Judge of the Day: Joseph R. Wall, You Can Find Me at The Club
If you’re sick and tired of paternity tests on every episode of Maury Povich, join the club — the baby mamas club, that is. In a decision by the Wisconsin Court of Appeals, the court ruled that the trial court’s use of the term “baby mama,” along with other comments about the African-American defendant’s habits, could lead to the reasonable perception that the defendant’s sentence was impermissibly influenced by race.
A quick review of the exchange between the trial court and the defendant reveals that the trial court judge (the Honorable Joseph Wall) is a jerk. But damned if he isn’t a hilarious one:
THE COURT: Where are you working now?
THE DEFENDANT: I’m unemployed right now.
THE COURT: You’re unemployed still?
THE DEFENDANT: Yes.
THE COURT: Have you gotten a job since January?
THE DEFENDANT: No, sir.
THE COURT: You’re kidding.
THE DEFENDANT: No.
THE COURT: What do you do all day?
THE DEFENDANT: I just stay at home with my daughter and that’s it.
THE COURT: Where is her mother?
THE DEFENDANT: At work.
THE COURT: So the mother works and you sit at home, right?
THE DEFENDANT: Yeah.
THE COURT: And watch the child?
THE DEFENDANT: I got all types of things goin’. My personal family.
THE COURT: Where does the baby’s mama work?
THE DEFENDANT: Metro Market.
THE COURT: Did she finish school?
THE DEFENDANT: Yes.
THE COURT: Is she going to college, too?
THE DEFENDANT: Yes.
THE COURT: Where do you guys find these women, really, seriously. I’d say about every fourth man who comes in here unemployed, no education, is with a woman who is working full-time, going to school. Where do you find these women? Is there a club?
THE DEFENDANT: No.
Wait, it gets better… after the jump.
Apparently not satisfied that there was not, in fact, a central depot where baby mamas congregate to pick up losers, the court persisted:
THE COURT: You’re sure?
THE DEFENDANT: I ain’t find her at — she not the club [type].
THE COURT: Oh, she’s not the club type.Later in the sentencing, the trial court stated: “Mr. Harris sits at home, gets high while his baby mama works and goes to school. I swear there’s a club where these women get together and congregate.”
Although the appellate court did not conclude that the trial court’s references to clubs and baby mamas were intended to be offensive, Judge Brennan summons her years of case study and studious practice to produce a single, bulletproof dissent:
“Baby mama” does not refer to any particular race. It is currently a trendy pop-culture term for a single mother, as evidenced by the recent Hollywood movie (released on DVD in 2008) titled Baby Mama, involving Saturday Night Live actress, Tina Fey, playing the role of a white single mother.
Finally, a judge after my own heart. Judge Brennan: two-way me.
Court’s “baby mama” remark leads to resentencing [WisBar]
State v. Harris [Wisconsin Court of Appeals]




Comments
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pretty funny
Yeah, if the questioning is race-based then the Tina Fey movie is racist.
Classy, your honor.
I love the defendant's misunderstanding of "club".
Here is some maf: Marin > MysTTTal
So dumb to reverse over this. I hope the guy gets more time on resentencing.
Grammar crime rate is down to 0%. Indeed, Marin is much better than Mystal.
6 = racist
Marin has been rocking this shit. LAT: CAN WE KEEP HER?
Great post Marin.
What exactly is wrong with the judge telling this loser to get off his ass and go to work? The judge doesn't sound like a jerk - he sounds sane. Besides, he asks where the baby's mama works, not who's "yo baby mama" - totally different.
Haiku for my Boo
-------------------------
Marin is funny -
New concept for A.T.L.
Let us keep her, Lat.
She trumps Elie. Keep her ... forever.
Marin has been rocking this shit
Marin? Two-way? With baby mamas? In a club? I'm so there.
I agree with 6. Can the state appeal the reversal to the Wisconsin Supreme Court?
DC Circuit Gitmo decision, plz?
Good job, Marin! Keep up the good work!
Kash
ps. I hate you and want my pet back.
The tina fey movie WAS kinda racist.
The tina fey movie WAS kinda racist.
I'm confused. What aspect of the trial transcript indicates that the judge is "a jerk"? I see the part that indicates the defendant is a worthless piece of garbage completely uninterested in supporting himself much less contributing anything productive to society... I see THAT. I also see the part that indicates the judge's understandable disappointment and frustration with the foregoing. But I can't find the other part you mention. I've been looking for MINUTES! Pls clarify. Thx!!!
