New Above the Law Comment Policy
As the Above the Law community continues to grow, more people are posting absurd, inane, and arguably offensive comments. And more people are complaining about those comments — in the comments, as well by email and other means.
Here at ATL, we reserve the right to moderate comments as we see fit. We delete comments for reasons including (but not limited to) offensiveness, abusiveness, excessive profanity, irrelevance, or rank stupidity. Above the Law is a privately owned website; we have no obligation to provide our bandwidth to any particular user. Because we are not governmental actors, we are not subject to the equal-access rules of the First Amendment; when we moderate comments, it is not “censorship.”
But we also offer this recommendation to people who are offended by the comments: DON’T READ THEM. Toward that end, we want to make it easier for you to avoid the comments if you want to. Over the next 24 hours, we’ll be changing our site design so that comments will default to “hidden.” If you want to see the comments, you must affirmatively opt-in, by clicking a button to reveal them (either the “show them anyway” button within the post, or the “comments” button / counter on the front page).
Read more — and see for yourself how this policy will work — after the jump.
This change will not affect the ability of readers to comment anonymously in any way. We are simply providing a more clear mechanism for our readers to avoid the rough-and-tumble environment of anonymous blog comments, which are often marked by vitriol and vulgarity (not just on ATL, but any website where people can sound off anonymously).
If you don’t want to read all of the crazy things that can be said behind the veil of anonymity, then please don’t click on the “show them anyway” button. If you affirmatively delve into the comments and then are offended by what you read, we have three words for you: assumption of risk (or, if you prefer, four words: coming to the nuisance).
At the same time, the new system is not meant to further unfetter (as if that were possible) anonymous commenters from normal standards of human decency and respect. We will continue to moderate comments — and we request your help in doing so. If you see a problematic comment that you want deleted, please email us (subject line: “Comment Moderation Request”), identifying the specific comment(s) by post title and comment number. Because of the sheer volume of comments posted to ATL, we have adopted this “notice and takedown” procedure to comment moderation, as opposed to full-time, active moderation.
Thoughts? We hope this solution preserves freedom while giving more sensitive readers a way to avoid what they’d rather not see. Thanks for visiting.
UPDATE: We are aware of the various comment rating / flagging / moderation systems that are used on different sites — e.g., YouTube, Slashdot, Craigslist. We hope to implement such a system on ATL at some point in the future. This is a temporary measure designed to address the situation on an interim basis.
(347) Comments
Comments
Comments hidden for your protection. Show them anyway!
What does this have to do with the rumored layoffs at Cahill?
Why don't you post something more interesting and important... like news about the Latham lay-offs?
Comment removed by moderator.
coming to the nuisance? re-heally meow?
lulz. it's come down to this..
Comment removed by moderator.
Comment removed by moderator.
Fine, good even. But please note where you have deleted a comment, perhaps why as well.
ELIE, LOOK AT #3!!! posters like him are RUNEING IT FOR ALL OF TEH US!!!! BAN HIM or delete his awfull werdz.
"We delete comments for reasons including ... rank stupidity. "
What about posts? I am often offended by the rank stupidity exhibited by the rampant misspellings and poor fact-checking in the posts themselves. What are you going to do about that?
What a stupid waste of time.
At last. Maybe now we can regain a semblance of our maturity. I hope deletion is fierce. Enough with all the childish bullshit that is clogging up this space.
Sounds good.
Now, how about some information about Latham lay-offs please.
Three cheers for this policy.
If you have a problem with a specific comment, you need to speak up:
"If you see a problematic comment that you want deleted, please email us, identifying the specific comment(s) by post title and comment number. Because of the sheer volume of comments posted to ATL, we have adopted this "notice and takedown" procedure to comment moderation, as opposed to full-time, active moderation."
Does mentioning any of the following qualify as "rank stupidity" worthy of an automatic deletion?
Ass lobsters
Cahill layoffs
Juicy insides
Tulane law students
Elie should think seriously about scrutinizing his diet in the same manner he plans to scrutinize the content of blog comments.
Will this comment be deleted?
PS:
So, you're giving in to some weak-stomached ninnies and offering to do *absolutely nothing* about actual issues in the comments which have a negative effect on those of us who enjoy some sophmoric banter and running jokes. Got it.
thx.
10
9
Ban HIM. What makes you think he is a HIM?
Let me guess, you are a chick?
C'mon; fess up!!
if you feel like spending some profits to make the site more useful, see slashdot self-moderation system and emulate
FINALLY! Hopefully I will not have to sort through idiotic statements about butt cheeks and ass lobsters in order to find the comments that pertain the the topic. Good job ATL!
"Enough with all the childish bull---- that is clogging up this space."
I am offended by your foul language. Moderator--please delete this offensive post.
How about a "Flag as Abusive" button next to the comments to allow reporting without forcing us to email in?
"Hopefully I will not have to sort through idiotic statements about butt cheeks and ass lobsters in order to find the comments that pertain the the topic. "
Why are we subjected to profane comments like this? "---- cheeks" and "--- lobsters"? How dare you force me to read such dreck!!
And having to sort through comments with such idiotic statements--moderator, please ban this off-topic poster!
Generally speaking, Elie's carelessly sloppy posts exhibit mere garden-variety stupidity, and do not rise to the level of rank stupidity.
if you fire Elie, half the offensive comments will be gone. guaranteed.
Focusing your life solely on making a buck shows a poverty of ambition. It asks too little of yourself. And it will leave you unfulfilled. - President Barack "Barry" Obama
If you fire Elie, you will once again be able to leave food in the ATL office fridge for more than eleven minutes. guaranteed.
Agree with 22, having a "flag as abusive" button would make it a lot easier to report ridiculous comments for deletion.
This new policy is completely pointless.
People complained because they LIKE to read the comments that address interesting issues but DON'T want to have to skim past infantile (e.g. Asslobster) comments along the way. The point is that to many of us, our time is valuable, and having to read some law student's asslobster comment takes time away from reading legitimate comments.
This new policy couldn't be less useful in addressing readers' concerns.
"a "Flag as Abusive" button"
It would work much, much better if it were like in Amazon discussions (first example to come to mind) where if there are enough "this comment doesn't add to the discussion" flags, it's hidden but not deleted.
Also, this would work to stop the re-numbering after comments disappear--the ATL staff could have a perma-block that makes the comment not openable, without disappearing it.
Someone with tech skills and time (perhaps a layoff victim), please start a new blog with a legitimate comment moderation policy. Please! The problem with the juveniles who post here is not only that they make it difficult to find useful comments, but they also inhibit any intelligent discussion since people with useful things to say are mocked or ignored.
*nervously hopes that my comments won't be deleted, offers to give elie a back massage as a bribe*
-nervous T-10 1L
4 interviews
3 offers
1 sa position
If you read this post carefully, the only change they are claiming to make is forcing you to click to read the comments. Although they claim they will "continue to moderate comments," I don't see any evidence that comments are now or ever have been moderated on this site.
Why is it so repulsive to you, Lat and Elie, to do your jobs, read the comments, and delete all the stupid posts? If 75% of the comments on this site weren't garbage, we might actually have some useful discussion, and intelligent people might actually read this site and post helpful comments about their firms. If you two can't find a way to read the posts on this site in order to maintain its integrity, why not include a "flag for removal link"? Or are you so in love with yourselves for getting ad revenue as a result of 100 posts about butt cheeks that you miss your greater calling of having influence in the legal market? Or, if you must have a better reason to be responsible, can't you foresee that if your site devolves into stupidity, it will eventually collapse, taken over by someone more diligent than yourselves? Hope you enjoy your glory while it lasts.
I would like to see a monograph or some other guidance for what constitutes rank stupidity, offensiveness, etc. Are we talking about offensive to the average person or to the average ATL comment reader?
