WoooHoooo

Turds

DecherTTT

WoooHoooo

Elie,

Usually, I could not care less about your grammar errors. And the idea of eight-year-old Elie dressing up as Ted Kennedy is hilarious. But multiple attorneys stand to lose their job (singular)? Come on now.

HELLO INTERNET FRIENDS HOW ARE YOU TODAY?

Elie's fat fingers are to blame for the mistakes. He needs a special typing wand a la Homer Simpson.

Bring back lat

es-er zohnot!!!

JONES DAY DOES NOT LAY PEOPLE OFF.

Good post with substantive info about something relevant to the legal profession and the many people looking for jobs (or who are scared they might need to). With the economy like it is, surely there must be more rumors about firm layoffs, cuts, hiring issues that is discussed here. I would much rather hear more about those rumors than read about trick or treating experiences. This is a legal tabloid after all, rumors cause clarification which hopefully will lead to even more substantive information.

Elie,

You have been sold such a bag of goods it is not right. I think this is why ATL is in danger of going under, and why Lat et al needed to be careful who took over. People obviously do not trust you to email information.

Now me, I'm just a 6th year in DC, so what do I know. I don't get paid to smooze, I don't get access to the network of leads you must have. And yet...

My law school roommate got let go by Dechert in June, along with 7 other people.

I got an email from a '05 grad of my law wschool asking for help as Dechert had let him and "about 5 others" go in August.

3 weeks ago a very old and dear friend who has been at Dechert since '01 told me she was let go, along with 50 other people and that she had been told not to expect much from firm by way of relocation as they expect to let go as many as 30 people in January, most in the BFS area, along with C&S which overlaps anyway.

Now, I could send you the emails and the resumes, but I don't trust you not to sell me or them out, and I now know that no one else does. So why don't you dig a little harder before you ignore what your comentators bring to your attention. Mostly it is crap, but in this instance, there is a reason why we are "so certain" that there is a bloodbath in Dechert. How sad that you cannot even get evidence when, in a best case scenario (for dechert), at least 30 extra people have been let go since the official count in March, and my friend who was let go placed it at about 80.

Actually this is really annoying me. Why not just check teh website and ask them why about 30 names are not on the BFS group that were there in May? How about calling recruiters to see if they have gotten a surge of resumes. Do you actually do any research Elie, or do you sit on your fat ass and wait for people to give you the smoking gun, or wait for law firms to lie to you?

11 - Working at Jones Day is probably worse than being laid off.

16 = Truth

13 here, i realize my post may be too long for some people on this blog. In a nutshell, Elie wrong, I know of at least 3 rounds of lay offs, and I have been told by those let go and inside that the low figure let go since March is 60, with "at least" 20 to go. Notice how no one from Dechert responded to comments saying it wasn't happening, yet Elir chooses to believe firm PR.

13, the answer appears to be the latter. It is sad because one of the real benefits provided by ATL was the ability to smoke out the bullshit responses from firms. Apparently that has been lost.

14 - You are an idiot. State your basis?

14 - You are an idiot. State your basis.

I do not know where number 13 got his/hers very high numbers, but being one of the people who was let go after the March layoffs (at least some of which actually ended up taking place at the end of May) I can honestly say that Dechert had at least several rounds of layoffs.

I think this is why ATL is in danger of going under, and why Lat et al needed to be careful who took over.

Yeah, Lat would have immediately have realized that Dechert was misleading him in their official comments through his magical psychic powers! And Lat would never sell out a tipster, like the fired midlevel-miscarriage associate, whose name and face were plastered all over this site!

**rolling eyes**

Hi 20, 13 here. My numbers came from those let go and the one person I know still there (who has not been fired, the other person I know still in there is out by end of this month, good old 90 days). I don't know if they are lying, or have facts wrong. But I am trying to help one land a job here in D.C. which will involve pay cut and moving city, and they are jumping at chance.

So while my numbers may be on high side, it doesn't hide fact that Dechert is lying, and Elie bought it.

And 21, Miscarriage Lady didn't email ATL in private, and Lat always questioned BS press releases, even if he did let those who played ball with him off a little too easy.

18 & 19 - fair (ie competitive) compensation is one of the top issues for associates. Jones Day has one of the most opaque and "eat what you kill" bonus systems in all of BIGLAW. That's not the type of work environment I want to be in.

Kids in my high school were always in danger of going under, it was no big deal who took over.

Dechert vs. Schulte??? and why???

Dechert and Skadden DC are both in trouble

"And 21, Miscarriage Lady didn't email ATL in private, and Lat always questioned BS press releases, even if he did let those who played ball with him off a little too easy."

No--someone else did, after getting hold of her disclosure to her firm. Miscarriage lady's uterine scraping, private letter to her firm, and face were then plastered all over this site--period. I don't know who you are, but you sound like a damned idiot trying to defend that while critiquing the inadequacy of someone else's "journalistic standards."

Scraped Uterus=TTT

23 - to the contrary, Jones Day's model is exactly the opposite of eat what you kill. It is anything but.

Wow 13/22, really??? You can prove 80 people have been/will be laid off? People get upset when they're laid off-- did you ever consider that your friends may not have been told exactly how many others were leaving with them and just guessed? I'd imagine I wouldn't have a great deal of perspective if that happened to me. I think I'd be especially willing to believe that my getting laid off was part of a giant and indiscriminate purge. "Being asked to move on" may boil down to semantics, but I still agree that there is a distinction between that and getting a pink slip.

Jones Day is in trouble

27, This is a fucking tabloid. I do not expect any standards!! I expect reporting. But tabloids work by keep snitches secret and calling bs when it is bs.

I do not have confidence that this would happen.

Let me break it down, because you seem confused. I am not slamming ATL for revealing people's information in relation to "newsworthy" stories. But only a short lived stupid site reveals sources. However the fact that Elie believes this junk, when I have, in my work email account 3 seperate emails from former (or soon to be former) Dechert people speaks volumes. And you are right, I won't send the emails to him as I am afraid he would post it without redaction (and remember, Lat tried to block out her name in most parts, it was last paragraph in original version that had it).

Look I don't expect standards, my comment lies more in fact that Elie is not getting the dirt because people aren't giving it to him. I can only conclude they do not respect or trust him. The fact that I also do not probably clouds my judgment.

Signed, 13, the Damned Idiot.

23 - you're an idiot. JD does not have an "eat what you kill" comp system. I work at JD, and I make slighly above market salary (in my geographic region) and got a slighly lower than market bonus last year - and I barely broke 2,000 hours.

For info on Jones Day compensation go to this link, hit control F and type "Jones Day"

http://www.abovethelaw.com/2008/02/associate_bonus_watch_jones_da.php

Hey 30, reread 22's comment. What part of that don't you understand. They have factored that in. As another let go I think saying there have been no layoffs since March is a very easily proveable lie.

33 - you ate less b/c you killed less. hth.

I get paid to smooze.

13 -- I'll sit through any number of "fat AA idiot" jokes, but you're really annoying. It wasn't a press release, it's what Dechert people told me directly. Could they be lying? Sure. But it's just irresponsible to suggest that 80 attorneys have been laid off and yet nobody is reporting it. Just think about it for 8 seconds before you post. 80 attorneys were shown the door "stealthily?" CWT laid off 90 and the internet caught on fire.

As I said in the post, clearly some people have lost their jobs. I'm not going to make up a "hard" number just because you and your anonymous friend wish it.

If your numbers "may be on the high side" then your numbers are "exaggerated" which was exactly the point of my post which you might have gleaned if you read the title.

Dechert Philly here - 13's numbers sound about right to me.

Calm in the storm. Any good headhunter uses a database system that can rapidly and reliably generate a report on growth, attrition, retention, and turnover rate at any of the nation's 100 largest firms in major markets. I don't cover PA markets but one of the locals should step up to the plate and confirm or deny the Dechert story. Piece of cake actually - and useful too. And more fun than Minesweeper.

32- you have issues. If you are so important and trustworthy, why don't you start your own blog? However Mystal and Lat get their information, they seem to get a lot of it. They've reported on layoffs at half a dozen firms this week. I know it must be dizzying to have received 3 emails, but rest assured I trust ATL more than you as a source of (tabloid) information.

Elie,

I am no supporter of inflammatory posts on this site, but I think "13" has a point.

Exaggerated or not, I think you should probably further investigate Dechert's layoffs beyond what the firm's spokesperson told you. (And if these are, in fact, "stealth" layoffs, then why would you rely on what the firm says?) Just because no other blog/news outlet is "reporting" this does not mean there is not much more to the story.

This is not a criticism of you. I actually think you are doing a great job in many ways. But this is probably one of the most important (if not the most important) issues to your readers. And, believe it or not, many attorneys' careers do -- to a degree -- depend on what this site reports about their respective firms, as firm management definitely read it.

So, please track these things down.

Best,

Loyal ATL reader.

