More Layoffs Coming in 2009?
I’ve been operating under the assumption that the legal layoff party of 2008 would stop in 2008. My rose colored logic has been simple. I’ve assumed that Biglaw managers can: A) count, B) add, and C) figure out a sustainable 2009 business model. If those three assumptions are true, I figured that most well managed law firms would be able to get through all of their attorney reductions in 2008 and get themselves into an appropriate position for 2009.
Flawed logic? Perhaps. It’s what the shrinks like to call a “coping mechanism.”
Of course, in making these assumptions I ignored the possibility that some firms were still using “operation ostrich”: a heads down, asses high approach that gleefully exposes tail feathers to the still spinning wheel of economic destruction.
The Legal Intelligencer today warns us that the first quarter of 2009 could see more chopping at firms that are still trying to ride out the storm:
Move over, New York — it’s Philadelphia’s time in the hot seat. Legal blog Above the Law was abuzz with reports and rumors Monday that two Philadelphia firms saw associate cuts with one of them laying off staff as well. And according to one consultant, the Pennsylvania market could most likely expect to see more attorney cuts in the new year as firms wait out the holiday season.
After the jump, the new cuts in the new year aren’t likely to be localized just to the Philadelphia area.
2009 job losses are going to be more than a localized problem:
Ward Bower of Altman Weil said he thinks firms have already done the staff cuts and the next round of layoffs — which he said could be expected in the first quarter of 2009 — will involve attorneys with perhaps some additional staff.
In fact, Altman Weil just released a new study which shows that the global financial crisis hasn’t yet fully hit the legal community:
“We expected to see more distress from law firms. But it appears that market conditions have not yet fully hit law firm balance sheets,” says James Cotterman, an Altman Weil principal.
This actually tracks with what firms have been telling us. Layoffs, Half-Skadden bonuses, and the new phenomenon of salary freezes have all been done with an eye towards 2009, so we’ve been told.
I suspect that much of the doom and gloom 2009 firm talking points are just laying the ground for excellent partner per profit numbers. Partners made a lot of money in 2008, but they don’t want to share it with associates in 2008 because 2009 is going to be — in the immortal words of Brigitte Nielsen — “so berry, berry, bad.”:
While 66 percent of firms that responded to the survey said they expect to make less money in 2009, nearly all of those firms said they don’t expect revenue to fall more than 10 percent.
But if 2009 is going to be tough — and they know this — then why can’t firms get their staffing levels into line? Nobody wants to get fired, but going to work everyday with the Sword of Damocles hanging overhead is almost worse:
Associate layoffs will most likely occur in January and February in part because of performance reviews at the end of calendar fiscal years, Bower said. But the larger reason for the delay, he said, is the holiday season.Bower said he knows of a few firms that have decided to lay off attorneys but didn’t want to do it right before the holidays so they are waiting until after the start of the new year.
I call “false choice.” Firms have had months to see this coming. Don’t tell me that you only figured out a week ago that you might have to let people go.
Sadly, it looks like the layoff beat will go on.
Layoff Reports Swirl Around Wolf Block and Drinker Biddle [Law.com]
Altman Weil Survey Shows Poor Market Has Not Fully Hit Law Firms [BLT: Blog of the LegalTimes]
Earlier: Prior ATL coverage of law firm layoffs.




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NO FIRST
Being second is more dignified.
Philly is TTT
2008 = tip of the iceberg
Firms are just spacing layoffs out to make it look less dire.
3 -
Your Mom.
Very Truly Yours, Your Real Dad
5 -
Your comment is exactly why Philly is TTT.
when does this thing turn around? Mid 2009??? Beginning of 2010???
Elie, why do you post like you knew exactly what the consequences of the market turmoil are going to be? Not even the so called experts know this with a certainty. So while your infalible logic may have been useful for firm managers (you should have offered it for a fee); others I believe, have a legitimate reason to hold off layoffs as much as possible. That way, they will only fire the amount of people that is necessary, and no more.
If anyone knew exactly when business may turn around, sure, it'd be a lot easier, but stop pretending there's an easy way out.
Elie- You honestly thought that layoffs would essentially end in 2008?
