Elite "State Schools" :

California > Michigan > Virginia

Turd

I know you feel you have to attract law students with stories about law schools, but can you please limit them to stories that are particularly interesting or relevant?

Is it just me or is anyone else wondering how UM can be so highly ranked when it appears that none of its students know how to write. SEN was better with prose than these chumps. Goes to show how worthless the LSAT and affirmative action really are.

I am sitting in a Michigan class right now

This entire lawopen sissy-fight is god damn pitiful

As they say on Dealbreaker,

Too long, didn't read.

If someone stole my sandwich with the Moist-Maker in the middle, I'd be pretty pissed, too. I'd probably yell at my boss and be placed on a leave of absence. Then I'd probably get prescribed happy pills that turn me into a lethargic moron when I visit my sister and her friends at the neighborhood hangout.

Who cares about these ridiculous e-mails. Mich. is one of the top-ranked public law schools, right up there with Penn State and UVa.

I am surprised all this silliness is coming from Michigan. If it had been Georgetown, I would have asked no questions at all.

4, I'm guessing a large portion of the ATL readership consists of law students who actually care more about the goings on at a law school than a detailed analysis of the Bailout. Especially when the latter is always going to be done better by actual journalists.

> Texas?

Almost right 2 - here's the way it really goes:

PennState-Philly>California>Michigan>Virginia

Jesus, what a shithole school. I would never hire any of these mouthbreathers to work at my firm.

Elie:

Good content (gossip w/o politicization) and decent writing (though perhaps a trifle too long). I criticize you when you are bad so I should let you know when you aren't.

Elie MysTTTal to UniversiTTTy of Michigan Law!!!

13 -- I'm surprised Penn State is in top 10:

1 Yale University New Haven, CT
2 Harvard University Cambridge, MA
2 Stanford University Stanford, CA
4 Columbia University New York, NY
5 New York University New York, NY
6 University of California--Berkeley Berkeley, CA
7 University of Chicago Chicago, IL
7 University of Pennsylvania Philadelphia, PA

i know this girl who went to michigan law. she's a basketcase freakshow who i wouldn't trust to represent my worst enemy. and by implication, everyone who attended michigan law is just like her.

I didn't go to law school at Michigan, but I went to undergrad there...so I thank you for the song. Our football team probably should, too.

17, They only made it in because of Joe Pa's connections - the Philly campus is otherwise totally TTT.

Hello I am deciding betttween Rutttgers-Camden (waitttlisttt) and UPenn Stttattte Philly (full ride) can someone please explain tttoo me whattt is ttthe besttt way ttto gettt an insurance defense job if I only gettt inttto Penn?

Is Michigan better at preparing students for bet the sandwich litigation, or sophisticated cross-border sandwich-making transactions?

Penn State does not equal UPENN. I cannot tell if you people are joking or just retawded.

21 = total loser. And I mean TOTAL.

24 -- you mean tttotttal!!!

-httth

Everyone at Michigan has herpes.

24, I think you meant to say "TTTotal."

26 -- gunning for a lawsuit by Keker, eh?

and 22 -- well done, sir

so 23, never read ATL before?

As a Penn State -- Philly campus alum, I absolutely LURVE the joke, and sometimes cannot believe how redonkulously dumb my fellow alums are. But usually I am not surprised.

13, I think it's more like this:
UPenn>Virginia>Michigan>California.

Still all state schools, and lets be honest, ranking only matters to the insecure, like me.

23: I think we all know that Penn State has two different campuses - State College and Philly. Penn State's law school is at the Philly campus.

Wow, all three of these guys are worse than the sandwich guy.

Here's my tip to UMich: We're going to laugh at you until you can laugh at yourself. Don't be so insecure.

I doubt most UMichigan law school students even know the fight song. Football loyalties are generally an undergrad thing.

Penn also has the Dickinson school in Harrisburg (formerly Dickinson College) and the Widener school in Philly.