Co-sign 29 and 30. Please, someone start a new blog. This blog won't make the necessary changes because it doesn't want its page clicks to decrease. This blog has truly become an embarrassment to our profession. If ever there was an argument for making college grads wait a few years before entering law school in order to gain maturity and real-world experience, this blog would be it.
Yeah, 29, what I said at 17.
So two votes for "this policy is a joke which does nothing to address the real issue". Look into a system where flagging a comment **hides the flagged comment** rather than "hiding" all the comments. Sure, it's open to abuse--the trolls can flag every comment, hiding them all. But that's your job to figure out, ATL--we don't get paid to be here.
10
Comment removed by moderator.
most of the people who comment here are straight idiots - like #s 10 and 17. get a life.
Comment removed by moderator.
Presumably a flagging system would tally the number of flags on-screen (rather than, say, dispatching an email every time a flag is posted), so even if some small number of users abused it (perhaps aggressively), the numbers would make it very apparent which posts are truly offensive (i.e., a post with 100 or 500 flags versus one with only 12).
sounds like Elie got served and is still in shock over it.
Agree with 22, 28 and 30. Need 'flag as abusive' button which hides messages. No one is going to bother to email to report comments, but something needs to be done so that legit comments can be found easier.
Lat,
Thats not good enough.
Personal Attack!!! Flagging 38 for removal! My delicate sensibilities have been offended!!
Agree with 42. I used to comment, but the "first crew,' and the "ass lobster bunch," make it pointless to even try to comment.
As someone who thinks Elie's grammar is terrible and that its criticism should not be censored, all I can say is...
THIS IS EXCELLENT NEWS FOR JOHN MCCAIN!
Man, when I first read the title of this post, I thought we were cracking down on the ASSLOBSTER guys once and for all, but instead they are being glorified and protected.
I don't know why I expected anything different from this website....
Hey, whatever happened to WGWAG?
"the rough-and-tumble environment of anonymous blog comments, which are often marked by vitriol and vulgarity (not just on ATL, but any website where people can sound off anonymously). "
But to stress test your parenthetical just a bit...dealbreaker has reasonably intelligent, anonymous comments without the super-repetitive stream of vulgarity that is the abovethelaw comment section (most of the vulgar comments there are at least non-repetitive). Is it just that abovethelaw readers are more assholic on average than dealbreaker readers?
Agree with others. No one is going to write you to remove the asslobster jokes. A flag for abuse link would work better, and you could then review the posts to ensure they should have been removed. This is a small step forward for decency (the comments re the Jenner associate were in amazingly poor taste) but doesn't really affect the (lack of) overall discourse here.
People used to get their ass lobster posts removed from blogs in my high school all the time, it was no big deal.
40-- are you really suggesting they wait for a post to get 100 or 500 flags before hiding it?????
Here's the problem with a "flag as abusive" policy: the Ass Lobster people would flag as abusive every single post that isn't about Ass Lobsters 1000 times. And where would that get you?
Comment removed by moderator.
Guys at my high school used to miss the point all the time, it was no big deal.
Not enough about Cahill layoffs; didn't read.
The best suggestion is to REQUIRE registration and activation of a nickname to an email to comment, like many other bulletin boards around the internet. Free of anonymous comments, not all, but much of the nonsense would be gone.
Simple -- if someone flags legitimate posts for removal several times, they get blocked from the site. For every problem, there's a solution, and right now, we need a big solution for the trash this site has become.
Can we flag Elie for spelling or at least for factual errors?
Comment removed by moderator.
Your website is so prehistoric that it self-regulates itself. I mean 90% of the time when I want to post a inane comment the server delays and it never posts. Even when it does post, I have to refresh to see it. And then I have to look through endless amounts of comments to find the stupidity I wrote. Your old system was better.
But really if you want to do something effective, make everyone register before they can post. Everyone should have a username.
re: 52 - how about one flag allowed per comment per IP address. if the asslobster people want to keep switching computers or waste all day using proxy servers just to flag more than once, go at it. they'll bore of it eventually.
Is asslobster@gmail.com taken yet? I'm sure it will be in about five minutes.
i do agree that many of these posts aren't funny. but i don't get why people can't ignore them and still make substantive comments. most of the 'asslobsters' would go away if people kept getting all worked up and ignored them.
-nervous T-10 1L
4 interviews
3 offers
1 sa position
61 - Have they bored of talking about ass lobsters yet? It stopped being funny after the first post. The Cahill layoffs thing stopped being funny... was it ever funny? The sheep nailing thing stopped being funny immediately. Yet all of this continues to go on.
Comment removed by moderator.
Everyone's unemployed anyway; what does it matter?
Comment removed by moderator.
Why don't you institute a policy like Slashdot's where people can give each comment a thumbs up or a thumbs down, and users can select their own personal threshold value (i.e., only show comments that have gotten a net positive rating of 3 or above, out of a total 5, or 7 out of 10, etc)?
Serious suggestion: implement a Digg or Youtube-like thumbs up/thumbs down comment rating system. That way, all of the retarded comments can easily be passed over, and the truly great comments (especially for a layoffs thread, which will have far, far too many comments to sift through to find the good stuff) will float to the top. Can't be too expensive to implement -- I'm sure there is a geek out there who would do the development work pro bono...
You're all a bunch of losers. Why do'n't you just get back to work? Oh, that's right; you don't have any.
I LIKE TO MOVE IT MOVE IT
I nominate 39 for post of the year.
first
Good.
Good.
In the event they do start banning IP addresses, here is my list of suggestions:
- Anyone that posts "Asslobster" 2 or more times.
- Anyone who posts "First" once.
- Anyone named Nervous T10-1L
- Anyone asking about Cahill layoffs
- Anyone suggesting ATL fire Elie (Even if it was justified, not gonna happen so let it go)
Can we also hide all posts by Elie?
Comment removed by moderator.
Please remove the post. It offends me. In fact, remove everything ever written my Elie, they all offend me.
Easily Offended
Please remove the post. It offends me. In fact, remove everything ever written byElie, they all offend me.
Easily Offended
I strongly urge the editors to engage in aggressive comment moderation. Inane, grotesque or idiotic comments should be pulled unless they are either (i) relevant to the article or legal profession, or (ii) hilarious to the reasonable attorney.
Just a couple weeks of aggressive policing would stop the gradual slide of this website's quality.
Focusing your life solely on making a buck shows a poverty of ambition. It asks too little of yourself. And it will leave you unfulfilled. - President Barack "Barry" Obama
The completely inane, offensive and generally non-sensical comments on this site are one of the funniest things on the Internet to me as (somewhat sadly) I'm completely amused by the sophomoric depths that a purportedly educated group of people will regularly stoop to. Obviously it will depend on ATL refraining from wielding its censorship powers, but making them opt-in seems like a good solution to me and preserves a bright spot in an otherwise drap corporate existence. And to the people who are offended, go read something else and stop complaining. Seriously. Peace out bitches.
Am I the only one who read the post title as "New Above the Law Communist Party"?
Good policy and is sensible. Lat/Elie - three questions:
1) Can we have a definition of "excessive profanity"?
2) Should we be counting our fucks and shits?
3) I hope this new policy will not ensnare "Commenter #83" style post - will it?
Anyone who wants a usename registration system HATES AMERICA
Seriously. Just get rid of anonymous posting. A username is still anonymous and would weed out people who are likely too impatient to sign in just to write their drivel.
choosing between all or nothing does not address the issue that people are raising. Selective deletion is the only solution.
Co-sign 68 and 69 - we need the option to thumbs up/thumbs down. Not only would it deal with the AssCahills problem, it might occasionally teach the odd arrogant bastard commenting here that not everyone agrees with him/her.
