Doody

how is this still happening with firm pay structures being so highly publicized? it's incredible

Can what be? That you're the biggest loser in the history of the world? Oh it can be

Any chance they'll post an experience-adjusted metric? As in, how much do first year paralegals who are women make compared to first year paralegals who are men?

You may find that there are simply fewer women with 10 or 15 years experience (and commensurate salary) in the field, due to the decision many women make to dedicate their time to raising a family.

Lat? Help me Lat? I'm lost out in the wilderness with this Jimmy Carter you hired.

Let's have a rerun of ATL Idol, only this time without any of the previous competitors.

Or it screams of the fact that women take time off to have babies. When you take 3 months off one year, then do so again a couple years later, that is a large chunk of lost time. Plus sorry, but you can't tell me new moms work as long hours as they did before the baby. Does that account for the 51% number? Of course not - thats good old boy stuff at the partner level. But it sure as hell accounts for a 9% difference in paralegal pay.

women are just lazier, stupider, and shittier attorneys

Well done, Elie.

how is this still happening with firm pay structures being so highly publicized? it's incredible

how is this still happening with firm pay structures being so highly publicized? it's incredible

Farewell ATL, we barely knew ye.

Wow - so now elie is lifting posts from law.com ...

It's no wonder we have such a hard time getting Americans to acknowledge problems with race...they refuse to acknowledge discrimination between the sexes too. Stupid Americans.

well, if ladies were more willing to take it in the pooper than i would be willing to pay them almost as much as their male counterparts

-V10 partner

lara flynn boyle is hawt.

elie is not.

There ARE a couple obvious reasons for this that contribute to the disparity, but of course don't tell the whole tale:

1. Women work part-time more often than men. They do take more time off for child-rearing than men. That definitely alters the numbers.

2. Women have only entered the legal profession in great numbers, and broken through the barriers, in the last few decades. As a result, the bulk of them have not reached senior levels, have not had the time to go up through the ranks, not because they're women, but because they're simply younger. That ultimately contributes the gap as well.

women are just lazier, stupider, and shittier attorneys

DO WOMEN GET SCREWED WHEN IT COMES TO PAY AT DLA PIPER?

There ARE a couple obvious reasons for this that contribute to the disparity, but of course don't tell the whole tale:

1. Women work part-time more often than men. They do take more time off for child-rearing than men. That definitely alters the numbers.

2. Women have only entered the legal profession in great numbers, and broken through the barriers, in the last few decades. As a result, the bulk of them have not reached senior levels, have not had the time to go up through the ranks, not because they're women, but because they're simply younger. That ultimately contributes to the gap as well.

Women are secretaries, men are attorneys. Now please leave me alone as I club your mother into submission.

Tadge Choadley III

These studies are worthless unless they accurately adjust for credential, experience, types of positions, etc. And they rarely do, because the authors want an inflammatory headline.

"Given the proportion of females to males that work as paralegals, that income disparity screams of day-to-day sexism."

No, it absolutely doesn't. It screams of a significant reason for such disparity. To assume that is sexism is pointless. I'm as liberal as they come, and I don't buy any of this "the reason women make less is sexism" bullshit.

this isn't any "news" right? woman power? equality? nah. ain't happening :-)

Thanks, Elie, for posting on this important topic (and good on you for doing so with such good humor!).

Attention young female attorneys:

If you would wear the pair of shoes to a club that you are currently wearing in court, get some more conservative shoes.

Also, while I enjoy a fine pair of breasts as much as the next guy, they are distracting in court and its harder to take you seriously. The truth is we can't control looking, but you can control buttoning up.

Cheers, clerk.

Guys, leave Elie alone, she takes this issue very seriously. If you had been through what she had been, you'd understand that women like her really are discriminated against in the legal pay scales.

Aren't the highest paid lawyers in the judicial field generally the judges and magistrates? Aren't they usually in their 50s to 70s? Doesn't a gender gap more reflect sexism in law school admissions (and perhaps preferences among potential applicants) forty years ago, rather than sexism today?