The court did not use the phrase "baby mama." It said, "baby's mama." Completely different.
In order to use baby mama, the question would have to be, "Where does your baby mama work?"
If the court reporter had typed "baby's momma" would the court's language still be an issue?
Haiku for my Boo
-------------------------
Marin is funny -
New concept for A.T.L.
Let us keep her, Lat.
Didn't like Marin during the ATL Idol process, but the contrast between the consistently good quality of her writing and Ellie's clumsy drivel is pretty striking. Time for ATL to join BigLaw and conduct some layoffs of its own.
Nevermind the racism, I see lots of evidence of sexism here. Would you call a stay at home mother a "loser"?
FIRST to say Judge Wall was right
ATL crisis:
Mystttal the parasitis
is killing this place
There is absolutely no objective or subjective measurement that could end with Elie being better at this job than Marin.
She is just funny, a better writer, and more relevant. I do not want to see Elie lose his job, but how about a co-EIC position for Marin at least.
GULCer > Stay at home mother > Texas resident > bovine gynecologist
25 - A stay at home mom convicted of running a cocaine distribution operation IS a "loser". Read the charges in this case.
RE-VOTE! RE-VOTE!! RE-VOTE! RE-VOTE!!
I take back my Mystal vote in ATL Idol in favor of Marin. Lat, listen to your audience.
This post is amateurish in that it doesn't even include the actual instance of "baby mama" as said by the judge.
From the article:
Later, the judge said, “Mr. Harris sits at home, gets high while his baby mama works and goes to school. I swear there’s a club where these women get together and congregate.”
comments 1-31 = Marin
Stay at home mothers = TTT losers
25 -- I actually started to type "psycho feminazi liberal" before realizing you might actually have a valid point, although I wouldn't call it "sexism" because it doesn't reflect discrimination against or hostility towards women. If the defendant and his baby mama mutually decided that the most productive arrangement would be for him to care for the child while she works, AND if the defendant is a dedicated, responsible father to the child, then it would be unfair to characterize him as a deadbeat loser. But something tells me that's not what's going on in this case. From the beginning of the colloquy, it sounds like the guy has always been a deadbeat loser who recklessly brought a kid into the world when he wasn't even capable of supporting himself, let alone a family, and the judge is rightfully pissed off that the guy has taken no further steps towards self-sufficiency.
marin is better than elie = fact
Totally agree with 33. This post is totally lame. I have to follow a link to another site to actually find the reference to "baby mama?" Good God, why do I read this blog at all for anything besides bonus/salary/layoff news?
I demand a recount. Marin is far superior to elie
Totally agree with 33. This post is totally lame. I have to follow a link to another site to actually find the reference to "baby mama?" Good God, why do I read this blog at all for anything besides bonus/salary/layoff news?
Marin smells like low-tide at the peer.
stay at home moms are lazy and use children as an excuse to leach off of their husbands.
The dissent would be more persuasive if it didn't cite wikipedia as an authority.
The OED lists baby-daddy and baby-mama as "colloquial, chiefly African-American" variants of the Jamaican terms baby-father and baby-mother; its first citation for baby-mother hails from the Kingston Daily Gleaner in 1966. The terms probably arose in Jamaican Creole—where they would have been pronounced "biebifaada" and "biebimada"—before taking hold in standard Jamaican English.
Everyone who is proclaiming Marin better than Elie right now would ultimately find some fatal flaw in Marin if she were made EIC. This crowd will never be happy.
Stay at home wives here:
http://www.cnn.com/2008/LIVING/wayoflife/08/05/lw.nokids.nojob.wives/index.html
And 33 is right. Marin mistook the "baby's mama" as being the relevant quote.
45 - your point being?
41, I didn't know members of the House of Lords experienced tides. A pier, on the other hand...
Anybody know if the judge is white or black? I know, black judges in WI are probably rare, and it's more unlikely that the court would reverse if he WERE black, but...
Life Peers to 165!!
Good call, 48. She still smells like the peir at low tide.
I want Marin to take Elie's position.
Life Peers to 165!!
Life Peers to 165!!
Marin used to blow gutter queens on the east side for a half a quid!
25 - what about the baby's momma being a loser? She works all day, goes to school, and by all accounts probably cooks and cleans for Mr. Harris. Mr. Harris must have some love skills to score this gig. Homer and I want lessons.