I think a flag for abuse option would work very well. (There are smart ways to design such an option. Abusers' flags have less weight, registered users' flags have more weight, IP-address associated with flag usage to track this, etc.) Just do something.
screw this site. censorship is shit
Reporting for duty.
this site really needs a comment moderation option. this new system is a lame, cheap attempt at fixing the problem. have some respect for your loyal readers who want to read the comments, but don't want to sort through the moronic ones to get to the substantive ones. it's not good business to alienate so many readers with this new "policy."
I think that being more strict about comments and removing offensive comments is great. It has gotten to a point where people fear that showing up in an article on this site is a potential career-ender. It shouldn't be that way.
Comment removed by moderator.
43- you offend me / please delete and then kill self
MysTTTal- your pathetic grammar offends me, please see above
WGWAL!!!!
(White guys with ass lobsters)
Methinks the comment foreskin will only encourage more schmegma to proliferate underneath.
89: What's that about Cahill? Do you have any word on possible layoffs?
Community colleges play an important role in helping people transition between careers by providing retooling they need to take on a new career. - President Barack Hussein Obama
Maybe all of the displaced "professionals" from Cahill, etc. can take BHO's advice. Retool tools.
Comment removed by moderator.
Agree with 29 that this could not possibly be less helpful. There are plenty of powerful commenting systems out there that allow for voting up and down, flagging as abusive/offensive, etc... Use one of them.
87 nailed it.
If it goes to that system, dibs on the login "Ass Lobster"
xoxohth.com now is gently moderated, funny as ever, and is probably at 70% of its peak in terms of containing useful info on law related subjects (at one time of course it was the first place to go for admissions info).
and ATL has turned to this.
bizzaro world.
Co-sign 68 and 69 - we need the option to thumbs up/thumbs down. Not only would it deal with the AssCahills problem, it might occasionally teach the odd arrogant bastard commenting here that not everyone agrees with him/her.
Um, 101... that's just poor taste, man. That ain't even cool.
Community colleges play an important role in helping people transition between careers by providing retooling they need to take on a new career. - President Barack Hussein Obama
Maybe all of the displaced "professionals" from Cahill, etc. can take BHO's advice. Retool tools.
Agree with 63...
Anonymous comments are what makes this site great.
The problem is that Elie and Lat like this job because it allows them to be lazy.
They could EASILY just look at the comments, delete and block inane posts, they simply choose not to--perhaps because they are trying to maximize clicks.
But the simplest and smartest thing is obviously to block post and posters that abuse the site.
110 -- How do you determine who's abusing the site? Is the site being abused by ASSLOBSTER posters? Or by posters who refuse to give in to the allure of the ASSLOBSTER?
My vote goes with the latter.
Comment removed by moderator.
CENSORSHIP, pure and simple. Anyone who writes for this blog is a loser and a hack. This just goes further to show it. Disgraceful.
And we have to keep the comments anonymous, since I have a brand new meme I'm itching to try out.
Bravo. It's about time.
111--If you post something about the law, politics, or related to a recent post--you're in.
Otherwise, you're out.
That's how.
-110
Thank God Lat is finally starting to get the picture. Hopefully this will help weed out some of the trash posted on here. Although, judging by the ass lobster, buttcheeks, etc. comments above, I have my doubts. The main problem is that we like to read the comments because they sometimes contain useful incite--especially when people from within a law firm comment on the situation on the ground. However, in order to read every one of those comments, we have to drudge through six vile comments. Furthermore, many of us have stopped reading the blog at work because we don't want to be associated with the disgusting comments. Thank you for finally beginning to see that there is a problem. I only hope that this policy will be the start of cleaning up the comment section.
P.S. In addition, please ban the IP addresses of those posting filth. Thanks. My guess is that it is the same handful of people posting repeatedly.
"...There is more than one way to burn a book. And the world is full of people running about with lit matches. Every minority, be it Baptist/Unitarian, Irish/Italian/Octogenarian/Zan Buddhist, Zionist/Seventh-day Adventist, Women's Lib/ Republican, Mattachine/FourSquareGospel feels it has the will, the right, the duty to douse the kerosene, light the fuse. Every dimwit editor who sees himself as the source of all dreary blanc-mange plain porridge unleavened literature, licks his guillotine and eyes the neck of any author who dares to speak above a whisper or write above a nursery rhyme...." -Ray Bradbury
I'm looking forward to when the story breaks that all these asslobster posts have actually been perpetrated by W. and his newfound free time.
103:
Too late. Confusingly similar log-in names must be prohibited. I am the asslobster, koo koo g'joob.
Comment removed by moderator.
Comment removed by moderator.
Lat,
This seems like a half-hearted attempt to address a real issue. I am a bit disappointed because (1) I very much enjoy this site and (2) I am on the verge of boycotting ATL because of the number of vulgar comments through which I must wade in order to read thoughtful, insightful, and even humerous ideas.
TO THE ATL READERS,
I think there is one way to insure a more stringent policy... if you don't like the comments, then stop reading the site. Moreover, e-mail ATL to inform them that you will not read the site until a better policy is in place. If and when the number of hits fall enough, I'm sure a better policy will be implemented.
To the contrary, I am confident that with this policy, nothing will change. I don't want to read a site that requires me to write an e-mail every time I see something that is a complete and total waste of time!
Do you?
117,
You ruined your credibility by confusing "insight" with "incite." And you further ruined your credibility by posting a stupid-ass comment.
Is it that hard to establish a rule: anything that is incoherent, off-topic nonsense should be deleted. See post 15. Nothing is lost by deleting this posts. I'm sure XOXO can handle the asslobster traffic.
123 - I can guarantee you that about three people would stop reading -- and far more would stop reading if you banned all these posts. Honestly, I'm just as interested at this point in reading about ASSLOBSTERS as I am about law firm news.
I'm not even a lawyer. I am, however, both a proctologist and amatuer lobsterman.
How has no one mentioned that Elie is gay?
Comment removed by moderator.
I think 39 sums it up perfectly.
Ditto 129
My only concern is that on layoff threads i want the management of the firms to read the comments expressing dissapointment and not dismiss the site as a bunch of sickos b/c the first comment is about some sort of rectal-dwelling shellfish.
Other than that I can skip past the buttcheeks comments myself. I find some of the new schticks funny actually in a Borat kind of way--I imagine some old partner reading it and it just cracks me up.
Elie bringing Mommy-Lat to the table for this one.
131 ==
What's that you say about Cahill?
Good idea. And, in the hopes that you are reading this, a request: more administration hiring news, please! You have been out in front on it so far.
Thanks Obama, this would not have happened under Dubya.
Did anyone else picture Lat writing this with Elie running around in the background screaming, covered in dorito crumbs?
133--What's that you say? Has Cahill found itself in some sort of pickle?
Your welcome 135. I tabs on ATL on my blackberry.
135, I agree. Obama hasn't even been in office a week and look what we have come to. It really sickens me. I would go to Canada but I hate Canadians even more. Maybe the Cook Islands. At least there I can be near all of the money I am hiding from Obama's attempts at redistribution.
136 - Hilarious. Only I imagined Elie passed out with a half-eaten jelly-donut in his lap.
You should make a button that hides only the anonymous comments.
You should make a button that gives me my job back.
Pacific Reporter's idea will work until the a-hole commenters just take up pseudo-identities and continue their boring remarks semi-anonymously rather than fully anonymously.
I like 141's suggestion. Knowing that everyone knows who I am, I'm MUCH more interested in maintaining my reputation amongst the group of attorneys that directly and indirectly finance my lifestyle.
Thank you to everyone that is working late!
Comment removed by moderator.
Comment removed by moderator.
Wait, I just realized I have to click "Show them anyway" every time I want to read the comments just because some people can't simply skip past comments they don't want to read. Screw that.
lol@142. I hear ya man.
