Apply for that instead. You are almost guaranteed an offer at the end of it.

As for Florida Coastal.......... Do something else for a year and reapply. I don't know anyone who got offers from there.

This 100% offer thing in a conference room is very classy. I sort of expected my firm to do it, and I heard they had in previous years, but didn't this year. My offer came in private, and I'm a little worried about my fellow summers.

Though I can't imagine any decent firms giving less than 100%. It's not worth the recruiting hit. Let the kid join and get weeded out when he's an associate. It's a little cruel, but at least it gives the kid another chance to make a better impression.

This 100% offer thing in a conference room is very classy. I sort of expected my firm to do it, and I heard they had in previous years, but didn't this year. My offer came in private, and I'm a little worried about my fellow summers.

Though I can't imagine any decent firms giving less than 100%. It's not worth the recruiting hit. Let the kid join and get weeded out when he's an associate. It's a little cruel, but at least it gives the kid another chance to make a better impression.

This 100% offer thing in a conference room is very classy. I sort of expected my firm to do it, and I heard they had in previous years, but didn't this year. My offer came in private, and I'm a little worried about my fellow summers.

Though I can't imagine any decent firms giving less than 100%. It's not worth the recruiting hit. Let the kid join and get weeded out when he's an associate. It's a little cruel, but at least it gives the kid another chance to make a better impression.

Paul Hastings SF = 100% offers

First: I think W&C probably made offers to most if not all of their summers because it appears that they have SERIOUSLY curtailed their OCI for this fall.

Second: To wear to your interview. (1) navy blue suit, white shirt (arrow or spread collar and no french cuff), club tie, burgandy belt and shoes (black if you have to). (2) Grey suit, white shirt, club tie or subtle pattern (if the first thing someone notices about you is your tie you are wearing the wrong tie) if the suit is light grey then brown belt and shoes otherwise black. Brown suits were in style for about a month in 1980 because Reagan wore them. No brown, no black, no chalk pin-stripe.

Akin Gump NY gave 100% offers, and I should say was one kick-ass summer.

Winston and Strawn NY gave offers to 100%

Paul Weiss, 100% Offers

the firms giving 100% offers --- are any of them staggering start dates?

138:

"If I didn't receive an offer my 2L summer, what keeps me from telling my 3L interviewers that I did receive an offer but am choosing to look elsewhere?"

Go right ahead. Your 3L interviewers will know someone at your 2L summer, check up, and you'll be blackballed. Happened to a classmate of mine.

what about getting no offered as a 1L - same stigma? this is not reported to NALP so there is no incentive for the firm to cold-offer

Anyone hear about offers from Quarles, Godfrey or Foley?

For the record, DLA Piper no-offered ~25% of their class this summer.

On the rank/money thing-- I went to a top 5 law school, turning down full tuition plus COL at a school ranked somewhere in the 30s-40s. Was scared spitless at the thought of all that debt.

Then I lost a parent during my first semester of law school. Couldn't focus on school; grades were embarrassing. But, because of my school name, I got offers at 3 of the V5. If I'd taken the full ride, I doubt I would've gotten a job at all-- I might even have lost the scholarship.

Take the rank over the money-- it's like paying for home insurance. Pray to God your ass doesn't need saving, but make sure you're covered anyway.

You should definitely stay away, far, far away from REED SMITH- they no-offered some summers without any warning or notice, and allegedly the NYC office did not have permission or even inform the home Pittsburgh office-- certainly some management issues brewing there.

You should definitely stay away, far, far away from REED SMITH- they no-offered some summers without any warning or notice, and allegedly the NYC office did not have permission or even inform the home Pittsburgh office-- certainly some management issues brewing there.

Kaye Scholer NY - 100%.