Having Marin here is a real upgrade over Mystttal. Can we keep her Lat, please??
It stinks like something offal in here.
This exchange certainly doesn't show him at his best, but Joe Wall is not a jerk.
I agree with other commenters who've pointed out that "baby's mama" is completely different than "baby mama". Also, how is the Judge a "jerk"? It looks like he's just annoyed (and understandably so) with the deadbeat father.
Marin for E.I.C. if she shows us her boobs!
42 -- Are nanny's lazy? What about daycare providers and au pairs, are they lazy too? Seems to me the only difference between a stay at home mom and a nanny, daycare provider, au pair, babysitter, etc etc, is that everyone except the stay at home mom gets a paycheck, sick leave and vacation.
Taking care of your own children isn't the hardest job in the world, like some people claim, but it certainly isn't laziness.
De judge say “baby's mama” NOT “baby mama”.
60--"deadbeat father?!?" wtf? A deadbeat father is someone that doesn't take care of his kids physically or financially. This guy is father of the year, he took care of his kid all day long while running a lucrative cocaine business. Quit your race baiting.
So that I am correctly reading the comments about this "piece of trash"... you are saying that a parent that stays at home with the kid while the other parent works and goes to school is a piece of trash?
Or are you saying that a man that stays at home with the kid while the mother works and goes to school is a piece of trash?
hmmm
So that I am correctly reading the comments about this "piece of trash"... you are saying that a parent that stays at home with the kid while the other parent works and goes to school is a piece of trash?
Or are you saying that a man that stays at home with the kid while the mother works and goes to school is a piece of trash?
hmmm
66 just said women are trash.
I'm reminded of the movie Hoosiers and the scene where the town is holding a referendum vote on the new coach (Gene Hackman). Jimmy Chitwood is the star of the town who gave up basketball after his parents died.
Rollin: [as Jimmy walks in on the town meeting that determines Coach Dale's fate] What can I do for you, Jimmy?
Jimmy Chitwood: I got something to say.
Rollin: All right, say what you've gotta say.
Jimmy Chitwood: [to crowd] I don't know if it'll make a difference, but I figured it's time for me to start playing ball.
George: [as crowd is cheering, points to Dale] I told you, once we got rid of him!
Jimmy Chitwood: But, there's just one thing... I play, Coach stays. He goes, I go.
George: [crowd starts murmuring] Uhhh, the coach is dismissed by a vote of 48 to 25...
Opal Fleener: I think we should vote again!
Rollin: All those in favor of the coach staying, say 'Aye'
[majority of crowd says 'Aye']
I think we should vote again on ATL Idol.
Good find Marin. Use of the term baby mama by a white judge when referring to a black woman is racist. Just deal with it.
Where's Captain WorkHard when you need her/him? Lol lazy Captain WorkHard!!
I'VE GOT A PROBLEM WITH "MARIN"
He/she removed a post which explained that AIDS could be gone in a generation with a little "self-control" via use of condoms. It was in response to Elie claiming that AIDS was a huge problem.
Sorry, AtL, but there are a hell of a lot of people dying from brain cancer, breast cancer, and a million other diseases that are receiving a HELL of a lot less funding --- and they did nothing to acquire the disease. Remember, the 'A' in AIDS stands for "acquired" ....so for the most part, you don't have to acquire it if you so choose. But you can't say the same for something like pancreatic cancer; just ask Justice Ginsberg.
Perhaps she would have a lot longer to live if we were spending money on pancreatic cancer research instead of AIDS which is about 99% preventable without any further research. Wear a condom and stop shooting up!
How long until this gets "removed by moderator"?
Attacking Wall (who was a terrific judge but recently grew tired of it and returned to his former job as an AUSA in the ED Wis) completely misses the point. This jerk off defendant deserves to be reamed out, and the two appellate court judges who somehow discerned some offensive racial angle to Wall's comments and voted to reverse are "politically correct" dimwits.
71--hmmm. Bet you are a smoker.
Elie rules!
71--you are just another shallow thinker. it's fine, go back to your office and continue being angry.
Different editor, same crappy posts. Oh bother, Christopher Robin...
71: You should go join the Westboro Baptist Church. Their belief system is right online with yours.
You could protest at military funerals and such.
LONG LIFE ELIE!!!!!!!!!!!!