I will only read comments from Trophy wife (for some reason I scan all of the comments looking for her picture knowing full well that there is some dude on the other side).
Comment removed by moderator.
What' sTTT ?
Comment removed by moderator.
What if ATL just limited the numbers of posts from each IP Address per day?
I think people aren't offended at the existence of junk posts so much as the fact that with so many it's a pain to sift through them to posts with content. I bet it's a few putz's posting again and again, why not limit them?
(I already see the problem in advanced--most of them are law school kids who change IP addresses regularly)
153 - I'm pretty sure there aren't many law students posting on here. It's mostly bored associates / overbilling partners talking about ass lobsters and whatnot .
Make people do free registration. I'll bet that knocks out half of the garbage. It's really gotten to the point where the stupid crap comprises 95% of comments.
haha look at 149. 'trophy wife' pwn3d himself.
he tried to act like an anonymous commenter complimenting 'trophy wife' subtlety. what a moron.
i'm sorry i annoy people but at least my comments are somewhat on point or related to the story elie posts. asslobsters and cahills have no relevance.
-nervous T-10 1L
4 interviews
3 offers
1 sa position
140, or possibly Lat got so frustrated with Elie's rambling that he knocked him out. And Elie is lying on the floor, unconscious, with 1/2 a rotisserie chicken still in his mouth.
Comment removed by moderator.
Comment removed by moderator.
Make people register.
It has worked wonders on other websites that maintain very high levels of traffic, and excellent commentary.
Here is an idea: Block T-10 L bc he is f-in annoying. No one cares about you, your job search, your sa offer, or anything else related to you. Shut the f-up already. You are so annoying.
Here is an idea: Block T-10 1L bc he is f-in annoying. No one cares about you, your job search, your sa offer, or anything else related to you. Shut the f-up already. You are so annoying.
Comment removed by moderator.
This is the stupidest comment policy ever.
You have essentially told those of us who come here for legal news to stop reading because you can't be bothered to police the trash.
I am going to write to Lateral LInk and other advertisers here to suggest they pull their ads until the comments are better monitored. I encourage others to do the same.
Comment removed by moderator.
Go to engadget.com and copy their comment system. Lets you vote up, down and flag for moderator.
Here is an idea: Block T-10 L bc he is f-in annoying. No one cares about you, your job search, your sa offer, or anything else related to you. Shut the f-up already. You are so annoying.
Here is an idea: Block T-10 L bc he is f-in annoying. No one cares about you, your job search, your sa offer, or anything else related to you. Shut the f-up already. You are so annoying.
Anybody have any news on possible Cahill layoffs?
This blog is incredible.
Fix the multiple comments? No, just post a procedure about opening new tabs and letting comments sit for 45 seconds at a time! After all, why fix something when you can just tell people to deal with the shoddy technology!
Moderate or block spammers? No, just require an extra click to view the comments! After all, comments aren't important, so just let them crumble into spam!
I am starting to think that the Latham brass has either (i) cut a deal with ATl or (ii) threatened to sue ATL for disparagement if the site comments harshly on their actions. It is somewhat unbelievable that all of these posters are asking for information on the LW layoffs yet not a peep is posted about them on the main site blog posts. The day a site starts bowing to BigLaw is the day I stop visiting it. The time to start a new law blog is near.
LW is clearly laying off. I only have first hand info about Los Angeles but I am certain every office is feeling it. They are trying to do it "Stealthly" but it is only a matter of time before the total numbers come out. I am betting it is at least 10% of their associates. LW is and has always been a well managed "business" so you can be sure they are acting harshly to the down turn in the economy (especially since they are so corporate and finance dependent).
LAT, please get your bloggers to do the leg work and get us this information. That firm does not deserve the benefit of the doubt...not with the way it treats its associates.
161, 162, 167, 168 - is it possible that you are just bitter because you don't have anywhere to work this summer? How do those grapes taste? Sour, huh? Law school not as easy as you thought it would be? Life's got you down? Oh don't worry about it I'm sure you'll land on your feed. Either that or drive your car off a bridge after your girlfriend leaves you for someone with a job. Let me know how it works out, or not. I don't care.
more annoying than the "offensive" comments are the multiple posts. if ATL can't fix something as simple as that, how the hell can we expect them to implement a slashdot-style commenting system?
also, making people create usernames won't do shit. xoxo makes you create usernames and their comments are 100x more offensive than ATL.
I go to a really good school (Hofstra) where we don't put up with this kind of garbage. Good for you, Lat!
I go to a really good school (Hofstra) where we don't put up with this kind of garbage. Good for you, Lat!
Did the fat bitch also lose her summer position?
Did the fat bitch also lose her summer position?
171 -- i imagine ATL can only comment if people from LW feed them information. it's possible LW conditioned any severance package on confidentiality, so no tipsters = no post.
I think I just read "really good school" and "Hofstra" in the same sentence. Yup, my ears are bleeding. That can't be good. I think I might have had a stroke.
ABOUT TIME!
If you want crass, pointless posts, go to xoxo. This site is supposed to be about useful information and gossip.
I agree with those above who've said it's great that ATL sees there's a problem, but this new policy doesn't do nearly enough to stop it. Being able to hide all comments isn't particularly helpful if I want to read the respectful, on-topic ones without wading through all the fratboy drivel. We need to either require registration or have a flagging system that will automatically remove posts.
180 --
And ASSLOBSTERS!
Comment removed by moderator.
Comment removed by moderator.
Can we blame a certain Law School for this?
Damn the offensive racist parties.
Comment removed by moderator.
Comment removed by moderator.
Comment removed by moderator.
Comment removed by moderator.
Comment removed by moderator.
Suggest checking out the comment system on streeteasy.com. It allows you to ignore the comments of commenters you don't like. I presume most of the - shall we say - less pertinent comments come from the same group of people.
Agree with those who say the new policy does not address the problem even a little bit. It's not that people are offended by just seeing the word "asslobster," it's that reading the comments is too frustrating because of all the stupid filler in between the actual discussion.
Example: I forwarded a post to my husband about layoffs at my firm, and when we discussed later I told him some information that was about 90 posts down in the comments. He said he hadn't gotten that far in the comments -- he tried to read them, but stopped after the first few because they were "too horrible."
i affirmatively like funny coments. stupid racist conservatives dillholes belong in KY, MS and GA but not ATL.
Agree with 192 and others. I don't mind a few off-color comments. But the site has become absolutely HIJACKED by them, and it makes finding the good comments impossible. The comments used to be part of the charm of the site. Who are these people that have nothing to do all day but post nasty things on this site?
Comment removed by moderator.
Comment removed by moderator.
194 - you are very smart. After all, it takes at least (AT LEAST) 10 seconds to post a comment.
dumbasses like you are why we need to cull this herd of second tier shiTTT
192 - apparently your husband is too moronic to skip down to post 90 where you told him the info was. besides, if he can't handle an asslobster every now and again he should work on developing thicker skin or perhaps stay of the internet
194, I am but one man dedicated ruining the ATL commenting experience for everyone the way ATL ruined my career. I had become so obsessed with the ATL comments that it was hard for me to distinguish them from my real work. The senior partner had gotten through 1/2 of the complaint draft before he realized that I had replaced all of the parties' names with "ASSLOBSTER", the entire prayer for relief was a series of questions about Cahill layoffs, all of the allegations were actually 1L job search strategies and all of the documentation had been replaced by pictures of Trophy Wife!! Damn you ATL, you ruined my career!! I WILL HAVE VENGEANCE!!
Comment removed by moderator.
Comment removed by moderator.
Comment removed by moderator.
David Lat, et al.:
You blew it on this one. There was a very good proposal in the "Community" section. You should have implemented something akin to the proposal. I recite it here (along with several of the comments that added to it), so that everyone can see what could and should have been:
"Hello ATL Community,
I have become extremely frustrated by the comments lately and would like to propose an idea to remedy the situation.