I thought Elie was a dude?

-25

5 has a good point. Women who leave the profession do drag down the numbers, because that means that there are less senior women at every step but the same number of junior women, and law is generally a lockstep seniority pay scale.

26 was awesome.

25/28 - good job sherlock, you figured out the joke.

22 is absolutely right.

You can only do a fair comparison if you compare apples to apples. If female lawyers disproportionately leave before they are up for partner (which they do), then the failure to adjust for years of experience can account for most or all of the disparity.

But why do females leave before they make partner more often than men? Evil firms with unfriendly family leave policies?

No. Same reason a dogs licks their balls: because they can.

Being a lawyer sucks. Being a lawyer in a big firm sucks on stilts. Women can leave and spend all their time taking care of kids - an infinitely more rewarding and enjoyable job than lawyering - without any kind of social ostracization. Men could also be stay-at-home dads, but few of them are willing to bear the social stigma that comes with a man doing that.

Women have an easier, more socially acceptable way out of this nightmare that is being a lawyer. Is it any surprise that they take it?

I second the call for an update as to whether the survey results were properly adjusted. If they weren't, Elie, than your stupid fucking blind assumptions are what is embarrassing. THAT IS ALL.

27-HA! judges and magistrates are among the lowest paid members of the legal community. Big firm partner make the money, judges make government money...which is bad. The point may still be valid for partners, though the time scale should be much more compressed.

Goodbye, ATL.

Welcome, pulpit for left-wing victimhood.

Something is wrong with my internets. I typed in www.abovethelaw.com, but was mistakenly directed to the Cosmo site. I'll have my sec look into this. It'll be a good opportunity to chase her around the desk and slap her ass.

Ellie has been through enough. She fought her way through HLS and now has a tough job at ATL. Leave her alone.

Kash Kash

Couple of points.

As to seniority, its been my experience that men get promoted to partner more often because other (male) partners feel more comfortable taking men with them to client functions. Thus, the associate men learn the client promotion skills faster/better than women. At least in my firm, me (and a couple other women) were always overlooked in favor of the male associates when it came time to client schmoozing, which led to the men getting partnership nods and us women being told "sorry its not the 'right fit'".

Second, when it comes to salary negotiating (for laterals at least), women are told more often "our salary offer is X, take it or leave it" and that no negotiation is possible, but then men end up with higher salaries because "they negotiated for it." This happened to a friend of mine, who made enough of a stink over it, that her firm offered her "a package w/release" to leave.

I have worked in three mid-sized firms (no pay structure, 20-50 attorneys) and in each one there were several female attorneys with young children that worked fewer hours than most. Not part-time, just fewer hours. They left between 3-5, we stayed at work until 7ish. I suspect this is one way to explain this.

Also, the stats are totally worthless. You need to account for different positions, years of experience, hours worked, etc etc. I'm willing to bet when you account for all this you'll find far less disparity.

5 & 29 - exactly. The number does reflect a problem, but you need to interpret it the right way.

Now we're comparing the median and the average, so if a smaller proportion of female hold senior positions, this will bring down both the average and the median, even if both sexes are paid the same on all experience levels.

This is still a serious problem, but the causes might now be different.

38 - you and your friend both sound like you are fat. Is that correct? I wouldn't take some fat heifer with me to meet clients either.

38: Was that package with "full" release?

32 - fuck that shit. I would much rather let my gf (probably future wife) go to work and become partner while I stay at home, watch the kids, watch television, and socialize with MILFs during play group.

I particularly love the indignant closer, Elie. Were you seething with rage as you typed? Perhaps if you thought a bit longer before posting this, you would realized the shortcomings of the statistics (as others have above). Maybe not. But now, you've inspired hundreds of my fellow unthinking female law students to carp about how sexist the profession is. Thanks for that.

okay, lat, this isnt going to work out.

we come to ATL to be amused by irreverent law-related gossip, not to be talked down to by some proto-obamaton wannabe.

get rid of this guy, asap.