31 -- Sorry. US News Ranking:

6 University of California--Berkeley Berkeley, CA
7 University of Chicago Chicago, IL
7 University of Pennsylvania Philadelphia, PA

maybe it's good there is a food stealer at michigan. everyone i've met that went there (the girls at least) could stand to drop 5 or 50 lbs.

UMichigan shits all over UVA. The two should not even be in the same sentence together.

UVA is the Elie Mystttal of law schools.

Michigan > UPenn STTTate

I'm a Michigan Law School rejectee who had lots of earmark requests on my desk from U of M when I got my rejection.

Needless to say I went to a different top 20 state school and said FU to a state and university that said FU to me.

Enjoy your 9% unemployment, ATL thrashing and middle tier firms.

Neither UPenn nor Chicago are state schools. They're both private.

If Michigan thinks its applicants are going to think less of the school bc of some ridiculous sandwich theft, then it deserves to be TTT.

I think Michigan students need to fire their PR dept.

UM and RichRod have been owned by the Sweater Vest.

UM has been owned by the Sweater Vest.

41, then why is it called Penn "State"?

41 - Since when did Penn State become a private school? I think JoePa would say otherwise.

get over it. lunch-stealing can happen at any school. and to everyone obessed with rankings, get over it you uptight fools.

get over it. lunch-stealing can happen at any school. and to everyone obessed with rankings, get over it you uptight fools.

Someone needs to serve the first emailer a turd sandwich.

get over it. lunch-stealing can happen at any school. and to everyone obessed with rankings, get over it you uptight fools.

Nice work, 22; I been missin' that ol' meme.

Michigan = TTT

Everyone is ignoring the 5th ranked New York Law School.

53 -- I'm suprised New York Law School's No. 5. I think California's right behind.

1 Yale University New Haven, CT
2 Harvard University Cambridge, MA
2 Stanford University Stanford, CA
4 Columbia University New York, NY
5 New York University New York, NY
6 University of California--Berkeley Berkeley, CA

From my experience, the biggest dbags I have met went to the following schools - Michigan, Cornell, Boston College. Whussup with that?

41 -- cite?

Obviously Chicago is not a "state." But I'm confused as to where you get the idea that UPennState is "private." Obviously, it's a state school. University of California -- state school. University of Virginia -- state school. University of Michigan -- state school. University of Penn State -- state school. I mean, they even call it "Penn State" for short.

53-54: This post ocassioned comment about STATE schools like Michigan and Penn. NYULS is private.

57 -- if it's private, why is it called New York Law School? I call 57 out on trolling. If it looks like a duck ("New York") and quacks like a duck ("Law School"), it's a state school. Plus, let's not forget NYLS, which is the top-ranked public school, employs Scott Turow-wannabe Cameron Stracher. Well worth the in-state tuition, but questionable investment for out-of-staters, IMHO.

-HTH

"Would that Michigan Law School Dean Caminker felt the same way."--This is the worst sentence I have ever read in my life. Seriously. ATL needs to hire a person to proof read posts.

UVA is private. Suck it, GULC!

GO BLUE!

Closing eyes and remembering the good old days. GO BLUE!

I just threw up a bit of my lunch reading that fight song.

lawopen is a fly trap for the gunner and attention whore contingent of Mich Law. Every school has these people. Of course when you look at the trap to see what it has caught, it going to be gross.

62,
"good old days" = "John Cooper era"?

Hail Hail Hail to the GULC!!
GULC GULC GULC
Fight Fight Fight
TTT-14 is better than TTT-15
GULP GULP GULP
VICTORY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Johnny Drama

59,

For those of us who can only manage near-perfect grammar, please explain whatever problem you found in that sentence. Seems to me like a perfectly good use of subjunctive mood. Should he dumb it down and begin the sentence with "If only" instead?

p.s. "Proofread" is one word.

