first

Pretzels

LOBSTER!!!!!!

Skadden? How could Skadden do that? I mean, it is NYC, and Skadden is so totally fabulous? I mean, I work for Skadden!!!

I'm gunna butter your bread, boy!

I just ripped a real delicious PUSSY FART. Oops!

#7 -- Ass Lobsters are one thing, but pussy farts? Damn, girl, that's just beyond the pale.

I was fired by Skadden on Friday. So maybe they fired 49% so they can say they kept "more than half" but it was a total bloodbath. At least 25-30 people are now without a salary, and more than a few are pretty much without money. Pretty damn heartless considering how we paid for ourselves many times over.

Major stealth layoffs at Dla Piper.

SKATTTEN IS THE FIRST ELITE FIRM TO GO!

What a shocker. I thought the plan to pay double market was full proof.

I love how ATL hides the Skadden news, which is pretty huge, in a generic post about staff layoffs. But when there were whispers (and no confirmation) about Milbank staff layoffs, they were all over it.

LOL at the tipster:

"but take it from this tipster that they kept most of their slackers and fired most of the hard workers"

B/c that is how all businesses would decide layoffs. They would say you know what, we definitely need to keep the non-billing STAFF attorneys around here doing jack and let all of the hard workers go because they are giving us a bad name by earning us money.

At least that's how I run my business ... but I cannot figure out why I cannot make a profit, go figure

Can I ask why you take a Skadden staff position instead of a full time gig at a smaller, less prestigious firm? Serious question, please no lobster responses. Do staff positions turn into full associate positions? What type of law student ends up working as a staff attorney?

What about the rumored layotts at Cahill?

Why is the Skadden news not cover story? Firing 30 attorneys that are listed on their website sounds like news. How much do staff attorneys get paid there?

We here at Holland + Knight, LLP are proud to have been on the bleeding edge of staff layoff developments. This is but one example of our outstanding leadership in the legal community.

On a day-to-day basis, how did "Staff Attorneys" differ from (for lack of a better word) "real" Skadden attorneys?

Sorry for the laid off, but I think it's pretty smart business planning. I'm sure the non-Staff Skadden Attorneys enjoy the security that comes with knowing there are dozens of Staff Attorneys to be laid off before their job is in jeopardy.

Why is the Skadden news not a cover story on thise site? It sounds like they fired 30 attorneys listed on their website. How much do they pay staff attorneys there?

People often take Staff Attorney positions because they can pay more than twice what you would make at a smaller firm.

#9 - how are SAs at Skadden contracted? 1 year contracts? 6 months? Were the layoffs a complete shock?

What's a staff attorney? Did these people go to law school and pass the bar, or are they like promoted paralegals?

People often take Staff Attorney positions because they can pay more than twice what you would make at a smaller firm.

#9 - how are SAs at Skadden contracted? 1 year contracts? 6 months? Were the layoffs a complete shock?

BITCH SPREAD THEM BUTT CHEEKS SO YOU CAN LET OUT ALL OF THAT SKATTTEN FROM YOUR INSIDES!

Staff Attys at most large firms are req. to bill 2000.

Akin did stealth layoffs back in the fall during reviews.

Since the pay difference between them is probably so great wouldn't it make more sense to lay off 2-3 extra midlevels, which wouldn't be news, than to lay off 30 staff attorney's which is news?

SAs at Skadden made in the low 100s (depending on start date) plus bonus (this year they shat on us and paid 2500-10k depending on hours), but in past years was a bit higher. Everyone who took this job did it for the money, not for the quality of the work. A lot of people on second careers, all really hard-working folks, many of whom practiced law at smaller firms before coming to Skadden.

#13- they decided based on pure hours (ie the slackers who took all day to do a job got rewarded with keeping their jobs while those who actually did a good job and worked efficiently got shitcanned).

#19 - would you admit you fired attorneys if you were a (formerly) prestigious law firm?

#21- yes we were all NY admitted attorneys.

#22 - no contracts, all at-will employment

BITCH SPREAD THEM BUTT CHEEKS SO YOU CAN LET OUT ALL OF THAT SKATTTEN & FLOM FROM YOUR INSIDES!

The ATL editors and naïve 2L’s who have spent the last two months celebrating Skadden for having overpaid their “regular” associates ought to take a long hard look in the mirror.

