No bailouts.

Makes a hell of a lot more sense than the mortgage bailout and probably would be cheaper.

Recession is over (see Dow) so no need.

Such bailout is urgently needed indeed for those 3Ls without offers and recently laid-off junior associates. May the Lord preserve them.

I would like to issue an apology for the ruminations on this internet weblog of a Mr. Chester Shackleford, perhaps better known to you as "Partner Emeritus". While the Firm, as an acknowledgment of Mr. Shackleford's past contributions to the Firm (from September 1947 to March 1979), permits him periodic access to the Firm's common areas, he holds no official title with the Firm and is not permitted to make representations to the contrary. On behalf of the Firm, I wish to offer my sincere gratitude for your kindness and generousity in providing Mr. Shackleford with a warm and nurturing environment. He will not trouble you again.

Suggested Obama portfolio:

SLM - short
STU - short
TBT - long
PST - long

No bailout for you. If you can't pay for $150k at HYS, then you can't attend. Doesn't matter how bright you are. Go to a school where you'll get the SAME legal education for a fraction of the price. And yes, all top 100 schools are, if you strip away the pedigree and the trademark babble, the same.

Student loan debt used to be dischargeable in bankruptcy until a bunch of medical residents in the early 80's filed bankruptcy just before they started getting paid decent salaries as doctors. The potential for abuse is still just as problematic.

Waste of a post unless Elie really sends this in. Unless, of course, Elie takes some initiative and exploits his resources by getting a petition started on ATL.

You must be fucking kidding me. This is the most absurd plea I've ever read.

TL;DR

Waste of a post unless Elie really sends this in. Unless, of course, Elie takes some initiative and exploits his resources by getting a petition started on ATL.

Absurd. This letter seems to say that someone making under $150k can't pay back their loans. You mean to tell me that, on a $145k salary, you can't pay back loans? What kind of cock cake are you?

I'm all for loan forgiveness programs for government attorneys and public interest attorneys, but otherwise its ridiculous.

Why $150,000? I make more than that, and let me tell you, student debt really cramps my style. If my husband and I didn't have to pay our student debt, we would be able to buy a house, thus stimulating the economy.

Wage garnishment limits are effectively a government bailout. They should be able to take 80% of what you earn, with criminal penalties for nonreporting of "under the table" income.

@8: Bailing out honest students who bought in the system seems better than bailing out unscrupulous home-buyers who tried to cheat it.

Though my education WAS no money down.... and I did see a huge raise in my monthly payments one cold December.

Student loan debtors should fare very well in the upcoming hyperinflationary period. Just be glad that when this hit you did not have any savings, as much of those would have been wiped out by now as they have for many of us. So quit yer bellyachin'

Dumb.

Co-signed. Since September of my second year of law school I've had a 6 figure biglaw job lined up. Before I even enrolled in law school, I read that my school, which is considered a top law school by most, had a median starting 6 figure starting salary. Up until my layoff a couple weeks ago, the debt seemed to be worht it.

I didn't know when I was taking on this debt that I was going to be laid off after only a few months in along with half of my class. There is just about nothing in the way of job options right now, and no firms are offering first years 6 figures, which is basically what I need to make to pay off my loans. My loans are at 4 and 6% right now, so yah, I can defer them, but they'll probably be at 200k a year or 2 from now. Considering that biglaw may never come back, and the glut of laid off associates, I don't know how I'll ever be able to manage them.

-suicidal laid off 1st year

EliTTTE

Elie, why should others subsidize your bad choices? If the govt. forgives your debt, they have to get the money for roads, bridges, welfare, etc. from those who made the right, albeit less glamorous, choices (e.g., gainfully employed and productive engineers, scientists, short order cooks, shoe salespeople,etc.). I propose you go to trade school, learn how to actually create/fix something and then ask that the govt. grant you an extended payment plan.

once again, a recidivist policy proposal that privileges people who took out loans they couldn't afford and/or lived beyond their means at the expense of people who budgeted carefully, worked their asses off to pay for school and then paid back loans as quickly as possible. why does "populism" have to be synonymous with "stupidity?" rather than wiping out unpaid student debt, shouldn't we instead be focused on making high-quality education more affordable? if that means offering a blanket tax credit to those who attended law school, then so be it. but discriminating against fiscally responsible graduates who borrowed as little as possible and lived within their means is not only unfair, but economically foolish. by wiping out the $150k in student debt that the big-spender in my law school class racked up, all we do is encourage more of the same behavior that created the credit bubble in the first place.
a modicum of sanity would be appreciated.

Let's refrain from posting pointless stories. This one, for example, accomplishes nothing. It is NOT sofa king awesome.

Elie, please stop sucking at this.

Unfortunately, once the first bailout was approved, there was no longer any good reason to say no to anyone who wants their share. If the banks, why not AIG? If AIG, why not GM? If GM, why not homeowners? If homeowners, why not student debt? If student debt, why not medical bills? If medical bills, why not car loans? If car loans, why not credit card debt? If you, why not me?

Unfortunately, having started with the bailouts, there is no principled way to say when to stop. There's no clear, bright-line that objectively establishes who "deserves" one and who doesn't.

So either the federal government bails out the entire country and bankrupts itself (and everyone else) in the process, or it says sorry guys, no it's not fair but we're done.

A great mess Messrs. Bush and Paulson left behind. And a fine job Messrs. Obama and Geithner have done in spreading it around.

That said, I can't imagine what it's like for those with six-figure loans and what are starting to look like no prospects of ever paying it back. God help them.

signed,
A Canadian with no debt and no dog in this fight (except, ideally, the global economy not collapsing)

No one wants to hear the news anymore. It's the same every day. I need a bailout. I'm very important. I have many leather-bound books and my apartment smells of rich mahogany.

Bacardi and Cola.
DO IT DO IT.

What an IDIOT! No wonder you are unemployed.

Bailout. Forgive my debt. Honor is overrated.

22: btw how was going to a good law a bad choice? tool.

- that nervous 1L fellow.

Remember when the government was bailing out 9/11 victims? Something like a $20 billion fund. Why did we do that, exactly?

I took a full scholarship to law school A instead of attending more prestigious law school B so I wouldn't graduate with a mountain of loans.

These bailouts keep punishing the people who made similar decisions (buying the house they could afford rather than the big mansion, etc).

you know what you got yourself into when you took out X amount of loans.

22, I have had a six figure biglaw job lined up since September of my second year of law school. I also attended a top school with a median starting salary that's in the six figures.

I didn't have a crystal ball showing me that I'd be laid off along with half my class after only a few months working at my firm. The market is terrible right now and me and the other laid off first years may NEVER find jobs that can service our 6 figure debt. We need help you heartless bastard. We're not the octo-mom, this actually made financial sense when we took on the obligation.

Besides, do you think the economy is ever going to come back with people so burdened by debt? People with huge debts can't spend and consumer spending is essential to the US economy.

-suicidal laid off 1st year

I love, just love, how in this country folks on welfare get food, insurance, rent, unemployment, etc. and don't have to pay back one damn dime, but if you go out and get an education, the government wants all the money they lent to you back with interest.

And no, the "but you pay the money back to help the next generation" argument is not applicable. If that were the true case, then why not have the poor people pay back what they took for the next generation of Big Brother teet-sucking m-effs. To counter your next argument about how they can't pay it back, let's ask a recently-laid off BigLaw associate how well their repayment plan is working out for them.

I swear, it's like there's a penalty for success in this country. I don't know why the most motivated, successful and ambitious people have to pay out the nose for all the lazy, good-for-nothing pieces of shit in this country who are too proud to go out and get a landscaping/burger-flipping job. I have no problem paying taxes for public goods or, better yet, to subsidize education or to help the truly needy (I'm talking handicapped people).

But I guess you've got to keep the poor folks fat, stupid and happy. Otherwise, they just might not do the shitty work we could easily send to Mexico, China, *insert foreign country not filled with entitled douchebags here* for 1/4 of the cost, and they won't vote Democrat. I hope Barack is almost done restoring enough confidence in the economy so all of our best and brightest can go back to buying big screens, rims, houses, etc. that they can't afford.

I guess I'll just keeping sending in my loan repayment checks with the memo reading:

"For: Actually Adding Value to Society"

there's no difference between the asshole who bought a house knowing he/she couldn't afford it and the people here pleading ignorance/crying uncle as to their undergrad/grad student loans.

nobody has any sympathy for you, especially if you passed up in-state tuition for the "unique life experience" of some over-priced private school; said f-you to that part-time work-study job that would've made your debt somewhat manageable; went to the club every other day of the week and spent money like a drunken sailor; or had that "life-changing experience" during your spring break trip to cabo/europe/cancun/DR.

there are people who passed that shit up and went to the student loan trough for a manageable amount. on behalf of them, please go sit on an upside down stool.

STFU you f#$%ing whining babies. JHC on a popsicle stick!

Channeling James Lipton on Inside the Actor's Studio for my favorite curse words, Goral and Applebaum and Douchebags, Twats and Wankers!

Stop being such a bunch of whiny hippies. You assumed the risk when you took out the loan. Stop complaining and pay back your loans. What a fucking joke!

Kids take out the same loans to go into industries that are far less lucrative than the law, and they aren't complaining.

Your parents should have worked harder so they could pay for your education.

PATHETIC!

I can see why Obama's liberal agenda dominated in this past election cycle. Free shit for everyone!

34 --- i agree 1000%

Our dumbass of a president is CAUSING our problems.

So I really don't see asking him to pay off my JD as helping. He's already proven incompetent.

Makes total sense...but wait, why would this government reward success and those that are doing the right thing by obtaining an education when they can just give more and more to all the dumbass failures in this country. If only we lived in a rational world...

22, I have had a six figure biglaw job lined up since September of my second year of law school. I also attended a top school with a median starting salary that's in the six figures.

I didn't have a crystal ball showing me that I'd be laid off along with half my class after only a few months working at my firm. The market is terrible right now and me and the other laid off first years may NEVER find jobs that can service our 6 figure debt. We need help you heartless bastard. We're not the octo-mom, this actually made financial sense when we took on the obligation.

Besides, do you think the economy is ever going to come back with people so burdened by debt? People with huge debts can't spend and consumer spending is essential to the US economy.

-suicidal laid off 1st year

You know, we could just kill ourselves and the debt still won't get repaid. Then society won't even get the benefit of our labor. Suicide's looking like a better and better every day.

38 says it all. Great post.

Uggh. The last thing the world needs is more unemployable lawyers. Or PhDs in ancient languages. Give us a break - no bailout.

How do I know if I am prestigious?

if obama does this i'm taking $70,000 in student loan debt next year instead of $8,500. idiots.

should have considered what your worst case scenario is and whether you can service your debt payments at that level before levering up.

what would this mean practically speaking?

-- pay off everyone's student loans no matter what field and what degree? so... could you basically go to college on the 7 year plan and F-around on the govt's dime? would this only cover graduate degrees? encourage everyone to go to school for free?

-- when would this go into effect? would it help this year's 3Ls? next years? what about people going to school in 2 years? would it become a ton more competitive to get into these schools?

-- i guess merit scholarships would mean nothing since school would be free for everyone?

-- where would all of this money come from?

