damn. Black Thursday

1st

Eighth!

Damn. Hopefully they spared their first- and second-year associates.

FATALITY

-

Today is bad.

how many layoffs in their Denver office?

ATL should run a story about how widespread associate layoffs will affect the student loan industry.

Is this some kind of sick early April Fool's joke?

The ship be sinking...

Epic fail ITE.

Thanks Bush.

Rather, I blame the **ABA for accrediting too many law schools. Doctors have jobs lined up waiting for them, lawyers scrounge for TTT jobs. Thanks ABA. This is your fault. **

how do you pronounce "Faegre?"

And the streets ran red with blood.

Faegre is known as the "Cravath" of Minneapolis

Mommy?

Epic fail ITE.

Thanks Bush.

Rather, I blame the **ABA for accrediting too many law schools. Doctors have jobs lined up waiting for them, lawyers scrounge for TTT jobs. Thanks ABA. This is your fault. **

Mommy?

ATL/Elie:

Please do a chart (since 9/2008) with months, # atty layoff, # total atty layoff, # total layoff (incl staff) and % of attys laid off.

How many AmLaw 100 (200?) attys have been laid off so far???

ATL/Elie:

Please do a chart (since 9/2008) with months, # atty layoff, # total atty layoff, # total layoff (incl staff) and % of attys laid off.

How many AmLaw 100 (200?) attys have been laid off so far???

ATL/Elie:

Please do a chart (since 9/2008) with months, # atty layoff, # total atty layoff, # total layoff (incl staff) and % of attys laid off.

How many AmLaw 100 (200?) attys have been laid off so far???

Mechant!

It's "Fay-gree"

12: FAY-gree

amlaw already has the chart. And it's far more objective than any chart you will find here.

Epic fail ITE.

Thanks Bush.

Rather, I blame the **ABA for accrediting too many law schools. Doctors have jobs lined up waiting for them, lawyers scrounge for TTT jobs. Thanks ABA. This is your fault. **

LAYOFFS?!? Don't talk about -- LAYOFFS?????? You kiddin' me MysTTTal??? LAYOFFS??

It's "Fay-gree"

Faegre Benson is a good law firm with good people. But the deep economic recession our country is in knows no geographic boundaries and doesn't seem to be discriminating in terms of impact on type and quality of law firm.

ABA: o hai guise. u want creditz?
COOLEY/ TTT: plz give me credit

COOLEY/TTT; cum to r skool and git big law cash money.
student: ok. tytyty.

"Posted by Jim Mora in "Some Resources for Making Sense of the Layoffs"
Monday, February 9, 2009 1:43 PM

LAYOFFS? Don't talk about -- LAY...

aw, screw it. Its about time this schtick got retired, isn't it?"

Vince here saying that although the ship be sinking, you can mop up the incoming water flooding through the portholes with a ShamWOW.

Where did you get the info re Merchant layoffs? A reliable source says that as of yesterday 7 attorneys were laid off, which doesn't quite seem like a bloodbath.

http://www.startribune.com/business/39466652.html?elr=KArksUUUU

11/16 – Don’t blame the ABA, blame the Department of Justice under Clinton-Reno. In 1993, the DOJ began an antitrust investigation against the ABA, claiming that the ABA’s standards were too restrictive, thus preventing new law schools from starting and more lawyers from entering the profession. The case was total BS insofar as antitrust law is concerned, but the ABA either didn’t want to or couldn’t afford to fight the DOJ. In 1996 the ABA agreed to a consent decree that loosened the standards, and since then, anyone who can rub two nickels together can start a law school and get approved by the ABA. Regent, which started off as CBNU School of Law, i.e. Christian Broadcasting Network University School of Law, is but one example.

When are the New York firms going to distinguish themselves by moving to the 190 scale?

NY to 190!!!

- 2007 Guy

The Midwestern AmLaw 200 firms of Barnes & Thorburg and Baker & Daniels are, at minimum, cutting staff today. No word on lawyers yet.

32. I saw that report and others. Like I said, I'm hearing 35 people total. I'm not hearing the particular breakdown is being reported elsewhere (that doesn't mean it's not true). I also understand that layoffs are ongoing today (which may account for the differences in the numbers).
Also of note, when I spoke to the firm they didn't confirm my numbers, but they didn't deny them either or point me to the previously published reports.
--Elie

16- You are an idiot

ABA: o hai guise. u want creditz?
COOLEY/ TTT: plz give me credit

COOLEY/TTT; cum to r skool and git big law cash money.
student: ok. tytyty.