32 - nice comment. Salient, appropriate, well-written and humorous. Any interest in taking over this now-crappy blog?

I won't deny that there is sexism in law firms, but unless you adjust the numbers for experience, you aren't proving a thing.

32 is also right. Lawyers have the highest job dissatisfaction rates of any profession. It's no wonder women frequently leave.

you're dumb. women leaving the profession to have babies does matter, because it means that overall, there's more men in the advance stages (read:partner) that are making more money. So, it looks something like this:

first year associates: 100 male, 100 female
5th year associates: 100 male, 50 female
partners: 100 male, 25 female

When you take the median male's salary, it's somewhere in the middle of the entire profession. when you take the median female's salary, it's weighted more toward the junior level since there's LESS senior female lawyers.

nothing sexist about it, it's just math. you lose.

systematic: of, relating to, or being a system; carried out using a planned, ordered procedure; methodical, regular and orderly; of, or relating to taxonomic classification

systemic: relating to a system; pertaining to an entire organism

Read. Think. React.

Too many people leave out phase two and go directly to "profit."

I want more Kashmir. Bring on Kash Kash. I don't like her ugly younger sister Smelly Elie Mystal.

Salary and bonuses are not lockstep at every biglaw firm, let alone every firm. I'm assuming the Census doesn't only include the salaries of attorneys at the V20 firms.

I am a woman and I think this post is stupid. There are a lot of reasons that women earn less that have very little to do with sexism.

Also, they put this type of article in women's magazines twice a year. If ATL is using that trash as an inspiration for its stories, then I am truly looking forward to "187 ways to please your man," "does my boss have a crush on me -- take the quiz to find out," and "754 ways to look hot in a pantsuit."

Vomit.

There are so many variables that are unaccounted for by that statistic. Honestly, post about something interesting or at least well researched.

female partners are CRAZY

- female associate

IS THIS REALLY A FEMINIST SITE? DO YOU WANT TO GET PAID MORE? QUIT MAKING GRAMMATICAL ERRORS

So Elie sucks at economic analysis too. This is news worthy?

Elie, the vast majority of attorneys in the US aren't on a $160K lockstep pay scale. See http://www.nalp.org/content/index.php?pid=618. Thus, those pay scales will obviously not "smooth out gender inequality when it comes to salaries." Epic reasoning fail.

But I guess I didn't see any typos in the first 3 paragraphs, so that's an improvement, right?

Elie, your comment about the women leaving the profession not affecting the income disparage is both logically and statistically incorrect. The fact that more women leave the profession to start families is exactly what is causing this discrepancy. The median value of a distribution is the middle value of the group (basic definition). Therefore, in order for a group to increase in median value you need to have more people on the higher valued end of the distribution. Because more women leave a group at a younger age it decreases the pool of females who can reach partner (or even senior associate/council) level and thus drive up the median.
Furthermore, "women who take a 'survival of the species' time-out and then come back to work should be penalized" is a loaded statement that does not capture all the issues involved. Many firms give several weeks for maternity leave. Some firms will even give additional maternity time at reduced pay; however, at some point firms need their employees to be present and if someone stays away for long enough they are going to have to fill the space with a new body. The problem with taking a break from the legal world to raise a family is that your legal skills are going to be rusty when you come back, essentially the shorter the break you take the smaller the impact. If you stay gone too long then that will impact your abilities.
I admit in a perfect world women would be able to have children and maintain a career. However, being able to have a child and maintain a career is not always possible and in some women’s cases not even wanted. The decision on how to raise a child should be made between the husband and wife. As old school as this sounds, it currently is more socially acceptable for the female in the pair to be the primary care giver to the child - this social stigma in society probably adds to the pay discrepancy as well. However, I would not jump to label people who make these types of decisions as sexist. Jumping to label the entire problem on sexism is poor judgment and some more critical thought should be done before hand.
One last thing, I'm sure true sexism does exist in the legal profession. However, I do not believe that the entire profession is sexist in general like this blog post seems to suggest. The sexism that exists is on the individual side of things. Sexism exists where male associates, partners, and clients say and act in crude ignorant ways. The truly sexist people are not so pervasive within the profession that they are affecting female salaries at all levels.