This is a tough call. I graduated from college with a 4.0 and a great resume re leadership/public service, I scored in the 99th-percentile on my LSAT, and I went to what I think is considered a second tier school (Top 20, but barely) on an 80% tuition scholarship instead of trying for Harvard & Co. I only took out Stafford (no interest for six months after graduation) loans, and I paid off 2/3 of them right when interest started accumulating.

I made all of these decisions because they seemed prudent, if not as sexy as my alternatives. I don't want to be a Supreme Court clerk or a professor, and I knew that graduating in the top 5% of my class would put me in a top firm (and it did) alongside my Harvard colleagues, so that's what I did. At this point, I would be pretty upset to find out that I should have thrown caution to the wind because all debts are erased.

The bank bailouts are not relevant to this discussion. However much we hate the banks, our economy will fail (see: Dow 0) if our banks fail. Almost everyone who understands what moves our economy recognizes this. Failure to forgive student debt will not destroy the economy. We don't spend much anyhow (less likely to have kids, buy expensive cars, etc.), and MOST of us are finding and keeping good jobs.

That said, I do have sympathy for those with massive debt and no idea what to do with it. If there were some way of offering partial forgiveness for those who have been fired without cause, I probably wouldn't oppose that. But practically speaking, I don't know how those people could be easily targeted.

32,

The best solution here would be, IMO, to treat student loans like any other debt for purposes of bankruptcy. And if we're worried about banks not extending the loans if they're dischargeable, a waiver would take care of that.

34: In fairness, taking out a loan that made financial sense in any economy other than this one (which no one, not even Nouriel Roubini, saw coming) is not quite the same as buying a home you KNOW you can't afford.

Look at it from the lender's point of view: the bank is just as stupid as the borrower for loaning money to someone who obviously couldn't afford that big a mortgage. But the bank, like everyone else, expected a law student to be able to repay big loans based on a high salary.

Not that this is reason enough to bail them out, but it's not fair to call them student.

-25

You take off my jacket!

"The young, educated, elites that put you into office. "

hahahahahahhahahahahahaha!!!!!

"But, it looks like America is not holding up her end of the bargain."

ROFLMAO!! Oh, you are just kiling me.

Dumb "elite." You and your sense of self-entitlement.

Earth to elite -- the world and the nation owe you nothing. Get over yourself.

And when Obama's done, you are going to owe the nation another few trillion dollars.

this argument is obviously stupid. but its not more stupid than bailing out car companies and homebuyers who made decisions that didn't pan out.

22, you should take the silver spoon your parents fed you with and shove it up your ass. Tell Mommy I said Hi.

"The young, educated, elites that put you into office. "

hahahahahahhahahahahahaha!!!!!

"But, it looks like America is not holding up her end of the bargain."

ROFLMAO!! Oh, you are just kiling me.

Dumb "elite." You and your sense of self-entitlement.

Earth to elite -- the world and the nation owe you nothing. Get over yourself.

And when Obama's done, you are going to owe the nation another few trillion dollars.

What is the total amount of student loans outstanding at present?

47, I am in a nearly identical position and would feel the same way.

Um, that should say "call them stupid"

How stupid of me.

- 48

18 despite government spending there is not going to be hyperinflation anytime soon. We don't have the growth for it. We may even be looking at another lost decade, but if not that, then at least a lost 3-5 years.

-suidical laid off 1st year

The answer is simple.

Don't pay back the loan. Fuck 'em.

Buy land or a home from a private party on a no qualifying loan.

Learn to surf, fly, and make good drinks.

When did this nation's public policy go from "we'll fight to protect your right do what you want" to "we'll give you whatever you want."

This started with GW's awful, blatant attempts to buy back the poor people with his tax rebate bullshit and horrendous stimulus plan idea, and BO is going right along with it.

Does anyone else find it rich that Barack is saying that we won't continue failed policy while doing THE EXACT FUCKING THING GW WAS DOING BEFORE HE LEFT OFFICE???!!!! Get a clue, loaning money to ourselves is not going to fix this economy. Oh, and just FYI, FUCKING SPENDING MORE THAN WE HAD CAUSED THIS WHOLE ISSUE!. Stop trying to promote even more dubious growth in the GDP with these bullshit measures. People might, just might, have to (dare I say it) LIVE WITHIN THEIR FUCKING MEANS.

Unlike the auto and banking industries (where a group failure could have a drastic impact on the economy as a whole), I happen to think the idea of a significant number of attorneys walking the street burdened by absurd levels of debt is a positive thing. What is the downside and why would anyone care?

So you are going to carry debt that you can't pay off until you die, because you made a gamble on an absurd and unsustainable BigLaw salary.

Seeing the pain in these parts is the one positive to this economic downturn.

"Your parents should have worked harder so they could pay for your education."

36 you feudalistic piece of shit, what happens to me should have nothing to do with what my parents have done. I fucking hate people like you.

Lawyers are so lame that they don't know this is a joke? It's a joke, guys! We know that no one will ever bail us out. But, to do my part for the world, I tell everyone I know not to be a lawyer. Cause paying off 100K+ isn't so hard if you earn a top tier, big law firm salary.. the problem is that 90% of attorneys don't earn that much and they still have to pay back these loans. And I was a prudent one. I got a scholarship and everything... but my loan payment is still more than my morgage payment. Oh well. Stupid profession, lame peers. I hope I get it right in the next life.

Lawyers are so lame that they don't know this is a joke? It's a joke, guys! We know that no one will ever bail us out. But, to do my part for the world, I tell everyone I know not to be a lawyer. Cause paying off 100K+ isn't so hard if you earn a top tier, big law firm salary.. the problem is that 90% of attorneys don't earn that much and they still have to pay back these loans. And I was a prudent one. I got a scholarship and everything... but my loan payment is still more than my morgage payment. Oh well. Stupid profession, lame peers. I hope I get it right in the next life.

That's like homeowners saying "yes, I got a WAY more expensive house than I could afford but I thought the market would keep going up so it's not my fault..." Taking out a loan for a house or an education is a risk. Why should people who went to Berkeley or UCLA and got out of law school w/ very little debt have to pay for those who went to Harvard or Yale? Like many of Obama's policies (and I voted for him so I'm not a hater), it rewards the irresponsible at the expense of the responsible.
If someone came up w/ a plan where one does public service work to discharge the debt, that would be more reasonable. They have programs like that for teachers, I think

64 you stupid fucktard, people from UCLA and Berkeley have six figure debt. You obviously went when the schools still cost under 10k. Tuition at both schools already has, or is about to go up to 41k. Plus cost of living is pretty high in both areas.

Fucking prick. Think before you speak.

I am offended by the rampant racism on this blog.

Paying off the absurd student loans required to pay the absurdly high tuition for top law schools only adds incentive for those schools to increase tuition further.

A law school requires nothing more than faculty, a few bricks, and a few books. You are already getting ripped off paying $60k+ a year. Don't make it an option for that amount to go even higher.

Quit all the whining. Those of you who are too poor to fund your education shouldn't have gone to law school. Since you were lucky enough to have a government stupid enough to make this kind of opportunity possible for you take what you've learned and make something happen. Fu@@ all the bullsh@@ it's time to get paid!

Fair enough -- forgive the debt -- you surrender the JD -- go do something you can afford
Offer open to all Law School grads from the last 3yrs.
Reduces supply -- prices (wages go up)
Next time make better choices

Just like a negro to look for another hand out. Just because you got a ticket doesn't mean you deserve a free ride.

So you want me to be punished for having the means to PAY for my education? Meanwhile, you take up a spot you didn't deserve and can't pay for, then have the nerve to ask for ANOTHER HANDOUT. Pretty stereotypical. Just like your people to beg for a handout and then renig on your obligations. You are filthy, worthless, lazy, scum.

-The Prestigious Southerner

47 - hear, hear.

36 - hear, hear.

61 - you disgust me. combine 47 and 61 you idiot. feudalistic? how about this is the way the game is played. if you couldn't afford law school, live in your parents basement and get a scholarship to minimize your debt-load. i sure as hell don't want to be paying your loans.

Something tells me there is not going to be the political will to bailout lawyers. It has to do with the way people hate us. If we could sing, or hoop, or build cabinets, or do math, or add value to the economy, things might be different. A nice idea, but it has no legs.

45 if everyone made decisions based on the worst case scenario then no one would ever take risks you stupid fuck hole. Most people consider the expected value. If you don't know what that is, look it up bitch.

yes lets reward poor planning and punish those who self-funded their educations

I understand why many think that this general idea is unfair, and I don't disagree to a certain extent, but something needs to be done to reduce the paralysis.

The country needs to push reset. You don't get complete forgiveness, but you get a lower interest rate and some percent of your balance knocked off. Same with mortgages.

Can't pay back student loans? Join the military. It is starting look more enticing each day.

Folks, you've already been given a bailout. Here goes:

Step 1: Get a Ford Direct Loan

Step 2: Get on the income contingent repayment plan.

Step 3: Pay nothing because you have no income.

Step 4: Have your debt forgiven after 25 years .

Now, if you actually start making more than a living wage between Step 3 and Step 4, then you'll be back in repayment status, but in that case you didn't really need a bailout anyway, did you?

74, shut the fuck up you stupid ass. What 22 year old has the money to self fund their education you little bitch. What that means to most people is mommy and daddy paid. A lucky few got full rides but most people don't get that.

And it wasn't a poor decision for a lot of us. How the fuck were we supposed to know this was going to happen.

Die slowly and painfully.

people who are attacking this girl are being ridiculous. This "letter" is clearly satire commenting on how ridiculous it is that the government is just giving bailout money to company after company who proved they don't deserve to exist anymore anyway. If you are going to reward bad behavior why not give students a break too? It is a slippery slope this bailout business and people have a hard time feeling good about writing a check to the federal government for their loans when they see how retardly the government continues to spend that money.

people who are attacking this girl are being ridiculous. This "letter" is clearly satire commenting on how ridiculous it is that the government is just giving bailout money to company after company who proved they don't deserve to exist anymore anyway. If you are going to reward bad behavior why not give students a break too? It is a slippery slope this bailout business and people have a hard time feeling good about writing a check to the federal government for their loans when they see how retardedly the government continues to spend that money.

73:

you need to be able to service your debt on a worst case scenario. you (reasonably) plan for the expected value you stupid fuck hole.

- 45

The NY Times had an article a few days ago about graduate students complaining they had no job prospects. The representative students had advanced degrees in Sociology and Islamic Studies, respectively. Yet somehow they can't get jobs! What were the odds?!

And besides, you elected a socialist who demonstrably hates capitalism, and ran on a platform of "change" that was so subjective that you could ask 20 people what he meant and get 20 different answers. What did you expect would happen? Free ponies for everybody? Your only "hope" for "change" is that when Obama finally spins up his $100 bill printing presses inflation jumps to Zimbabwean levels and outpaces the usurious rates you stupidly agreed to on your student loans when all you could think about was a bar trip to Europe and that shiny new laptop. Otherwise you might as well tie your Kindle 1 and Kindle 2 to your feet and throw yourself off a bridge.

I wish that more people would post about how fiscally prudent they were by accepting a scholarship at a lesser institution.

Those posts are very enlightening. We could all really learn smoething from those people. Really.

You can't cancel student loan debt in bankruptcy.