1. Holdays
2. Some firms are borderline on 'needing' to layoff people and will wait as long as possible.
3. Spacing. 20 here, 30 there gets less attention than The Cad 96
"My rose colored logic has been simple. I've assumed that Biglaw managers can: A) count, B) add, and C) figure out a sustainable 2009 business model."
Your assumptions might be correct, but no one knows how much more clients/potential clients are going to cut legal expenses (i.e., firm revenue).
Firms are trying to minimize layoffs based on a constantly moving target for 2009 expected revenue.
Excuse me, but I believe you meant to say that "is exactly why Philly is a WORLD CHAMPION TTT."
No wonder SkaddenDC tried to get out ahead of everybody. Now who looks bad, huh, asshole?
You really thought that layoffs were done? Really? You need more friends in BigLaw who actually know what's going on.
Latham salary freeze in progress
seventtteenth
seventtteenth
"Move over, New York -- it's Philadelphia's time in the hot seat."
I can't believe Elie is citing this article--it sooo obviously ignore the total bloodbath in Chicago that Elie seems so invested in reporting w/o any concrete evidence.
One of the reasons that I was ok with Lat making prognostications is that he had experience at the best of the best - Yale, prestigous clerkship, Wachtel, US attorney. His machinations rang true, and they sounded like something that I agreed with even as a 3rd, 4th or 5th year associate. That was part of what made him a good blogger - he had experience in the field about which he was blogging.
I'm not sure if Elie's assumptions or beliefs are that meaningful. His tenure here has exposed him to be disdainful of critical thought or study, unwilling to review his work or challenge his beliefs or thoughts and fond of falling back on tired jokes, cliches and party lines when he has to come up with anything original.
This post, in particular, reveals Elie to have absolutely no idea how most major law firms operate. It's like a five year old watching a Formula One race on tv and yelling at the drivers to shoot each other with their missiles. Sorry, but I don't think that what Elie thinks that law firm managers should do and his assumptions about the business of the practice of law are even remotely relevant. Adam Smith, Esq. is a good site for that - this is not even close.
5 -
Mom told me to tell you that you are years behind on the child support. She blames being high on the rock for sleeping with someone from Filthadelphia.
3.
I know for a fact that my firm has its head in the sand. We are all waiting for layoffs and are thinking that the firm is trying to hold off as long as possible because of the reputational impact of layoffs. However, two things are likely in the future. 1) so many firms lay off lawyers that there is no reputational impact or 2) the firm just can take it any more and realize that you can't continue to pay people 160-220K to surf the internet all day.
goddamn you latham you cheap bastards.
As always, your "rose colored logic" is tainted by your personal opinions. Given the fact that you've essentially turned ATL into your own personal editorial page, I guess we shouldn't be surprised.
The firms are not going to lay people off until after the new year for one simple reason: economics. They are waiting to see how many people leave. Admittedly, the economic downturn probably means that most people will stay, but given the fact that the "market" bonus this year of $17,500 is much less than they will pay in severance to those they fire -- most firms are still paying three months salary, which would amount to $40,000 for a first year associate -- the firm saves about $22,500 for every person who leaves voluntarily instead of being fired.
Obviously the layoffs will continue. You cited a thoughtful discussion last week that firms were laying off attorneys partly to compensate for the absence of voluntary attrition. Without some correction to that characteristic, why would layoffs stop? The most interesting question is how many of these layoffs are "true" layoffs? If a firm lays off 25 associates to make room for 15 first year associates, they've have really only laid off 10 (though I'm sure that distinction is lost on those who got the boot).
As always, your "rose colored logic" is tainted by your personal opinions. Given the fact that you've essentially turned ATL into your own personal editorial page, I guess we shouldn't be surprised.
The firms are not going to lay people off until after the new year for one simple reason: economics. They are waiting to see how many people leave. Admittedly, the economic downturn probably means that most people will stay, but given the fact that the "market" bonus this year of $17,500 is much less than they will pay in severance to those they fire -- most firms are still paying three months salary, which would amount to $40,000 for a first year associate -- the firm saves about $22,500 for every person who leaves voluntarily instead of being fired.
Elie, since you're a guy who thought in a post that $9,920 is less than $9k, you really should not rhetorically inquire as to whether biglaw partners can count or add. You know the saying about throwing stones in glass houses and all that.
