More Firms Shorten Summer Programs, Push Back Start Dates
As we mentioned earlier this week, it looks like firms are taking a small break from layoffs to focus on people who aren’t even employed yet. 3Ls who hoped to start working this fall and 2Ls who dream about summer lunches in bunches continue to be sorely disappointed.
The latest firm to push back start dates for incoming first years is Squire Sanders. The firm confirmed the news earlier today. A firm spokesperson released this statement to Above the Law:
We moved start dates to January 19, 2010. As we have advised those affected by our decision, while this is unwelcome news, we know you are aware of the unprecedented challenges facing businesses around the world, including law firms. Though we believe our firm is well positioned in the long term to deal with the current severe economic downturn, we are not immune from it. Our client base remains a very strong one, and we are actively pursuing and achieving new opportunities. We hope to emerge from this economic downturn as an even stronger firm.
Squire Sanders was one of the original gangsters on the salary freeze front. But this time, they are rolling right along with many firms that have already pushed back start dates.
After the jump, we move onto the 2Ls.
2Ls who have been paying attention are already sharpening their claws for what should be a summer full of open competition and subtle sabotage. We expect that it’ll make for some good blogging (“My summer office-mate is trying to destroy me! Maybe ATL will post this racist email he sent to my group”). But many summers will have less time to outwit, outplay, and outlast their summer “colleagues.”
We received word today that Dechert is shortening its summer program from 12 weeks down to 10 weeks. The firm is also canceling its annual summer associate trip to London.
A firm spokesperson confirmed the news to Above the Law. In this environment, you have to look at canceling a European vacation as terribly rational. Good show ol’ chap.
Meanwhile, it appears that Pepper Hamilton also shortened its summer program. The firm declined to comment for this story. But multiple, independent sources tell us that the program has been shortened to 8 weeks long. Pepper has already greatly reduced the size of its summer class, one tipster reports that there are only 12 2009 summers, compared with 27 2008 summers.
All of these firms remain committed to honoring their outstanding offers to incoming first years and 2009 summer associates. That’s got to pass as silver lining.
Earlier: 3Ls: Welcome to the Terrordome
Prior ATL coverage of start dates
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Smells like first.
Why is there always a partner following me around with a coat hanger lately? Does this behavior have something to do with the economy?
LONDON?!? Wow, what a bubble we just went through
They have to get them in the door before I can give them their severance.
just cancel all 2009 summer programs. there is no work to give summer associates and this maybe will reduce the chance of a 3rd/4th round of associate layoffs.
There is no hope for the economy!
Smells like a great time to have a summer gig at a mid size litigation firm. My firm actually told me that I could stay as long as I want (two extra weeks moving the total to 13; thanks for the extra $5,500).
All of you BigLaw suckups and d-bags need to reevaluate, particularly after, as has been urged by legal consultants, starting salaries at BigLaw come down to circa $140k. (the same amount of coin that I will pull down while working reasonable hours).
Enjoy your 6 week summer program where only 45% of you will get offers, bitches.
Oh, did I mention I go to a T3 (or TTT in the douchey ATL parlance)?
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Dow's still up. Tell them the recession is over.
7 -
Hope you're a superstar there at your midsized firm because there are going to be thousands of people who are much more qualified than you gunning for your job. Better step up those hours and do a little "BigLaw-esque" ass-kissing, lest you be exposed as the Tier 3 hack you are.
how much did the incoming class get as a deferral payment? Seems like market is 10,000$.
Skadden canceled their famous all offices summer associate retreat in New York City.
Milbank needs to announce something already! They need to realize that the longer they wait, the worse it will be for the affected 3L's and summers...
We all know that Milbank will defer eventually, so why not get it over with!!!!
Today's jump in the Dow brings the rally tally to 6 winning sessions out of the last 7 business days. Over that time the Dow has skyrocketed an impressive 14.3% and the Fed's moves today ensure that interest rates and mortgages will fall in the near term. Recession over, recovery underway.
Are you kidding me, No. 7? What firm would pay a T3 clown $140K? My firm wouldn't allow a T3 sewer rat to walk through the door.
i wonder if sidley is taking all the summers to chicago again this year...
oh please, elie...your comment about 2Ls is totally unnecessary, gratuitous and unfounded. stop trying to engender panic in people in the hopes of creating more fodder for this piss-poor blog.