Because of the vile, vulgur and racist comments frequently appearing on the site, it is becoming almost embarassing to admit that one even reads ATL at work.
ATL is a legal news/gossip blog. There is simply no reason to allow disgusting and racist comments about the editors that have absolute NOTHING to do with the law, nevermind the article in question.
My proposal- and I'm sure this would be easy to set up- is a community-moderated comment section. Set out some very basic ground rules and then put a little rad flag above every single comment. If enough members of the ATL community click on the red flag (because, e.g., the comment is racist or otherwise insulting and unrelated to the article) then the comment is automatically removed.
I think this would substantially elevate the quality of ATL and bring the site back to the days when there was no stigma attached to reading.
Just my two cents.
-NYC Associate"
This comment from Saturday, January 24, 2009 at 12:47 PM, adds to the proposal:
"It would be better if a threshold number of red flags for a given post would not result in automatic deletion but in an e-mail to an ATL editor. With automatic deletions it would be possible to continue wars against a particular firm, school, or poster by reporting posts you don't like."
This comment from Sunday, January 25, 2009 at 5:48 PM, further adds to the proposal:
"I like 12:47's proposal. A given number of flags should result in an e-mail alert to the editor.
As a companion policy, ATL should ban the IP address of serial offenders. I do not know how many posts from a given IP address would need to be flagged before it results in an outright ban on posting, but it seems that after several posts by the same author are flagged in a relatively short period, ATL should consider banning that person.
This could be done on a case-by-case basis, and the decision to ban the IP address would presumably consider frequency of offenses, nature of offenses, and intensity of flagging (number/rapidity). Essentially, when it becomes clear to those monitoring the flagging that a given commentator's posts are degrading the community, ATL should ban that commentator (by banning his/her IP address)."
Take heed Lat, take heed.
http://abovethelaw.com/community/2009/01/proposal-re-atl-comments-secti.php
"Comments hidden for your protection." You have to be kidding me.
Count me as another reader who actually used to enjoy the comments, but just can't take it anymore. The baldly racist comments, the pointless & obscene comments, the repetitive & dumbass comments have, in recent weeks, completely clogged the site and ruined the experience of reading a story and then taking in the smart and smart-alecky responses to it. I used to look forward to reading all the responses and to find that 15-20% that constituted "comment gold." Now, it's more like 1% and it's not worth wading through all the fools.
In the vernacular of the site, this new policy is an EPIC FAIL because it fails to fix the problem and encourages more dumb behavior by the ruinators. As a regular reader, I don't want to be "protected" from obnoxious comments -- I want to be spared from wading through the sewer for fifteen minutes to get to the obnoxious comments that are actually worth reading.
Looks like it's just time for me to grow up and stick with WSJ Law Blog and Volokh.
http://www.averyindex.com/happy_healthy_ethical.php
204, you should have left the post in the community section. I don't want a bunch of overly sensitive jackasses deleting my posts when they could just as easily move on down the list. I don't post stupid shit, but I am very critical of stupidity, some people say that I am too harsh sometimes. That's life. If I'm not being obscene I would rather not have my post deleted because it offends your delicate sensitivities.
Comment removed by moderator.
By the way, I'm with 204 on this. I just read that post after posting mine. Install a mechanism to help the loyal readers rid the dreck from this site. Christ, you guys let us vote on everything else here, no? Why not let us vote the morons off the blog?
--206
Come on people:
(1) If you are so busy, you shouldn't be checking ATL in the first place. It takes .5 seconds to skim the asslobster comments. I know you are crazy billing machines, but I think you can tack on an extra 2 minutes at the end of the day to make up for skimming.
(2) It takes me LONGER to read through all of the 10 paragraph comments (like this one) on why the asslobster guy sucks, than it does to read the asslobster comments.
(3) And as much as I hate to say it, the asslobster etc comments are the only thing that make me laugh on this site any more. Really, how can you not have a hilarious mental image of the tip of a lobster's claw poking out of some random person's ass?
That is all.
Free speech is not subject to voting you drecks. Humor takes effort. If you don't like this blog, go start your own you lazy asslobsters.
Not the first to say the new comments policy sucks
I only read the first paragraph. Waaaay too long of an entry.
141-im assuming your comment was meant to be ironic, seeing as how you're basically still anonymous and i very much doubt that you are in fact a bear
FIRST!
I think we should stick with my policy of calling out the one lame poster who is responsible for the most crude and dimwitted responses (ass lobster, Elie's weight/sex preferences, buttcheeks/insides, etc.). I have no problem with repetitive / stupid but harmless posts (e.g., 30 Cahill posts every day), the crude but clever or original (e.g., trophy wife), or really anything that is at least funny.
The problem, in my mind, is strictly limited to one tool who spends all day, every day, lashing out at other commenters (see 161) and filling the comments with crudeness and profanity (not a big deal) that is really, really lame and unoriginal (bigger deal). This person posts dozens of comments every day, making it seem like his type is the norm in this forum, which it is not. He also makes multiple posts criticizing the same person, and then calls his multiple personalities "the community" and uses his self-generated "consensus" to enhance the sting of his criticism.
I will rid this site of that virus--Danger Style.
Yeah this new comment policy absolutely misses the point.
Oh well.
I agree with 29,123, and 164. I read the comments to find out what other people actually think of the ideas and events described in the original post. If the commenters' take on the news is funny, then that's great! But if a large proportion of the comments are neither relevant nor funny, then reading the comments is a waste of time, and the blog loses its value as a discussion forum. If you aren't willing to moderate the posts properly, at least make it possible for users to flag the useless ones.
219, ASSLOBSTER not relevant? me confused? me sad?
Comment removed by moderator.
221, hey ASSLOBSTER!! They are doing it this way because those of us who post these things that you call sophomoric are responsible for more views than "the vast majority of commentators". Every time we post we refresh and it is another hit for ATL. Shut up, go home and sex up a goat.
even 4chan bans IPs of commenters that are too annoying, yet ATL is unable to figure out how
First to say I only read ATL for the absurd, inane, and arguably offensive comments.
Comment removed by moderator.
Require registration of all commenters. That way people can remain anonymous enough to other users to avoid unwelcome attention, but will think twice before saying things they would be embarrassed to say outloud in front of their peers.
Being a lawyer means taking on a certain level of accountability for your actions. If you are ashamed to leave your name next to a comment that is inappropriate, childish, or just plain stupid, maybe you shouldn't make the comment in the first place.
I'd leave my name, but unfortunately this has become a hostile and irresponsible community, with which I want no association.
I will check in periodically in the hope that ATL will return to being the lighthearted, yet intelligent blog that it once was.
It's a tough call on what to do with the comments, because sometimes people break news in them Like the fact that Latham is doing stealth layoffs. Are they firing first years?
Will I get taken out to $50 per person lunches every day when I am a summer at a V20 firm in New York?
Comment removed by moderator.
How come dealbreaker doesn't have a problem with inance comments.? I tend to think that bankers are more immature thanb lawyers. Am I wrong?
Comment removed by moderator.
You guys moderate comments?
If you censor us, the terrorists win! Why do they hate our freedom?
Thanks 207. That's a good read, and one I really needed.
must add my voice to the many that were delighted to see something being done about the comments, but sadly disappointed by the suggestion. to reiterate the above - we already have to affirmatively go to the comments by clicking "below the fold" or "comments" most of the time anywa. We WANT to read the comments because they used to be USEFUL and we dont want to sort through the crap.
the best answer is the community moderated red flag system. seriously, please, please do it.
We are having a theme party this weekend. After last week, I am not able to tell you what the theme is, but I can tell you that it will be disparaging and this will be our theme song.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=icr0eW1fRSs
Comment removed by moderator.