Otherwise everyone that goes to med school (and law school for that matter) would just rack up all of the school debt they could, declare as soon as they graduate., and the start making money after that and be debt free. Sure your credit would suck but you'd have enough cash flow that it wouldn't matter then.

71, first of all go fuck yourself. secondly I CAN'T repay these loans, and they're FEDERALLY GUARANTEED, so YOU will be repaying them regardless of whether there's student loan forgiveness or not.

the variable is whether I stay in this country, remain alive, and contribute in some way to society. either way you're on the hook you dumb bitch.

One option is to allow borrowers to consolidate private student loans at rates and terms similar to those available through the public student loan consolidation programs offered by the federal government. If I could get 2.875% on my 6 figure private student loan balance, I would be in a much better place.

75-

NO. This nation has turned into a bunch of whingeing pussies. People need to learn how to man up and take the hit when they fuck up. If I had just one wish, it would be that the baby-boomer generation hadn't come out as the biggest spoiled brats this world has ever seen, including my parents. I wish my grandparents would have beaten the shit out of them more. This is the real reason why Europeans hate us, not because we don't call our clubs discotheques, don't have socialism or don't fuck dudes.

People are such fucking pussies nowadays. Guys look like girls, people cry when the slightest thing goes wrong. We have a guy (The Bachelor) on national TV crying as if (the only acceptable reason) he had just been hit in the scrotum dead-on with a sledgehammer. People don't have the testicular fortitude to just say "I fucked up. Damn, this sucks, but I need to move on." Oh no, it's someone else's fault. We're the most specialist people ever, just like mommy and daddy said!

Maybe this recession will teach people how to toughen up. I'm fucking sick of living in a nation full of entitled, spoiled, politically-correct douchebags. GROW A FUCKING PAIR.

Student loans are a scam. They provide funding to those who can't afford higher education, forever tethering the graduates to loan payments. The result is the dilution of a college, post-college degree. Plus, a nation of demoralized citizens over how much debt they incurred to pursue careers that don't always pan out. And what have the nation's colleges done in response? Increased tuition beyond the pace of the rest of the economy. Why? Because the "customers" were financing everything. Just like housing prices sky-rocketed when money became so cheap.

I maxed out my children's 529's the first few years of their lives. Frontloaded the investment hoping that compounding interest would do most of the work. Now the "pay me" generation wants to be excused from their loans because its just too hard. Am I one of the only suckers that actually forgoes immediate-gratification consumption to take care of my family?

Any I have no student loans. My parents worked their butts off and saved, they didn’t have college degrees. I'm doing the same for my children.

84,

Really? I didn't know that bankruptcy courts discharge all your debt just because you ask them to. I thought you had to convince them to do it. Silly me.

You can't spell elite without Elie.

Here's a thought - if no one will give you a job, give yourself a job and start your own firm. BIGLAW is closed to you for now, regardless of your pedigree. You'll probably respond that you don't know jack shit about practicing law, so that's not a practical idea. You expected BIGLAW to teach you this essential skill. But you knew or should have known that BIGLAW isn't in the business of teaching associates how to practice law. You hoped that you could coast for a few years of big $$$ paychecks for doing monkey-scribe work. At least you would have most of your student loans paid off when BIGLAW showed you the door (or you quit to write the Great American Novel, find yourself, etc...)

Now is the time to learn how to hustle. BIGLAW may reopen to you once you have a book of business. Assuming you're reasonably smart, you may come to the realization that once you have a book of business, you don't need to share it with BIGLAW.

Keep in mind that if you parents c-signed your loans, and you commit suicide or otherwise die, they are on the hook for your loans.

This really is a good idea and makes a ton of sense to include people making under 250K. Think of someone who took out full loans to attend a top 25 law school who is now working in biglaw. The monthly loan payments are likely in the 1200/month range. If you freed up 1200/month in spending for these young (and still dumb) lawyers many would buy homes, stock, electronics, lots of beer, or all of the above. This bailout plan is much better than throwing money at mortgages for people that may or may not have a college degree and may have just been laid off from the cushy union job that lasted 5 years longer than it really should have (I'm looking at you GM and Ford).

Dear generation Y:

This is your wakeup call. It's been a lot of fun overindulging you and making sure each of you got a trophy. However, now it is time for you to actually compete and earn your way. Perhaps you should be grateful at how unbelievably coddled you have been, rather than upset that the gravy train is now over. Throw all the temper tantrums you want; they will avail you nothing. The good news is that the Army is always hiring.

Love,
America

88, educational access should be tied to the ability and initiative of the individual, not their parents, fuckface.

Damn right 87. Except that a lot of those Europeans guys look like girls too. What's even worse is that the next generation of college student swill be worse than the ones now getting out.

-Glad that his parents beat some sense into him

Let's get real...

Let people default en masse on their student debt. Then student debt might get priced according to value of the risk relative to he/she who takes it out. 1L debt should always be the most expensive, and then it becomes easier to figure out who the better risks are. If people can't get the $150K to go to the Touros, Cooleys, Regents and Quinnepiacs of the world, where no one makes six figures coming out, these schools might just go out of business as they should. Accordingly, there will be fewer new JDs every year and the rate of unemployed attys will go down and those with JDs will be a more valuable commodity.

Go one step further, you can refi at a lower rate if your income jumps tremendously after a year or two of practicing.

Thank about it...

I got in-state tuition for UCLA and still have a mountain of debt...

If the economy hadn't collapsed and BigLaw hadn't started laying off 1st and 2nd years, the debt wouldn't have been an issue.

So STOP comparing recent JD grads to those who bought a house when they very well **knew** they wouldn't be able to afford it, period. Those people did not have a plan, did not have BigLaw jobs.

We WERE able to afford all this debt, it's only because of the recent BigLaw butchery that we can't. It's not the same situation as the homeowners.

84: You can have your debt discharged if you show undue hardship. In the past that has been very hard to do, but my guess is that going forward courts will become more open to it.

I got in-state tuition for UCLA and still have a mountain of debt...

If the economy hadn't collapsed and BigLaw hadn't started laying off 1st and 2nd years, the debt wouldn't have been an issue.

So STOP comparing recent JD grads to those who bought a house when they very well **knew** they wouldn't be able to afford it, period. Those people did not have a plan, did not have BigLaw jobs.

We WERE able to afford all this debt, it's only because of the recent BigLaw butchery that we can't. It's not the same situation as the homeowners.

92, no one co-signed for me, just the federal gov't.

I got in-state tuition for UCLA and still have a mountain of debt...

If the economy hadn't collapsed and BigLaw hadn't started laying off 1st and 2nd years, the debt wouldn't have been an issue.

So STOP comparing recent JD grads to those who bought a house when they very well **knew** they wouldn't be able to afford it, period. Those people did not have a plan, did not have BigLaw jobs.

We WERE able to afford all this debt, it's only because of the recent BigLaw butchery that we can't. It's not the same situation as the homeowners.

i hope this is a joke, but 4 of my facebook friends keep linking to it repeatedly so maybe not...

i COMPLETELY disagree with wiping out all student loans for a lot of the reasons stated above. however, i WOULD support an extended deferral time before loan payments start coming due (especially for those who are currently unemployed). maybe 3 years after graduation or something, to help people build up savings or protect against unemployment

(of course, you could start paying earlier, but it wouldn't be mandatory)

on second thought, people would probably be dumbasses and live large and get sucked in to a lifestyle they would no longer be able to afford once it's time to make loan payments, so who knows.

i do think deferred payments would be a good idea for those who were laid off

If the government gives me back the $100K I paid back even though jobs were in short supply when I came out, then I am all for the bailout now.

Damn- this post was like reading Jon Stewart (it's that hillarious). Now, coming to the comments section-

Please tell me you are not this humorless? Are you people really the best and brightest of the legal profession? If so, I am not surprised with where the industry is.

First, yesterday, the bunch of prostitutes putting down the lower class whore attorney as not classy, and now, useless idealogical arguments in the middle of a very funny humor piece. If I were your client, I would fire you for not laughing at this.

I concur with 14. When I was making $150K+ after graduating from law school, I paid off my loans in 2 years. Anyone making over $150K+ and has been making that salary for say 5 years HAS NO FUCKING EXCUSE FOR HAVING STUDENT LOANS STILL OUTSTANDING.

Also, for those of you about to moan about how it's SO expensive to live in New York, I LIVE IN NEW YORK (and started worked in an even more expensive city, London).

No fucking way. I lived like a student the first 5 years of my practice to pay off student loans. I also went to public schools. If loans now get forgiven, I want ALL OF THAT money back. This is totally ridiculous. You gambled, you lost. End of story.
Elie, please stop posting crap like this.

41k for UCLA and Berkely?? Is that out-of-state tuition? I'm sure in-state has got to be less. and yeah, those lucky enough to go to a (good) state subsidized school have far less debt. but not everyone can get into those. I couldn't, so I had to go to a more expensive private school.

Fortunately, I picked one that not only gave me a good scholarship, but had a pretty good rep, so my debt isn't too bad and I can make the payments on my non-big-law salary.

Realistically, the problem with student loan debt only affects a relatively small number of students, those with large debt (mostly lawschool, but could be most any graduate school), who thought they'd make a huge salary (and big-law first year salaries only became absurdly huge in the last 10 years). While I somewhat sympathize with those people that thought going to lawschool was the golden ticket, only to find out that BLS is a pos and alumni are lucky to get doc review projects paying 80k a year, a student loan baillout would likely not reach those that really need it but benefit a bunch of people that didn't.

Yeah, I'd love to discharge my student loans (which I am still paying on more than 10 years later), I'd be satisfied if the government would merely reduce or cancel the interest, or increase the amount of interest I could deduct from my taxes.

I work in mid-law. Make decent money in the southeast. Student loan payments are far from astronomical. Honestly, I'd just like to see student loan rates return to their historical rates. I've got some hanging out at 8.5, others at 6.8, others at 5.1, and my lowest is at 3.1. That rate is just out of whack with the cost of (admittedly, generally secured) borrowing in the current economy. Leave the principal-that is my responsibility-but adjusting the interest to a more appropriate level would be completely reasonable, in my opinion.

As a "young, educate elite," please shut up. You don't speak for me, and I certainly didn't help put this dipshit I have to refer to as "president" into office. No one ever promised you anything besides the right to make something of yourself. This "entitlement' bullshit is starting to drive me insane.

i don't think we should get a bailout, but i do think we should at least be able to deduct interest paid on student loans regardless of income (just as all the rich folk get to deduct the mortgage interest on both their first and vacation homes).

108, if they would just stop the interest for a few years until I can get back on my feet, I'd be happy. It's the prospect of this debt growing completely out of control that worries me.

-suicidal laid off 1st year

95 -- ability and initiative are great. Really, they are. But higher education costs money. Should everyone foot the bill because you have ability and initiative? There are many things you could do to make a living with that ability and initiative that don't cost $100k+. You miss the point completely. No one told you the only way forward was to rack up student loans.

No way. You took on the debt, you pay it back. Tough luck.

I wonder when the class action law suit against T1 schools who listed 125k (now listing 160k) as the AVERAGE starting salary in the private sector for their grad will be filed.

Do people understand that the government paying back everyone's loans does not erase the debt, it merely shifts it to the entire American population.

It does not make economic sense to shift the burdens of idiots who continued to get worthless master degrees after finding out that their first undergraduate degree was worthless to those that realized such a degree was worthless and dropped out.