Anyone who believes there is no connection between this move and over-market bonuses is kidding themselves. Skadden partners were furious with management after they got pwn3d by Cravath. Staff attorneys were offered up in sacrifice.

Where is Jean Dixon when you need her? Who's next? Which firms will follow?

27: what was the bonus range in prior years for SA's at Skadden? 2500-10k is not cool. Were any fired that were there for several years?

27: what was the bonus range in prior years for SA's at Skadden? 2500-10k is not cool. Were any fired that were there for several years?

Wow, HALF SKADDEN has truly been redefined...

"...as many as half of Skadden's staff attorneys were laid off last week."

31: yes most who were laid off were there multiple years. past years' bonuses were not quite as shitty but close to the 08 range.

21 - Staff attorneys are essentially doc review temp attorneys, except on payroll. It's pretty mindless work, and it doesn't have any promotion opportunity, but it pays $100K-$120K, which is three or four times what the same people could make at, say, personal injury warehouses.

I don't know of any staff attorneys laid off in DC. 5 - 10 legal assistants were laid off.

I feel like I'm taking crazy pills here.

When you lay off someone inexpensive, you have to have someone expensive do the work. You're laying people off because your clients don't have the money to pay your bills. Raising costs will lower the number of hours of work you bring in, and hence you will have to make more layoffs.

Doesn't anyone else get this?

I know my clients have started refusing to pay for high dollar associates and counsel doing the work they know in the past was done by a paralegal or junior associate. And they're not buying the "efficiency" line anymore either.

Skadden's response: staff attorney's = pieces of shit. Heartless fucks.

So the Skadden DC layoffs, much ballyhooed, were merely staff attys?

last time I believe this brd's comment section.....

I wonder what KASH'S ASS LOBSTER is wearing today.

These staff attorneys were nothing but pawns of the white slavemaster. They should be grateful to be freed from his yoke.

37--You're not taking crazy pills. More layoffs will come.

In an economic crisis, staff attorneys bleed firm resources when a priority is to keep its top efficient talent, a move actually more beneficial to the client. Do you want to pay a lawyer to win your case, or a lawyer to review your documents?

The comment about retaining over half of the staff attorneys is rather shocking. Firing half of an entire position level is a drastic maneuver.

Skadden DC did not lay off staff attnys - just LAs.

Skadden DC's office is in complete turmoil right now. Everybody is wandering around with a confused look on their face and nobody seems to know what is going on.

37 - what if there is no work.

BS 46

I'm afraid not Mr. 48. No get back over to Fashionista, this site is a little bit above your pay grade.

25-
Akin did stealth layoffs? How many? Give more info.

Not that we should be shocked.

25-
Akin did stealth layoffs? more info please!

not that we should be shocked...

37 here -

If there is "no work" then there is no point in having "efficient top performers" that are highly paid.

If there is "some work" then the partners that bring it in can do it, and need the same balanced experience levels down the line to keep the fees low for their clients. Clients know that filing UCCs can be done by a monkey, and they're not going to pay $345 an hour for a junior associate to do it when they could have paid $175 for a paralegal. You're providing no additional talent or service by having highly paid and skilled lawyers doing hours upon hours of menial tasks ... you're only costing more money.

We need a separate post on this Skadden news. It's big news but not many people are seeing/discussing it because the lead is buried.

Separate post please?

sounds like jrs in NY were low on work...

Were any DC staff attorneys laid off or not?

Next step? REVOKING OFFERS TO 3L'S! We all know it will happen eventually.

Next step? REVOKING OFFERS TO 3L'S! We all know it will happen eventually.

Next step? REVOKING OFFERS TO 3L'S! We all know it will happen eventually.

Next step? REVOKING OFFERS TO 3L'S! We all know it will happen eventually.

Half Skadden?!? Ahahahaha! That is rich.

55, the answer is no. I'm a midlevel at Akin DC, and I had not heard that at all. I know some underperformers who are still alive and kicking, so don't believe 25.

Thanks 61. As a former DC Gumper, and am (now) worried about my former assistant, and was keeping my ears open for layoffs, especially after the restructuring.

27/34: that is awful, how many hours did you have to bill to get a 10k bonus?

55-59 - No, next step is scaling back summer programs further. Since there is little/no work to give summers and paying for summer camp food and drink is an atrocity at the moment...