Marin Heads Assemblllllllllllllllllllllllllleeeeeeeeeeeeee!
You mean: Love Live Elie?
This mistake is too crazy for 78 not to be Elie.
The judge was just keepin' it real.
Marin rox!
I just read the opinion. This is ridiculous. I don't know how any judge could have douchebags like the defendant before him every day and not be pissed off at their attitude. Baby mama. As if that's grounds for reversal. I agree with 6 - I hope the defendant gets hammered on resentencing.
This isn't racist, but it is sexist for a stay-at-home dad to be slammed like this. It would not happen to a stay-at-home mom, and, therefore, the judge's derisive remarks are rooted in stereotypes about the "proper" role of men and women.
84: Sounds to me like the dude stayed at home and was a father, but that he was not a stay-at-home-father.
83: I agree. Not the best use of judicial resources.
Another question would be why these women keep chosing these absolute losers. They are no better then their lazy partners and deserve their lot in life.
As for #71, no I'm not a smoker, and no I couldn't join the "Westboro Baptist Church" because I'm not a liberal. You see, this is a group started by one of Al Gore's campaign supporters. It's also run by a guy who almost won a senate seat as a DEMOCRAT in Missouri a few years back.
Nevertheless, has anyone here woken up with AIDS having done nothing to acquire it? Aside from the dozen or so rape victims who acquire it -- for whom some research should of course continue -- those who get AIDS are largely responsible. That's the sad truth that no one wants to discuss.
Think about Justice Ginsberg--a pancreatic cancer patient--who probably lives a very healthy lifestyle, doesn't take risks, and has some of the best doctors in the world. She gets less support than an AIDS patient as far as funding goes. Pretty disgusting. An irresponsible person -- straight or gay -- has more money thrown at them by the government than a person suffering from an equally-deadly disease that is NOT the result of irresponsible behavior.
Far be it from me to imply that mi'lady is interested in entering into nuptial arrangements solely for monetary gain, however it would be improper to hypothesize, and impermissible to conclude, that the lady would render her affections to a gentleman of lesser monetary means.
- Kanye Lothario
My clients always have baby mama drama.
My clients always have baby mama drama. Divorce and custody attorneys to $100K.
THIS FAMOUS CELEBRITY SUPPORTS CHILD ABUSE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AoiOo3zSVDw
Yeah this one right here goes out to all my baby's mamas, mamas . . . mamas, mamas, baby mamas, mamas.
-Pop Bottles
So let me ask this:
Is it offensive for me to sit in class eating starburst?
So because he said "baby mama" and insulted a lay-about there is a requirement for a retrial? This is ass-tarded. I would suggest hizzoner next time say something like "now, you happen to be an African American gentleman, but I also think all white trash men of Caucasoid ethnicity who have enough money for beer but not enough for child support suck just as much as you. . ." then this would all be OK and no need for us to pay for a retrial. Stupid is a stupid does, as Forrest Gump said, there is no race quota or limit for dumb folks, they are everywhere, they don't enough know they're dumb. . .
The anti PC police are worse than those they hate. It's pretty clear here that the judge was way out of line. To deny that 'baby momma' references were anything but attempts to ridicule the defendant based on his race is just ridiculous. This is a judge, a steward of law and justice, the neutral arbitrator.
Had this been a black judge using slurs like 'redneck' to a deadbeat white defendant, you would agree the judge crossed lines. If someone then noted 'but people use redneck in popular culture, see comedy central' you wouldn't change your mind.
Just like the PC police, the anti-PC police discredit themselves when obvious lines are crossed and they flail their arms saying 'oh god, stop being sensitive'
71 is right.
Stupid decision by the appellate court. They need to pull their heads from their ivy-gilded arses and understand that losers like this defendant abound. There is no excuse for coddling human detritus like this.
Stupid decision by the appellate court. They need to pull their heads from their ivy-gilded arses and understand that losers like this defendant abound. There is no excuse for coddling human detritus like this.
PC nonsense to overturn on something like this.
LOL 96 good one!
Why is everyone on here such a tool?
"Define Tool"
The defendent didn't indicate that "college" meant one class a week online.
He said BABY'S MAMA not BABY MAMA...there's a big difference between the two. Yes "mother" would have been more formal, but the whole thing smacks of hypersensitivity (the same hypersensitivity we are seeing from Att'y General Holder. The bottom line is was his sentence within guidelines or not?