This new policy seems to be working wonders. Great job Lat and Ellie!!! Harvard and Yale must be proud!!
Comment removed by moderator.
two words - ellen beschevsky.
even the ABA Journal bans people. can't we just ban the racists?
Comment removed by moderator.
The only interesting person that comments on this blog is that nervous T-10 1L character. I'm so glad he's back. And I'm super glad he landed a summer clerkship that he'll get no-offered on.
I'm glad this board is no longer hosting a party for racist, sexist jerks to sound off.
Regarding the "Just don't read the comments..." I think something that's important to me is that I enjoy the comments - the interactivity is what differentiates net news from a newspaper - and commenters who deliberately offend are controlling the dialogue. To find the one, "I worked there too..." or "Here's how I handled something similar..." you have to scroll through 100s of "I'm going to put something in her ass..."
It's not offensive because my poor virgin eyes can't tolerate the stupidity. It's offensive because no one but a couple of idiots gets to talk.
Comment removed by moderator.
136 = funniest post EVER.
Comment removed by moderator.
239 - ATL does ban commenters too. But some of them come back on different IP addresses.
240 - If you prefer xoxo to ATL, then read xoxo. It's a free market. Vote with your feet (or your eyeballs).
I think 226 hit the proverbial nail on the head. Go take a look at the comments on Gawker. They're usually hilarious and clever as hell. There is a very good chance that Gawker's readership is just more creative and civil than ATL's readership but I'm willing to bet that requiring registration of all commenters plays a big role.
47, the a**hole commenters aren't being "protected" - they are being marginalized.
They are furious, which is why they are complaining so bitterly in the comments to this post.
I wonder what the Glass Cock has to say about this.
Nothing Sucks as much as TOXIC TORTS at SEYFARTH.
This is actually a brilliant idea. Just wait and see.
This site has now officially been taken over by lazy, good-for-nothin gov't type attorneys who have absolutely no idea what it is like to live in the real world. What kind of society do we live in where people can't stand up for themselves and instead have comments questioning their lifestyle removed?
I would implore every intelligent, Biglaw attorney to reconsider where they get their gossip. If someone can suggest a source that doesn't cater to the kind of liberal trash who has infested this site, please post it. Thanks.
The last couple weeks have been painful trying to read this blog. Asslobster, Cahill rumours, spread the you know whats, peanuts and cheese, First!, and all the other inane postings along with the racist and anti-semitic comments have made this blog a real embarassment to the profession. And boring. And not funny.
Every third post should be about the comment moderation.
Comment removed by moderator.
To everyone making suggestions:
"Update: Yes, we are aware of the various comment rating / flagging / moderation systems that are used on different sites -- e.g., YouTube, Slashdot, Craigslist. We hope to implement such a system on ATL later this year. This is a temporary measure designed to address the situation on an interim basis."
With all due respect for the effort, this entirely misses the point. If I simply did not want to see ANY comments to an ATL post, that is easily achieved by simply not scrolling down the webpage. The problem is that ATL derives a lot of its value FROM comments, but from USEFUL or FUNNY comments. Lately, 95% of posts on this site have been so stupid, it's simply not worth sifting through them to find the interesting or entertaining ones. I fail to see how "hiding" the comments makes any difference whatsoever, since no one was making anyone read them to begin with.
The only way to deal with comments that have absolutely no value of any kind is to selectively delete them. I hate censorship in all forms, but deleting posts that say "ASS LOBSTER" is not censorship, as there is no coherent content to this post to begin with. And the moderator has to be someone who has a sense of humor. Stuff like Frat Stud is fine. Stuff like SPREAD YOUR BUTTCHEEKS needs to be removed not because it offends our sensibilities but because it results in a heap of trash comments that I do not have time to wade through to find something relevant.
This policy is like solving the problem of finding the needle in the haystack by hiding the haystack. I fail to see what it accomplishes. If you're planning on implementing a comment rating system, that's a great step, but this policy is totally pointless.
I *very much* welcome this change. I'm confident that I will now spend a much smaller percentage of each day reading moronic/rude/know-it-alls bashing every firm/school/job in existence. Thank you Lat! Now if we could just get a new EIC.
NT101L, seriously, I am not a fan of yours but I don't want to watch a kid get really hurt over bullshit.
Your outing is inevitable. You can't annoy thousands of people a day and expect not to slip up or be ratted out sooner or later. As annoying as you are, you don't deserve to have your career end before it begins.
With that said, if you are outed, I sure as hell would toss your resume in the trash if you became known. I wouldn't want to be responsible for hiring a guy who is known to annoy thousands. I know my RC would ditch you too, and would probably break any offers outstanding with you.
I am not your friend, and I think you are an obnoxious douchebag. I just don't think some kid deserves to have all his hard work turn to shit over something like that. Go away or just become another anonymous poster. You will be doing everyone a favor, especially yourself.
231 - Maybe the terrorists have already won.
Oh, yeah. When Lat lets us vote on shit here, we make REAL GOOD DECISIONS.
I mean, we chose Elie, amirite?
What's next? Elie will proof read his posts before they are posted?
Seriously, I heartily applaud this measure. Thank you.
DEAR ATL,
PLEASE GROW UP AND BE A BIG BOY BLOG.
ALLOW US TO RANK THE COMMENTS. IF BELOW A SET THRESHOLD THE COMMENT DOESN'T SHOW.
IF YOU CAN"T DO IT, THE WORK CAN BE DONE IN BANGALORE BY THE WEEKEND.
WWW.DIGG.COM FOR SOME TIPS (and there are soooooo many others)
Above the Law-Please grow some balls!
I believe in freedom of speech, but I don't want to keep reading "stupid" comments. I cannot believe that most of the comments are from law students or lawyers. Scary!
Make everyone register their real e-mail accounts, verify the address, and reserve the right to kick them off the comments page.
People post off-topic, abusive comments because its anonymous. DUH.
Opt-In or Opt-out...comments hidden for my protection? Are you serious? Yawn...
Please everyone, read the update that Lat / Mystal added to their post:
"Update: Yes, we are aware of the various comment rating / flagging / moderation systems that are used on different sites -- e.g., YouTube, Slashdot, Craigslist. We hope to implement such a system on ATL later this year. This is a temporary measure designed to address the situation on an interim basis."
This is not a perfect solution. But as a temporary measure, it is not bad.
Uh, you could just use a comment moderation system (where readers vote comments up or down). My impression is that slashdot.org is generally pretty cutting edge with this stuff (they pioneered the concept and give away their code - slashcode.com). Wired.com has a simple thumbs up - thumbs down version, which would also go a long way towards improving the current situation.
David
Chocolate Rain! No more fun for Mr. Tay Zonday.
Chocolate Rain! Guess I'd best be on my merry way.
Chocolate Rain! Censorship's no fun for you and me.
Chocolate Rain! Above the Law's becoming TTT.
I agree with 256, except that I don't think this policy is pointless, in fact it makes the problem worse. My problem with the off-topic comments is not that I'm personally offended or scarred, it's just that they make it harder to find the gem comments which were part of what made ATL so great in the first place. Now, making me click one more link to get to the comments, where I then have to still fish through all the ass lobster comments, just makes it that much harder for me to get to the good comments.
I do appreciate you recognizing this problem, though!
That's asinine. Did someone suggset you might have some kind of liability issue? You don't.
I only read ATL for the comments. The site loads slowly. I'm already annoyed at having to click through the jump. I'm too lazy to click yet again to get to the interesting part.
Cut the dreck in the posts and encourage it in the comments.
Re: above-- If I wanted to work I wouldn't be on ATL in the first place.
Could you also do something about the comment not processing? I.e. you draft a comment, click post, and nothing happens. The same morons who are into firsting (and fisting) don't know better than to keep clicking "post."