While I enjoyed the last two MLaw posts, I think the only reason Elie posted this was to show that ATL is discussed by law students. This is not enjoyable.

There is no UPENN State. UPENN is a private school, while Penn State is a state school. I honestly hope you people are kidding, or else our profession is doomed to be overrun by mindless drones who lack the mental capacity to distinguish between two schools merely because they both involve the word "Penn."

Gentlemen at my legal preparatory academy used to misappropriate the fruits of the culinary labors of their erstwhile companions with considerable frequency. Indeed, I once engaged in the selfsame behavior. Accordingly, such an event was viewed neither as conspicuous nor noteworthy, such that its recording in the annals of human history was entirely unwarranted.

GULC > UVA (because the latter is a state school)

I'm not even going to try to figure out how many of you freaks are joking...

University of Pennsylvania = private Ivy League university in Philadelphia with a Top 10 law school

Pennsylvania State University = public, multi campus university that just merged with an established law school (Dickenson) that is decidedly not in the top 10

screw michigan and richrod!!!

69, Do you understand what a semantic difference is? Sounds like *you* are the idiot. Some people say UPenn, others say Penn State, but in reality, it's the same school: UPenn State. I can't believe you don't understand this. Ugh.

Go Lions!

69 and 72 -- U Penn State troll. No one is trying to say that UPenn State is not a good school -- indeed, I think most of us agree with USNWR that UPenn State (well, the Philly campus, at least -- not the main campus in State College) is one of the best, if not THE best, public law school around!!

Obviously, though UPenn State is public -- not one of you claiming otherwise has provided ANY actual info to back up your rather weak arguments to the contrary. 56 makes a great point, and I don't see anyone refuting him or her.

The point is that even though UPenn State is public, it's still a great school, and you should be happy to have gone there -- indeed, if you're from Pennsylvania and can get in-state tuition, UPenn State (again, this only applies to the Philly campus) is probably the best value for your dollar of any law school in the country!!!!

69 and 72: kill yourselves.

75 -- Good point, although a stretch. Berkeley is the best public school around.

Private schools rock! Go GULC!

Thank you, 74 and 75. For god's sake, 69 and 72, do a little research!!!! While Penn State's main undergrad campus is in State College, its law school is in Philly. It's sometimes referred to as just UPenn, sometimes just Penn State, but we call it UPenn State so there isn't the kind of confusion 69 and 72 are trying to create.

To be clear:

Penn State -- State College = main campus
UPenn (State) -- Philadelphia = law school, can be called UPenn, UPenn State, or just Penn State, but we call it UPenn State to distinguish the Philly law school from the State College main campus. Both state schools, both rather well regarded (although not on par with the top state schools such as Boalt and UCLA), but different campuses.

Penn State DOES NOT HAVE A LAW SCHOOL IN PHILADELPHIA.

77 -- you're right, of course, on Berkeley versus UPenn State. I was just trying to assuage some of the more embittered commenters (e.g. 69 and 72) who were apparently taking out their feelings of inferiority on all of us by trying to create confusion amongst prospective 1Ls about whether UPenn State is, in fact, a state school.

-75

Berkeley is a socialist America-hating university with a law school that almost dropped out of the top 14 a few years back.

79 -- shouting will not make your falsities come true. Can we get some moderation up in here? Commenters like 69, 72, and 79 are trying to sow confusion among prospective law school applicants. For the record: UPenn State is NOT THE STATE COLLEGE campus of Penn State -- obviously, it is the Philadelphia law school that is, while public, a DIFFERENT Penn State campus.

the 1L was the inspiration for Milton in office space..."I believe you have my stapler..."

Always some white boy gotta invoke the holy trilogy. Bust this: Those movies are about how the white man keeps the brother man down, even in a galaxy far, far away. Check this shit: You got cracker farm boy Luke Skywalker, Nazi poster boy, blond hair, blue eyes. And then you got Darth Vader, the blackest brother in the galaxy, Nubian god!