If you've forgotten already:
http://abovethelaw.com/2008/11/kaye_scholer_cheaps_ip_attorne.php
What's with the Latham posts? Is something going on over there, or is that douche bag just a bitter rejectee who didn't get an offer?
Lat, post the fucking Latham salary freeze memo already.
26 - yes it's legit.
no, confirmed, latham froze salaries
Thank god I live and work in Texas, far away from all of this chicanery and devil wrought entitlement.
Yep -- we just got sent a memo saying that we will receive the same salary in 2009 that we received in 2008 (e.g a third year will receive the same salary she or he made as a second year).
Confirmed -- Latham's Fargo office is frozen.
I'm a partner in a big national firm (no, really...). We have not yet done layoffs. We will be doing them in the beginning of the year. Those who will be elliminated have already been identified and will be told in the first part of January. Other firms will do the same. The worst is yet to come.
If you were at CWT, etc., and got whacked already, be thankful. You have a head start finding a new job over the hoard that is coming shortly. It will get very, very ugly in 2009.
Don't worry everyone, the tender love of a sheep will take away all of your economic woes and jitters.
Elie,
A style tip for you:
If a sentence includes the use of first person, it will piss off your readers. You're a smart guy, but so are your readers. We really aren't here for your thoughts. Report the developments (and rumors and gossip), and that will provoke discussion on its own. You do not need to start our discussion by setting forth your position on the record. Don't be a Papa Bear.
Exceptions:
The blogal "we" is permissible, provided, however, that it is used sparingly, and that it is used to refer to a matter of fact, not a matter of opinion. (Proper: "We covered this topic in this post in July." Improper: "We think layoffs will end soon.") And it is always "we" and "our", never "me" and "mine."
Anyone who does not think firms will lay off in 2009 is blind. Actually, I think 2009 will see some of the more prestigious firms laying people off. And some will probably cut between 10% of the associates. I think that a lot of firms are simply waiting for everything to unwind and waiting to see what the bank outlook looks like. Everyone has a lot of deals on hold to be restarted in 2009, but who knows whether that will actually happen?
-- Doom and Gloom
Dear Biglaw,
We would greatly appreciate if you go all of the layoff out of the way before we started. In fact, please layoff too many people so we can be busy.
-3Ls
"I've assumed that Biglaw managers can: A) count, B) add, and C) figure out a sustainable 2009 business model."
A colon should only be used after an independent clause.
"[...] I figured that most well managed law firms would be able to get through all of their attorney reductions in 2008 and get themselves into an appropriate position for 2009."
The sentence should read "[...] and to get themselves [..]" to have the appropriate parallel structure.
"[...] then why can't firms get their staffing levels into line?"
What line are they supposed to get into? This should be "get their staffing levels in line (still incomplete, so) with their demand forecasts for billable hours."
This is what an HLS degree gets you? A fifth-grader could use grammar more appropriately than you. Our whole profession is built on the English language, and I'm tired of reading through blogs where you butcher it mercilessly. Listen to the comments about your terrible writing skills; even better, make the effort to improve them.
For all of those who think comments like mine are stupid, we're professionals who are immersed in language, and it is aggravating to read a blog by an HLS graduate that my 10-year-old kid could have written better. I guess that's why you're embarrassing yourself on a blog while we're out here making real money.
What about Paul Hastings?
37, this is what an HLS degree gets you when the school lowers its admission standards to let subpar people in.
You can put HLS-brand lipstick on a pig and you still have a pig.
"excellent partner per profit"? Dude, look up what PPP means, please.
18 - Thank you.
34 - Thank you.
37 - Thank you.
Over the last twelve years, the pricing of residential housing skyrocketed, with the rate of annual price increases far outpacing the rate of inflation over that period. Builders responded by building too many homes. Money was extended to finance the purchase of those homes, until it became apparent to all that housing prices were unsupportable. The market crashed.
Over the last twelve years, partner profits at major law firms (and associate salaries) skrocketed, with the rate of increases far outpacing the rate of inflation over that period. Law firms responded by hiring too many associates, and paying them too much money, until it became apparent to all that attorney salaries (and partner draws) we unsupportable. The market crashed.