Faegre Benson is a good firm comprised of good people. But fact is this unprecedented economic meltdown knows no geographic boundaries and is not discriminating between caliber of law firm it is impacting.

36-Elie-Have you heard any reports about layoffs going on at Milbank

I am not surprised MN is feeling it. It is spreading aacross the country like wildfire.

I have to admit, that I do laugh at all of the smart ass "I work for a V10 and you all suck" commentors that I have seen little of lately. Whose laughing now you unemployed douchebags?

Elie,

Honestly, I don't understand why people give you so much ish over misspellings etc. Without this site we would all be in the dark about a lot of these layoffs. You are doing a great service and for that I commend you! Keep it up! (I mean not the layoff posts...I hope those stop - not because you stop posting but because firms stop laying off....)

In any case. Thank you.

Elie,

Honestly, I don't understand why people give you so much ish over misspellings etc. Without this site we would all be in the dark about a lot of these layoffs. You are doing a great service and for that I commend you! Keep it up! (I mean not the layoff posts...I hope those stop - not because you stop posting but because firms stop laying off....)

In any case. Thank you.

OCEANS RISE

CITIES FALL

QUINN REMAINS

Fascinating. Faegre was supposed to be the most stable large Minneapolis firm and they are suffering layoffs. What about Dorsey? RKMC? Briggs?

None of the firms laying people off so far is v10.

-"I work at a v10 and you all suck" commentor

46 - you, good sir, are an idiot.

- Fired Latham associate

24 -- they should call it the "amlayoff 100".

"None of the firms laying people off so far is v10. "

Latham?

Terrible day.

8 in Denver, 21 in MPLS. Finance & Restructuring and Healthcare were the only 2 practice areas not hit.

Minneapolis, Milwaukee, Atlanta and Texas in general are going to pay for making first-year associates into 3rd World despots with that sky-high compensation.

ABA: o hai guise. u want creditz?
COOLEY/ TTT: plz give me credit

COOLEY/TTT; cum to r skool and git big law cash money.
student: ok. tytyty.

Can I say the Jim Mora guy makes me laugh everytime I see him?

None of the firms publicly announcing economic layoffs is v10. Latham, and most other v10 firms, are conducting forced attritrion because no one is leaving. That being said, I'm sure v10 firms will also publicly lay off more people because of the economy, but none have done so yet. It will be interesting to see which v10 firms leads the charge on this.

$120k in Minneapolis, a city that isn't as expensive as DC but certainly more expensive than cities like Cleveland or Milwaukee or Pittsburgh, is "3rd World despot" money? Lulz. With $150k debt from Harvard, 120k salary doesn't sound that great.

This is really sad. Faegre is a great firm with genuinely good people - this must have been very difficult for the management to do. And yes, it is the Cravath of Minnesota, but not in the "Death Star" sense. It is the "go-to" firm - it has the best lawyers, the best clients, and the best reputation. And no, I don't work there (or in Minneapolis).

52:

Minneapolis is $120k. Minneapolis is far more expensive to live in than Pittsburgh, Milwaukee, or Cleveland. It isn't Chicago, but anything close to the city is expensive. Given most Faegre lawyers have $150k+ T14 degrees and there is tremendous compression in the payscale (average raise is $5k-$7.5k), people typically leave a ton of money on the table and if they only paid $90k people would work for the AUSA.

Faegre first years make $120K. Recklessness might not a factor in these firings.

But my impression of Faegre has changed dramatically today.

Did Count Layoffyoula hurt himself overcounting?

55 - If you are wondering which v10 firm will lead the charge pal, don't look now, it's probably yours. That's what you get when you put lawyers in charge of running businesses. It's the equivalent of putting a drunk yr old behind the wheel of an 18-wheeler. Also, the 4 yr old is hopped up on Meth and has IBS.

-- JD/MBA

I have a sinking suspicion that my next door neighbor was one of the victims of said bloodbath.

BigLarry here here saying it's definitely not safe in Minneapolis.

62 - Yes, I was.

BigLarry here saying it's definitely not safe in Minneapolis.