I agree with 30. Perhaps those who have been fired want to believe that they were randomly selected for termination as part of a mass layoff, rather than accepting that their performance was not up to par. By telling 13 and others that they were let go as part of a big group, maybe they are just trying to save face and put the blame on the firm rather than on themselves. I would expect firms to be more stringent in their mid-year reviews given the slowdown in business, and those who might have just slipped by in a boom year are now getting cut, thus a larger number of firings around October. All seems pretty logical to me.

Elie,

You've made a declarative statement (the title of the post). Secondly, who are your "Dechert people"? The Firm PR propaganda folks? If so, then 13 still may have a very valid point, and it's not asking too much for you to dig a little deeper. That's what I think 13 is saying.

42, 44, what other digging is there to do? If there isn't a flood of tip-emails coming in re: Dechert layoffs, and the only "tip" that Elie has gotten so far has been from 13 and couple of other comments in other posts (as indicated in the post), it doesn't seem like a terribly deep story. It seems that if there truly were massive "steal" layoffs going on that ATL would be receiving lots of email tips, rather than just posting in response to a few comments and a follow-up with the firm.

I don't agree with 13's criticism of ATL. I'm sorry for people who have either been laid off or pushed out-- at the end of the day it doesn't really matter how it was done. But the article talks about the "demise" of a firm being slightly exaggerated, and then goes on to explain that people have lost their jobs. I agree with 42 that more research is a good thing, and so far ATL has been pretty good at following up on this kind of thing.

I say, keep up the good work ATL. 13, I can understand your frustration with Dechert and that you are loyal to your friends, but it sounds to me like you're taking that out on ATL unfairly.

To those at Dechert who have been treated poorly, my sincere sympathies.

20 here, 13th numbers are a little high, but he has a very good point. There were a number of stealth layoffs in Dechert. The firm gave virtually no support to the associates.

Agree with 12. These kinds of posts are the reason I visit this site regularly. Keep up the good work, Elie.

Dechert's annual evaluations are traditionally given in the spring. These performance reviews seem somewhat ad hoc.

Elie, you are fat and an idiot and you got your job due to affirmative action.

The statement from the Dechert spokesperson is utterly false; this type of misleading communication is one of the reasons why so many Dechert associates are completely miserable and harbor such resentment toward firm management. Not only do they fire our friends and colleagues, but then they shamelessly lie about it!

1.) "Performance reviews are taking place now" - FALSE/MISLEADING. COB today was the deadline for associates to enter all their matters and select evaluators for each in our online system. Meaning that supervising attorneys have not yet even begun to complete evaluations - so obviously the firm has not yet been able to review the [as of yet nonexistent] comments and evaluate associates such that they would be in a position to dismiss poor performers. Attorneys are to complete their evaluations by November 3rd at midnight. Associates are scheduled to receive the results of their evaluations in January/February.

2.) "There have been no layoffs since . . . March." FALSE. I don't pretend to know the exact numbers. However, multiple colleagues were laid off in July (I know of 5 personally), and others just this past week; there certainly may have been more in between that I am not privy to. They were each told they would receive 3 months of severance, during which they would remain Dechert employees in name and on the website in order to assist them in finding a job, but were not expected/wanted to come to work. Much is shrouded in secrecy, as management doesn't want the associates to know what is going on and some who were let go are embarrassed and keep up the charade of working.

3.) "We have reassigned 20 lawyers from our structured finance practice to other areas". REALLY? News to me. Some first years in line to join the real estate finance group were moved to other practice groups before they started working at the firm, but certainly not 20. Other associates have requested to move to busier groups but have been shot down, since there's really no group that's in dire need of additional associates right now.

Predictably, Dechert management is taking the low road. So much more I could say, but this is enough for now. As the Blue Cross commercial says, I wish that I knew what I know now when I was younger ...

Interesting...Dechert was actually interviewing 3Ls at OCIs at my school this fall.

51 - cite to The Faces ("Ooh La La"), not the commercial that plays their song. Thx.

Crap. Took a Dechert offer. Ditched a bunch of V10 in NYC because decided I wanted to stay in Philly after school.

Whatever - I'm only a 2L.

I will say this - Dechert has some really top notch attorneys (esp. in Philly) but others that are just run of the mill - the type of people that get a law degree and work at a firm for 3-4 years. At year 4 or 5 you better be an all-star to stay.

It's the culture and it works for those that have the intelligence to succeed.

of course dechert is interviewing 3Ls, it's not able to get any 2Ls to accept offers or even attend callbacks...

50- Very helpful. That terse and witty critique added quite a bit to the debate.

Associate morale at Dechert Philly is truly in the pits. Can it get any worse now?

Dechert has some really TTT overseas offices and is bleeding cash in the new China office. Has there ever been an economic downturn during which Dechert didn't have massive layoffs?

50 - Elie got his job by winning a reality blogging contest in which no names or personal information about the contestants was disclosed and the winner was selected on the basis of their writing by the votes of fellow ATL readers just like you. How is that affirmative action?

Some of the comments do raise a legitimate question of how much more investigation and fact checking Elie should have or could have done. Lat used to actively solicit tips from readers in virtually every layoff-related post. I don't see much of that from Elie.

At the end of the day, though, this is a blog, not the New York Times or Washington Post. I've noticed that there has been a marked increase in mainstream, non-law related ads on the site since Lat moved over to corporate (need a mortgage, anyone?). Despite the decrease in the quality of this blog since Lat left and all the TTT comments directed at Elie, the advertisers are apparently pretty happy with the viewership.

What is happening at Skadden DC? I thought the v5 firms were immune. Any trouble in other Skadden offices?

I never stick up for Elie, but this time I think he is in the right. What the hell did you want him to do? Post a bunch of speculation?

59 - What's Dechert doing in China? Do they have any business there?

51 is on point 100%.

OK. This Skadden DC talk of trouble is driving me crazy. Does anyone have an facts or is this all BS? I'm not at Skadden DC, but at a DC based firm that is quite like skadden dc. Funny thing is that I think we are in good shape.

Well, maybe not so much.

Ugh. 65 here with a slightly corrected post. Forgive me for my TTT grammar:

OK. This talk of Skadden DC trouble is driving me crazy. Does anyone have an facts or is this all BS? I'm not at Skadden DC, but at a DC based firm that is quite like skadden dc. Funny thing is that I think we are in good shape.

Well, maybe not so much.

I'll throw in verification on Dechert. I was with a Philly Dechert associate last weekend- formerly of the real estate group, now a doc review monkey- and she spoke of practice group shuffling in several offices and waves of layoffs, at least in DC and Philly.

So there's something up for sure.

What happened to Dechert summer associates from this year? No-offer city?

Dechert offered all Philly SA's, at least

Ok Elie, if that is your real name, I'll bite back. This is 13. You just opened yourself up to revealing how little ou know and how low this blog has fallen. Sorry for delay in responding, DC traffic is a bitch.

First, lets get something out of the way. In your response to me you claim that it is "just irresponsible to suggest that 80 attorneys have been laid off and yet nobody is reporting it." As with all your great work, I had to reread this a few times to get your point, which is not that it is irresponsible to claim people let go, but that it is irresponsible to claim that you were not reporting it. Ok, well setting aside the fact this is a tabloid and it is a bit rich for you to decide that posting the truth is irresponsible, maybe what is irresponsible is misleading your readers about what is happening because you either didn't bother to look or don't have the sources to verify.

I posted a comment about Dechert in another thread, as did several other people. Dechert have let A LOT of people go, and ATL was giving them a pass. What you did was look at these comments and then make a post out of them, which basically called the claims BS. You post this ona Friday, with (hopefully) no real news to follow it so over the whole weekend those looking for info on CC, Katten, Sonnenschwine, and MVA will first see a topic saying Dechert is sound at moment, nothing to see here.

Based on your post you claim to know this from speaking with a "Spokesperson". Well that is just Genius Elie. Got a team of monkeys working on this one? You would make a great detective. "Well we can rule Scott Peterson out of the investigation, he didn't do it." "How do you know Sarge?", "Oh, I asked him and he said he didn't." - Its fun playing journalist, isn't it?

See the problem, EIC, is that Dechert is letting people go. You seem to think it is unthinkable that this is happening and you don't know about it. However, if I am right, and you are wrong, isn't it a sign of how useless this blog now is, that you didn't get word, and people didn't tell you that well over 30 people have been let go since March. I mean, if you can't even get the gossip, and you legal coverage of deals is beyond useless, what is the point of this place.

Which brings me to the real issue. Dechert has, and will continue to, let people go. I am trying to be coy about what I know. I can't put down the right figure, or it can easily be traced back to a small group of people. But its between 30-80, and there will be between 15-35 let go in January. To date most in C&S, and BFS, but other areas hit too, and January will not be as selective. I have tried to get my source to contact you. Introduce themselves. Before I wanted them to do this as I still believe this blog serves a purpose, keeping firms in line, and being the defacto union for associates. But you failed Elie. Epic Fail. Now I want them to contact you so I can do the Elaine dance as you have to admit that you did no research, believed the PR people (and don't use semantics to counter my argument that you swallowed the press release. If "your people" are spokespeople for the firm then they are not "your people" they are Dechert people, and anything they say is an offical release.