Layoffs will continue and grow in 2009.
Elie, I have someone you should meet - his name is hyphen. Hyphen, Elie. Elie, hyphen. Y'all should get to know each other.
Agree with everyone else here: if you think layoffs won't happen in 2009, you're crazy. Again, as others have said, this is for several reasons. Firms are spacing them out to attract less attention (29, lots of layoffs in Texas. See the survey the other day where Atlanta then Texas were most common places for stealth layoffs.) Financially, it makes some sense to wait until the new year. People may leave voluntarily, and bonuses are less than severance. For the same reason, firms don't know for sure how many people they need to layoff, since a voluntary departure is just as good as a layoff (and is how some firms characterize it anyway). Also, from a transactional perspective, firms are hoping the credit markets are going to loosen up in 2009, when bankers need to make some money again. If they don't (and they won't), then more layoffs will be required.
One reason I don't buy: the holidays. If you think any big firm has a heart, then you, too, are crazy.
Next year is going to be so much worse on the overt and stealth layoff fronts, starting in January and ramping up in February, when we don't see nearly as many farewell emails after shitty bonuses are handed out and firms have to make cuts because of unusually high attrition rates.
If all this is true, is there any truth to global warming?
45 here - I meant "low" attrition rates. Wishful thinking, I guess.
Guys at my high school use to break Ellie's sister's hyphen all the time, it was no big deal.
32 - if you are a Biglaw national firm partner, how come you don't know the difference between "hoard" and "horde"?
Elie,
You cited a news article that cited ATL. You can't be your own source, fag.
-one of your tipsters
"I ignored the possibility that some firms were still using "operation ostrich": a heads down, asses high approach that gleefully exposes tail feathers to the still spinning wheel of economic destruction."
If anyone here, believes Elie knows here ass from her head when it comes to the economy or running a business, may you wallow forever in her bullshit.
Dechert just now laid of 70 secretaries (including mine) and staff firm wide. merry christmas.
Layoffs won't happen in 2009.
-Crazy Person
52: That's not the worst of it at Dechert. Just announced that associates will have to pitch in emptying their own waste baskets to save on janitorial costs.
52
What about Ballard & Blank. Will they be shit-canning soon as well?
Partners made a lot of money in 2008, but they don't want to share it with associates in 2008 because 2009 is going to be -- in the immortal words of Brigitte Nielsen -- "so berry, berry, bad."
__________________________________________
Correction: Partners make a lot of money [always], but they don't want to share it with associates [period], and will thus use the general economic collapse as an excuse to ratchet associate compensation downward over the long-term.
You heard it hear first, kids.
49,
I take grammer and spelling tips from Elie. Seriously, my bad. But in my defense, this website is a blog, not the New York Times.
Stay employed. Best,
-32
I don't get this article. Does Elie like layoffs or not? Based on other posts, it seems like layoffs are bad things. Yet this post makes it seem like any firm that doesn't do layoffs has their head in the sand.
Has Morgan Lewis laid off anyone in Philly or anywhere else?
I would prefer to be fired later rather than earlier. I fully support my firm's efforts to put off the day of reckoning
dechert continues their trend of letting people go on a Monday following a pay period - this is really just a portend of the whole place going under.
Philly lawyers -
Lets meet at the Ritz to discuss these troubling times over a few glasses of Macallan 18. Neat, of course.
Chauncey Gadfly II, Esq.
3L now--should I be worried starting in the Fall of 2009 or do you think things will still be bad by then.
A colon precedes a list, for example: one, zero. Colons are useful especially when the list contains difficult material (see example), even if not all style authorities agree on this.
king & spalding is laying off
giving people a few weeks notice
i heard that their xmas party in the atlanta mothership is being held in the office - no money for a real party
no wonder they are laying off folks
A colon can precede a list, but it still needs to have an independent clause before it. Observe the following situation: (notice how that's a complete sentence?)
"My rose colored logic has been simple. I've assumed that Biglaw managers can: A) count, B) add, and C) figure out a sustainable 2009 business model"
Wrong
"My rose-colored logic has been simple. I've assumed that Biglaw managers can do the following: A) count, B) add and C) figure out a sustainable business model."