Do we really want to encourage people to continue to seek worthless education goals?

Additionally those that have actively paid off their loans will merely be punished by such a move.

115, shut the fuck up. This MISERABLE economy has changed everything.

All of ou whiners should have worked hard to get accepted to a school that will pay your student loans for you if you don't make enough to pay them back. That's true foresight.

oops, 117, did you think that was a serious comment?
-115

It probably makes more sense to reduce interest rates or stop charging interest for a while so that people can pay down their principal or receive hardship deferrals without accumulating more debt.

That said, some of you are really clueless about the way law school tuition works these days. Bargain basement in-state tuition? What? To give you a little perspective, the in-state tuition at Penn State Dickinson is about $30K/year. The annual in-state cost of attendance at CUNY is $33K/year, assuming no summer pay and $5500 to get through the summer. If you are talking about elite state schools (Michigan, Berkeley, Virginia), tuition is usually well over $30K/year, over $40K/year at Michigan.

113, yes, this country should pay to educate it's smartest people (say, top 10%?) a little longer. Are you really, really so stupid that you don't see a benefit to educating intelligent, hard working people?

It's fucking dumb as shit to tie educational access to parental wealth.

Maybe I missed something in the bailout but the banks and big three are taking loans that would require being paid back. In fact, most of the banks are paying dividends on those loans. So this argument is not even equal to completely wiping out someone school loan debt.

Good lord most lawyers are a bunch of whiners

"The young, educated, elites that put you into office."

SPEAK FOR YOURSELF.

I'm young (30), educated (BA + JD) and elite (T-10 law school, V25 law firm job, family of high-paid professionals & executives), but *I* didn't put Obama into office. I didn't want to see McCain get the job either, but at least I didn't ride the irrational wave of good looks, speeches without substance, unredeemable promises and dearth of relevant experience.

I'm not going to say "you got what you asked for", because no one asked for anything except "change you can believe in", which should have been made void-for-vagueness before it ever escaped Barack's lips. If ever there was a vapid expression of empty passion, that was it.

No, Obama voters are getting what you *deserve* - policies failing before they're even out of the gate, broken promise after broken promise (earmarks? fixing the economy? reigning in spending? bipartisanship?), and ineffective leadership (I've stopped tallying the withdrawn-nomination score).

What pisses me off is that I, too, have to suffer what *you* earned. Thanks. Thanks a lot.

Please think before exercising suffrage next time. Please?

It's okay to fail and to ask for help. We've all been there or will be there. But to stridently insist that sympathy and help is required to "reward success," I don't get it, did the definition of success suddenly flip 180 degrees?

Elie, I have 3 words for you in exchange for debt relief.... United States Army.

I don't care if you're too fat to pass basic, you can clean latrines, kitchens and showers at bases all over the world. I don't care if you're an objector, I promise not to put you in the firing zone if you promise to do any non-violent task uncle sam asks of you.

Do this for 3 years (with room and board on us) and your debts up to 120k are toast. Fair?

As always, I am shocked by the lack of empathy of ATL readers. Schadenfruede runs rampant as the majority of ATL readers continually degrade others to make themselves feel mightier.

Many Americans took out too much debt for the wrong reasons. Debt they couldn't afford and loans that should not have been granted. Does this include student debt? No. One of the basic tenets of America is that education is the answer and pathways provided to all regardless of race, religion, color, creed, or economic cicrumstances. These are guaranteed by our system of goernment and indeed the Constitution. (See Con Law 101)

Many of us have taken out a great deal of debt to pay for college, law school, etc. and we were assured that it would pay off in the long run. In the short run, that is not proving the case and many of us have hit financial difficulties that may burden us for years to come. Most of us are not looking for forgiveness but for loans that we pay back over a longer period of time and at a low fixed rate. As we bail out auto companies, rich financiers, banks, and people who bought homes they could not afford, why not those that took out student loans? Why not provide us with long-term fixed rate interest rates at 2%?

There is no reason not too.

"This is the real reason why Europeans hate us, not because we don't call our clubs discotheques, don't have socialism or don't fuck dudes."

Really? I'm pretty sure I engaged in at least 2 of these 3 activities last night. And I'm pretty sure I was in the US. Perhaps you can explain to me what I was really doing with that guy at the Proletariat Discotheque?

dear mysTTTal

you only got into that "much better and more expensive school" because of your skin color.

ps you SUCK

All you whiners should have worked hard enough in college to get into a law school that would pay off your student loans for you if you didn't make enough to do so. Now that's real foresight.

I paid my way through school. Now you who borrowed should get off free? No way. Rot in hell jackasses!

This plan is weak in at least one aspect. Supposing that student loans are forgiven for those who are graduates, what do we tell those who are currently in college or plan on attending shortly? "Too bad you weren't born sooner"? It's not like the need for student loans is going away any time soon, or ever.

In a perverse way, partial forgiveness of mortgage debt makes more sense because, ideally, those who get help won't make the same mistake twice, i.e., taking out loans they couldn't afford. By definition, however, most students have no money to pay the exorbitant tuition of a non-state institution, so future students will continue making the same "mistake."

My friend who works in finance told me that soon inflation will be so bad that I should buy a wheelbarrow now while I can still afford one, because I will need one to carry around the worthless dollars needed to buy a loaf of bread. That is the student loan bailout, 150K will be the minimum wage!

All you whiners should have worked hard enough in college to get into a law school that would pay off your student loans for you if you didn't make enough to do so. Now that's real foresight.

@127

Alas, my male perspective is showing through. I meant guy-on-guy. As for the Proletariat Discotheque, methinks that was a joke, and a clever one ;)

Here's some homework: Ask an older foreign-born cabbie or security guard how many degrees they have and what they've sacrificed. Shut mouth and take notes. Reconsider wisdom of own ATL comments.

I just have this to say.

Everyone that thinks it's unfair to forgive loans to people when you a) saved, b) lived within your means, c) worked hard, d) had money, e) whatever. You are right.

I just hope that you also hate that we (the USA) are doing the same thing for homeowners that bought houses they couldn't afford because of course real estate always goes up in value! You should also hate that we are endlessly propping up an auto industry that just needs to go into bankruptcy so it can reorg (I'll even go so far as to say that if the gov't needs to backup or provide a DIP that is ok).

And this is why socialism and Obamanomics doesn't work. Everyone wants their bailout. If he gets a free pass then I should. Moral hazards aren't just things that economists talk about when they get bored.

You all better be voting for Mitt Romney in 2012,

XOXO, the capitalist wing of the GOP.

When the government bailed out the banks and AIG, they also took over a huge chunk of the equity in exchange.

So TTT students (including those unemployed TTT graduates of T14 schools), since you like to use the bailout analogy so much, here's the deal:
1. your student loans will be forgiven, and in exchange
2. the government will take 80% of your earnings for the rest of your life.

Do you still want that debt-for-equity swap bailout?

No bailout. You are smart enough to get into law school, you are smart enough to do basic cost-benefit and opportunity cost.

Cost: I have a nondischaragable recourse debt the size of a mortgage.

Benefit: I have a law degree and am, at most, guaranteed 3 years of six-figure income in a very high COL city. This is best-case scenario.

Sorry brats. Should have gone to public school.

No bailout. You are smart enough to get into law school, you are smart enough to do basic cost-benefit and opportunity cost.

Cost: I have a nondischaragable recourse debt the size of a mortgage.

Benefit: I have a law degree and am, at most, guaranteed 3 years of six-figure income in a very high COL city. This is best-case scenario.

Sorry brats. Should have gone to public school.

LIVE WITHIN YOUR MEANS!!!

Wow. There certainly are a lot of self-important assholes on this comment board!

I had no idea there were so many self-righteous little Andrew Carnegies in Tier 2 schools, pulling themselves up by their bootstraps and scrounging for aluminum between Torts and Civ Pro.

Can you please tell me where you all work? Because I want to move there and make a mint selling you crewcuts and sensible shoes.

"One of the basic tenets of America is that education is the answer and pathways provided to all regardless of race, religion, color, creed, or economic cicrumstances. These are guaranteed by our system of goernment and indeed the Constitution. (See Con Law 101)"

My Con Law 101 class did not cover the right to a college degree. Please provide what number amendment such a right is contained in.

Actually, one of the basic tenants of America is that hard work--not years of pointless education--will eventually bring success for your offspring. No one has ever told me that there is a basic right to higher education (with the notable exception of Bill Clinton who seemingly made it up out of thin air).

Dear Republican Party,

Stop fighting over whether or not teens can have sex. When I was a teenager, no amount of G-d or abstinence-only education was going to deflate my perpetual boner. Also, stop trying to force religion on people--we're smart enough to make our own decisions.

Basically, stop worrying about we all do in the privacy of our own homes, churches, alleys behind Taco Bell. Why am I saying this? Because we desperately need people that actually know what the fuck they're doing with finances, the economy, etc. Democrats, G-d love 'em, think everyone is special and should be able to do what they want. And for the most part, they're right. On the other hand, they don't know what the fuck to do with a $14 trillion economy. They actually think Barack can just fix it with his magic wand if enough economists tell him its right (CNN Headline: Dems tell Barack to Hurry Up and Fix the Economy).

Bottom line: we need someone who will actually be fiscally responsible, not a puppet being pulled by the ultra-right wing caste (cough* GW *cough) while simultaneously attempting to aggrandize the GOP through direct pay-offs to poor people.

Please take this election beating as a lesson that the American people could fucking care less about what your religion or private life is like. Please bite the bullet and keep your faith to yourself. Focus on what the GOP should really be about, and what it lately has not been living up to: fiscal responsibility. We will desperately need you to come in and clean up the socialist mess Obama will have left by 2012.

Sincerely,

The Real Republican Party (i.e., not a bunch of small-town evangelists)

lol @ 141

34/37, So i should have gone to Suny-Buffalo law instead of Columbia for the "in-state tuition." Stupid, stupid fucks.

lol @ 141 - someone needs to make an Andrew Carnegie character

Stop whining, you little losers. You took contracts, you know the deal. You promised to pay for an education, which you received. Your school provided no guarantee of a job. You owe the debt, pay up. No one made you go to law school, and no, your inability to get into medical school is not a valid excuse. Sure, the guy who started a pool cleaning business after receiving his AA will probably always be worth more than your debt-laden, legal-aid, democrat-voting ass, but at least you are sooooo smart and l33t.

121 -- I think your concept is great, everyone pays for the top 10% to get educated. What do I get for footing the bill? Should we subsidize the best athletes so they can join the pros? How about the best looking so they can pursue modeling? The issue is, what do these "elites" give back to the country for our bettering their lives through collective funding. Are you advocating that the top 10% that are subsidized by everyone else dedicate their lives to government work? Because this thread is about forgiving debts or resolving debts. You remember, right? There are plenty of intelligent, hardworking people who have personal and monetary success that don't need to rack up $100k+ in loans. As for your constant personal attacks -- clearly you can't think or write clearly without venting your close-minded, obtuse views. Are you really so dumb to not realize why I could care less if you are smart/pretty/athletic in respect to funding your success? Think of all the major inventions of the world, 99.9% of which were made absent state-mandated education funding my the whole.