Now, I am not trying to get you to make up numbers, but I am sorry if I annoyed you by pointing out how ill informed you are. I have said my piece. I know what Dechert has done, and have an idea of what they will do, if they stick to their plan. I have no intention in thrashing a firm, even as a Guest of ATL. However you really messed this one up. Sometimes doing a bad job is worse then doing no job. I do hope that when you have to report the true numbers you have the decency to link back to my comment.

As to what ATL's job is, or the idea I think I could do Elie's job better - Apart from shit on Dechert, McGuirewoods, and Skadden, I would be dry in a few days. No good looking to me for shit. I am neither important, or interesting. But then I am not paid to find good shit on firms. I do think ATL should be more than a mouth piece for law firms. Remember when this blog influence firms, and when it broke news?? Lately it just repeats what other blogs report or gives a "witty" take on a press release. I expect more. The Katten coverage was good, but missing Dechert will haunt Elie for a while.

If you were on Who Wants to be a Millionaire, you'd be screwed. You called out, and picked a fight, with a Guest who claimed to know more than you. Well you phoned your friend, and they lied to you. It was always a 50/50 deal, either they were right or I was, and looking at the comments I think we see the audience is with me.

Try and learn from this. Either research before dismissing a comment, or sit on your ass (fat or otherwise - I didn't appreciate you trying to lower my comment to a fat Elie jab, I personally am better than that. Getting of your fat ass is an expression. Don't play a victim card here) and do nowt. Providing false or misleading info helps no one.

As someone stated above Dechert never has performance reviews this early. Management is getting rid of so many lawyers because it saves hundreds of thousands of dollars per associate shit canned and lots more per partner's throat slit.

Revenue is clearly taking a dive in '08 and '09, so equity partners won't be taking home the $2 million they expected. They are trying to mitigate the lower PPP by trimming lawyers.

If there's a major economic slow down, it takes a special breed of assholes to fire dozens of lawyers, go to great lengths to conceal the lay offs and then say it's performance based when the firm gets outed. It's hard to perform poorly on nonexistent deals or nonexistent cases. Dechert certainly does not have 2000 hours per associate in its bankruptcy, products liability, real estate or corporate groups for '08.

Dechert could have just told the affected lawyers that times are hard and business is down. That management has gone to such lengths as inventing performance reviews shows how dishonest they are and what a shit hole they've turned the firm into. If they are decimating partners and associates one can only imagine what Dechert is doing to its poor staff.

what is dechert's BFS? do you mean FRE? or FSG?

What is amazing id Dechert is getting rid of Partners too. And still it is kept quiet. 51 is correct. Those let go are being asked not to tell anyone. But by end of October the July wave will suddenly vanish. Maybe Elie will notice then. Hint, check website bios now and in late November.

Bank Financing and Securitization.

One last comment from me, 13, I never said the Dechert crap you were fed was a press release. I said it was pr, and I said they lied to you. I based this from fact it was a 'spokesperson" that gave you the 100% cross our heart, oh wait fingers crossed truth. In a different post I mentioned that Lat called out BS boiler plate Press Release.

But hey Elie, if you can't research a huge story like this, it is probably a bit much to expect you to read my annoying comments correctly.

13/75. You are a douchebag.

For the Record:

As of 10/18/08 Dechert's Numbers (per their website) are:

NY: 118 associates, 74 partners
Philly: 150 associates, 76 partners
DC: 50 associates, 26 partners
SF: 11 associates, 3 partners
Boston, 20 associates, 10 partners

Oh no. Someone I don't know thinks I am a douchebag. Maybe I will go hang myself.

Seriously 76. What was your point? I corrected Elie based on my understanding of things. I then stood up against his response. So what do you achieve by coming on and insulting someone you don't know who has challenged someone you don't know?

I don't think Elie is covering up for Dechert, I just think he is doing a bad job. This is not that hard to prove, and the lack of people from Dechert saying no others were let go since March is pretty conclusive.

Also, I am not slamming Dechert for anything other than not being open about what is going on. They have a rep, which I won't go into, but they have good lawyers and bad lawyers like every firm. The people I know and worked against are god lawyers. All the more reason to treat them like grown ups.

@65/66 - nothing wrong with Skadden DC that I know of. Skadden is the one V5 firm that will shed attorneys when it needs to ... but its so large a dozen or so is not noticed in most cases. Last year, though, Skadden Chicago is rumored to have trimmed a bit after a huge lit slowdown, they're probably hurting for it now though.

DC is one of their strongest offices, though. Nothing to worry about there, and especially now going forward with all of the new regulatory BS coming up no matter who wins in Nov.l

Thanks 80. Again, I'm not a skadden drone, but my firm is quite similar to their dc office, and we seem just fine.

Any idea why people in the last two days or so have bashed Skadden DC so much?

Dechert ranked 154 out of 157 firms on this year's AmLaw mid level associates survey.

http://www.law.com/jsp/article.jsp?id=1202423418159

In New York they were number 80 of 81 firms. 1 spot above Cadwalader. In its hometown of Philadelphia the firm ranked 15 of 16.

http://www.law.com/jsp/article.jsp?id=1202423417920

It wouldn't surprise me if the high number of stealth layoffs were not at all exaggerated.

I had drinks with a Dechert associate last night and was told that the associates had to sit through a three hour meeting with the chairman and were basically told nothing although I think they are doing their own survey now. I guess they don't believe AmLaw.

At least 3 of the associates let go back in July were first years (class of 2007). Truly heartless.

Dechert oozes sleaze so they certainly don't deserve the benefit of the doubt. Expect a) massive layoffs, b) concealed,by management, c) portrayed as performance-related.

Its time for this TTT and its associates to be put out of their misery.

Hey #13 -- tell me more about the BFS group at Dechert. I am curious as to what that practice group is like? Is it as good as the OCF group?

Oh and I was out to drinks with an associate from Wachtell last night who told they are laying off 324 associates from their OCF group. And I have 2 emails from Cleary associates who just told me they are laying 200 associates from their OBGYN practice group. Spread the word.

Dechert associate here - 13/51 are basically correct in their assertions, though the numbers may be off somewhat (not much though from what I can tell).

I think it's unfortunate that 13 and other posts have degenerated into a tit for tat with ATL, but I have found it disconcerting, as an associate living under the constant threat of layoffs that could occur at any moment, that ATL hasn't covered this more thoroughly.

Some may recall that ATL broke the news on the first round of layoffs at Dechert before they were initially announced. That is the kind of reporting I think 13/51 and others are missing and frustrated about not seeing.

In any event, I think Dechert, in traditional lawyer-style, actually covered themselves with their comment. "Technically" they haven't laid anyone else off, but they have certainly told many many associates at various levels (yes, including some 2007 grads while they were still first years) that they have 3 months to find another job. The general understanding of this strategy is that it was an effort to enable the displaced associates to find a new job without the stigma of a layoff. There is something commendable about that approach, but the seedy side of it is that it has enabled Dechert to get away with displacing many more associates since the Feb/March layoffs than they let go in the first round.

Indeed, part of the reason why no one can give specific numbers is that no one really knows the true extent, because it depends on people voluntarily telling others they have been let go. But whether it has been 30, 50, or 80, the growing number of dark offices makes it clear that there have been "stealth layoffs" since the first round.

I find it encouraging that something is finally being said about it at all, but I worry that this dismissive post will embolden Dechert to go even further.

Trust me, trust us, there is something more here than Dechert would have you believe....

Anyone know if the layoffs are concentrated in any particular office(s), or are they across the board?

13/78:

My point was to get you to post again. I love it when people proclaim "this is my last post" and then post some more. I figured you'd fall for it easily. I'm just having fun.

or how about particular practice groups?

Another ex-Dechertite here - a few quick points.

First, I know annual reviews are a corrupt industry, but fwiw mine were always excellent. Year after year, and in conversation with partners between, I was told that my performance greatly exceeded expectations. Until they let me go. Maybe they lied and I sucked, but then they should have been more honest from the start.

Second, there is nothing honorable about stealth layoffs. Everybody assumes if you float a resume from Dechert today that you were canned. Firms do stealth layoffs to hoodwink law students and future laterals, not because it's the kinder and gentler approach.

Third, Dechert is cheap and stealth layoffs cost less. People get off the payroll sooner than if they were given severance and might even do some work in between. Even people who got severance from Dechert were told it would cease if and when they found new work. Most businesses (that I know of) cut a check when they lay people off and let the unfortunates get on with their lives rather than creating perverse incentives to not find a job.

Fourth, this is not the first time Dechert has done a layoff and it won't be the last. They have a very unbalanced client base and they will always have unmanageable excess capacity in a downturn.

One final thing - you can't just subtract December associates from what Dechert started the year with to find the number of layoffs. Associates who have not been asked to leave are departing as fast as they can for the same reason that rats flee a sinking ship.

It shouldn't have been a tit for tat exchange.

People post here secretly so they can say things they would put in an email. They can tell the truth. Now people also post junk, but that is Elie's "Job", to sift through the crap and find the truth. For him to take a number of people claiming that Dechert had let go many associates and refute it in a post is silly. And then for him to take a commentator to task for calling him on it is worse.