Well 14, that's just great for you and your firm but I'm sure 7 could not care less because not everyone is interested in begging and pleading for a position in a jerk-filled firm where they aren't wanted. Regardless of your sentiments, 7 still has a job! :-) Affectionately, Not 7
15- I doubt it. They just deferred the entire incoming class with no compensation for the deferral.
The Dow Is Up Guy is my hero.
Here's hoping it keeps on chugging, only 1500 more points to go until Obama is break even from were he started!
Is there a verb for this now?
You can "Latham your first years". And my British colleague and I have decided that paying only the statutorily minimum severance would be "Pipering your people." But have we verbed a proper noun yet for deferring your incoming first years and/or shortening your summer programs?
I thought about "Morganing", but that could mean either deferring your incomings or bouncing your WARN checks.
WHY DOESNT ATL DO A POST ON WHY THE "MOST PRESTIGIOUS FIRM IN THE COUNTRY"--
WACHTELL
-- HAS NOT
1- RELEASED REVENUE AND PPP
AND
2- TOLD INCOMING 1ST YEARS WHEN THEY WILL START
WHY THE SILENCE?
How can you tell that a firm is still committed to its offers to incoming associates if they don't respond to Abovethelaw?
-nervous incoming pepper associate
7 and 14--Got my start in a mid-sized firm, so no disrespect intended, but you kidding yourselves if you think you won't have to kill yourselves with hours and work with jerks just because the firm is mid-sized. Biglaw, Midlaw or Smalllaw, its all the same. The profession attracts a$$holes and thrives on workaholics. Been there. Done that.
My midsized Dallas firm is strong enough to support my 3500 sq ft, wife, and Lexis.
Buck "The Prestige" Norris
Milbank is clearly waiting to announce until AFTER the V32 march madness is over. Sneaky, but clever.
20--Get your facts straight. Morgan didn't bounce anything.
13 = 19 = least funny repeat commenter since nervous t10 1L
7 is a bigger douche than the douchiest Big Law lemmings that post on this site. And that's saying a lot. 7 is also clueless. People at Mid Law that get paid that bill A LOT. At least as much as big law brethren. Without a lot of the perks and support. And are generally much more qualified than 7 seems as well.
Skadden is offering incoming 3Ls the option doing pro bono work for Redass Lobster for 1 year.
your 3500 sq ft wife? impressive..be proud
-be cool
20 Sorry. Didn't realize you were talking about MoFo.
18 -- Deferred for one month! Poor babies need compensation for an extra month? Wahhh.
26,
You ought to let your synapses catch up with your mouth and fingers. (Or at least master the concept of the double entendre.)
http://abovethelaw.com/2009/03/anatomy_of_a_dissolution_morga.php
"Over a month ago, we reported that Morgan & Finnegan was bouncing checks to attorneys and staff..."
"M & F issued WARN checks drawn on its account with J.P Morgan Chase ("Chase") that was fully funded to cover those checks. Without prior notice to M & F, Chase froze the account and rejected the checks when they were presented for payment. The transition team has been trying to resolve this situation with Chase, both as to WARN payments and future WARN payments. But, we do not know, at this time, what the outcome of those efforts will be."
-20
Winston & Strawn just cut their program from 10 to 8 weeks.
33--To use the term Morganing lacks clarity--MoFo vs. MLB. MoFoing would be better.
what other firms haven't announced yet?
Winston has also not set start dates for its incoming first years. Paul Bearer, are you ready?
The Dow is Up Guy is my hero also.
-not 19
31/35
There is no Morgan in MoFo. MoFo is Morrison & Foerster
23 & 28: Thank you. The only thing more pathetic than a BigLaw summer drinking the kool-aid is a MidLaw summer bathing in it.
"[r]easonable hours . . . " - HAHAHAHA.
What has MoFo got to do with anything? There are two Morgans - MLB (deferrals) and Morgan & Finnegan (bounced checks).
Which firms haven't pushed start dates back? I'll start: Simpson 3Ls still start in September.
Paul Weiss still at 13 week summers and September start dates. But, it's still not as chill as Latham.
any layoffs in Bratislava?
If mid-sized litigation firms are populated by girls like 7, I'm glad I'm not headed to a mid-sized litigation firm.
dechert hasn't pushed start dates back, yet.