121 -- I think your concept is great, everyone pays for the top 10% to get educated. What do I get for footing the bill? Should we subsidize the best athletes so they can join the pros? How about the best looking so they can pursue modeling? The issue is, what do these "elites" give back to the country for our bettering their lives through collective funding. Are you advocating that the top 10% that are subsidized by everyone else dedicate their lives to government work? Because this thread is about forgiving debts or resolving debts. You remember, right? There are plenty of intelligent, hardworking people who have personal and monetary success that don't need to rack up $100k+ in loans. As for your constant personal attacks -- clearly you can't think or write clearly without venting your close-minded, obtuse views. Are you really so dumb to not realize why I could care less if you are smart/pretty/athletic in respect to funding your success? Think of all the major inventions of the world, 99.9% of which were made absent state-mandated education funding my the whole.

Should you completely forgive the debt? No. But there's a stark difference here between people graduating in 2008/2009 with people who graduated in the 2002-2003 time frame. Back then, Stafford loans were variable, and you could graduate and immediately consolidate a fixed-rate loan for less than 3%, i.e., less than inflation - and get a similar low rate even on your private loans. But as interest rates rose, Congress overmanaged and fixed Stafford loans at 6.8% (!!!) from 06-08, and only recently somewhat corrected the problem. And because of the credit markets, nobody can consolidate their loans fixed at these historically low interest rates. As a result, most people now have variable private loans that are lower than their federal loans, but with no predictability about what the interest rate will be in the future.

So 86 is onto something. Allow people to refinance current debt at a fixed rate of 3%, for either a 10,15, or 20 year period. Their receive certainty as to their payments, improve cash flow, and maybe spend some of that money in the meantime. Presto, stimulus.

33,

"I swear, it's like there's a penalty for success in this country."

If you consider following the path of least resistence to a high paying salary procured entirely with academic credentials and then begging grown-ups for help because you cannot figure out what to do when that path becomes obstructed to be "success", you should probably just pack it in and call it a day.

Folks, as I say to busted clients, if you simply cannot pay debt, you don't really owe it. So relax. Explain the situation to the creditor is plain, polite ways and wait.

There is not much they can do to you if you really cannot pay. All those monthly bills showing a growing balance and stern threats are just tosh. When they call, simply explain the situation in plain, polite ways. Don't send any money to them, though. Not one single dime.

Once you go about three years without making a single payment, yahtzee!, you will find them much more agreeable to reducing the balance to something below the original amount.

elie, put your legal knowledge to work and declare bankruptcy. show undue hardship. quit complaining.

Effective October 8, 1998, your obligation to repay Title IV, HEA student loan and grant liabilities can no longer be canceled (discharged) due to bankruptcy, unless you can successfully prove that repayment of the debt would cause "undue hardship" as defined by case law in your jurisdiction.

http://www.ed.gov/offices/OSFAP/DCS/loan.cancellation.discharge.html

This article proves my point about today's generation of attorneys. They would rather bankrupt an insititution, bar future generations of students in pursuing their education just to walk away from a responsibility.
We are in a financial crisis because people who support the preposterous idea of student loan forgiveness acted irresponsibly with regards to money and financial decisions. No one put a gun to your head or coerced you to leverage yourself to the tune of hundreds of thousands of dollars in student loan debt. You gambled with your future and you are now letting a temporary setback justify your request for loan forgiveness? You are no better than a drug junkie that goes into a methadone clinic to ask for real heroin. People like you disgust me. Stand up to your responsibilities and pay your student loans. I recall testifying in Congress back in 1996 about the fact that people who discharged student loan debt in bankruptcy deprived other students from getting loans in the future to futher their education since the William D. Stafford program would become insolvent if student loans were discharged. I was very relieved that my testimony was part of the impetus that galvanized Congress into making student loans non-dischargeable as part of the 1998 amendment to the Bankruptcy Code. Now quit whinning, be a productive member of society and re-pay your student loans!

Great post. Worst comments ever. No sense of humor at all.

Without loan payments I'd stimulate the economy big time: iphone, bigger apartment, new suits, top shelf liquor, top shelf escorts, etc.

I live within MY MEANS, have a good job in biglaw (for now), have made consistent loan payments every month for FIVE YEARS, never missing one payment. If i did not have this loan payment, I could afford a home. I pay $1100 every month (700 private, 4something feds). I don't have a car payment (i bought an older Honda and plan on running it into the ground). I rent and make prudent financial choices. I didn't run out and buy a LV bag with my first biglaw paycheck.

If the feds forgave my law school loans (feds, not SM- she's guaranteed by them), I would be able to inject another 400 or so into the economy, or save for a down payment on a house.

For everyone saying "you should have done a cost-benefit analysis" before entering law school. Give me a break. I was 21, fresh out of college, and needed to do something. I didn't know my ass from my elbow and was just trying to figure my life out. What excuse do the 30somethings who took out interest-only mortgages have??

I worked through college and law school. My parents were busy supporting two kids and making ends meet. They didn't bust their nuts saving to send me to school- they helped with college and I am grateful. They weren't economists.

The very mention of a Student Loan Bailout gives me multiple orgasms.

For the past four years, my spouse and I have struggled and done without to put our child thru college so that she will not have college loans or at the very least, only a minimal amount of loans. We would much rather have been living the high life than scrimping, but we didn't. If you borrow money, you need to pay it back. It's as simple as that. Your education isn't free. You need to work for it.

@151

At what fucking point did I ever ask for a bailout? What I'm pointing out is the ridiculous hypocrisy of hitting us for all we're worth in re: paying back all government help we get when worthless poor people get all the money for free.

If you had the reading ability of a 10 year-old, you'd understand my argument had two logical implications:

1) Both students and poor people get free money

OR

2) Both students and poor people have to pay back those that help them.

My vote is for 2. We took a calculated risk, and we should pay back the help people gave us (a crazy concept, I know, giving back to those that gave to you). And, just like if we can't pay back our loans, if the poor people getting money can't pay it back because they a) won't get a job, b) are worthless pieces of shit fucking everything that moves to make more crack-babies or c) both, then cut them off just like we would be cut off from credit!

Anyone who physically cannot help themselves has both my deepest sympathy and tax-dollar support--no question. Anyone who wants to get a free ride cause they voted for Obama and he's "gonna take care o' me" can go fuck themselves.

This is just temporary; you will get a job again; you will in the future be able to pay off your debt. Don't pretend as if you will never receive a paycheck again.

I agree with previous comment(s) - want your law school debt forgiven? Fine, turn over that JD.

I doubt if there is much political support for bailing out law students, so you'll need to expand the pool to broaden your base. Make it all student loans - undergrad, graduate, medicine & law. Parental debt should be wiped out, too. Emulate the Bonus Army - march on Washington. They may pay you to go away.

@86: I don't know where you're hoping to consolidate those loans at a 2.875% rate, but it certainly won't be the federal government. Staffords are at 6.8% and GradPLUS is at 8.5%. I bet your private loans from back in the day have much lower rates.

143,

Let's get together and talk sometime. Any good ideas on who to try and get to run?

<3's -136

Spending 100K to get a JD that will (generally) pay $160K each year over many years: rational decision.

Quitting a $160K job last year to blog: irrational decision.

Quite frankly, Elie, you don't deserve a bailout.

Not while I'm President!

Can we have a humor bailout?

108 and 111 - agreed. increase income threshold to permit interest payment deductions. that would be helpful.

143,

Fiscally conservative libertarian here. I couldn't agree with you more.

To sum up: I don't give a crap who you want to screw, what mystical statute is going to "save" you, or whether or not you want to get high every night using your parent's money. Just don't expect me to pay for your problems, and I'll pay my own way as well in exchange.

Kick out the wedge-issue evangelists. Researching on embryos, prohibiting prayer in school, and, low of lows, the gays are not responsible for your lot in life! Take back the party!

-Actual Republican

How about the government just pay all our bonuses this year? None of that half-Skadden crap, either. I want a full, non-recession-era Wachtell.

IF I KNEW WHAT I KNEW NOW----I WOULD HAVE NEVER GOTTEN ANY STUDENTS LOANS OR WENT TO COLLEGE!!!! I'M DAMN NEAR IN DEBT TRYING TO PAY BACK THESE LOANS!!!!! ALL MY LIFE I WAS TOLD THAT "A COLLEGE DEGREE WOULD GET YOU IN A BETTER SITUATION FINACIALLY." YEAH RIGHT! I STILL LIVE CHECK TO CHECK! DON'T GET ME WRONG, I'M THRILLED WITH THE KNOWLEGDE I'VE GAINED IN COLLEGE AND THE FACT THAT I'M THE FIRST TO GRADUATE FROM COLLEGE IN MY ENTIRE FAMILY---BUT SOMETIMES I FEEL I WAS LIED TO!

"Great post. Worst comments ever. No sense of humor at all. "

Second.

IF I KNEW WHAT I KNEW NOW----I WOULD HAVE NEVER GOTTEN ANY STUDENTS LOANS OR WENT TO COLLEGE!!!! I'M DAMN NEAR IN DEBT TRYING TO PAY BACK THESE LOANS!!!!! ALL MY LIFE I WAS TOLD THAT "A COLLEGE DEGREE WOULD GET YOU IN A BETTER SITUATION FINACIALLY." YEAH RIGHT! I STILL LIVE CHECK TO CHECK! DON'T GET ME WRONG, I'M THRILLED WITH THE KNOWLEGDE I'VE GAINED IN COLLEGE AND THE FACT THAT I'M THE FIRST TO GRADUATE FROM COLLEGE IN MY ENTIRE FAMILY---BUT SOMETIMES I FEEL I WAS LIED TO!

IF I KNEW WHAT I KNEW NOW----I WOULD HAVE NEVER GOTTEN ANY STUDENTS LOANS OR WENT TO COLLEGE!!!! I'M DAMN NEAR IN DEBT TRYING TO PAY BACK THESE LOANS!!!!! ALL MY LIFE I WAS TOLD THAT "A COLLEGE DEGREE WOULD GET YOU IN A BETTER SITUATION FINACIALLY." YEAH RIGHT! I STILL LIVE CHECK TO CHECK! DON'T GET ME WRONG, I'M THRILLED WITH THE KNOWLEGDE I'VE GAINED IN COLLEGE AND THE FACT THAT I'M THE FIRST TO GRADUATE FROM COLLEGE IN MY ENTIRE FAMILY---BUT SOMETIMES I FEEL I WAS LIED TO!

@170

I GRADUMATED FROM ITT TECH TOO, AND THEY ALSO DID NOT TELL ME HOW TO TURN OFF MY CAPS WHEN I WAS TYPING!!!! I FEEL LIED TO THAT ITT TECH WAS THE MOST PRESTIGIOUS TECHNOLOGICAL INSTITUTE IN ALL OF SOUTHWESTERN ORANGE COUNTY!!!!