ATL got hoodwinked by Dechert. Pure and simple. And hopefully ATL will dig a little deeper, both in this story and the next story. My fear is, seeing how petty Elie was above, that he will put his head in the sand and ignore this and hope it goes away.

Stealth law offs are the WORST! There is nothing good about them. It is FAR BETTER for a firm to say we hired too many and do not have the work. Stops people having to lie to other firms about why they are looking for work, and it take s away part of the stigma. And for any assholes about to say that only the bottom "turd" of associates are affected, look around. If you firm got rid of 30 associates, would you be so sure you are safe. And if the head of your department was told to lose 10 people, are you sure it is quality of work they look at, and not pay, bonus, who they can screw out of being a partner. This affects us all, at all firms. We need firms to be honest about why people are let go.

Dechert associate here: I think the layoffs were primarily in the FRE group, but I am not sure. There were a number of 2007 associates who were laid off (more then three). I think the firm was trying to layoff associates in order to free up room for 2008s. However, the corporate and some litigation groups are extremely slow. Many of the associates who were not laid off were put on doc review projects and some were give sabbaticals to do other work elsewhere. In general, I do not think the firm is doing well at all.
This is especially true because that some of the people who were asked to leave were partners.
I do not know if the firm will dissolve, but I would not be surprised.
The management of the firm does not know what they are doing, other than try to squeeze every penny they could from associates.
Most people who were asked to leave still have not found a job and now, especially 2007s who did not have savings from law school and relied on the job at Dechert to survive (some were personally reassured that they would not be laid off by senior partners a few months prior to them being laid off), have no were to turn and will not be able to pay their bills once the checks from Dechert stop coming. It is completely unfair and the firm knows this.
I would also like to agree with people that these layoffs cannot be performance based because the work was nonexistent for months. Additionally, many of the more senior associates who were laid off were unbelievably smart and did better work then partners.
I hope that any 2ls who still can go elsewhere do it and many third years who were summers at Dechert find another job because even if the economy turns up, Dechert is not to be trusted.

Time and again, it is shown that Elie is in way over his head as EIC. Elie lacks the temperament to be an effective EIC of ATL. He is certainly aggressive, yes, but shows that aggressiveness mostly when attacking the readership of ATL or a jelly doughnut.

Elie's problem is he is obsessed with the comments and thinks he is "taking on" the commenters instead of just putting out good articles and being above the fray of the comments. That and his spelling and grammar.

If Skadden DC is not in trouble, then why is everybody so worried that they are pulling the wool over our eyes.

Concerned in Charlottesville

Re the questions about people who have already accepted at Dechert or who are 3Ls who summered there. Short answer, if the econ picks up by the end of 2009 you'll be ok for a while. But when you're a fifth year and the econ starts to turn again, get out...

Management has tanked the reputation of a once well respected firm. People have built careers at Dechert and the dishonesty of management in laying off associates, including first years is eroding the value of Dechert credentials. To give poor performance reviews when it's widely known within the firm that there is very little new business coming in is disgraceful.

The New York office has some groups that have had little to no work for a long time. Obviously real estate is being eviscerated. I think the bankruptcy and corporate groups have merged and together they have nothing to do and haven't had any significant business in several quarters. Since the Vioxx settlement the firm has been stuck with dozens of extra lawyers in its products liability group. Management is even getting rid of partners. The posts about Dechert on this blog and the firm's ever decreasing associate rankings in AmLaw are an indictment on what management has done to the firm. Unfortunately, Dechert might very well get away with this as memories fade when the economy picks up. Because of the stealth nature of its lay offs management will be able to downplay how it fired so many associates and partners.

ELIE, GET THE REAL NUMBERS AND DO A FOLLOW UP POST. MAKE DECHERT MANAGEMENT INFAMOUS.

For those still at Dechert do NOT fall for management's lines that these posts are by a few bad apples. It's not the case that 5 or 10 associates are the only ones posting. Why would that be the case for Dechert, but not Pepper Hamilton, or Blank Rome? Why so much hate for Dechert in the AmLaw mid level associates surveys? As far as firm reviews go, Dechert is under performing.

Like a lot of the other posters, I have several Dechert friends in Philadelphia who were asked to leave in early summer. (They were in FRE, not litigation.) A few are still at Dechert actively looking for jobs. At best, the firm spokesperson is playing a semantic game when he/she says "there have been no layoffs since March." At worst, the spokesperson is lying. Whatever the truth may be, kudos to Dechert for managing to cover it up so well.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=khuu-RhOBDU

Is Dechert/Thelen merger a possibility here?

No 97, Skadden DC is not in trouble. But they are "reorganizing" if you know what I mean.

102
Interesting notion. Dechert certainly has enough empty offices after the layoffs to absorb Thelen's remnants. They would only want Thelen partners with significant books of business and it would take very impressive books of business to convince Dechert to bring in Thelen associates with those partners. Haven't Thelen partners with big books of business already jumped ship?
Dechert is not strong enough to make it unscathed through a serious recession. Dechert's momentary rise was due to a boom economy in which rising tides lifted almost all law firm profits. They also agressively raised rates. Doing that cost them some long term clients but in their arrogance Dechert didn't mind losing clients who objected to its "premium" rates. That arrogance is costing them plenty now. In litigation the firm relied way too much on Vioxx litigation and document review. A friend from Dechert's Philly office told me that one partner was literally in tears when that litigation settled. The firm is definitely not a go to firm for corporate work in NY, especially not in this economy. They eat long, long after the real NY players get fed.

Re the #s in post 77 -- do those include the Class of 2008?

If so, then it should be easy enough to find out roughly how many summers Dechert had in2007 and back them out to get some "real" numbers.

Even if they don't, it shouldn't be hard to find NALP or similar data from 2007 or prior...

Dechert FRE associate here - 51, 88 dead on. Layoffs have been going on in waves since March. Our clients are laying off people and economy is slow, so I understand why we have layoffs.

However, it is extremely disappointing to see my firm basically lie about what they are doing. How hard is it to just admit you are laying off people? It is not as if Dechert is the only one.

As usual, one thing you can rely on at Dechert is for management to trip over its own feet. Like having those public layoffs in March only to realize the same day that you have a massive doc review project that needs bodies thrown at it.

Dechert continues to get a pass. As reported on this site and elsewhere Dechert "reassigned X number of FRE associates in March." Half truth as that implies that they were some how reassigned to another group like C&S. Reality - they were allowed to stay on and do doc review until project ended, at which time they were asked to leave.

So the tilte of this blog post is accurate then...the demise is slightly exaggerated. Dechert seems to be losing its FRE department and getting rid of lots of people. Sure they seem to have been doing this in a way so as to misrepresent what they are actually doing, but ending the FRE practice group would not cause the demise of Dechert.
Have any other departments conducted such lay-offs? If not, then I fail to see how the firm would collapse. Or will the lay-offs in other departments just follow after the review period? Reading how Dechert operates, they will probably clean house right before bonuses are distributed!

Has ATL always been the online mouthpiece for biglaw's public relations departments?

When a firm like CWT openly cuts 100 associates, there are multiple ATL posts and the coverage is stinging. But when a firm like Dechert discretely fires roughly the same number, Elie posts the spokesman's BS verbatim under a banner that states that the rumors are exaggerated, or incorrect.

ATL dubbed the Cadwalader firings a "bloodbath" (and rightly so), but stated that the stealth firings at Dechert are merely "some kind of reorganization process." ATL's coverage gives firms just one more incentive not to be upfront about layoffs.

Anyone know anything about Dechert's Princeton office?

109-
Princeton office was overwhelmingly Vioxx litigation. Its small size and location might help it get through some of the larger cuts as that office is likely a bit cheaper to run than the very expensive new offices in NYC and Philadelphia. The associates in Princeton also get paid less. The problem with the firm's non Philadelphia offices generally is that they service that office. In the best of times associates in satellite offices relied heavily on partners in Phialadelphia for work. Now that there is so much less work those offices are hoarding it. Partners are doing associate work and associates are doing paralegal work in the hopes of making hours. If you're in Princeton then you should be looking. No one without a book of business or an incredibly close relationship with a rainmaking partner is safe.

The last post is inaccurate in several respects. The princeton office is on the same pay scale as Philly. It is largely Products based but also does white collar lit and IP as well as some corp. Additionally the best known products trial attorney is based out of the Princeton office as is the chair of that department. I'd feel comfortable being in that office.

111 is correct. Princeton is a very safe office. It has many important partners and litigation there is very busy.

111
Writing that Princeton is largely products based is a huge understatement. Most of the billables from that office were from the Vioxx litigation. The location of the best known products trial attorney and the group head is a plus, but the head of the products group does not have a significant book of business and has been unsuccessful getting new business since the Vioxx settlement.

Dechert's Princeton office has 31 lawyers according to Dechert's website. It's no worse off than the rest of the firm given the rumors on this blog, and might even be a better office to be than most because it shouldn't be too hard to keep a little over 2 dozen lawyers busy.