According to USNWR, even a city school (Chicago) is better than a state school (UPenn State):

1 Yale University New Haven, CT
2 Harvard University Cambridge, MA
2 Stanford University Stanford, CA
4 Columbia University New York, NY
5 New York University New York, NY
6 University of California--Berkeley Berkeley, CA
7 University of Chicago Chicago, IL
7 University of Pennsylvania Philadelphia, PA

To Hell to Hell with Michigan, the cesspool of the west.

Glad to see the UPENN State folks back. Done right, it's always a satisfying joke!

84 -- There is nothing wrong with being a Nazi poster boy. Guys in my high school used to imitate Nazis all the time, twas no big deal.

Suck it GULC.

UVA2L

69, 72, 79 et al. -- do you REALLY have nothing better to do than to hang around ATL trying to convince unsuspecting law school applicants that UPenn State is not a state school when all they have to do is a little research to find out otherwise? I join the legion of commenters in pointing out to the easily-misled that UPenn State is, of course, the Philadelphia-based state school AFFILIATED WITH, BUT OBVIOUSLY NOT IDENTICAL TO, Penn State's State College campus.

Elie, I'll give you credit. Publishing the hate mail was genius.

Well done.

90 -- with the Wall Street crisis, you're about the only person extending credit right now!

/rimshot/

72, you're confused re Dickinson. No Dickinson "merged" with Penn. Dickinson College is still alive and well, and it's a private school, not a state school:

http://www.dickinson.edu/

Well done, 91

55 - ditto here. all of those schools produce an inordinate amount of frat culture d'bags.

The biggest d-bags I've ever met all come out of the Ivy League law schools. USC owns everybody, and our football team will pound your faces into the ground.

Some are apparently confused by the fact that people tend to refer to the State College campus as Penn State. The Philly campus can be referred to as Penn State to denote that it is a state school even though it is not in State College. To be fully accurate, the law school is in fact Penn State Law-Philly, but it is easier to just say Penn State.

HTH

Thanks, 93. And thank you, 92, for calling 72 out on his lies. It's confusing enough for would-be 1Ls searching for the "right" public law school; denying these fresh-faced youths (particularly Pennsylvania residents, who get in-state tuition!) the opportunity to consider UPenn State is a cruel, cruel joke. 3 years at a top-notch state law school in Philadelphia (plus the opportunity to become a Nittany LAW-lion) could be a sweet proposition to a Pennsylvania resident.

-91 (not a UPenn State grad, but almost wishes he could have been, if only to be associated with JoePa one more time...)

96 -- Thanks for clearing that up, but I believe UPenn State also works for the Philly law school campus.

Our firm had a refrigerator raider in 1995 that caused an enormous productivity drain while much of the staff attempted to catch the culprit in the act. Sad to say, it was a 4th year associate from Michigan. In light of the latest allegations, we will just stop considering Michigan grads until they clean up their act.

First!!!

Interesting Trivia: Joe Paterno was considering going to law school - at UPenn State-Philly. However, became an assistant at the State College campus and never went to UPenn State-Philly. He didn't do both since obviously the commute is too long to the Philly campus. If only UPenn State Law were located at the State College campus he might have realized his dream.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joe_Paterno

Joe Paterno's son, Scott Paterno, graduated from Penn-Dickinson (see last paragraph of the following article, the remainder of which should put to rest any suggestion that Paterno somehow isn't affiliated with Penn):

http://www.collegian.psu.edu/archive/2004/03/03-15-04tdc/03-15-04dnews-07.asp

Good post!

I love how the UPENN trolls take the Penn State bait, every, single time.

I love how the UPENN trolls take the Penn State bait, every, single time.

I love how the UPENN trolls take the Penn State bait, every, single time.

I love how the UPENN trolls take the Penn State bait, every, single time.

I love how the UPENN trolls take the Penn State bait, every, single time.