IF I KNEW WHAT I KNEW NOW----I WOULD HAVE NEVER GOTTEN ANY STUDENTS LOANS OR WENT TO COLLEGE!!!! I'M DAMN NEAR IN DEBT TRYING TO PAY BACK THESE LOANS!!!!! ALL MY LIFE I WAS TOLD THAT "A COLLEGE DEGREE WOULD GET YOU IN A BETTER SITUATION FINACIALLY." YEAH RIGHT! I STILL LIVE CHECK TO CHECK! DON'T GET ME WRONG, I'M THRILLED WITH THE KNOWLEGDE I'VE GAINED IN COLLEGE AND THE FACT THAT I'M THE FIRST TO GRADUATE FROM COLLEGE IN MY ENTIRE FAMILY---BUT SOMETIMES I FEEL I WAS LIED TO! HELL YES TO A BAILOUT!

sorry, kiddies, no student loan bailouts for you.

if you are overburdened y student loans, too bad - you chose what undergrad schools to go, and what law schools to go to, in many cases forgoing cheaper state school, or one that would have given you financial aid, in order to attend the more prestigious undergrad school - to move up the food chain in the law school sweepstakes - or the more highly ranked law school for the law firm sweepstakes. you made a calculated gamble. win some, you lose some; its called life.

if you want relief, seek to amend the bankruptcy code and make student loand non-dischargeable in BK. you can then file for bk, like hundreds of thousands of folks did in the past.

also lobby to make all student loan interest deductiblke - get rid of the cap on incoem after which it is ni longer deductible.

lots of folks before you have carried high law school and undergard debts, that were as high relative to prevailing salraies as they are today. my loans 20 years ago were 1.5 times starting NY biglaw 1st year salaries, with income taxes being higher than they are today.

(1) You don't do "real work". You write for a piece of shit blog.

(2) You made your own choices. You should deal with the consequences.

(3) At the undergraduate level, elite schools are pushing to dramatically increase financial aid. Students from families that make less than 60k a year are now paying nothing. Those from families making under 100k are paying very little. All grants; no loans.

(4) With respect to law school, people make decisions. Economic factors should be a part of those decisions. Why should someone like me, who took a full ride at Virginia, all of the sudden be told that I might as well have paid sticker price at NYU... since the loans don't really count. The whole notion that you have to attend "the best school you get into", regardless of cost, is a stupid one.

(5) You are a self proclaimed "elite". That's hilarious. You're a 30 year old fat ass blogger who couldn't hack it practicing law. You probably make 60k a year; have an abundance of health problems owing to your laudable girth; couldn't run a mile to save your life; and sit around wondering if your dick still works and contemplating gastric bypass.

Nationalize legal education in this country. A law degree is no less a public good than bank. The Department of Education should treat law schools in the same manner that Treasury is for the banks. Professors would be servants of the state and tuition set according to the ability to pay. Socialism can be fun!

AT LEAST CUT HALF OF THE LOANS!!!!

Feel free to jump all over me if this is retarded (as I have no doubt ATL commenters will) because I am no finance whiz, but what if law schools gave a tuition rebate that students could then use to pay down loans? Part of the reason law school is so expensive is due to future earning potential, right? Now that future earning potential is less, should tuition follow suit? My school has an absurdly huge endowment and they're using the money right now to build new luxury law dorms adjacent to the school among other frivolous crap. Why don't you give me some of my money back instead, since I would rather die than live on campus anyway (like any sane law student)?

Absolutely asinine, self serving and selfish post. LIVE WITHIN YOUR MEANS and stop fucking whining when you find out you've somehow made some bad decisions. Don't expect to be bailed out by those that actually were smart about their spending and lived within their means, that's hypocrisy at it's worst.

You're a law student. As am I. I believe you understand the basics of contracts? You signed at the dotted line to plunge yourself into debt with no guarantee of a job unless you worked your ass off, and even then nothing is guaranteed. I am at a "less elite" T25 school for almost a free ride instead of at a T5 with crushing debt. I lucked out and Biglaw still offered me a job, albeit with a pushed back start date.

I'm going to spend wisely and budget even with my first year salary, and pay off what little loans I do have. That's my style. Those that need bailouts are those that will still need it later after "stimulating" the economy some more and patting themselves on the back for being douchebag assholes.

Sound righteous? Maybe. I like it better than sounding like a a little whiny bitch who wants to be saved from their own stupidity.

156, what if you had started this year at Latham NY where they have already laid off half of their first years and may lay off even more over the next few months?

the severance is 50k after taxes. that won't pay off your loans.

stop being cocky. you in part got lucky.

"this actually made financial sense when we took on the obligation" - 32

"IF I KNEW WHAT I KNEW NOW----I WOULD HAVE NEVER GOTTEN ANY STUDENTS LOANS OR WENT TO COLLEGE!!!" - 170

That's right, who could have imagined the economy might change? It never has before.

why do you people keep taking these stories and not crediting?

Man undgrad was cheap as hell. UC's rock. I owe 500 dollars and pay 3 dollars a month.

Thought the post was funny. You people are weird, humorless, self-righteous and scary.

The guy who started the facebook group that is getting all of this attention (currently with over 100,000 members) is currently commenting on a heated thread http://blackbooklegal.blogspot.com/2009/03/open-thread-student-debt-solutions.html

181 = EPIC FAIL.

T5 person probably smarter than you.

You admitted you got lucky.

What does "living within your means" entail when you owe 170k and make 50k a year? Living with your parents? Would do that if it were an option and that itself may not be enough.

Shut up. I hope you hit a whale on the way to France.

180, law schools raised tuition because of the endless supply of useful idiots who were willing to pay that price, funded by easy money from the government. Law schools have zero incentive to give back the money, as long as there are people willing to pay, and there always will be.

But hey, let's make education more "affordable" for the masses. It's not like schools are completely aware of the government subsidies and jack up the tuition price in order to capture the entire subsidy for their own benefit.

Yes we can!

186:

Excuse us for having an opinion on someone who was given a far-reaching voice on his idea that he should be helped out of his own mistakes by those who were fiscally responsible. It's not that we're humorless, we're just opinionated. Are you familiar with lawyers?

PS. your face is weird AND scary

sorry..I forgot to clarify that his name is Rob. On thread he is responding to criticisms of his theory:

"As the creator of the Facebook group in question, I came here to rebuff some of the typical criticisms that I was certain would arise when Craig told me that he had started this discussion. . . ."

http://blackbooklegal.blogspot.com/2009/03/open-thread-student-debt-solutions.html

33/159:
I concur with almost everything you said, except the part where you said that it's _like_ there's a penalty for success. No - strictly speaking, there is a quantifiable penalty for success (if we define that broadly as earning more money) in this country. And once income tax rates go back to 1990s levels and Obama gets his planned lowering of the deduction rate to 28%, the quantity of that penalty will be higher than it has been in at least 30 years.

As for social safety net spending, I truly do not have a problem with it. Except when I stand behind a woman in line at the grocery store who's buying $80 of groceries with her WIC card - a WIC card she clutched in a hand with a $50 nail job (according to my wife). And her other hand also had a $50 nail job. She also had a bluetooth headset in her ear. I know those have become pretty cheap, but I've still never bought one since every cell phone comes with a free corded earpiece (heaven forbid one have that unsightly cord hanging by their face!). It's extremely frustrating to directly watch one's tax money subsidize obviously unnecessary safety net spending.

Other instances of abuse have gotten my blood boiling, too, like the 23 year old man who came in for help with his income taxes (VITA while I was in school). He was collecting Social Security disability, but he was plainly able to work (hell, he picked up a fairly heavy office chair from another desk and carried it 30 feet over to my desk).

Abuses like these are why so many take a dim view of many safety net programs, even though it's clear they help a lot of people during very rough times. They were meant to be temporary helping hands, but now they are "entitlements." So, we're stuck with them forever. (Before I get any invective thrown my way, I was vociferously opposed to the bank bailout and the auto bailout, and I think the loan forgiveness idea in the article is idiotic, even though I would benefit enormously if it were to happen.)

I worked after undergrad, saving up while paying my mortgage. Went to law school thinking I could afford it. I'm taking federal loans and paying the rest by selling my increasingly worthless stock. I have no idea how I'll make my 3L tuition. Loan forgiveness is not the answer, but a break on the student loan interest rates might really be nice. 6% is a bit much at the moment. . .

177 = post of the day.

elie probably also has a mortgage loan on a condo (or shoud I say crib?) he canb't afford and is getting a bailout on that as well.

186 here. Work at an NYC law firm, not fired, debt paid off, with plenty of opinionated and insightful friends and fiance. None as weird, scary, humorless and self-righteous as you people. ;p

Elie made me laugh.

*downgrades from champagne to 40's and attempts to weather the recession*

-Pop bottles

Geez.....just use your capital one or chase or whatever bank balance transfer checks to "pay" your student loans, wait 6 months and file bankruptcy....then at least a portion would be discharged....so what if it is fraud.

188, 181 here.

Fine, I retract part of my statement. I did not get lucky. I worked fucking hard and I earned my GPA honors at my T25, and earned equally my Biglaw offer that awaits. I got into T5 schools and chose not to go there for monetary reasons.

I owe under 40K in debt (all living expenses, my scholarship paid for tuition) and will erase that my first year of working on my Biglaw salary, which I believe simple deductive reasoning from my post would have revealed.

Thanks for reading carefully before you posted. What are you, TTT?

Wow, talk about epic failure.

196

Thank god someone else has a sense of humor.

The feds should erase student loan debt. They should simply stop giving student loans to law students.

The feds should not erase student loan debt. They should simply stop giving student loans to law students.

77 -- 74 here. I am in my twenties and paying some for my education. What I mean by "self-funding" is to either directly pay for it yourself, or achieve an LSAT/UGPA combination which you can sell to a school good enough to make it worth attending. If you want to roll the dice on paying full price and hoping you make the top 10% then you are just gambling. Most people who gamble with those kind of odds lose. But, I suppose if you could have figured that out you would have either done well enough on the LSAT to go for free or done well enough in school to get a job.

This socialist bullshit only rewards failure and poor planning.

Just require Alan Greenspan to personally pay off all student loans. It's only fair.

What has happened to the youth of America? Personal responsibility is a sign of maturity. Unless and until you accept that basic concept of adulthood, you might as will put your pull-ups back and crawl back in the playpen.

I would love if this proposal were to go through, but I am wondering if it is a little too radical.

How about a more moderate (and cheaper) idea: the government should, for the next 2 years (1) treat all unsubsidized Stafford loans as subsidized and (2) extend the "in-school" status to both subsidized and unsubsidized loans, i.e. paying interest on these loans as if the person owing them were still a student and if the loans were subsidized.

Everyone who took out Grad PLUS should be left on their own.

This solution would cost considerably less and it would give relief to every honest graduate who got hammered by the economy, allowing them not to go into a financial dept pit. On the other hand, it would not reward the insane spending sprees that some of our friends had engaged in and it would not diminish the underlying debt load, which would have to be paid out eventually.

I think this way we can all get some breathing room while not paying for people's stupidity.

USA! USA! USA!

United States Army.

B*tches!

@48 you can't the discharge smart guy.

Read the BK Code before you comment on it. If you could waive the discharge, then every loan would have a discharge waiver and there would effectively be no access to bankruptcy, unless it was a 100% chapter 13.

@48 you can't waive the discharge smart guy.

Read the BK Code before you comment on it. If you could waive the discharge, then every loan would have a discharge waiver and there would effectively be no access to bankruptcy, unless it was a 100% chapter 13.

198. Not that it matters but I am at a T14.

Nice to hear that you don't owe much money. Others do. I'll admit it, you rule. I am a lesser man for asking for a bailout. If it comes, guess what? I'm gonna take it. Take that with your pride and shove it.