Right
Rose-colored should be hyphenated, otherwise it's like saying "my rose (plant) colored logic", as in "I colored in my Thomas the Train picture."
Furthermore, the C) clause should not have a comma preceding it because it is not an independent clause. Notice how 'Skadden, Arps, Slate, Meagher & Flom' is spelled? Do you think those guys know a thing or two?
Anyway, 64, don't tell me that you can just fudge it when it comes to grammar. It's like an artist saying they don't really need to know how to do brushstrokes. Can you go outside of convention? Sure, but it needs to be readable. Just like a painter can't do a smiley face when he's asked to do a impressionist portrait, a lawyer cannot just make up shitty grammar that is terrible to read and then act like it still counts all the same.
If you want to embarrass yourself to your clients by writing like a 16-year-old high school kid fluffing his term paper, then go for it 64.
Oh, and you know what's more useful than a colon? Getting your head out of your own.
64 = Ellie making a lame attempt to protect her dignity by pointing out that some stylists would not hold one of her 1,000,000 grammatical errors against her.
Hi Elie, it's me...well, I'm you...here's what I said not too long ago:
"I believe that my personal opinions and beliefs should be as far removed from the content that I post as possible. However, I'll let the readers be the judge of whether I am doing a good job at maintaining intellectual and professional impartiality."
http://abovethelaw.com/2008/08/meet_new_editor_elie_mystal.php#more
What happened man? Did we forget this while downing ho-hos and rocking out on our PS3?
Get back at me brotha
Much Love,
Elie
66,
Most American authorities, including Strunk & White and the Chicago Manual of Style, recommend using a comma before the conjunction in a list of three or more items. It's called the Oxford comma (or sometimes the Harvard comma, fittingly enough). For someone who clearly values grammar very highly, I'm surprised you've never heard of it.
69, who gives a fuck about an Oxford comma?
This is how the Oxford/Harvard comma was created:
Random Harvard/Oxford Graduate: Here you are, sir. This is the client letter you wanted me to write.
Boss: Thanks. (Proofreads). Hey, why did you put this comma here? This isn't an independent clause.
Random Harvard.Oxford Graduate: (desperately trying to maintain his prestige) That's just a Harvard/Oxford comma
(smugly smiles and walks away; subsequently creams own pants at the thought of how awesome he is; falls asleep like a baby holding on to his diploma)
A thought. Perhaps one of the reasons firms are unwilling to make all of the adjustments necessary to accommodate the downturn is because if they did so all at once they would get crucified on blogs and in communities like this one. ATL, you can't be a powerful, fanatical, somewhat delusional champion of the status-quo and then throw up your hands in disbelief when firms are hesitant to make difficult, prestige-damaging changes.
52:
If your secretary has been laid off then that means you are next. No need to keep the associate on once the secretary has been fired. Stop spending money, NOW and start looking for a job.
Sorry to break the news, but your time at Dechert will soon be ending.
Dechert is going under. How many law firms can you think of that can take the hit of losing the cash cow that was the Vioxx litigation, without a warning and then have the financial crisis hit out of the blue. And all of this on top of the Real Estate Practice Group, with virtually no billable work, but with 84 Associates doing nothing but pro bono work instead of being laid off.
Bad management, bad business plan and above all bad place to work.
Dechert is the next name to go to the great graveyard of failed law firms.
Many people are on the lookout for things during the holiday season, like a payday loan to cover last minute expenses or getting loved ones the presents they want. Some people are looking out for a way to escape the holiday season altogether, or find a different holiday because the current ones just don't live up to the hype. Well, if you remember the sitcom giant Seinfeld, then you may remember an episode where a made up holiday made its debut to the world ā Festivus. Festivus is a holiday alternative to Christmas, and its traditions are interesting. First, the Festivus Pole, in lieu of a tree, is only an unadorned aluminum pole, nothing fancy to it. Second, after the Festivus dinner has concluded, is the Airing of Grievances ā where you tell your family members how they've disappointed you over the past year. Then, the Feats of Strength ā an all family Battle Royale.
While Iām waiting to see what payday brings, you can learn more about Festivus in this article http://personalmoneystore.com/moneyblog/2008/12/23/happy-festivus-payday-loans-can-help-with-skimpy-paydays/