I find it hard to believe that 99 is actually in a position to be making hiring decisions about lawyers. The idea that someone would stop hiring grads from one of the top law schools in the country because a couple people stole food is laughable.

I love how the UPENN trolls take the Penn State bait, every, single time.

I think this has to be the worst post and most retarded comments I have ever read on this site. I mean seriously, this shit just does not make make sense.

I think this has to be the worst post and most retarded comments I have ever read on this site. I mean seriously, this shit just does not make sense.

109 -- I'm supposed to be interviewing a Michigan 2L on a callback this afternoon. I've hidden the remains of my sandwich in my desk drawer and have already dinged the guy on the interneal recruiting application so he can't get an offer. At our V20 firm, we don't need any sandwich stealers.

104, 105, 106, 107, 108 & 110. What are you talking about? What's the bait, I don't get it. Also, why did you post the same thing 6 times, or are you 6 different people?

112, et al., allow me to rephrase your comment so that it adds some value to the discussion:

I, a UPenn State Law -- Philadelphia grad, think this has to be the worst post, and these the most retarded comments I have ever read on this site. I mean seriously, this shit, like a broken change machine, just does not make sense.

-HTH

114 -- you are completely right. I don't understand why so many people post the same thing here, often at almost the same time. And what is bait? Do you mean "bate"? If so, you must be Elie, since the proper spelling is "bait."

84, what's a nubian?

Again, 113, I think you're full of it. Any firm that bases actual hiring decisions about a school with 1000+ people on two sandwich incidents is so far out in left field that they are doomed to failure. Either that or some punk 1L who wishes they got into a school as good as Michigan taking anonymous jabs. Care to put a name to the comment? Otherwise, I call bullshit on your comments.

~109

118 = TTTom Brady

119 = epic fail

Whats a Black People?

118, sure you can call me, George Uest. Can you tell me your name so I can ding you when you come to interview with me?

- 113.

118--You're fungible. Get used to it. I'm a hiring partner for one of the most awesomely prestigious and distinguished firms in the United States, and if I ever have to make the decision between a Michigan grad and one from somewhere else (say, from UPenn, Dickinson), I'm going to go with the other guy. Two stolen sandwiches is two too many, and I feel perfectly comfortable making the judgement that Michigan grads are prone to petty theft, and thus not wanted at our incredibly distinguished and prestigious firm.

122 - don't worry about it - one one of us need to know who the other is to avoid working together. Your priorities are certainly not in line with mine or any of the other individuals I've come to respect. I'll be sure to keep those top candidates away from your law firm.

As for you, 123 - same question -- I'm not the one claiming credentials, but you and 122 are. So you gonna put a name to the comment or do I have to assume that your "awesomely prestigious and distinguished" law firm is all in your mind?

Nevermind. I take it back - 122 is just as much of a coward claiming fake creds as you are 123.

Serves me right for not reading the name slowly once through.

TOO MANY WORDS

ty

Don't michigan students who send emails to law open understand privacy? All emails should stay between the 1200 of us!

8 - especially if my boss threw some of the sandwich in the trash and then encouraged me to fish it out

:)

70 - A+

103, thank you!

--100

Wonderful quote, Elie's Mom!

124-125---123 here. Rest assured, my firm is awesome indeed. Prestigious, distinguished and remarkable in every way. And I swear to you, that as long as I have the privilege and honor to hold a position with this awesomely prestigious and distinguished organization, I will spare no effort to ensure that Michigan grads are forever on the outside looking in, pilfered sandwiches clutched in their grubby little hands.

Now go steal a sandwich.

So I'm a 1L, and recently started regularly reading this site. And now, I'm done.

The ridiculous mean-spiritedness of the commenters is just too frustrating to wade through. I really can't tell if all this "UPenn State" stuff, for example, is serious or not. (And no, I don't go to Penn Law). The fact that it could even be construed as serious is enough for me not to want to read it.