Does anyone know if any of the layoffs so far have been from the Princeton office?

Dechert is having problems across groups. I personally know of three associates in the bankruptcy group that have billed between 600-700 hours for the year. All they do now is write articles and focus on pro bono. Dechert HAS NO BUSINESS.

To 112 (who was so eager to correct 111's representation of Princeton's payscale as "less") - yes, it is true that Princeton is on the same scale as Philadelphia. But this is "less" than Dechert's peer firm in Princeton (i.e., Morgan), and it is "less" than all of Dechert's other US offices, whose salaries were raised when peer firms in their markets raised salaries.

Sorry to break it to you Dechert Princeton sychophants, but the well known litigator and practice group head that you reference don't have a book of business. One was defined by the Vioxx litigation and now has nothing. The latter went down in flames on the Fen-Phen litigation years ago. Dechert is top heavy with a lot of service partners that bring nothing to the table.

How are things in the NYC office?

Dechert does not favor the philly office. If anything, Dechert is still throwing its scarce resources at NY, and has been for years, because it wants so very badly to be a NY firm. Given the vast disparity in pay and overhead (and I think talent - come on, why would you go to D in NY?) between Dechert NY and Dechert Philly, the logical thing WOULD have been to spare Philly associates and make the cuts in NY. If anything, the opposite happened. And being cut in Philly truly blows since it means a major cut in pay. (Notwithstanding that Dechert pays philly less than its other offices, it still pays better than all but Morgan in the city. And Morgan ain't picking up Dehcert's leftovers.)

Skadden to 190!!

120 illustrates another issue at Dechert. Dechert's offices see each other as the enemy and tear each other down a fair bit. A Philadelphia associate rightly doesn't care too much about sharing work with a New York assocate when the New York associate, depending on class year, makes tens of thousands of dollars more in base and bonuses. Dechert short changes its Philadelphia associates and creates needless competition between them for a limited bonus pool. It doesn't do much for firm morale. But 120's basic points are dead on. Dechert shits on its associates and apparently its partners too.

Times are hard at Dechert's NYC office. No real work and the associates that I know are always pissed because they do a lot of paralegal work. I can't understand why this firm wants to pretend that things are running smoothly. It's so clear to see that the firm is poorly managed and that morale is non-existant.

Looks like they have a hard time getting new business. Their rep is in the tank, so can they really be surprised? Dechert's street cred is pathetic. They are going to have a hell of a time pulling top talent.

#92 and #93,

Thank you for speaking the truth about this whole stealth layoff sham. Firms are essentially asking departing associates to blatantly lie on their interviews (often by having them sign NDAs), and many associates take the bait because they are afraid they won't get a job if they are honest. Newsflash: Firms know when you've been asked to leave. While you may think you're being clever (and self-preserving) by coming up with some lame answer like, "Oh, I want more hands-on experience" or "Oh, I want a smaller firm," any interviewer worth their salt will smell blood and pounce. Also, it's a small community and it's not that unusual for "off-the-record calls" to be made to an interviewer's friends when something about your answer (to the "Why are you leaving?" question) just smells funny.

As someone who has not been asked to leave, but would like to jump ship - Does the interviewer see Dechert on the resume and assume I've been shown the door?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yTp_atr2G9E&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yTp_atr2G9E&feature=related

Keep digging Elie. Look at other firms that commenters claim are laying off, too.

Dechert isn't the only firm doing "stealth" layoffs in the "performance review" context ... but doing them months before reviews actually take place. Look at Mayer Brown. They haven't been properly accounted for as a firm that is indeed laying off associates.

Dechert DC is going to struggle starting the middle of next year.

Dechert DC's financial services and white collar focus should be much more consistent than other offices/groups given the current regulatory climate and the likely onslaught of SEC/DOJ investigations and increased rulemaking. In general, DC based regulatory practices should be better able to weather the storm.

Fried Frank has now instituted its "stealth" layoff program. Attorneys are being told left and right that they cannot practice is their chosen field, but will need to find work in other practice groups.

132, if there's no work in your "chosen field" and the firm shifts you to another practice group, that's not a layoff, stealth or otherwise.

If there's no work in your "chosen field" and the firm refuses to shift you to another practice group where there is work at your year level, dumps you in doc review, and then gives you a bad performance review at the end of the year as a result, recommends that you find work elsewhere, and tells the world that no, they're not laying associates off because of the economy, that's a stealth layoff.

"eat what you kill" applies to partners

"non lockstop" or "producitivity based" bonuses refer to associates

HTMFH

Elie does a fine job. That he does not have the sTTTench of a shiTTT school on him is what drives you assclowns batshit no doubt.

Dechert is refusing to even consider charging fixed fees instead of billing by the hour. In the coming year this hard line will prove to be disastrous for the firm as their competitors are more accomodating to their clients.

"Elie does a fine job. That he does not have the sTTTench of a shiTTT school on him is what drives you assclowns batshit no doubt."

But that's only because of AA--if not for some quota requirement, he would have been a Loyola grad being layed off from Dechert, just like me!

I'm confused - is Dechert doing worse than other firms right now, or are people just mad because their management tries to conceal what's going on and operates in a sneaky and "stealth" manner?

Shouldn't layoffs like this be expected in an economic downturn? Or is something especially bad about Dechert's financial performance?

138: probably both. Good management presumably has backup plan for when economy or particular practice areas slow down over the years.

Former Dechert Atty here, worked for Dechert in the early '00s. Dechert treated its associates poorly then, and it looks like the tradition has endured. I assume Bart is still at the helm.

I feel badly for the associates but not for the management, which has tried to claw up to the next level of firms, via PPP, on the backs and at the expense of its associates for many years.

Law students, you have been warned.

@138 - Dechert decided they only wanted the biggest, most cost-insensitive clients. Apparently, there aren't many of those around right now. They pursued a myopic and over-greedy strategy and the associates are paying for it.

Should we "expect" layoffs in a bad economy? I have mixed feelings on that one.. Associates at big law firms, back in the dark ages, expected to make partner if they worked hard and did good work. Ok, those days are gone and we all bought into the new model for a 160K starting salary.. But I don't think it's too much to expect a little short-term job security.

People laid off today are going to have a rough patch and may never really recover. It will kill some budding careers.

As associates, we should do all we can to publicize layoffs to make sure there is a long-term recruiting cost for the firms that do them. From this comes job security.

136
You're right. Dechert's inflexible billing policies will definitely cause them anguish. They bill just as much as the top of the AmLaw 100 but in cities like NY the firm does not have the brand to command those rates. It also makes it extremely hard for partners to bring in new clients. When Dechert started with its premium rate policies it lost several partners and whole groups in practice areas that couldn't command the ridiculous new rates. State tax practice, media law to name 2. Read the May 2007 issue of AmLaw which had a big feature on the firm, but also posed some questions as to how viable its growth strategy would be in years to come. It seems that the author of the article was right to raise those questions.

http://www.law.com/jsp/article.jsp?id=1178874295275

136, 138
From the tale end of the AmLaw article on Dechert:

"The longer ladder to partnership and emphasis on premium practices has made Dechert's revolving door spin much faster: 37 percent of the 192 equity and 20 income partners listed in a law firm directory in 2001 have departed, replaced by 96 lateral and 43 homegrown partners. (There are currently 174 equity and 114 nonequity partners.) Associate turnover, meanwhile, has been as high as 35 percent.

Practice groups that couldn't keep up with rate hikes withered. "Every year, the rates were going up substantially," says M. Joel Bolstein, a former environmental law partner who left for Fox Rothschild in 2002. "It was a sustainability issue. We were competing with other state and regional practices, but at Dechert, everybody's rates have to go up at the same time." In a one-on-one meeting in 2002, Bolstein recalls, "Bart said, 'We're really going to be taking a closer look at the environmental group and how that fits in with our vision for the firm.' It was pretty obvious that the group wouldn't be getting resources." Dechert gradually priced itself out of the running for laterals in that and other practices. "Very recently it became difficult, if not impossible, to hire at Dechert at the partner level," says Lee Zoeller, a former state tax partner. "It's hard to find someone with a $5 million book of business."

Winokur and his team don't seem too worried about the churn. Though he acknowledges that turnover can have an impact on the firm's culture, Winokur says the effect on finances has been negligible. The firm is hiring now in Europe, he says, and planning for an office in Hong Kong -- Dechert's first in Asia. It can afford to. With a 25 percent required annual capital investment by all partners, the firm carries virtually no debt, Winokur says. And it is awash in cash from its record returns.

That's not to say that the firm isn't looking over its shoulder. It faces competition on every front as it tries to hold on to premium work. In hedge fund work, for instance, Schulte Roth & Zabel is fighting Dechert for dominance; Kirkland & Ellis is muscling in, meanwhile, on private equity. "There are huge peer-group issues now," admits Feirson. "If you look at Dechert's Am Law 100 numbers now, you say, 'Isn't that unbelievable, isn't that great.' But if you look behind you, it's terrifying."