Any law student who would ding a firm based on it not making the 2009 summer associates fat is economically ignorant, entitled and lazy. Not someone you want to hire in the first place.

-

Speaking as one of those prickly in-houses who knows that certain work can be done by a monkey...You are kidding yourself if you think I'm going to approve a bill of junior associates doing temp/para work, or senior associates doing junior work (or temp/para work).

I'm not paying for your "brilliant legal insight" when what is at issue is grunt work. You paying these people too much is your problem, not mine. You needing to support bloated recruiting budgets is your problem, not mine. The boat, second home, private school and mistress is your problem, not mine.

Lots of law firms out there that could use some work right now. Trying to make hours by soaking a client with overqualified people isn't going to fly.

37 and 52 here -

64, thanks for backing me up on this. Are you one of my clients? If so, you're welcome for keeping the bills done, thanks for keeping the work coming.

65: the 10k bonus was for those who hit 2k hours. meanwhile associates who did 1600 hours got the full skadden bonus. given that a staff atty has a bigger skill set than most 2nd-3rd year litigation associates, this makey no sense.... watch for skadden nyc to start shedding idle associates asap.

50/51 - approximately a dozen in NY.

66: I find it highly unlikely that the average staff attorney (who, in most other law firms, does grunt work/doc review) has a greater skill set than the average 3rd year litigation associate. Everyone needs to realize they are replaceable; associates, secretaries and staff attorneys, but some are more replaceable than others. Staff attorneys fall into that "more replaceable" category.

37: Exactly! Were I a Skadden associate, I'd be very bummed-out at the prospect of having to handle all the work staff attorneys previously did. Sure, I guess any work is better than no work at all, but if it suddenly gets very busy, associates will have to pick up the doc review slack.

When the salary freezes start at the top new york firms (and start they will - sooner than you think), will that be newsworthy? Or will that be relegated to an afterthough "oh, by the way, skaTTTen fired a shit ton of lawyers today..."

NY to 125!

Clients appreciate firms that have a staff of relatively inexpensive attys to perform the grunt work efficiently (i.e. do not have to stare at a priv doc for 10 minutes before they figure out it is priv b/c they didn't teach that at YLS).

Associates won't pick up the grunt work previously offered to temporary staff lawyers (that in-housers and other clients won't pay top level rates). Staff lawyers were cut by 50%, leaving the remaining 50% to continue with the existing grunt work.

To: All firms pulling this garbage.

Tell you what: You assign junior associates to do paralegal work and midlevel associates to do doc review. Go right ahead. And when you bill me, I'll pay for your junior associates at paralegal rates, and your midlevels at staff attorney rates. And don't complain when I do.

Signed,
All your clients.

72 - look, it sucks you = epic fail at life, but get over it.

72 -- not to mention the time a partner has to bill once s/he realizes that 75% of the so-called privileged documents aren't privileged at all. One would think a 4th-year would understand privilege, but one would be wrong.

77. Woohoo!

77. Woohoo!

Akin did not have a dozen stealth layoffs in NYC. Some people have left, but I don't know of anyone who has left against their will. Some may have gotten bad reviews, which was a hint, but that happens every year and every firm.

79 - Not this year. Tell me something, honestly: If somebody gets a bad review this year, do you really think they'd leave unless they're forced to? You think a subtle nod toward the door, rather than a firm shove, is likely to get them gone? Do you have any idea how hard it is to find a lateral job right now? I think most people would have to be pried from their jobs with a crowbar at this point.

I'm not one to drink the Skadden kool aid -- I don't work there -- but I don't think that these layoffs ipso facto mean that Skadden is suddenly assigning fourth years document review and then billing for it. There are some other alternatives here:

(a) Skadden is hiring temp contract attorneys to do this work (this is what we do at my firm). Temp contract attorneys are paid at an hourly rate with little to no long term overhead for the firm (health care, insurance, etc.). This would probably save the firm some money and not impact the rates billed to clients.

(b) Skadden could be assigning fourth years the doc review but then writing down their rates or time. This would make sense if Skadden didn't want to take the hit to its associate recruiting (and/or wanted the associate manpower in place for if/when things ramp back up), but, in the meantime, wants to recoup at least some of the costs of the associates' salary.