To the people who run this site: Maybe try a mandatory registration for commenters, or a more active moderator, or *something* to keep this rampant idiocy in check. I can't imagine that this is what you actually want your site to be like, is it?

123/132... still too afraid to put your money where your mouth is? You're pathetic and so's your "firm". Best guess is that you're a sad little 1L at some TTT wishing you hadn't been hungover for the LSAT.

ann arbor. the berkeley of the middle lower penninsula of michigan.

#133: "I really can't tell if all this "UPenn State" stuff, for example, is serious or not."

Basic stuff, even for a 1L. Better switch career paths.

After scrolling through all this garbage, it was nice to read 133's post. Seriously, you all are a bunch of losers. Go back to your Civ Pro reading.

Yeah, 133, You might be a little dense/sensitive for this business. I suggest you go back to reading Palsgraf or whatever it is you are supposed to be doing.

The internets are a mean place, aren't they 133?

134, it seems you are unfamiliar with the ecology of the internet. I would point you to this, as a starting point in your learning: http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2004/03/19/

If you must know, I 180ed the LSAT.

Keep stealing those sandwiches!

-122 (G.Uest)

You made it pretty darn clear that you're a fucktard without the illustration there, 122.

You could claim your the second coming of Christ for all anyone cares. Its the internet. Just don't go thinking you're fooling anyone into actually believing a thing you say.

So, I was talking with Caminker about this earlier today and started recording party of the conversation on my cellphone camera (it has a good mic). Its not on his face the whole time (trying not to be uber obvious), but its him. He's freaking pissed, and is thinking about shutting down the lawopen listserve. For the audio/video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eBGIQ7ZuuiU

Kudos on the Rick Rolling 142. It was a welcome diversion.

134, you're correct. I am afraid. Afraid to sully the name of the prestigious and distinguished Firm that I am fortunate enough to be affiliated with by bandying its name about on this forum.

Look, perhaps we got off on the wrong foot. The larger issue, 134, is not whether you personally steal sandwiches--maybe you do, maybe you don't. I have no way of knowing. But a man is judged by the company he keeps, and by remaining affiliated with a certain institution in Ann Arbor, you say to the world (or, more importantly, to the firms that you will interview with) that you, at the very least, condone this behavior.

Your allegience to the maize and blue will drag you down, 134. But remember, Penn U at Dickinson is still taking applications for transfer students.

Good luck,
123/132

Is UMich the same as UMich State?

Sam Mcguffie owns all. That is all you need to know.

145--I think it is the same. Just using the same well cited arguments assuring us that UPenn and UPenn state are the same schools, it would follow that UMich = UMich State. Great schools, crappy states.

Every single time my school has been on AbovetheLaw, it's been a brief moment of hilarity, and even a badge of pride. This is yet another situation in which Michigan needs to get over itself.

Late to the game today (first time I've had work in months), but...

GO BLUE! Beat UPenn State!

123/132/144 has made such a mockery of himself and serious law students and lawyers. Honestly expecting people to believe that he works for a prestigious law firm, but one that let's him sit and avoid work while making elitist comments on a gossip blog all day.

Thanks for calling him out, 134. Good job!

Emanuel Heller Joins http://www.EvilEsq.com Editorial staff as S.F. Bureau Chief, Posthumous

Who shoved the stick up Michigan's ass?

Just pity the Michigan folk. They are living in a state they will never, and never intended, to practice, and they are living in a city with quite possibly the ugliest undergrads on the face of the earth.

153--clearly you are not an IVY graduate

34 -- Not so. I went to Michigan for law school and we were enthusiastic followers of Michigan football and basketball. The only exceptions were those who had been undergrads at rival schools, particularly Michigan State. (Those two really hate each other!) People like me who had gone to small colleges or schools with crappy sports teams were (and remain) especially into Michigan sports. So, yeah, I know and love that fight song.