Milbank has given us a start date (mid October), so I don't know what the problem is. Also summer program still at 12 weeks.
how do you "achieve an opportunity"?
jones day september start date
Dechert sounds like squirrel farts.
how bout them Konigsburg layoffs?
above the law is dead or dying - it's like a recession, you're not 100% sure until a couple months after the fact.
The only things that are bigger than biglaw are my balls.
The less of you young little idiots to screw up the only heavy duty stapler on my floor, the better.
ParaLegal.
why would you think having a september start date is a good thing-- your firm isnt gonna need you- it should push back your start date.
Anyone know if Ropes and Gray will be deferring incoming associates?
I hope they push back your start dates until I win the powerball and can tell you all what freaking morons you are.
ParaLegal.
We are all so fucked. First they will push back, and then....they will revoke.
The smart firms are those whose reaction to the economic downturn has been to structure layoffs in a manner designed to replicate their normally expected attrition, focusing principally on 3--7 year associates rather than 1st or 2nd years. Summer programs can be toned down and shortened, and 3L start dates staggered between October--January, with some stipends for those whose start date is deferred. There's been far to much panicking by firms who are taking ill considered actions when they see billings and collections declining by 10--20% or so in the depths of the recession and are fearful Armageddon (ppp declining below $1 million) is at the door. Yes, the economic model of BigLaw is changing, but firms are inflicting to much self damage in terms of their culture, associate morale and future talent pool by taking precipitous action without a more reflective assessment of their future, and that of the economy.
21 -
It's located immediately to the left of the "A" key on your keyboard.
Try it sometime.
no start date as of yet at Allen & Overy
Where's the Paul Weiss love on ATL?
Document review at shiTTThole Paul Weiss is the 6th circle of Hell.
JDU STUD
56 - no.
24 - your lexis? as in westlaw? or do you mean your lexus... bc clearly you must not own one
still no word on official start dates at Baker Botts
milbank might push back, but everything is on hold for one big announcement. I'm guessing the debate is currently about pure layoffs (and what severance to give) versus continued stealth and perhaps a skadden-type public interest stipend. The problem is probably that it is hard to gauge the numbers either way.
my personal opinion: start dates get pumped to Jan. 1, one more round of "performance" layoffs, and a public interest deferment program.
67 - how slow are things there? Why/how are you so sure start dates will be pushed back?
Howrey has not yet conducted layoffs or changed start dates for incoming associates
The Milbank Promise remains.
64 - How do you know? And is R&G going to push people back from their announced Sept start dates?
69 -- that's because Howrey is among the worst managed firms in the world
Winston completed its stealth layoff back in Feb. It included partners and associates. They hired way too many '08 summers. These people are arriving in the fall and there needs to be work for them.
I don't know if there is going to be another partner dump, but I do see another lay off of associates in the next month or two. Depending on how this shakes out, the new class (current 3L's) will start in September. If they opt against a public layoff, the '08 summers will definitely not be starting on 2009.
I believe that March is when the points knife fight starts among the partners. After this is done, we will know more about W&S's staffing plans.
GP Boston should just get er done and offer incoming associates a Skadden-like deferral option. It would be better than a 3 month delay with no compensation. Why would three months make a difference when there are over 120 new associates waiting to start? It would probably be better to have everyone start in phases.
I love all these 2L's testifying to the health of firm management on this website. Dude, get a life and Shut the fuck up. You know nothing. Hell, even associates don't know how well managed a firm is often. YOU as an incoming summer officially know absolutely nothing.
God damn, you all piss me the fuck off. Next thing you know, someone will say this comment is TTT. . . . har-de-har-har!! You're so freakin clever!
Last fall some firms announced September start dates - and have not pushed them back yet. I have heard reports from classmates of Ropes & Gray, Foley & Lardner, and Howrey doing this. But it seems like the rational move is to push start dates back to Jan. Isn't this an easy way for a firm to save money?
What the fuck does TTT stand for?
75, I would wager even the partners in charge of poorly managed firms don't know how well their firms are managed... So that covers everyone in the spectrum, so no one knows for sure? But we can all look at extrinsic evidence and make evaluations and judgments.
BTW your comment was TTT
HTH
TTT = Top Tier Talent
TTT = Transparent Tasty Thongs
Are the stealth layoffs at Kirkland discussed a few weeks back still ongoing?
73 -- what evidence do you have to support your claims of layoffs at Winston??
Ropes...are you pushing us back?
I hope they cut ALL the summers. We should be hiring laid off laterals, NOT newbies...