45 -- they've all be doing aggressive "performance-based" layoffs for months. With the Faegre announcement, it will likely open the door for some more public bloodletting.

good firm, i worked on matters across from them as an associate in nyc. good luck all.

Anyone know what classes were hit the hardest in MPLS or what groups were hit the hardest? Sounds like a tough day for some good people.

Any info on Dorsey?

51: Thanks for the information. do you know what class years got hit in Denver or Minneapolis?

Any info on Dorsey?

These folks are going to have a hard time finding a job, at least here in MN. MPLS is probably the most overly saturated mid-market. Four local law schools, plus people from elite schools who want to settle down here. You also got the fact that MPLS firms don't really leverage and most become partner. Not a whole lot of associate positions open up.

-63 - Your wife confirmed it in an email to my wife.

-62

There is life after leaving a big law firm. Those Faegre attys, if they are motivated, will learn to swim in the real world. Many opportunities out there.

No talk of layoffs at Dorsey as of yet

No talk of layoffs at Dorsey as of yet

Minnesota has a surprising absence of large national law firms.

Any news on Winthrop & Weinstine?

OCEANS RISE

CITIES FALL

QUINN REMAINS WITH EGG ON ITS FACE(BOOK)

Any news on Winthrop & Weinstine?

The seismic shift in the operating model of major law firms is opportunity for young associates to restructure their careers. There is nothing wrong in working for a boutique or localized firm. The financial rewards are doubtful to be in the same league, but who cares because a good lawyer still will make good money and will likely be blessed with a more normative and enriching work/life balance. There are better things to do in life than to use a law degree to work yourself to death and die of stress in big law.

It's pretty much impossible to move to Minneapolis and get a job as a lateral. Anywhere. I graduated from HLS and have been applying to everything that opens up in Minneapolis for over a year, at firms, nonprofits, government, etc. There's literally nothing here, and it's compounded by the fact that people here aren't prestige whores. I kind of assumed that an attorney who graduated from a YHS would be more desirable than one who graduated from William Mitchell or St. Thomas, but it turns out I was very, very wrong.

82, if you are not from Minnesota, it is very difficult to break in if you did not summer there. You have to have a connection, or they are simply not interested. Firms there hire their own kind of people, and non-Minnesota/Wisconsin/Dakotas/Iowa natives generally need not apply.

It's pretty much impossible to move to Minneapolis and get a job as a lateral. Anywhere. I graduated from HLS and have been applying to everything that opens up in Minneapolis for over a year, at firms, nonprofits, government, etc. There's literally nothing here, and it's compounded by the fact that people here aren't prestige whores. I kind of assumed that an attorney who graduated from a YHS would be more desirable than one who graduated from William Mitchell or St. Thomas, but it turns out I was very, very wrong.

It's pretty much impossible to move to Minneapolis and get a job as a lateral. Anywhere. I graduated from HLS and have been applying to everything that opens up in Minneapolis for over a year, at firms, nonprofits, government, etc. There's literally nothing here, and it's compounded by the fact that people here aren't prestige whores. I kind of assumed that an attorney who graduated from a YHS would be more desirable than one who graduated from William Mitchell or St. Thomas, but it turns out I was very, very wrong.

It's pretty much impossible to move to Minneapolis and get a job as a lateral. Anywhere. I graduated from HLS and have been applying to everything that opens up in Minneapolis for over a year, at firms, nonprofits, government, etc. There's literally nothing here, and it's compounded by the fact that people here aren't prestige whores. I kind of assumed that an attorney who graduated from a YHS would be more desirable than one who graduated from William Mitchell or St. Thomas, but it turns out I was very, very wrong.

I'm from Minnesota originally, and I still can't break in. The midwest has its own special brand of eliteness - if you went to law school in another state, they don't want you.

82/84-87: Why are you trying to move to Minneapolis?

Because I like the winter.

- 82

No, really, I am curious. Do you have family there? Raised there? Etc.

(Just like the winter would also qualify you for Vermont, Maine, Colorado, Wisconsin, Wyoming, North Dakota, etc.)

I am pretty sure the 35-36 number for Merchant Gould includes support staff as well as lawyers. 7 of that number were lawyers.