(c) Skadden could also just have half as much doc review work, period. It may plan to hire more staff attorneys when the work returns.

Not saying that this doesn't really hurt for those who lost their jobs today -- just saying that when a firm does this, it does not necessarily mean that the firm is ripping its clients off.

81 - It is obvious you don't work at Skadden

(a) These were staff attorneys who were let go, not document review attorneys, many of whom were doing 3rd and 4th year associate work, often better than their associate counterparts.

(b) Trust me they're not writing down their rates, AT ALL. There' s 3rd and 4th years reviewing documents. Hell, Skadden's 1st and 2nd years are glorified paralegals and billing as an associate.

(c) There is plenty of work at Skadden. They're just greedy bastards.

81 - It is obvious you don't work at Skadden

(a) These were staff attorneys who were let go, not document review attorneys, many of whom were doing 3rd and 4th year associate work, often better than their associate counterparts.

(b) Trust me they're not writing down their rates, AT ALL. There' s 3rd and 4th years reviewing documents. Hell, Skadden's 1st and 2nd years are glorified paralegals and billing as an associate.

(c) There is plenty of work at Skadden. They're just greedy bastards.

Any Skadden DC staff attorneys?

What does Skadden use as the billing rate to clients for their lit. staff attorneys?

Are there really 3rd or 4th year associates who do mostly doc review? How do clients put up with that? I'm a class of 2005 biglaw associate, and during the 6500+ hours I've billed in my legal career, probably about 60-80 hours has been doc review, all in situations where the number of docs was so small that it made no sense to bring someone else up to speed on the case. I must admit, though, that the easy billables of doc review often sounds really nice.

A third or fourth year doing doc review does not have much of a future at the firm. It is a major hint to move on.

Akin did stealth layoffs back in the fall during reviews.
It laid off 2 associates.

Why is it that negative press about Skadden ALWAYS get buried on this site, but the good news gets prominent coverage and even results in the site coining phrases, e.g., "skadden bonus."

I was one of the 30 staff attorneys let go at Skadden on Friday so let me clear up a few things:

The bonus is decided using 2 factors. They look at hours worked and they looked at what you did. I know a couple people that billed about 1800hrs last year but in addition to 1st and 2nd level doc review, they maintained privilege logs, did research on witnesses, created deposition binders and went to court to monitor ongoing trials. They received the max bonus as did those that billed 2000+ hours of document review.

1st and 2nd years will sit in the conference room and do the same document review as the temps or staff attorneys and will let the staff attorneys actually run things. You'd be surprised how little actual law new lawyers know, and they tend to be afraid to make decisions regarding documents. They defer to the more experienced (staff) attorneys. The associates are really just liasons to the staff attorneys and 4th-5th years.

For the last 2+ years, I have been on a number of cases where the 4th year running the case will say at the initial meeting "I know that you've done this before so I'll let you just handle things as you normally do". They never knew the protocol regarding privilege, parent/child documents as they relate in terms of responsiveness/privilege, etc.

It is possible to move from staff attorney to associate and several people have done it, but if you do it, you will have to leave the NY office. Former staff attorneys are moved to other offices.

The people that took staff attorney positions fall into 2 categories. One is people that just got out of school and have no experience. They work 80+ hours a week and do just doc review. The others are people that practiced before going to Skadden. In addition to doc review they do all the things mentioned above and more.

That said, I must also say that the layoffs were arbitrary. A group of us were working 10+ hours a day since December 30 and when the docs were done (That is, IF they really ran out of docs and weren't saving them for those left behind), they let us all go. Quality of work, prior reviews, etc played no part in the decision. I had partners request me on cases, but that made no difference on Friday.

In addition, they did NOT retain more than half their staff attorney force. In the exit papers we received was a chart showing the number of attorneys retained and dismissed in each age range and 30 of 60 were let go.

Staff attorneys cost the firm about $200k each with salary and benefits. We were billed out for $215hr or more, depending on duties. So even if you just did doc review, if you worked steadily until June/July, you will have at least 1000hrs and every hour you billed from that point on was pure gravy for the firm.

The bottom line is, by firing staff attorneys and support staff (staff attorneys are NOT support staff), the firm doesn't have to report it to the NALP to go into their numbers.

In addition, they did NOT retain more than half their staff attorney force. In the exit papers we received was a chart showing the number of attorneys retained and dismissed in each age range and 30 of 60 were let go.