33 - 38 - 40 - 46 - 104:
The post has been revised to include the precise "baby mama" reference in the transcript. Look at the second blockquote, in blue:
Later in the sentencing, the trial court stated: "Mr. Harris sits at home, gets high while his baby mama works and goes to school. I swear there's a club where these women get together and congregate."
And Marin lost??? To MysTTTal? That fool sucks!
Is there a club where you learn to be a semi-retarded illiterate disgrace and still beat a nice-seeming amusing girl in the blog race?
Laughed out loud in family law. How appropriate.
I am honestly a little tired of the PC crap.
OK, so I don't know what the defendant's race is or for that matter what the judge's race is.. but just because the judge called him out on who he really is .. which is a no-job-applying-baby-producing-sucking-the-blood-out-of-the-baby's-mama-with-no-money-to-support-the-kid-you-pump-into-the-society-loser, how does that make the judge a 'jerk.'
Start showing some respect to the judges that wade through these BS cases just because the attorneys want to make a quick buck trying these loser cases.
To 21 and others...How is the defendant a lazy jerk for not working and staying home with his kids? When a housewife does it she is a decent mother but when a man does it he is a lazy jerk? What about when a women doesn't work but just put out kids? Is she a blood sucker??
This isn't the nineteenth or even the twentieth century. Find some time to read the latest WSJ or NYT articles about the number of laid of men who worked blue collar jobs. Duh...we're in a recession with 8.1 percent employment which has been most brutal on blue collar workers...i.e. MEN. You idiots need to take a chill pill.
To 21 and others...How is the defendant a lazy jerk for not working and staying home with his kids? When a housewife does it she is a decent mother but when a man does it he is a lazy jerk? What about when a women doesn't work but just put out kids? Is she a blood sucker??
This isn't the nineteenth or even the twentieth century. Find some time to read the latest WSJ or NYT articles about the number of laid of men who worked blue collar jobs. Duh...we're in a recession with 8.1 percent employment which has been most brutal on blue collar workers...i.e. MEN. You idiots need to take a chill pill.
I think people need to take the time to read this whole case out before they decide to comment on what they think is right or wrong or what should or shouldn't happen. Half the people think it's just a case of racism or sexism aganist a man who wants to be a stay at home dad, but if they took a minute to look at the facts before they went off and did their research they would see it is not the case of an innocent stay at home dad. He was arrested on felony drug charges. His "stay at home" status was really running a cocaine ring and dealing from out of his house, using that to take care of his daugther, not to mention expose infront of his daughter while he was supposed to be "raising" her. This is just another bad example of how parenting can lead to messing up a child's life. TOTALLY irresponsible and inexcusable! Now, I am not saying what the judge did was right or that I agreed with it, but as far as I am concerned that is a totally seperate issue. The judges' manner was not professional in any way, but really I don't think it was that big of deal or meant in the way that now its being spun into, but I also think that as a Judge and a high ranking figure of respect in a courtroom, he should convey that, and be nothing but proper and professional at all times. I would expect better language or speech out of a judge of our courtroom, but like others said you never know how fed up he was or if he was having an extremely bad day, he does after all deal with this B.S. 24/7 it can get old. Then again, being that he is a judge he should know better than to use that sort of language, when he of all people is well aware of how overly sensitive these issues can be blown up and how people will take anything they can and run with it in order to get off the hook. In trial it is sometimes unfair but that is the way it is and he should know that even a stupid little mistake such as proper uasge or grammer is enough now a days to get some seedy lawyer to find an excuse to get his low-life client off the hook. I believe that people should be treated equally and decent, like the people they are, but I do think once you overtly break the law and stop respecting the authority that everyone else does, that is when you stop having rights and being treated as an equal law abiding citizen. This man was doing illegal things with no respect for an honest living, so therefore he shouldn't be respected like that of an average citizen. Once you stop caring about the law is when you lower yourself as a humanbeing and you dont DESERVE those rights. So instead of throwing the case out or reversing it on the case of the judges irresponsibility, the judge should be repremanded or penalized seperatly from the case, but not affect the case, because it was a pretty dead ringer, he was caught red handed it wasn't about suspcision or forming a judgement in their decision he was guilty anyways. You do the crime you do the time. If they want some action to be recongized then you fine the judge, suspend him, or fire him, but you do it seperately. One man's unprofessional attitude still doesn't take away from the crime that was commited.