At Faegre, the two hardest hit groups were real estate (7 lawyers, including 1st years) and corporate (10 lawyers). That's what's slow in this economy, so that makes sense. But the layoffs were definitely not based on performance, or even strictly on hours. Everyone is scratching their heads as to why they hit the people they hit, and there is a real sense that the Management Committee owes everyone a better explanation in that regard. What little they've told the affected people so far has been untrue on its face. It looks more like a random shooting than a reasoned business decision.

90 - raised there and family there.
-82

Milwaukee Baby! any word? rumblings at Foley and GK?

Thanks, 82. I'm sure you will get an offer and be able to move back home soon. Maybe not right now, given the economy, but soon enough. Good luck.
-88/90

Any news on Oppenheimer Wolff & Donnelly?

From the Strib online (new notices only):

Maslon Edelman Borman & Brand eliminated five administrative positions. Halleland Lewis Nilan & Johnson cut at least six jobs, including two lawyers.

Did the Faegre attorneys see this coming? I don't remember seeing them on the list of pay freezes.

35 - Any further word on Baker and Barnes? Ice going to be next? Any information would be great.

merchant and gould also rescinded 3L offers

Along with the above posters, I'm original from Minnesota but went to an out of state T20 law school. Couldn't get a job in Minnesota. I was actually surprised how well William Mitchell did for recruiting. It almost seems there was more William Mitchell grads than U of M grads at the firms I was targeting. Strange.

Faegre didn't have a pay freeze. It bumped all lawyers up as usual starting with the January paycheck. Their lawyers were told prior to bonus announcements that the bonus decisions would not be significantly different than in prior years, though whether that ended up being true is not yet known. Their bonuses are not lock step--they're all ad hoc and the process is as transparent as mud, but their lawyers seem to like it. Unless they compared penis size in late December, no one will know what the wider bonus situation looked like until their annual summit later this year.

Oh, and as of a couple of weeks ago, group heads were still being told there would be no layoffs. Management repeatedly told partners and associates no layoffs. So no, no warning. Unless you read the news, distrust the managing partners, and can do math.

82 - I don't think breaking into the MN legal market is as difficult as you make it out to be. There is strong demand for native Minnesotans who went to elite law schools out of state. For example, most of Dorsey's summer class went to law school outside of Minnesota. That said Minnesota firms put a premium on personality and fit, so that may be a factor. Also certain practice areas are not really booming these days.

Faegre is a good firm and has some very good attorneys. Wish them good luck (those staying and those asked to leave).

As a University of Minnesota student I can confirm that, as was hinted at earlier, the firms in the Twin Cities aren't prestige mongers. Not being from the Midwest, I had assumed that my degree would end up getting me in doors in town just based on its name and ranking (especially compared to the other three schools). Alas, such is not the case.

And in addition to the Faegre & Benson/Merchant & Gould news, I heard today that Patterson, Thuente, Skaar & Christensen (http://www.ptslaw.com/), a local IP boutique, has rescinded its 3L offers as well.

Good luck to all those laid off.

My fellow Americans, change is coming to America. It's true that things will get worse before they get better, but nothing good comes without hard work.

On behalf of a grateful nation, I think you for your sacrifices, and I look forward to your future contributions as productive lawyers.

Together, we can make it happen. Yes, we can. Yes, we will.

Believe in change, and change will come.

=======================================
NOTICE: I AM NOT REALLY OBAMA. THIS IS FOR ENTERTAINMENT PURPOSES ONLY. NOT NECESSARILY REPRESENTATIVE OF THE REAL OBAMA, HIS ADMINISTRATION, OR HIS AFFILIATES.
=======================================

For those of you law students out there who aren't from Minnesota and would like to move here, please note that you can get a job in this city without being from Minnesota or going to a Minneapolis law school. I did. Many of my friends and acquaintances did. All you need is a decent class rank from a decent (i.e. U.S. News first tier) law school and an ability to interview.

Don't forget connections, 107.

107, don't be a dick. Yes, it's possible. But it's not easy. It's actually easier from what I've seen to come in as a lateral from out of state, but that assumes the existence of a lateral position for which you are a good fit. There aren't a lot of those these days and there haven't been for a year.

--Minnesota lawyer from a non-Minnesota law school who has advocated for geographical outsiders during hiring decisions.

Hey 92

The hard part about Faegre's decision is that the affected individuals (at least the ones I am aware of) are great lawyers from great schools who were, by most accounts, successful in their practices.