I think if Elie wasn't black and unattractive, there wouldn't be the harsh critism you guys lay on him. His biggest mistake was showing his face. He should have let his creds speak for him, and hid behind his double ivy pedigree. The racist, small minded, cowardly pricks on here love to be "tough guy typists." Elie's just as good as Lat, bar a couple spelling errors. Shut the f*ck up, get back under your practice group partners' desk, and get to work on your partnership prospects. Remember to cup the stones and swallow... asshats....

41 - good point. Elie is also a fat woman, so that would explain why she is so concerned about this issue.

Can we get some Census numbers that compare fat women to everyone else?

I am a woman and I think this post is stupid. There are a lot of reasons that women earn less that have very little to do with sexism.

Also, they put this type of article in women's magazines twice a year. If ATL is using that trash as an inspiration for its stories, then I am truly looking forward to "187 ways to please your man," "does my boss have a crush on me -- take the quiz to find out," and "754 ways to look hot in a pantsuit."

Vomit.

You won't believe this statistic: Women are INFINITY PERCENT more likely to get pregnant during sex!!! Men are INFINTITY PERCENT less likely to be forced into the burdens of child-bearing!!!! Where is the indignation!!!!???

Statistics need controls. "Your ignorance is embarrassing. That is all."

I think if Elie wasn't black and unattractive, there wouldn't be the harsh critism you guys lay on him. His biggest mistake was showing his face. He should have let his creds speak for him, and hid behind his double ivy pedigree. The racist, small minded, cowardly pricks on here love to be "tough guy typists." Elie's just as good as Lat, bar a couple spelling errors. Shut the f*ck up, get back under your practice group partners' desk, and get to work on your partnership prospects. Remember to cup the stones and swallow... asshats....

Ah, c'mon...really? You guys don't think the Ole Boys Club is very much alive and kicking? I'm not one to hang my hat on it as the sole reason for the disparity, but totally ignoring it as if it doesn't exist is just willfully ignorant.

I work in M&A and on the rare occasion I get pegged for an all-hands meeting, I guarantee you it will only be me and 1 or 2 other women in the room with 20-30+ guys. Pure coincidence? Surely not. In the associate ranks, we may be 35-40%, but in the partner ranks were less than 10%. Once again, purely coincidence?

And sure there are inherent structural differences, both in the legal profession and American Big Business in general, given the fact that we've got the uteri, but that doesn't mean that the Ole Boys Club isn't very much alive and kicking.

It's just a shame that the US is so short-sighted as a society to make families (and by that I mean both the mothers and fathers) such a lower priority than the dollar. And we wonder why so many longterm problems emerge as a result. As much as it pains me to say it, I think many of our European counterparts have a better hold on this. We don't need to be as extreme as they are, but surely we don't need to be as extreme as we are either. We reap what we sow.

There are so many variables that are unaccounted for by that statistic. Honestly, post about something interesting or at least well researched.

Salary and bonuses are not lockstep at every biglaw firm, let alone every firm. I'm assuming the Census doesn't only include the salaries of attorneys at the V20 firms.

38, maybe you get passed over for partner because of your total lack of skill when using the english language. If you take out your obviously unnecessary parenthetical and changed the tense, your sentence reads: "At least in my firm, me [was} always overlooked in...." Me hopes that ur husband iz gud at hiz gob.

you are embarassing. this blog sucks since you've taken it over.

Its pretty clear that the numbers do not adjust for experience. Just look at the 64% disparity among "judicial workers" which includes judges and magistrates.

Judges salaries are almost always set by statute and constant for all judges in the same level. So there would be 0 disparity between male and female judges or magistrates in the same court.