Good luck with biglaw. I hope it's bigger than your wildest imagination.

189,

Yeah, I realize my school isn't going to give back any money. People will always pay whatever it takes to go to top schools, regardless of the economy. But if I am right, such a plan would appease both those in and out of debt, right? Ok, so you lived within your means, woohoo here's your rebate check, enjoy. Alternatively, you paid out the ass to go to some prestigious school, woohoo here's your rebate check, go pay off some of your debt. Or is that still unacceptable to the people who took scholarships at worse schools and somehow think they're morally superior to those of us who made different choices? The number of people able to fund HYS out of pocket is small -- and those who are doing it have their parents footing the bill. Stop shitting all over us for making a decision based on the institution rather than the price.

-180

210 = Epic Win.

181, 198 = slut.

38 & 42: Obama has had less than two months in office. He is in the middle of a shitstorm partially fueled by decisions made by various people in the last eight years. If it only takes 1.5 months to determine someone's 'incompetence', then I hope you aren't going to be one of the people bitching they got fired after barely being a first year.

I would love if this proposal were to go through, but I am wondering if it is a little too radical.

How about a more moderate (and cheaper) idea: the government should, for the next 2 years (1) treat all unsubsidized Stafford loans as subsidized and (2) extend the "in-school" status to both subsidized and unsubsidized loans, i.e. paying interest on these loans as if the person owing them were still a student and if the loans were subsidized.

Everyone who took out Grad PLUS should be left on their own.

This solution would cost considerably less and it would give relief to every honest graduate who got hammered by the economy, allowing them not to go into a financial dept pit. On the other hand, it would not reward the insane spending sprees that some of our friends had engaged in and it would not diminish the underlying debt load, which would have to be paid out eventually.

I think this way we can all get some breathing room while not paying for people's stupidity.

@209

You are the type of fucking pussy that is ruining our nation. There was a day when people who got unemployment would go and pay every penny of it back once they got a job. There was a day when people took pride in a hard day's work, and they were embarrassed to take anything but a handshake and a home-cooked meal for free.

You people have ridiculous sense of pride and no shame. Everyone's parents told them they were the best, and that nothing they did was wrong. That's why this nation has degenerated into a bunch of whining pussies. Parents now sue schools when their kids are caught cheating. We can't tell people they're stupid. A bratty child cannot get the spanking s/he deserves because it might hurt his or her feelings. And heaven forbid you should shame someone for looking like a freak! That's just their individualism. And don't you dare shame them for killing a helpless, unborn child, they have a right to choice!

The fear of my children turning out like you is what keeps me honest as a parent. Your parents have failed you miserably. You are not entitled to anything. You don't deserve a gold star for everything you do. You have to take responsibility for your own actions. Your parents should have whooped your ass religiously until you got some common sense. Or, should that fail, done what every reasonable parent use to do and send you off to the military where they could whoop your ass religiously until you got some common sense.

177 = epic win.

How does one end up with $200K of debt. Law school tuition at expensive schools is still in the $40K range. And when I was in school, I saved what I earned as a summer associate and used it to pay all of my living expenses over the next year (rent, food, etc.) -- so I only had to borrow one year of living expenses.

There's no legitimate difference between food stamps for the poor and a loan bailout for students. Welfare is welfare, and to be honest, I'd be happy to simply get rid of all federal welfare.

However, if we're going to do welfare at all, what is the best way to handle it:
a) give money to people to help cover basic needs, such as food, rent, and health insurance, while designing a system of incentives such that not only are people on welfare unlikely to ever make an effort to get off of it, but also that people on welfare are likely to have and raise children who will be on welfare for life. In other words, not subsidizing food or rent or shelter, but subsidizing entire lives.

b) give money to people to help cover costs incurred in the pursuit of education. Presumably, the vast majority of people receiving such help will be self-sufficient for the rest of their lives, and will teach their children to do the same. In other words, subsidizing a one-time cost, NOT entire lives.

Again, in whatever form, we're talking about welfare that people who pay taxes a) have no direct say in and b) are on the hook for. Personally, I'm not opposed to welfare that takes the form of a one-shot handout that helps people make better lives for themselves and puts them on the path to a lifetime of self-sufficiency.

Be opposed to a student loan bailout all you want, but recognize that it's economically much more beneficial to the country and to the individuals than other forms of welfare that you probably support.

@214. Yo American Dad, you need to take some vicodin to mellow out.

You're right, I have no pride. If I had a job, I'd still take a bailout if it were offered to me.

Whatever man. Live your life the way you do and stop getting all worked up. Based on your comments, I'd think I was responding to Trig Palin.

Go to back to Sunday school. The lord judges you for yelling at me.

Don't some law schools have loan forgiveness programs to help graduates work who at a non-profit or other low paying job? Nobody seems to mention these if they're still around.

Elie, why did you not credit the facebook group that started this

debate...http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=46657437878&ref=ts

this is a distortion of his idea

Here, just an example from GW:

Full-Time J.D. (minimum 12 hours per semester)

Tuition and fees*: $42,205
Books and supplies: $1,295
Health Insurance: $1,800
Loan Origination / Guarantee Fees: $1,400
Room and board: $14,200
Personal Expenses: $3,200
Transportation: $2,200
Total Cost of Attendance: $66,300

66k x 3 years = roughly 200k

I know lots of people who blew everything they made during the summer on partying, a new car, etc...

217, the army of people with worthless MAs and JDs from TTT schools should tell you that more education does NOT lead to a lifetime self-sufficiency.

If the higher education does lead to higher earnings and self-sufficiency, then that person should have no problems borrowing money (up to the present value of the higher earnings) to fund that higher education.
QED

And who said that the rest of us support welfare in the first place.

@205/213

I roughly agree with you, though I think you're a little off-base suggesting that students who take out GradPLUS loans are spendthrifts. The 9-month cost of attendance at most top schools is upwards of $60K/year and Staffords cap out at around $20K/year. Even with a healthy scholarship, a student working in unpaid internships needs something more than her Stafford loan to pay the bills.

i just got my Ph.D. and i make a stable mid 90k salary with no student loans (in fact, I was paid while being in school). I'll take that over two months at 160k and then job searching for 2 years...

I just got my phd and i make a stable mid 90k salary and no student loans (in fact, I got paid to go to school). I'll take that over two months at 160k and then job searching for 2 years...

@218

Nothing to do with religion. Why don't you fucking grow a pair and take some pride in yourself? With your lazy, self-entitled, "whatever, dude" attitude, it sure is a shocker that you're not gainfully employed.

"If I had a job, I'd still take a bailout if it were offered to me."

Read: "Because I'm a fucking douchebag with no pride who is willing to scam the government out of money so long as I'm not paying for it, I'd love to get a bailout just for funsies!"

By the way, I'd love to live my life the way I want to, but I have to keep paying more and more taxes to support deadbeats like you, so it is getting a little bit more difficult.

Just ask yourself: would I want my kid ending up like me?

I a) don't give a shit about working, b) don't take pride in myself, c) would gladly take free money from someone who's actually earned it, and d) come up with lame zingers such as "go back to Sunday school."

If you said yes, then please kill self immediately and spare us future generations of your douchitude.

I just got my phd and i make a stable mid 90k salary and no student loans (in fact, I got paid to go to school). I'll take that over two months at 160k and then job searching for 2 years...

MysTTTal

I believe in capitalism completely, including the consequences of failing as well as winning.

But when our federal government taxes Peter to pay Paul, and is generally in the business of redistributing wealth, how can you blame economically rational people for demanding their share?

If Congress is in the position of determining who needs what, and who can "afford" to have wealth stolen from them to pay for it, then how can you not expect law students who find themselves with $200k in debt and no job prospects to argue that they too need money from Congress?

Again, not only am I capitalist, I'm a complete libertarian, and I think the government is good only for fucking things up - especially the economy.

But when I look at people asking for a student loan bailout, I simply see rational actors responding to incentives created by Congress. Try to shame them all you want - it doesn't even compare to the potential payoff if they get their way.

i would settle for eliminating the income limit on deducting student loan interest. idiot bob can buy a $1 million house he can't afford and write off all his interest. I can't write off my student loan interest???

Hang in there guys, help is on the way. America has no choice but to bail out the elite first in order to stay competitive with the rest of the world. Otherwise we're witnessing the historic collapse of the Great American Empire.

To the naysayers, ask yourself this. What if you had started at Latham NY this year? You would have a 50% chance of being laid off right now, PLUS a good chance of being let go in the next round.

Remember, there but for the grace of God go I, friend.

226. Self-entitled? I've worked for everything I have. I just don't ask for a lot. I put myself through some really good schools. Still working while in law school.

I took out some loans. Prob can't pay back those loans in the near future. How am I scamming anyone? I'm not asking for a bailout. I'm just saying if it's coming to me, I'd be a fool not to take it.

BTW, have kids? Are you nuts? No procreating here. Though the act intrigues me. Now go raise those good ol boys of yours. We need people with pride so I can just chill.

Assumptions man. It's all about assumptions.

P.S. I thought the Sunday school quip was rather funny. Anyone?

222: First of all, the degrees aren't worthless, even though their present value is diminished. A JD from any school opens a lot of doors, even if most of those doors lead to jobs/careers that you wouldn't consider prestigious.

Second, when you're talking about creating people who can create lives for themselves and their families without constant dependence on government beneficence, the single most important factor is education.

As to who said the "rest of us support welfare in the first place" - certainly not I. Try to read carefully:
"Be opposed to a student loan bailout all you want, but recognize that it's economically much more beneficial to the country and to the individuals than other forms of welfare that you PROBABLY support."

A completely legitimate assumption based on, among many things, the fact that our current president is a socialist.

Dude -- bailouts are only for billionaires.

Seriously; since the reason student loans were supposed to be non-dischargeable in bankruptcy is the government ultimately was insuring them. They should probably be made dischargeable now since all the other debt being vaporized is also from the government.

Student loans do nothing but drive up tuition to support an army of useless baby-boomers who can't or won't find real jobs. Let's send some of those womens studies professors to find out how much they make in the real world.

Private student loans should have always been subject to bankruptcy laws which, hopefully, might eliminate them and the "degrees" ("look, I can cook!") that come with them. At 20% interest it's tough to assume plenty of risk wasn't factored in when they were issued.

I'm strapped with student loan debt, but make my payments dilligently (I made my bed, and now I must lie in it.) However, I paid over $6,000 in student loan interest last year, and DREAM of the day in which they erase the salary cap on deducting student loan interest on your taxes.... now THAT would be great!

I'm strapped with student loan debt, but make my payments dilligently (I made my bed, and now I must lie in it.) However, I paid over $6,000 in student loan interest last year, and DREAM of the day in which they erase the salary cap on deducting student loan interest on your taxes.... now THAT would be great!

Let us form an angry mob to make demands on the firms that laid us off, Congress, and our law schools.

Student loans provide nothing more than access to an opportunity—they are not risk-free investments and education does not guarantee success. The whining on this board is more than a bit pathetic. That the crashing economy was unforeseeable is not an excuse to transfer the risk-taking student’s debt to taxpayers through government intervention. Life is not fair. Bad luck is unavoidable. Get used to it.

here here!!!