What this says to the rest of the attorneys is unclear. One thing that will be difficult is that until now, the atmosphere at Faegre has generally been communal and collaborative. Things are going to suck when people start to get stupid (as in “well, they got rid of such and such because [insert ridiculous speculative unfounded rumor] ...”).

This news is sad for everyone in Minneapolis but If it had to happen here it was going to start at Faegre. Huge overhead (at least by Minneapolis standards), eye-popping rates, less-than-efficient staffing on matters, etc. The attorneys who were laid off are good people who were in the wrong place at the wrong time.

Next up.... Dorsey (although they had the good sense to freeze salaries this year, which may help them go a little bit longer without layoffs). After that.... Fredrickson, Briggs, and down the line.

Good luck everyone, we're all going to need it.

Most of the Mpls firms do favor natives, but they also recruit quite heavily from other schools in the Midwest.

111, do you know anything specific about Dorsey or is that just the next logical step in your mind?

112, I don't know of anything specific about Dorsey, just seems like the next logical step.

Dorsey's overhead has to be at least as high as Faegre - plus they have that new building. Plus Faegre and Dorsey's rates are about the same. I could see it taking a little longer for trouble to pop up at the second tier of firms because Faegre/Dorsey seem to charge about $50/hour more than everybody else in town. Then you have the fact that Dorsey has all their crappy offices outside of MPLS to support (i.e. NYC). I don't know that Dorsey has taken any action but you have to think it is coming. Good luck to everyone in the market and to those who were fired yesterday.

111--their overhead is huge by MN standards (tho Dorsey's must be higher as they are building owners) but their staffing has not been inefficient until the last year. Faegre's actually been staffed very leanly, with younger associates doing lots of primary drafting and arguing motions. This last year as work dried up thats changed. Now partners are keeping their claws in everything. I'm surprised the clients haven't noticed their bills now charge $500+ for shepardizing rather than paralegal rates. That's not because the paralegals got hundreds of dollars better, as great as the paralegals are.

Minnesota is not that insular at all in its hiring. My firm has hired a new associate from my school (on the coast) at least three of the last five years.

#116 - What firm do you work for?

Dorsey does not own their own building and never has (Hines owns it, I think?). They are just so badass the name of the firm is on the front of the building. They're also the best firm in town.

Two of the Merchant attorneys are 1st years. Merchant also made this comment in the Minneapolis Startribune--a low blow to its former employees who are now in the job market: "Merchant & Gould said that its job cuts were more about performance than the economy, although that did play into the equation."

118 - Dorsey is not the best firm in town. Only the best local firm. Fish & Richardson is the only sizable firm with a national practice (along with corresponding billing rates) and a NY salary. I doubt many would choose Dorsey over Fish & Richardson if they had the chance.

Dorsey definitely does NOT own the building. They DO own Minneapolis.

Fish & Richardson, Schmich & Bichardson. I don't see their name on any buildings.

Fuvk Dorsey they can suvk my big salty donkey divk

I hear Faegre fired second years. It doesn't bode well for a firm to fire first and second years. First and second years should be safe in these firing rounds, and there should be a list of firms that make such firings so that law students know which firms to stay away from.

Is it true that Faegre fired only attorneys and that staff/support roles were not touched other than those who took voluntary retirement?

http://minnlawyerblog.com/2009/02/13/faegre-hopes-expects-the-worst-is-over/

Merchant has also cancelled their entire summer program. I'm not sure how big it was to begin with but I know a few 2Ls who are SOL.

Other shoe just dropped...

#128 - what does that mean?

It means that Faegre laid off 58 additional people on thursday. It included at least two additional hourly attorney positions, some paralegals and other staff.

There might be something you don't know about their insurance. I sued them and they billed Jerome Schaefer for Mutual Insurance of Bermuda even though Mutual Insurance doesn't have a NAIC number and isn't authorized to sell insurance in the state of CO where I sued them or Minnesota or Wisconsin or Kansas or D.C. Their ex partner Christopher Beall filed in the 10th Circuit that there was no insurance after he admitted in a motion that there was insurance and sent me verified bills for Mutual Insurance and referring to the insurer. When I sued them they got judge Naughty Nottingham to order me imprisoned without stating an offense or having an evidentiary hearing. So who knows what kind of insurance they bought for themselves?

PS Comment 131 was posted by Kay Sieverding