This blows. Without a deferral stipend, I'm going to have to find some shit minimum wage job to live on until I start. Nothing like working minimum wage with a 160k/yr offer in your pocket. Not that I'm above working for shit pay, but fuck...
Winston and Mayer are both going to lay off associates soon.
I will sell my offer for $40,000... one less new associate to worry about... once I receive the money, I will rescind my acceptance.
Walmart is hiring greeters... might be a good part-time job to pay the bills until we all start in 2015... what better way to spend your time then to help customers live better lives... http://walmartstores.com/Careers/7739.aspx
seriously, check it out. We can still be associates at walmart and just like law firms, they will help us "reach our own personal goals through opportunity that is unmatched at any other firm and through training and development programs that can help you take that next step in your career."
86, what is your basis for asserting that Winston and Mayer Brown will be laying off associates? I thought they had already downsized.
81- You won't hear anything out of them until after the office move.
75- wasting your time with these jabronis
and fuck people, the lexis joke is old, recognize it. I cant handle any new 1L's trying to correct him. Im going to snap
The stealth layoffs imagined at Kirkland are ongoing. A few equity partners are being terminated each month.
92- Yes, they are, again you just wont hear anything until after the move, and it will probably be a short note released on a sunny, early summer, friday that has a cubs home game. If I felt like looking up the schedule I could probably pick the exact date for you.
10 - I know SSD is giving $10k to pushbacked incoming first years.
A lot of you are living in a fantasy world if you believe that after being "pushbacked" you will be starting some kind of employment with these firms. This is just postponement of the inevitable.
95 = 3L with no job offer, and just jealous and bitter.
Guys in my high school used to shorten summer programs all the time. Twas no big deal.
75--Regardless of whether comments are posted by 2Ls, 3Ls, associates or partners, they are worth reading if thought through. If your post is an example of your writing style, I suspect you spend some time standing behind Roxanna in the bread line.
WInston tipster here. I worked there for years (in house now) and have friends who are partners. The last batch of layoffs were timed with the performance reviews. People were given three months. About 100 or so people were fired, and roughly 35 of them were partners. They have until the end of April to leave.
Does anyone actually know anything legitimate about GP Boston? All I've heard are rumors and guesses. Nothing official announced so unless you are RP, MK or some other high-up partner, I can't imagine how you'd know anything.
85: You should count your blessings, gladly take that minimum wage job, and pray to the sky above that you still have a $160k job come January. Remember, your one phone call away from being over-qualified for that minimum wage job and unable to get any other job.
93, not my office. It's certainly possible. But from what I hear from the mid-levels and NSPs I know in Chicago, I think you're wrong.
98 - 1L who thinks his opinion matters. HA !!!!
The Howrey partner retreat is happening as we speak. If Howrey is going to do layoffs or defer start dates, I suspect these actions will take place next week when all the big dicks return to the office.
Attn Summers:
Do not be a pain in the ass this summer. You do not want your reputation to be the guy/girl who asked for any special arrangements , complained about work assignments or , god forbid, asked for an extension and were seen at recent events. Keep your head down, finish all assignments quickly , attend a few events and all trainings and don't ask for any exception on your dates, splitting, etc. In years passed, if the hiring partner was on the fence about you because you always seemed to be manipulating the program, he/she might hire you anyway. This year, if you are in any way borderline or just a little twerp, you won't get an offer.
Attn Summers:
Do not be a pain in the ass this summer. You do not want your reputation to be the guy/girl who asked for any special arrangements , complained about work assignments or , god forbid, asked for an extension and were seen at recent events. Keep your head down, finish all assignments quickly , attend a few events and all trainings and don't ask for any exception on your dates, splitting, etc. In years passed, if the hiring partner was on the fence about you because you always seemed to be manipulating the program, he/she might hire you anyway. This year, if you are in any way borderline or just a little twerp, you won't get an offer.
Attn Summers:
Do not be a pain in the ass this summer. You do not want your reputation to be the guy/girl who asked for any special arrangements , complained about work assignments or , god forbid, asked for an extension and were seen at recent events. Keep your head down, finish all assignments quickly , attend a few events and all trainings and don't ask for any exception on your dates, splitting, etc. In years passed, if the hiring partner was on the fence about you because you always seemed to be manipulating the program, he/she might hire you anyway. This year, if you are in any way borderline or just a little twerp, you won't get an offer.