The disparity, therefore, must come from the fact that their are more male judges and more female staffers. Judges make more than staffers, and there you go.

No you may complain that its sexist that there are more male judges. But this is an entirely different issue than pay disparity.

Elie - for you to have done an entire rant without bother to do the simple little analysis I have done indicates that you are intellectually lazy.

The fact that pay equity just happens to be an Obama talking point this week shows that you are a partisan hack.

Hey Elie, suck it smooth!

Regards,

Bo Jackson aka Moosecock Jones

You won't believe this statistic: Women are INFINITY PERCENT more likely to get pregnant during sex!!! Men are INFINTITY PERCENT less likely to be forced into the burdens of child-bearing!!!! Where is the indignation!!!!???

Statistics need controls. "Your ignorance is embarrassing. That is all."

42 - I'm not sure, but I suspect it probably was. She only took the package because she needed the money, she had a mortgage and *surprise* student loans to pay off, plus she felt that if she sued, her legal career would be over and she didn't have a husband's income to fall back on.

I had signed a similar release when my firm let me go over the not making partner bit, but I didn't fully realize the implications at the time (besides the whole needed money dealie) Neither my friend nor I were making "biglaw" salaries. though we made decent incomes, it wasn't enough to have a big enough savings account to risk 6+ months of unemployment.

Fortunately for both of us, we found good jobs, not paying quite as much as before, but better environments. But isn't that part of the problem? Environments that cater to women's mindset and lifestyle better tend to pay less.

41 - not fat, but yeah not exactly a size 0 either. :p My current boss takes me on client promotions just fine. but there are some firms where the 'good ole boy' network still flourishes with abandon.

I'm sure my politics are closer to Elie's than Lat's (he of the Federalist Society), but the indignant PC tone is *unbearable.*

The only apples-to-apples comparison here (paralegals) shows a 7% difference in pay, and that's on an annual salary basis (not, e.g., pay per hour worked).

Fine, let's not pat ourselves on the back re the status of women in the legal field. But the righteous indignation, which is misplaced on ATL anyway, seems completely unjustified.

Lat -- Please act now before the house that you built is ruined forevor. There is no hope that this is going to get better. That is all.

64 - you're right, Elie is unattractive. thanks for your post.

" I think many of our European counterparts have a better hold on this. "

If you think being a woman professional is tough in America, you should try being one in Europe.

#60/64:

If we're all so bigoted and racist, then why didn't we bash Lat all the time? He isn't one of us Caucasians.

Oh, I remember why. He was a good writer who posted entertaining stories. Elie does neither.

Ah, the fruits of that wonderful affirmative action tree...

The only thing that's embarrassing is your analysis and hyperbole, Elie.

"Women who have left the profession to start a family are not artificially dragging down the salary numbers, since they are "out" of the profession."

This is wrong. Lawyers who've been practicing longer (i.e. partners) tend to make much more money than those that have been practicing for just a few years (i.e. associates). If women leave early to start families, the high income they could have earned as a partner doesnt contribute to women's salary figures. Thus, the women's figures are lower. They are "out" of the profession, and the higher salaries they would have earned had they stayed in arent factored into the numbers.

Half the other girls I go to school with are in law school (and will later be in the law profession) to meet husbands. Just as there are a lot of idiot sexist men, there are a lot of stupid girls who think being a lawyer is going to be like watching legally blonde. Once those girls find their husbands, start having babies, or realize they won't be writing briefs on pink stationary and dotting their "i"s with hearts, they stop making lawyer $$. Women are so quick to blame everything on sexism, when sometimes the problem is the set of values they bring to the table.

- a girl

MY MOM WORKS AT DLA PIPER. SHE MAKES 227,000K A YEAR.

Guys in my high school used to draw flawed conclusions from overly general census data all the time. It was no big deal.

"Women Getting Screwed When It Comes To Pay"

I find the title of this posting offensive. I am calling for Elie's immediate resignation due to this blatant sexism.