Get rid of Elie. That should cut down on the profane, outright stupid, and otherwise undesirable comments immediately. The man is incompetent and unnecessarily abrasive.
271 - I don't know about that. I've been reading the site since Lat started it, and the commenters here have always been an awful bunch.
To everyone asking for more moderation, you have gotten your wish. Someone has moderated the hell out of this thread.
As a result of this policy, I will probably read ATL comments less - and be happier for it.
The trolls are unhappy because they know fewer people will be reading the comments - and taking their bait.
Agree w/274. This move may seem like nothing, but it will subtly change the "feel" / reader experience of ATL.
The new policy serves to (1) increase the distance between the main posts and the comments, and (2) privilege the main posts over the comments.
Commenters are unhappy because their contributions are being marginalized. But this is probably a smart move for Lat / Elie to make (esp. given how awful the comments can be).
First time commenter. You are inviting a world of pain with this new policy. You've effectively just challenged all the trolls to a game. The old adage about pigs and wrestling applies well to internet trolls...you'll both waste inordinate amounts of time doing something pointless, but the difference is that the trolls like it.
I hope that you win, but at least for a while, if not for a very long time, expect to spend most of your time chasing after and deleting troll comments. I hope, for your sake, that I'm wrong.
FWIW, I would echo 203's proposal (even then only automatically "hiding" rather than deleting comments). Let the community do your work for you.
276 here. Just saw the "update". Good for you. Good luck in the meantime.
I have insomnia in its worst form. I need a cure and I think tomorrow I will have to not go to work and try to take some time off to get treatment and to sleep for a few days? I've literally slept less than 3 hours a night average for the last month.
(a) Can I get paid medical leave for this?
(b) Can I tell people I'm doing work for why I'm out? I know I can, but would I be better off lying and saying some other sort of health issue that doesn't make me seem like a dipshit? I'm not embarrassed, but would think it might reduce people's confidence in me? But I'm a believe in being open (I don't care about making partner, if that makes a difference).
278 - Try sending this in to advice@abovethelaw.com, for "Pls Hndle Thx":
http://abovethelaw.com/pls_hndle_thx/
Comment removed by moderator.
To the person that thinks that Dealbreaker doesn't have a problem:
Bess just bans IP addresses at the drop of a hat.
She is a a total fraud.
Ban all IP addresses originating from a law school classroom.
Problem solved.
278 - you don't have to tell anyone what the medical condition is. I believe that's between you and the short term disability insurer and your DR.
I'm sure you're not alone in your illness. Unfortunately, a lot of biglaw attys are suffering from some sort of stress-induced condition that will only worsen if you don't get help.
Feel better!
Des anyone have trophy wife's telephone number?
As one of several Butt Cheeks Guys, I actually have to say this is a reasonable approach.
Makes sense, good for business.
Moderator removed by comment.
240, is your life so void that all you can come up with is hacking an ID and trying to fool us? Plainly pathetic. Grow a brain of yours sometime. Better, just go away.
Comment removed by moderator.
This is going to blow the Count's mind. Wait, can I say blow anymore?
If you google "ass lobsters," ATL is the first site to come up.
Wait, you aren't going to delete "first" comments, are you? Because that would seriously reduce the joy in my life.
- blah blah
commentgate
I just am sick of seeing a page of "first" comments. I support this policy. I am with Commenter #12.
I am with 293. The person who is "first" should be able to enjoy their victory, without having it diminished with a page of people who wish they were first.
Delete all posers; reward the first person!
When are the comments going to be ribbed for her pleasure?!
Can we still say that Ellie is a digusting waste of afro-flesh?
More generally, are comments about Ellie's distrubing physical appearance, incometency with which he conducts himself, and severe halitosis still above board?
Please advise.
Am I still blocked from posting a comment?
More goverment attorney coverage, the biglaw firms are all gone now.
Agree with 263. Make everyone register.
Agree with 299 and others. Make. Everyone. Register.
300--FUCK you.
-301
Does anyone else think it is hilarious that someone with a Yale law degree spends his time evaluating and deleting ass lobster comments?
I find your flip "don't read the comments" response a complete f-you to your serious readers' legitmate concerns. The comments on this site have become, virtually over night, disgusting and upsetting.
Mere months ago, the comments were the most valuable part of this site- pretty much the best place for off-the-record information and unconfirmed rumors about law firms and other topics of interest. A place for lively debate.
As the comments grew more obscene, I have become a less frequent reader. Count me as one of the people who boycott until you get the comments back under control.
You people who are complaining about censorship are missing the point. If they don't do something about the moronic comments, then eventually the IT department at all of your places of business will automatically flag this site as having inappropriate content and will block your access. So inane, disgusting comments will eventually hurt ATL's business.
Does this mean the end of "First"?????
Thank you. Comment moderation is long overdue.
I'm not sure I get it. ATL advises us not to read the offensive comments. Yet, how are we supposed to know if they are offensive unless we read them in the first place?
Pretzels.
This is a good step in the right direction. I look forward to the implementation of a self-policing ro self-regulating comment system, with flags and such, as described above. (I hope you can find a way to implement that without requiring people to register and still not allowing them to game the system by repeatedly flagging or un-flagging the same comments.)
I have a suggestion. What if ATL used a system like YouTube's? Let everyone comment, but put a thumbs up/thumbs down next to the comment. If a comment gets enough Thumbs Down, it is hidden from view BUT a reader can click a link to reveal that comment if she wishes. You could even show the total score next to the comment, much like YouTube. If ClickMonkeys want to waste their days going through every comment posted and give it a mark, well, that's fine since they're unemployed nobodys anyways.
Granted, this will allow a lot of ruinators to screw up the site by giving a thumbs down to legit comments, but we just have to hope that people's minds converge, for the most part, on the true, the good, and the beautiful.
LOL at you people giving lobsters and cheeks the credit for the new policy. We all know it was the DUCKTALES takeover that caused this. A woo oo.
I'm really upset about this idea of a comment system. The people who already commented are shitheads, and you're completely fucked up.
Moreover, plan sinister clever on the Seine train to Volga Derida conspiracy Obama!
I don't want to hide all comments. I want to read the good ones and hide the stupid or offensive ones. Please get the newer and more improved system (a la Youtube) up and running soon.
I feel uneasy about this and from the guy who sticks pens in people's eyes, that's saying something.
KASH I WANT TO MARRY YOU -- OR JUST MAKE LOVE TO YOU.
FINALLY - this is great news. I agree with everyone who finds many of the comments to be offensive and useless. If ATL cannot find a way to deal with this issue effectively - my firm will no doubt block the site. Please comment on the topic in a mature manner. I do not want to read ridiculous pornographic posts that have nothing to do with the topic, lawfirms, or the law. The individuals who post that crap are yet another glaring example of why children fresh out of undergrad should not be allowed to go to law school and most certainly are not ready for work in a real law firm.
I'm really upset about this idea of a comment system. The people who already commented are shitheads, and you're completely fucked up.
Moreover, plan sinister clever on the Seine train to Volga Derida conspiracy Obama!
Can't wait for the rating/flagging moderation!!!
Ok, here's my situation. HLS 2L with decent to good grades 1L year (somewhere b/w a B+ and an A-). SA offer at a V25 firm (but not V10) in corporate dept.
2L grades for fall just came in and I ended up w/ 2 B+s and a B.
Am I freaking out about nothing or is there a realistic chance that this will result in a no-offer/cold offer for a permanent associate position?
Finally. It was becoming a total taste of time to filter through the waste-of-space comments to come across something useful or funny.
You need to study and learn from boingboing's comment moderation policy. They do a really superb job. Comments appear almost instantly, and the offensive/stupid ones don't get deleted--they get disemvoweled, which is a quite ingenious way of dealing with them. The result is a much more intelligent brand of commenting than can be found around these parts.