Amen 141. Law firms like Dechert should be shamed so that when they get googled by a 2L 3 or 4 years from now this blog comes up. If anything motivates management at Dechert to start acting human again it will be losing pitches because inhouse counsel can see that it lacks the ability to staff its matters with top talent. The only plus from in house's stand point is that Dechert probably now lacks the ability to egregiously over staff its matters, which was a hallmark of some of its practices in better times.
I can't imagine any potential client would completely dismiss what's written on this blog as completely unfounded. Even giving Dechert the benefit of the doubt, it says something that a firm can inspire this much antipathy in its employees.

I hear you 144. But isn't that the problem with Elie's rush to rubbish the idea that Dechert had let go MANY associates and Partners. If you just search Dechert posts on ATL and read the titles you will see "Rumors Of Dechert's Demise Are Slightly Exaggerated" instead of "Dechert Reportedly Engaged in Stealth Layoffs". You wouldn't even have to change too much of the actual post, except maybe question the Dechert "spokesperson" a little bit more, but it would put people on notice of Dechert, and maybe pressure them to release more information.

Maybe this is a bit much for you Elie. Maybe you crumble when a real story comes along.

how's dechert ny's litigation practice faring?

Another problem with Stealth Layoffs is the unintended (or maybe intended) effect it has on people trying to escape Dechert.

If you are a good lawyer at a sinking ship, you want to leave. However any firm that gets your resume (along with the flood of other ones from Dechert) will assume that you are one of the stealth lay offs. Some firms will assume, as you are doing here, that Dechert is getting rid of you because you are underperforming.

Stealth layoffs distort the market, and need to be hammered. This site used to do something about this. Now it just bends over, grabs its ankles and pray that the Big Bad LAw Firm is quick this time.

In all fairness to Elie, Dechert's level of underhandedness is hard to fathom. He'd need to do a lot of legwork to get beneath the firm's bullshit. People at the firm can hardly believed how underhanded management is at times. This is a firm that retroactively changed its bonus requirements and docked people thousands of dollars for not entering their time every day. Up until management's revisionist history, late time meant time entered after the second business day of the following month.

I think the thrust of the posts is that Dechert is getting rid of people because it lacks the business to keep them busy enough to justify their salaries. Dechert did not start its review process months in advance to hurry people out the door because it suddenly realized it had between 50-100 under performing associates AND partners. It did so to avoid paying bonuses and salaries. If law firms are seeing dozens of Dechert first year, midlevel and senior associate resumes then they know the issue is with the firm. In any case, now is a terrible time to be in the job market.

146-
Dechert's white collar litigation group in NY is headed by a very well respected lawyer who came over as part of the Swidler Berlin merger. That partner and the people in his group have a very well regarded practice within the firm. Outside of that white collar group I'd be surprised if NY litigation was doing well, but I defer to those who actually work in that office.

@141. I wish what you say were true. That firms could be punished for stealth layoffs. But here is my fear for you all, because I have already been stealth laid off by a v10 (I mean left voluntarily because of previously undisclosed complaints about my performance and lack of confidence in my abilities), every firm is going to begin engaging in stealth layoffs starting this quarter. And when every firm engages in the activity, it ceases to become a stigma. Moreover, in a bad economy people are just happy to have any jobs, even if it is a Faustian bargain with firms such as Dechert. That is why, unfortunately, I am keeping my mouth firmly shut about publicizing the firm from which I was let go. I figure it won't stop others from stepping in my dog poo and it won't improve my prospects for a new job. All I can say to everyone out there is there are only two reasons you should not fear for your job: you are either stupid or indispensable. And no one is indispensable in this market.

Best of luck to all who find themselves, like me, in a choppy job market trying to land on their feet. Although we may be competing for jobs, I hope you succeed in getting employment soon.

Also last bit of advice: do NOT use headhunters. In this market, firms are going to scoff at paying finder's fees when there are layoffs of very good associates taking place all the time. You should conduct the search on your own and directly with recruiting offices. Note that many job openings specifically state that they take no recruiter calls/solicitations. So don't waste your time with search firms (even if they advertise prominently on this site).

150-
Couldn't agree with you more about headhunters. I had a few headhunters tell me outright that they were placing more partners this year than associates for the first time. The associate lateral market is very bad off. In light of the number of Cadwalader, Thelen, Katten, Sonnenschein, Dechert associates pounding the pavement looking for jobs it makes no sense at all for firms to pay headhunter fees. And those are just the firms we know about. If your resume is out there now you're competing with hundreds of recently stealthily and nonstealthily laid off associates in a recession. As bad as this sounds many of you may want to consider what you'd like to do if you could no longer work in a large law firm.

on a serious note, dechert lawyers are known for having girlfriends that f@ck other guys

How are the lay-offs impacting Dechert's DC office?

Keep it up Elie. You just need 3 new posts to get this embarresment off the front page of your site. So far we have a post on law students being nervous, NYU changing grade, another useless survey, and a story of someone ATL met over the weekend. Lets see how many more crap articles you can put up to push this real story down.

15, good call. I also predict that 159 will = truth.

154 - exactly what i was thinking...

Notice hardly anyone claiming to be from Dechert and denying the story, that there have been mass layoffs and it is done in a sneaky way.

How can Elie attack 13 above and not refute it with anything better than "well I asked and tehy said they weren't, so there". If you honestly believe it is false, then say so. If you want to look a bit deeper than repost about Dechert, this time in a negative light. If you can discuss baseball on one post, Elie, you can address people questioning your ability to report actual news.

Almost there, just 2 crap news stories to go....

155 is a genius

Elie, I understand that some of the people on this board can be harsh. It's probably cause they miss Lat and hate all things new. But in all seriousness, there is a lot more to the Dechert story than you may have been made to believe on Friday. Many if not most law firms engage in stealth lay offs, but the story at Dechert is that the number may be very high and that they have gone to great pains to hide it from ATL and other media. Lying to you about when they do reviews is the tip of the iceberg.

If indeed there's truth to the assertion that Dechert has been laying off associates and partners in groups of 5-7 from February or March to date, then that's a minimum 40 associates on top of the reported 13 reported on this site. That's a very, very conservative estimate. The numbers may be higher than that.

You're to be commended for following up the initial comments that appeared about Dechert in the Sonnenschein post from last week, but don't drop the ball on this story now.

Yes law students are nervous, for good reason, but a shit load of associates getting shit canned from one of the big players in Philadelphia deserves as much coverage as Katten, possibly Cadwalader and at least as much as Clifford Chance. You're not going to let the story fall off the front page without so much as an Update, are you?

Elie, cxould you please do a follow up.

You betcha, 160.

Dechert laid off 13 in Feb, saw the bad press (WSJ, Wa Post, even the Economist and we read it first on ATL), AND BROUGHT THE PEOPLE BACK with a press release that it was a misunderstanding and nobody was being laid off and some people were merely being reassigned [to a temporary project from which they were subsequently LAID OFF with no mention in the press]. And now we read that they have quietly pushed out something like 50 others? You BETCHA this is a story Joe the should-have-been-a-plumber-but-went-to-law-school-instead wants to read about.

Props to Dechert for making Cadwalader look humane. At least the Cads told the truth.

Exactly. When Lat ran this thing, heaven help a firm that lied to ATL. He would post things when there was nothing to it, keeping the firm name at the top of the page. Shame is a powerful beast.

But this clown, he's pushing the story down with threads about beards!!!!! SeriouSly, BEARDS!!!

all people want to read about right now is the job market. layoffs, firings, the lack of jobs, etc. who cares about trivial things like NYU and garbage about a nutty judge?? this site gets the most traffic when it posts about layoffs. keep your eye on the ball, and don't worry what pitch is best to throw on 3-1.

and yeah, i won't stop reading ATL. the only difference is that i won't be checking as often. the same, i'm sure, with other people.

Mission Acomplished!

Skadden DC is starting to resemble the Titanic.

Elie, this is silly.

You can try to post stupid stuff over it.

And you can bury your head in the sand, and pretend it doesn't exist.

But people are not ignoring the Dechert issue.

Now people are beginning to wonder why you are ignoring it.

I don't think you are doing it on purpose.

Don't think you are that smart to be honest.

Which means you are just bad at your job.

Oh well. If only there was a way that this story could be on the side bar for all to easily click on.....

Seriously though, why are you not addressing the Dechert story?

well played, 169-178.

Elie, I realize it hurts your feelings when law firms lie to you, and confrontation can be difficult for socially awkward people such as yourself, but please try to put the screws to DecherTTT. Thanks.

HAHAHA Caturday! And Beards!

So now ATL will cover 8 attorneys losing their jobs, but not 30 at Dechert?

Can someone post something substantive about these Skadden DC rumors? Elie? Care to confirm or deny?

182, Don't look to Elie. He'll just call up Skadden and ask them. When they say, off course not, he'll dutifully post that all is well at Skadden. And if you are crass enough to question him he will try and bitch slap you, and claim you are a fool.

And when others start to say, actually Skadden is letting people go, he will ignore it and ignore it. Sometimes it is best to have people think you are an idiot, then to open you mouth and confirm it.