Staff attorneys cost the firm about $200k each with salary and benefits. We were billed out for $215hr or more, depending on duties. So even if you just did doc review, if you worked steadily until June/July, you will have at least 1000hrs and every hour you billed from that point on was pure gravy for the firm.

The bottom line is, by firing staff attorneys and support staff (staff attorneys are NOT support staff), the firm doesn't have to report it to the NALP to go into their numbers.

In addition, they did NOT retain more than half their staff attorney force. In the exit papers we received was a chart showing the number of attorneys retained and dismissed in each age range and 30 of 60 were let go.

Staff attorneys cost the firm about $200k each with salary and benefits. We were billed out for $215hr or more, depending on duties. So even if you just did doc review, if you worked steadily until June/July, you will have at least 1000hrs and every hour you billed from that point on was pure gravy for the firm.

The bottom line is, by firing staff attorneys and support staff (staff attorneys are NOT support staff), the firm doesn't have to report it to the NALP to go into their numbers.

Less than half of the staff attorneys were laid off firmwide.

Surely there will be more fat-trimming. Clearing 30 staff attys from the payroll will not make or break Skadden, but it will keep juniors busy...for a while.

I was one of the SAs in DC who was laid off. To be honest, I'm not that bummed because I hated working there and have enough money saved up. I feel really bad for some of the other people who were laid off though. They laid off a guy who'd been at Skadden forever, first as a legal assistant, then as a SA, a guy with 3 kids under 5, and a legal assistant in his 50s with 2 kids in college who'd been with the firm for 15 years. The partner who informed us was pretty heartless about it, and smirked instead of showing genuine compassion.

I was one of the SAs in DC who was laid off. To be honest, I'm not that bummed because I hated working there and have enough money saved up. I feel really bad for some of the other people who were laid off though. They laid off a guy who'd been at Skadden forever, first as a legal assistant, then as a SA, a guy with 3 kids under 5, and a legal assistant in his 50s with 2 kids in college who'd been with the firm for 15 years. The partner who informed us was pretty heartless about it, and smirked instead of showing genuine compassion.

Why is a layoff of 30 attorneys buried in a post about secretary layoffs?

Why is a layoff of 30 attorneys buried in a post about secretary layoffs?

Oooh, Skadden is paying the full bonus! That's great! Never thought there'd be a price to pay, huh? idjits...

DEAN, ARE YOU HERE?

They now have 1st, 2nd and 3rd years doing some doc review. The Staff Attorneys that were kept are mostly the ones that were doing more specialized work on specific cases so they were saved. Those staff attorneys that were doing doc reviews were cut and replaced by associates that had been idle for some months.
It is a sad place and the remaining Staff Attorneys feel like they are living on borrowed time.

I'm a staff attorney, and I still have a job at Skadden (not because I'm a slacker either, you haters). Everybody out there moaning and bitching needs to get a grip.

We are "staff attorneys" people...contract attorneys with more security and benefits. We were hired at a time when Skadden was overrun with document heavy cases (that were too much for the associates to handle if they were to get any other type of experience), and were told when they hired us, that we should expect only to do document review and that we should not expect to become associates. A clear delineation was made between staff attorney and associates.

As it was made known that the we were only there to assist with the overflow of document review, it makes sense that when there was no longer an overflow (either because there are less documents or because the associates don't have any other work to do) we would become redundant. Of course work is being shifted to the associates in whom the firm has a vested interest.

Just because they invited us to firm parties and let us use the gym didn't make us associates. Its a nice gig if you can get it, but we all knew (or should have known) that it wouldn't last forever. I'm upping my rainy day fund for the date that my docs run out. If things don't get better in the market, there may come a time when associates are let go in an effort to keep the partner draw at a certain level. And that is completely logical.

All this heartless and evil Skadden is just stupid. This is a business, not a charity. Skadden has no obligation to look at the number of kids a person has before determining if they get to keep a job. Hell, I have no kids and I know my performance was better than the 50 year old legal assistant who repeatedly got bad reviews and was fired from five or six cases because he kept f'ing up. Should he still be employed because he has kids? Hell no. They should have fired his ass a long time ago. (And all of you know you didn't want to work with him either.)

Grow up and stop crying. Get your resume on out there.