I used to complain about too many posts concerning gifts to summer associates . . . those were the days . . . .

Does experience and part-time work and child-rearing account for the large disparity in paralegal salaries between men and women? I doubt it, given that there are a lot more female experienced paralegals than male ones. I wouldn't be surprised if if female attorneys faced the same income disparity outside of the lockstep biglaw firms.

"Some people will no doubt say something like "women are secretaries and men are attorneys," before clubbing their mates into submission."

This was meant to be a funny comment, but it makes no sense. It should probably read: "Some people will no doubt say something like 'women are secretaries and men are attorneys,' before being clubbed by their mates into submission.

Elie's attempt at making the joke PC by obfuscating the speaker and clubber's gender caused him to fuck it up.

Quit being PC and try harder to be funny.

#60/64:

If we're all so bigoted and racist, then why didn't we bash Lat all the time? He isn't one of us Caucasians.

Oh, I remember why. He was a good writer who posted entertaining stories. Elie does neither.

Ah, the fruits of that wonderful affirmative action tree...

God I hate affirmative action.

Love,

The Daughters of Xenu

go to law.com for a better piece on it.

81s mom makes 227 million dollars a year, according to his post.

At least it's encouraging to see that most of the commentors are reasonably intelligent and thoughtful individuals.

Me (and a couple people me work with) are very proud of you.

39-

As a working mother on the partnership track at a midsize (200 lawyer) firm, I can tell you that if I'm leaving at 5:00, it's because I billed an hour before I got the kids out of bed and will bill another couple after I tuck them in. Most of the lawyer moms I know, if they are partners or on partnership track, work the same hours, just on a different schedule.

Elie, you fail at simple analysis and basic reasoning. Fewer women in the senior ranks means lower average pay for women in a profession that relies heavily on lockstep systems. This is also the reason why female teachers make less than male ones.

Why don't you do a shocking expose on how older lawyers make more money than younger lawyers, which obviously means age discrimination is going on.

I can only guess at how low your score on the LSAT analytical section must be, and how of an much affirmative action boost you got from Harvard law.

86, huh? It doesn't make sense to me that way either. "Some [men] will no doubt say something like 'women are secretaries and men are attorneys,' before being clubbed by their [female] mates into submission." The type of men that say things like that aren't the types of men that are with women who would beat them into submission, they're usually pompous old boys types with dumb trophy girlfriends.

92- Stay home and raise your kids and make my dinner, mm'kay?

Cee Uou Next Tuesday

Does anyone really believe that firms are paying women less than they are paying men in the same position and all other merit issues being equal?

75 - couldn't have said it better myself. elie could ruin in months the empire Lat built. This is just plain awful, like so many posts of late. When will it stop????

Gallion

92 - "MOST of the lawyer moms I know, IF they are partners or on partnership track, work the same hours."

So what you are really saying is that SOME of the lawyer moms you know, even some of those who are partners or on the partner track, work less hours. Thanks.

The thing that kills me here is how many people blast Elie for the obvious misstep in his analyis that less female senior attorneys = less overall pay for women, but don't pause for a moment to take their analysis a step further. Is it purely a time issue (i.e. women haven't really broken into the legal system until recently and another 20 years and the partner disparities will be gone and sexism really is just a red herring) or are there are other factors (i.e. system set up that discourages women gaining seniority/partnership as they often have to sacrifice family for career at a much higher level than their male counterparts do---it's definitely easier being a partner and a father than it is being a partner and a mother)? I imagine it's a little bit of both, though which is the greater factor is up for debate.

This is a really important issue and Elie's post was appropriate and well put. Cheers to # 60 for calling out the infantile vicious criticisms for what they are. That much vitriol over typos shows their underlying sentiments are skewed and potentially hateful. Moreover, it should be possible to address and show concern for gender disparities without O'Reilly-esque uninformative political raving. Well done Elie.