The Dechert "spokesperson" is lying! Associates and non-equity partners are being "let go" quietly so as not to cause an uproar in the press. Plain and simple. For Dechert to be playing this as "performance related", when performance reviews have not even been done yet is ludicrous. I know for a fact that very good attorneys (with lots of billable work) are being "let go" so that year end bonuses will not have to be paid. Hold the sleaze ball "spokesperson" to account and get the FACTS out and not some Dechert spin.

184 makes very good point, the really sleezy thing is how many were let go just to keep bonus payouts down.

Elie, when you were bending over to take it from Dechert, did you wonder that maybe fall was a strange time to give performance reviews? You did query on that? Tell me you pushed back, at least a little?

Things are getting very bad here at Dechert... people in several groups are not billing and rumors have it that people will soon be let go -- especially from real estate and corporate group..

http://www.legalweek.com/Articles/1168153/Ex-Dechert+lawyer+sues+firm+for+discrimination.html

10/6/2008: Former Dechert associate sues claiming the firm exaggerated the extent of its corporate work in order to woo him, did not provide the touted opportunities, and then fired him in part because he is an Orthodox Jew. He was fired in 1/2004.

The worse thing is that Dechert will act like none of this ever happened. For the love of God Elie, do more follow up on this or some sad sack 2L 4 years from now will be blissfully unaware of the shit storm that went down at Dechert while he was studying for the LSAT. He will then foolishly accept a job offer there because he wants to stay in Philly or some such nonesense.
Firms like Dechert depend on secrecy to cover their egregious business practices. Shed some light on their bs. They also lied to you.

Dechert gets classier by the min.

If only there was a legal blog that reported this sort of gossip and stuck it to the big law firms.....

That story of 187 is pretty amazing. No real merits to it, and the guy is going to lose. But why wasn't that story on here?

Now I am beginning to think Dechert may have something on Elie, Lat or someone important.

Any update?

Buddy in Philly emailed to say Dechert having partner call in morning to discuss 'negative coverage". Wonder if Elie will be on the call, taking ntoes how to spin things in Dechert's favor.

Buddy in Philly emailed to say Dechert having partner call in morning to discuss "negative coverage". Wonder if Elie will be on the call, taking notes how to spin things in Dechert's favor.

Dechert is still having offer dinners (at least for NY schools). One of them is tomorrow. I wonder what will be said?

194, probably something like, stories we are letting people go? Really, hadn't heard. I saw Above the Law did a piece where it admitted that nothing really had happened.

They should change the name. "Dechert" sounds like squirrel farts.

They should change the name. "Dechert" sounds like squirrel farts.

They should change the name. "Dechert" sounds like squirrel farts.

194, offer dinner for DC schools was last week.

is all this firing just philly or NY too?

187
Any associate in Dechert's NY office would vouch for the fact that Dechert lies about the scope its corporate work. Now that group is very, very slow. The word came down from on high that corporate was to be merged with the firm's bankruptcy group with the thinking by management that there would be some sort of synergy that would allow the groups to win more business. This of course makes absolutely no sense. The groups do not get along at all and they have NOT been able to land any serious new business. The idea that these partners have enough business to occupy its associates to the tune of 2000 associate hours per year is laughable.

When the partners get together and divvy up the pot at the end of the year, THERE WILL BE BLOOD.

200, NY hit hardest, so I heard.

Never trust a law firm with an ugly website.

202
Makes sense. Salaries are highest in that office. Laying off a first year there saves the firm 200k if that associate has nothing to do. Mid levels and slow counsel/non-equity partners provide even greater savings. Some associates in that office have billed less than 600 hours from the beginning of '08 to date. While pro bono and the occasional article is fine for 100 hours or so, when that's all you're doing, then the writing is on the wall. The equity partners still want to pull $2 million each this year. With no significant corporate work, real estate completely dead, waning bankruptcy and slow litigation equity partners will get rid of as many associates as necessary to keep PPP up. There is also the fact that the firm chairman reportedly make $8 million per year. These are not people who will take a hit for associates.

It would be great to see a new post on this topic that incorporates the wealth of new information that has surfaced.

Obviously, we here at ATL feel terribly for the associates at Dechert and their friends. Clearly the firm is not doing enough to either calm fears, or the firm is simply not being forthright with people who are rightly worried about their jobs. If I were a Dechert associate, I too would be worried about the future, and might well "demand updates" in lieu of actual information from the partners.

However, the best "hard information" Lat and I have gathered remains captured in the post above. Clearly some associates have been asked to "move on," clearly other associates will be as well. But so long as the people who speak for the firm stick to their story, and so long as the partners refuse to contradict the firm on the record, we cannot know how many associates have been asked to leave, or will be asked to leave.

I encourage worried associates to continue reading this thread, as people here are allowed to say things that we cannot "report" as "fact."

As soon as we have additional reliable information about Dechert, even if that information contradicts what we have already posted, we will report that information.

In the meantime, I am sorry that it is such a stressful time for so many of you who are associated with Dechert or know people who are.

Please continue to post whatever you feel is relevant on the threads. We will continue to track down all the leads and post if any of them reveal additional information.

Do any Dechert partners with their feet to the fire to bring in new business at non-negotiable rates have anything to add? What about people in HR or staff members in the know? Usually associates have far less of the big picture than staff, many of whom see the smoking gun e-mails and memoes that associates do not. It takes a concerted effort for Dechert to keep up the charade that these lay offs are performance based and infrequent. I hope someone listening in on the reported partner call tomorrow drops a dime on their bs.

can we bump this thread then?

GUIDE TO ELIE TO STOP SUCKING SO MUCH:

1) Stop expecting partners and P.R. people from law firms to randomly decide they are going to change their story and fuck over their own firm.

2) Remove twinkie from right hand. Place in left hand with the left-hand twinkie.

3) Type post asking Dechert associates who have been laid off to e-mail you with some proof that they were Dechert associates, along with comments. Include four basic grammar errors.

4) Title post something that references some obscure movie and has nothing to do with post. Suggestion: "Goddammit! I swear if you guys rip on my (weight / bad posts / affirmative action admission into Harvard) 13 or 14 more times, I'm outta here!"

5) Wait for former Dechert associates to e-mail you.

6) Realize they do not like or trust you, and thus will not e-mail you with their own names.

7) Pretend to be Lat and write up the same post again.

8) Check Lat's e-mail.

9) Write post quoting people who gave some reasonable proof they used to be Dechert associates. Keep said people anonymous in post.

10) Stop being a fat douchebag who is too lazy to think up a method of verifying supposedly massive layoffs other than calling up the firm in question and asking, and then shoving his hands into his fat rolls in frustration until they change their story.

Dechert has been spewing lies since January 2008. Just before they started the first round of "stealth" layoffs, they gutted their secretary and paralegal staff. Everyone is fair game at Dechert.

A friend of mine in Dechert's corporate group told me that the D.C. office has been in trouble for some time. Really since August of 2007. They have been pimping themselves for work. Even know of an associate that left the D.C. office to transfer to NYC in hopes for more work. People are getting their throats clit.

The service partners at Dechert should be ashamed of themselves. Holding associates to standards that they can't even meet. Reviews should be interesting. Last year Dechert already pulled a fast one regarding "performance based" reviews just to push people out. Can't believe that they are doing it again this year. How pathetic.

Last year Dechert played the "billing" game and claimed that if associates had entered their time daily that there wouldn't have been bonus issues. They even pointed to some obscure memo that they claimed to have posted on the intranet. Funny how NONE of the associates knew about said memo. Now they are going to create "bad" reviews just to give someone the boot? They really need to get their money right. They should focus on getting some actual business and dump their dead service partner weight.

Isn't Rich Rizzo the Dechert billing hound?

Elie,

I have been vocal critic of you. But I appreciated you (finally) responding. I am trying to get my contact to reach out to you, but they really believe it will be obvious who they are once they speak. But keep digging.

One complaint is that you should have done a new post, and made Dechert squirm. No good comes from a response in middle of a post.

Elie,

I have been vocal critic of you. But I appreciated you (finally) responding. I am trying to get my contact to reach out to you, but they really believe it will be obvious who they are once they speak. But keep digging.

One complaint is that you should have done a new post, and made Dechert squirm. No good comes from a response in middle of a post.

13

Dechert partner call cancelled as Management tries to determine who is leaking info. There will be one on one calls instead.

NY Associates are not happy and are begging for info. All they are being told is that it is a few unhappy people, yet about 15 are leaving at end of month - However there is a rumor that some will be asked to stay on a week or so, to make it appear not to be a mass layoff.

Christ Elie. There can't be this much "whisper-down-the-lane" shit out there without some of it being true. You can't simply listen to a PR/HR hack who gets everything through two layers of rose glass, then spins it, and call it a done deal. If half of this information on Dechert is true, we've got the Lehman of Biglaw happening, and you're plumping the pillows on the fucking deck chairs. And you work floater secretary hours. Shit, nevermind, they actually came in on Columbus Day. And you just lounge around in your pajamas and gorge on Chipotle? Asshole. When LEH crashed, Carney worked the whole weekend, all hours. Bess and EP have worked more weekends than I have lately. I respect Lat's work ethic because he did time at WLRK. You come out of the gate with your mouth full of marbles, your stomach full of candy, and your dedication somewhere south of "2005 summer associate who doesn't get an offer." This plus your semi-weekly DailyKos cut and pastes? Lat, you built this. Do you really want it all to crash down in a misspelled heap of incompetence?