Can you start banning IP addresses? You guys threaten to ban people who would reveal the name of a dumbass summer associate why not do the same to a dumbass commenter. If the only contribution of an IP address is FIRST, LOBSTER, or something else derogatory, I think ATL will at least become a tolerable blog to read.
Agreed that a "flagging as offensive" option would be the easiest way to flame out the crap. Those who read xoxo know that the bad apples will eventually ruin the entire barrel if left unchecked. Lots of other popular blogs require user registration, which preserves anonymity (if you're allowed to use an anonymous avatar/name) but not contributions (look at dlisted.com, they have tons of comments all left by registered but unidentified posters)
If someone flags your constructive post as offensive because they disagree with you, remember that its a street fight. Start with the headbutt out of nothing, then throw some heavy strikes danga da danga da bang, then looky looky what we have here, smack his face on the side of the table. Then, complain to the moderators because you get flagged every time you post.
What a useless change. You could ALWAYS avoid the comments if you wanted to. The point is that people who want to have an actual discussion in the comments are forced to wade through inane, idiotic, ignorant sewage to do so. This policy doesn't change that at all, except now you have to waste the energy to make an extra click to get there!
ATL comment moderation should be considered critical for the good of the profession: If the only thing I knew about lawyers was what I read on ATL comments, not only would I think that lawyers are incredibly stupid, but I'd also think that they are fundamentally awful human beings.
Also:
"If you don't like the comments, don't read them."
Wow, what an amazing piece of advice! The problem is that one out of 20 comments may actually be worth reading, but you can't possibly know *which* ones are worth reading ahead of time. Instead, you have to read 19 braindead comments first. Since only idiots are willing to sit and read all of the idiotic comments and then post responses, it's a vicious circle of idiocy.
And is it really that difficult to implement a software solution to the problem of repeat comments?
275 hit the nail on the head:
"The new policy serves to (1) increase the distance between the main posts and the comments, and (2) privilege the main posts over the comments."
In other words, it undermines the general "leveling" effect of internet discourse, in which every comment is as good as every other comment. Now the posts by the ATL writers are elevated over the posts of the commenters.
As a reader of ATL, I like reading those comments that are applicable insightful to the subject. I wish there were a good way to remove comments that are just infantile cries for attention by people that clearly have too much time on their hands.
Seriously, why do people rush to post "FIRST" or bust on an author's errors. Are they really that insecure?
1. People need to quit apologizing for wanting comment moderation "even though I support free speech." THERE IS NO FREE SPEECH on a private website. Moderation is wanted, needed, and on this site, apparently tragically necessary.
2. I'm an adult; I can handle "offensive" comments. That's not why they need to be removed. They are annoying, time-consuming, useless, and make an otherwise useful site an embarassment to visit at work.
I think the "first!", "these pretzels are making me firsty!" and related comments should ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS be deleted, so as to avoid the "3- sorry, not first. Nice try though. -1" rebuttal, or the "fifth!" retort. Has to be the most assinine exercise in self-worth I've ever seen.
The current policy is worse than useless - it's a nuisance to those of us who like reading the comments, but only if they are funny and/or helpful. If you all are so busy that you can't just delete the useless comments (and G-d knows what you're doing that keeps you busy, since you're definitely not breaking legal news - see, e.g., Latham layoffs), just hire a high school kid as an intern for minimum wage, and have him or her sit there and delete the repetitive, crude and pointless comments. I mean, a trained monkey could do it.
This new comment policy is worthless. Unfortunately, with Lat off doing whatever it is he does these days, some of the best reporting occurs in the comments. So we are now left with the option of not SEEING the comments. I guess that helps those of us that are unable to ignore something if its on the screen. What it doesn't do is help those of us that appreciate the exchange of information in the comments but do not want to read through the horribly offensive, racist, infantile, homophobic, etc. comments.
Good work.
This new comment policy is worthless. Unfortunately, with Lat off doing whatever it is he does these days, some of the best reporting occurs in the comments. So we are now left with the option of not SEEING the comments. I guess that helps those of us that are unable to ignore something if its on the screen. What it doesn't do is help those of us that appreciate the exchange of information in the comments but do not want to read through the horribly offensive, racist, infantile, homophobic, etc. comments.
Good work.
www.lawshucks.com has serious potential of knocking off ATL.
-Not associated with LS
these pretzels are making me 333rd'sty
318: Don't worry. You're at HLS. You can end up getting hired by ATL so long as you get your sheepskin. You don't even have to be a good speller or understand the fundamentals of grammar.
Guys at my high school used to get censored all the time; it was no big deal.
People, this isn't rocket science. ATL provides several law-related postings per day, and allows readers to comment on the posts. Comments should be RELEVANT to thee posts they are submitted to. I for one would be glad to see the crap thrown out.
So, no more comments about lobsters, spread cheeks, Skadden DC, Latham, whatever, in posts that are discussing actual legal news items. YAY!!!!!!
The juvenile idiots who threaten to leave because of the moderation are more than welcome to go. You contribute nothing of value here anyway. Readers who post pertinent comments (or relevant humor, like frat stud/fraternity lothario) will still be allowed to post, I hope.
To the rest of you lobster/ass/whatever idiots: good riddance.
330: "and G-d knows..."
Holy shit! We're already at the point where people are self-censoring the "God"? It is this sort of overly-sensitive PC bullshit that makes mild-mannered people like myself turn to trolling. I don't find the asslobster comments particularly clever/funny, but I think I might be seeing where those posters are coming from...
The hilarious part about all this is that if the sensitive readers had just de-pussified themselves for a bit, the asslobster and buttcheeks posters would have gotten bored and left. As it stands, I am betting the trolls are going to have a field day.
yeah, or we could all agree to act like decent human beings and engage only in civil discourse. but i guess that's hoping for way too much.
Thanks for doing something about this. But the comments -- when they are not repulsive things about smearing mayo on Cate Edwards, etc. -- are often really informative. I don't think I'm alone in valuing the comments, but not the occasional repulsive ones. Maybe just be more active in the moderation?
338 - not only are you a sexist jerk ("depussified"), you are also an ignorant, idiotic one. "G-d" is used by some observant Jews for religious reasons, not for politically correct ones. Google it, and get a clue.
338,
As 341 said, it's written that way in a place where it can be easily deleted or destroyed for religious and cultural reasons. It's not "self-censoring," but rather as sign of respect and humility.
does this mean that we can't talk about the lesbians that work at king & spalding ?
343 - of course you can, that's always relevant.
Fuck it. It is the right thing to do. Too many comments that are irrelevant to the topic or are offensive to communities. Nothing wrong with being critical and bitching about how messed up our profession is, however, making blanket statements without appropriate rationale/logic is not what we got in debt for.
First, to 256, who wrote "Stuff like Frat Stud is fine. Stuff like SPREAD YOUR BUTTCHEEKS needs to be removed..."
You, miss, are an IDIOT. All that money on your education and you are still narrow-minded and short-sighted enough to think you are the Censorship Police????????????????????????? Quick, write to the Supreme Court and tell them all their confounding protected-speech issues have been solved. You FAIL.
Second, Elie: Steal this idea. Give it to Lat as your own. I know he doesn't read this far down. You clearly have two audiences. One in the ASSLOBSTER camp, one not. What do do?? How can this ever be resolved?? Hmmmmm.
Spin off another damned site, tools. Require some kind of registration on this one or the "new" site. Leave the other unedited. Go home. Count new shiny dollar bills. Sleep.
Well, I just wasted an hour reading 346 comments. I'm sending you a bill.
Bravo. This is an excellent new policy that achieves the best of both worlds. Thank you, ATL.