If my firm could lower its salary costs by something close to 49% by hiring all women, it would. So would any logical firm and the firms that didn't do so would not be able to compete on price. The all women firms would be put the coed firms out of business. Since this is not happenning, then firms can't actually hire women at a cheaper price than equally qualified men.

96, yes, and it's because some firms bill women out at a lower rate.

This is a really important issue and Elie's post was appropriate and well put. Cheers to # 60 for calling out the infantile vicious criticisms for what they are. That much vitriol over typos shows their underlying sentiments are skewed and potentially hateful. Moreover, it should be possible to address and show concern for gender disparities without O'Reilly-esque uninformative political raving. Well done Elie.

I like how this thread, which mostly consists of lawyers pissed about a post suggesting that there is sexism in the legal profession, is full of lawyers making sexist jokes while insisting that there is no sexism in the legal profession. It's so meta it makes me dizzy.

65 -

I agree, there is some sexism in big law firms. However, Elie's post does nothing to prove that. The statistics he cites only establish that women make less on average, while doing nothing to account for the types of jobs or amount of experience women have.

And, contrary to Elie's flat out falsehood, the fact that women are more likely to leave to raise children has a huge impact on these numbers.

I don't think people here are denying that sexism exists sometimes, but we are concerned with the lack of analysis that went into Elie's post.

Boooooo .... who cares about women .... what about boni being slashed at Squire Sanders?

Cheers to #60 for calling out criticisms by playing the race card? So any criticism of a person who happens to be black is due to racism?

Is that you, Kwame Kilpatrick? I thought they didn't allow Internet access in jails.

96: Yes. I work at a small firm and somebody accidentally left out a list of attorney salaries. A female lawyer with several years more experience was making the same as a guy five or six years out of law school. She's also the much better attorney. I'd imagine it's a lot more difficult to pull off that kind of thing in BIGLAW, where there's more transparency.

I told this woman what I discovered, in case you're wondering.

104, right on.

73: I think that "full release" thing was a sexual comment. See "Happy Ending"

youre all a bunch of idiots. with elie marching in the lead.

True, women are getting screwed when it comes to paid. But certain women are getting paid when it comes to screw.

True, women are getting screwed when it comes to paid. But certain women are getting paid when it comes to screw.

Women = GULC
Men=UPEN State

Elie,

For the reasons stated by 59, 48, and others, this post is embarrassingly stupid. Please shape up and don't let this knee-jerk bleeding heart shit happen again.

Thanks.

If the biggest discrepancy among any legal occupation comes with "judicial workers" and women earn 64 cents on the dollar compared to men there, and yet overall they only earn 51 cents on the dollar, how could that result from anything BUT a huge difference in the type of jobs which men and women are employed in?

Are you even trying?

Over/under on days until Elie quits or leaps out a window (which is effectively the same as quitting) as a result of the pure hate from commenters on every single post, even those he does not post? 20? I am shocked he has stayed this long, frankly.

Female associates are hot. Mostly. I love it when they fart.

Elie didn't make up the stats. They came from the law.com article which summarized the census report.

why the fuck am i reading some liberal feminist soapboxing on ATL. elie, take your tired shit and go home. no mas!

Elie is a poor replacement for Lat, and is obviously a partisan hack.

But knock off the affirmative action jokes. Its racist, and unmerrited. Elie may be a poor blog writer, but that doesn't mean he did poorly on his LSATs or that he didn't earn his way into HLS. The skills for writing good blog posts are distinct from the skills necessary to get good grades in college and do well on the LSAT.

So by all means, bash Elie. These posts are absolutley terrible. But please lose the racist affirmative action jokes.

Elle, you're fucking retarded. e.g. "And the "women get pregnant and have babies while men toil away all the live long day" argument is a poor one. Women who have left the profession to start a family are not artificially dragging down the salary numbers, since they are "out" of the profession. And surely we don't think that women who take a "survival of the species" time-out and then come back to work should be penalized."

This "argument" you make ignores the simple concept that pay goes up with senority. If women drop out more frequently than men, it follows that the male work force will be on average more senior than the female work force.