The sad thing is, 218, that ATL is probably getting lots of hits, and page views, as people trust that this site will have the Gossip. Sadly it has failed to deliver.

And Dechert is not alone.

You know what? I can't take it anymore. This is the most important issue going on and the story is buried in the archives. So here you all go, until ATL decides to do its job I am creating a blog just to address this issue. Starting with Dechert. Let me know about anything else and I'll create an open thread. Not trying to profit, just give a place where the most important issue facing lawyers today can be discussed.

It's clumsy, but at least you know I am not concerned with the marginal crap that ATL has been consumed with lately.

http://mfscribe.blogspot.com/

A few unhappy people are not responsible for over 200 posts. But even if you're inclined to believe that line of bullshit, are you also going to believe that a few unhappy people is why Dechert midlevels rank the firm second to last in Philadelphi, and second to last in NYC, one spot above CWT? That few bad apples speech from management was bullshit when Dechert started falling in the associate rankings and is bullshit today as Dechert competes for last place with CWT.

New York associates are concerned because too many partners have been doing associate work for too long. Partners stopped communicating with associates long ago. Probably ashamed of the fact that they have no matters to assign. Management has purposefully kept them in the dark. The fact that management let it get this bad speaks volumes about how "leanly" this firm is managed.

As for Dechert finding out who is leaking information, just look for the guy or gal in the partnership who still has morals. Dechert should be spending more time trying to drum up business and less time trying to get its underfunded IT staff to figure out who is posting to ATL. And fuck Dechert for making managements inability to land clients into an associate performance issue. You can put lipstick on Dechert's policy committee and it will still be composed of dishonest, lying sacks of shit.

WORRIED ABOUT YOUR JOB? HEARD ANY NEWS? SINCE ATL WON'T DO ITS JOB, PLEASE START A DISCUSSION AT:

MONKEY F&CKING SCRIBE

http://mfscribe.blogspot.com/

Friend at Dechert just told me that ATL is no longer accessible in at least one of their offices.

Hello All:
The Monkey Scribe has just been told that Dechert is blocking Above the law! Fight the power. And spread the word to your Dechert friends that there is a new outlet for them to discuss this ridiculousness. BigLaw cannot do this associates and get away with it. Also spread the word that the Scribe is on your side.

http://mfscribe.blogspot.com/

can someone verify that ATL has been blocked at Dechert or some of its office. New York?

yeah, i dont trust the monkey scribe yet

225, WORTH ASKING, BUT i WOULD ASSUME IF IT IS BLOCKED AT dECHERT THE ASSOCIATES CAN'T post until tonight. Right? I mean who is going to sneak out of the building to go to an internet cafe to post. Plus, if it is blocked they don't even know that ATL is saying it, as it is blocked!!

I am a former Dechert lawyer. I just called a Dechert partner in the Philadelphia office, and told him to log into the site. He was able to to start reading this article and the comments. So the site works fine for Dechert.

228, did you ask if the rumors were true?

The partner was not aware of layoffs since March, but he's not necessarily aware of what's going on -- he's in his own world. I can try to find out, but it's been a long time since I left there, and I have few remaining friends.

Thanks 230. If only ATL would do a follow up post that could collect the rumors and have Dechert address them.

I would really appreciate a follow up story on this. It is very scary information.

Is it possible that the site is blocked in one office but not another? Just curious.

More likely partners can access and associate can't.

Yay, at least this got a mention at top again. Never noticed link said Exaggeration but Caution. Is that new?

does anyone have the full text of the story on the dechert chairmin posted on the front page?

You would think ATL would post something on it, at the very least. At least it is newsworthy.

236, I don't have a subscription, but Westlaw has The Legal Intelligencer database, but they haven't yet picked up this article. I'm really anxious to read it.

Rumors are swirling on legal blog “Above the Law” about “stealth layoffs” at Dechert, with several posters to the site claiming associate layoffs ranging from 13 to 80 and even more across several months since March.

But the firm’s chairman, Barton J. Winokur, has adamantly denied any layoffs took place and said the number of associates who have left the firm for any reason in the first nine months of the year was lower than in the same period in 2007.

A Dechert spokesperson told “Above the Law” that “performance reviews are taking place now and some associates will be encouraged to move on.”

The spokesperson said there haven’t been any layoffs since March, and 20 structured finance attorneys were reassigned to other practices. The spokesperson also said business is down in some areas but strong in most practices, and associate headcount is up in the United States.

“In my view, layoffs are when you decide to cut headcount,” Winokur said. “It’s not when you decide to replace people with better people.”

Winokur said the culture of the firm is to improve year over year and when people reach a point of seniority and still aren’t getting better, the firm will sometimes tell them they don’t have a future at Dechert.
Legal industry watchers in the Philadelphia area told The Legal they’ve heard rumors of layoffs at Dechert, but no one seemed to be sure of the number.

A person knowledgeable about the local market said he heard of the possibility of layoffs from former and current Dechert attorneys but said even they weren’t sure of the number.

Winokur was adamant that there had been no layoffs since those in the finance and real estate practice announced earlier this year. He said there are a total of 68 U.S. associates who were at Dechert in January of 2008 that were not there by the end of September. For that same time period in 2007, he said, 82 U.S. associates had moved on. He wouldn’t specify whether those numbers were all associates who were asked to leave or if some left on their own accord.

Aside from the 68 associates who have left the firm between January and September, 101 were added to the U.S. offices in that time frame. Winokur compared that to the 96 that were added in 2007 when 82 left.

When looking at just the finance and real estate practice, he said 23 associates left the practice in the first nine months of 2007 and 24 left in that same time period this year. That includes, he said, the 13 layoffs announced in March.

Winokur said the firm came out earlier in the year and said it was cutting headcount and hasn’t done it since.

In March, the firm gave layoff notices to 13 associates in the finance and real estate practice, but later that day told the group that while they were laid off from that practice, they could take opportunities in other practices. Winokur said the group was told Dechert couldn’t guarantee how long they would be reassigned to a different group. He said 12 of the 13 took the offer and a few left during the first month of the offer.

Ultimately, there were nine or 10 associates from the original 13 who were laid off at the end of three months once their assignment concluded, Winokur said.

The 20 associates mentioned by the spokesperson who were reassigned were separate from the original 13, Winokur said. Nine of those 20 were associates were supposed to start in the finance and real estate practice, but they were split among other groups because that practice didn’t need extra attorneys, he said. There were 17 associates in total who were supposed to start in the practice, so only eight actually did.

One of the comments on “Above the Law’s” post questioned the “performance review” explanation for the layoffs, saying the firm’s review period hasn’t concluded yet.

Winokur said the formal review process, which is staggered over months to deal first with those associates who are having trouble, is set to conclude by the end of the year with partners and senior associates just now finishing filling out reviews. Those associates let go earlier in the year for performance issues were done because the firm isn’t going to ignore problems until review time, he said. Winokur said the number of associates who will have left the firm over performance issues is sure to rise — once reviews are completed — from the 68 who have already left.

Winokur said associates want more frequent reviews and the firm has responded. While there is still only one formal review — that will change to two next year — Dechert offers more frequent, informal reviews throughout the year. He said associates had complained that reviews were given too late, around the time bonuses were given out at the end of the year.

“This is all such bull, if you don’t mind my saying so,” Winokur said of the layoff rumors.

anybody know how many associates they have total?

if this article is true, is that even higher than average attrition?

240, 540 associates per the website.

I guess I'm taking a small risk in saying that I'm an associate at Dechert both with work and able to access the site in NY at work. I started work at 8:30 this morning, so not all the work has dried up.

Are any of Dechert's practice groups "safe" or, to some degree, insulated from the layoffs?

Dechert's comments are a little disingenuous. As a member of their Finance and Real Estate group, I can confirm that FRE laid off at least 13 associates/counsel in late July for economic reasons, i.e. lack of work. These layoffs were not performance-related because some of the people affected were given good performance reviews a few months previously and were even told that their layoff was economy-related. They were given three months to find another job. Seems like the firm wants to redefine what a layoff is - even going by its definition, these people have not been (and will not be) replaced with other attorneys (better or otherwise) and so must be categorized as layoffs. Also, since these people are still presumably on the firm payroll through the end of October (the end of their three month period - I still see some of them around), maybe the firm is taking the position that they have not been laid off yet and thus no layoffs have occurred.

DLA has been doing staff layoffs for 5 weeks. What about associates?

The Dechert View on "layoffs":

"In my view, layoffs are when you decide to cut headcount. It's not when you decide to replace people with better people." -- Bart Winokur

Former Dechert ATY here. Best job protection at Dechert: Sleep with Dan O'Donnell.