The real crime here is the outrageous tuition charged by the many worthless law schools that somehow are allowed to be accredited by the ABA. These places should be lining up in court behind Madoff to repent for the extraordinary fraud they perpetrate on their incoming students. Then again, a little due diligence on the part of investors/incoming students would quickly put these ponzi schemes/con-artist law schools out of business.

Elie, you shmuck. Harvard pays back loans for students who don't make money. So does Yale. At Yale, no matter what you do when you graduate, the school pays your loan payments for you so long as you make less than $60,000 per year. There is a sliding scale after that up to full payment by the graduate at a certain income level. I'm sure the program at Harvard is similar. So, I guess that pretty much makes you John Edwards. Way to stick up for the "oppressed" while living in your 15,000 square foot mansion and banging ugly chicks while your wife dies of cancer.

221 -- How is room and board $14200? If you and two roomates each pay $500/month, then you have $1500 rent and a total for room of $6000 a year.

For those of you with federal direct loans, it's called the "income contingent repayment plan." Look into it and stop complaining.

For those of you with private loans, continue complaining.

Well said, I like it Where do I sign?

Just one minor comment

Not only did I have over $100K in student loans, but while I was working (at BigLaw) I couldn't even write off the interest paid that school debt!

Elie is a man?

Dear Poster,

Newsflash: if you had to get loans to go to law school then, regardless of where you went, you are not part of the 'elite.' Pricey tuition is meant to keep out the riff-raff and there's really no difference between you and the schmuck who took advantage of easy credit to purchase a McMansion and an SUV (both of which were subsequently repossessed). I mean, did you really think it would be so simple to join the ranks of wealth and class? P.S. I'm sure Old Navy needs store managers...

You want to default on your loans? Fine, but you have to forfeit your J.D. and your right to practice law.

Someone who defaults on a mortgage doesn't get to keep the house.

249-=the most intelligent post on this thread

249--

True, but a beneficiary of the housing bailout will get to remain in their homes.

@145 -- 34 here, and the answer is yes IF YOU AREN'T CAPABLE/WILLING TO EVER PAY 200K+INTEREST in student loans. Since when does one product being better than the other justify ignoring the price tag?

I am sick and tired of us attorney thinking about the good of the "whole" population aka non-attorneys.
When considering their own financial interest, do the teachers unions, auto unions and welfare recipients think about the good of "other" people? Are the beneficiaries of the mortgage bailout telling the government that they should reconsider receiving funds due to "moral hazard" and other economic consequences.
People seem to suggest attorneys are selfish but the contrary is true. Do the teachers unions police their incompetent teachers the way our bar/grievance committee oversees us? We are attorneys - we are powerful - our people are in government - lets annul or reduce student loan payments.

I am sick and tired of us attorney thinking about the good of the "whole" population aka non-attorneys.
When considering their own financial interest, do the teachers unions, auto unions and welfare recipients think about the good of "other" people? Are the beneficiaries of the mortgage bailout telling the government that they should reconsider receiving funds due to "moral hazard" and other economic consequences.
People seem to suggest attorneys are selfish but the contrary is true. Do the teachers unions police their incompetent teachers the way our bar/grievance committee oversees us? We are attorneys - we are powerful - our people are in government - lets annul or reduce student loan payments.

I am sick and tired of us attorney thinking about the good of the "whole" population aka non-attorneys.
When considering their own financial interest, do the teachers unions, auto unions and welfare recipients think about the good of "other" people? Are the beneficiaries of the mortgage bailout telling the government that they should reconsider receiving funds due to "moral hazard" and other economic consequences.
People seem to suggest attorneys are selfish but the contrary is true. Do the teachers unions police their incompetent teachers the way our bar/grievance committee oversees us? We are attorneys - we are powerful - our people are in government - lets annul or reduce student loan payments.

I am sick and tired of us attorney thinking about the good of the "whole" population aka non-attorneys.
When considering their own financial interest, do the teachers unions, auto unions and welfare recipients think about the good of "other" people? Are the beneficiaries of the mortgage bailout telling the government that they should reconsider receiving funds due to "moral hazard" and other economic consequences.
People seem to suggest attorneys are selfish but the contrary is true. Do the teachers unions police their incompetent teachers the way our bar/grievance committee oversees us? We are attorneys - we are powerful - our people are in government - lets annul or reduce student loan payments.

I went to a 2nd tier school on a scholarship and have repaid my $30K in loans for living expenses. I finished top 1% and am doing very well in Biglaw.

I could have gone to a more prestigious school but was too worried about my ability to repay the loans.

What drives me crazy is how the people who went to Top 5 schools LOVE to flaunt it. Even anonymous posters on ATL will carefully point out at the beginning of their post that they are T5, like it matters to anything they write. Others put down the "TTT"s.

Law firms drool over T5 students. Clients are impressed if you went to HSY.

Face it, T5 graduates think they are better than T20 graduates, and so do law firms and clients, even though the T20 student got an equal education and had the credentials to attend the T5 school.

I detest this arrogance, this obsession with law school rankings and pedigree.

The ONLY thing that has allowed me to tolerate your T5 smugness and arrogance is knowing that you're juggling $150K in student loans while I am debt free. It is a great fucking feeling.

If the government takes that away, I will be thoroughly disgusted. I am already disgusted by the housing bailout. If a student loan bailout follows, I might have to leave the country.

The amount of outstanding student loans exceeds 500 billion dollars.

I feel for everybody carrying a debt. I thought about law school shortly after being laid off after the tech bubble burst in 2000. I took the LSAT, did well enough to get into some Tier 1schools (ranked 20 and below) even applying late. The shine wore off quickly enough. After getting admitted and figuring out which school to attend, I got hold of a recent alum lists and started calling. Previous grads had ended up in small firms, where temping, or just not getting paid the big bucks that supposedly everybody made. They were invariably struggling with the debt.

This made made me uneasy enough that once a tech job came along I moved half-way across the country and took it. I talked my way into a part-time night program just 6 weeks before classes started. The school was a Tier 3, but with my job I could pay it off. I ended up getting into a big law firm not for my JD but for my tech degree - the only non-summer associate hire out of school for my firm. Probably, will be laid off next week along with some other litigators, but at least I have some savings and the prospect of sitting for the patent bar.

Loyola 2L called it three years ago.

For number 68: You said that for those who couldnt afford law school, they just shouldnt have gone?

I come from a blue collar, hardworking, responsible, money saving family, but my parents could not put me through school. i went to a mediocre commuter school for undergrad because they gave me a full ride scholarship and i was being prudent and decided to forego having any real college experience. i worked my way through school as well, and had a 4.0.

then, i was lucky enough to get into a law school, which is decently priced, but only ranked 3rd tiered, because again i was being prudent with money. however, to live during law school you have to take out an immense amount of loans because you just cannot work first year, and second year, everyone is trying to get a summer job, which takes up all of their time.

i decided that i wanted to be a prosecutor or public defender very quickly during 2nd yr. However, there is no funding for me to be hired in one of those positions because they are government funded. there are people working in my particular office who have been working for free or for 10 dollars an hour who are already lawyers but they just cannot get hired. and its just not the public law jobs. pretty much everyone i know is unemployed right now who has already passed the bar. many people's positions are being revoked at big firms.

my loans are not as terrible as others, especially since i have no undergrad loans and i got a scholarship for my 3L year of law school. however, i am severely worried about my economic future. i would take any any any job that i could possibly find in law. i am pretty sure i am going to have to go out and get a retail job after the bar is over, which is what i was doing before law school.

i think if i did not have loans hanging over my head, i would be alright. and my economic future would not be so dire. but i dont think that its fair for someone to say "sorry, if u couldnt afford law school, u shouldnt have gone." tuition keeps going up. the only people who could then afford to go to law school or other kinds of grad school would then be people who have rich parents who could afford to pay for their tuition. being in america means that people can "rise to the top", right? thats what this girl means when she says that we have been lied to. we have been lied to that we could borrow these loans and make ourselves something better, when that isnt going to happen right now, and it is looking bleak for the future in general. that is the lie. there is no more american dream. and soon there may be no middle class.

i've done the "right" thing my whole life, and i've been helped out by my parents. and they have scrimped and saved for me to be the only person in my family to get a graduate education. and im going to be unemployed, or working for 9 dollars an hour after 7 years of schooling. apparently there is no reward anymore for hard work.

that is what this article is about.

1. Those asking for loan bailouts are too entitled and too whiny. Grow a pair. Um, a Biglaw job starting at 160k should allow you to pay off your loans in 3 to 5 years. No one guaranteed you the ability to pay off huge loans in less than 5 years with the ability to get rich soon thereafter. It seems to me that these student loans come with terms like 10, 15 or more years for a reason--because with any normal salaried job you should be expecting to pay them for a long time.

2. Law school is a gamble, not a conservative investment in your future. The majority of law students lose that gamble in any economy. More law students are losing that gamble now because of the recession. If you don't understand that, you should have done some basic research before making one of the most expensive choices of your life. You are delusional and naive if you think a JD guarantees you any sort of 6 figure salary. See the stats below.

Bureau of Labor Statistics: Median salary of lawyers 9 months after graduation in 2005 was $60,000 for all graduates. In May 2006, the median annual earnings of all wage-and-salaried lawyers were $102,470. http://www.bls.gov/oco/ocos053.htm

NALP: Distribution of full time salaries for the Class of 2006--Median was $62,000 http://www.nalp.org/2008jansalaries

Payscale.com: Median salary with less than 1 year of experience is $50,000. http://www.payscale.com/research/US/Degree=Post_Graduate_Diploma,_Law/Salary.

3. Since most recent law graduates don't earn anything close to 6 figures (see the NALP distribution chart above), I call bullshit on whiny claims that you can't pay off your loan without earning 160k upon graduation. Again, grow a pair.

4. Most law schools are worthless, overpriced diploma mills not worth 2 cents much less the 30-40k per year they all seem to want to charge. There are huge number of law schools because they are Profit Centers for universities and a sucker JD candidate is born every second, not because there are great opportunities for all the grads of ABCrap Law School. I have met a lot of people who graduated from the local Tier 4 law school. For some reason, they were all tending bar/waiting tables when I met them. I'm not making a judgment on their abilities as lawyers, I'm making a comment on the dearth of well paying legal opportunities.

5. Forgiving loans is smart stimulus. Ha, Ha Ha, Ha. I'll file that under Plan W for writing checks to deadbeats. Sure, give me a billion dollars and I'll stimulate the hell out of the economy. I'll promise to spend all that money just like Monty Brewster.

Does anyone know someone who is sick and tired?

i think number 261 should read number 260. i bet his daddy was a doctor and that he doesnt even have any student loan debt to worry about.

no one seems to realize that the shit that the baby boomer generation did is now ruining the lives of the 20 somethings out there trying to make it. but no one wants to help us out in any way. we are also the largest group of people in the country who do not have health care, also because these jobs who actually do hire us dont want to give us benefits. just throwing that out there as well.

23 is right. Many of those on this blog whining about the debt they incurred attending YHS frequently belittled those who went to lower ranked schools (because of the scholarships offered to them) before the recession got this deep.

263, Try janitor and dish washer for parents. I have student loan debt from law school, but not as much as many because I worked all through undergrad and choose a law school that gave me some scholarship money rather than the most prestigious one I could find regardless of the cost. So again, grow a pair.

263, I feel for you. 259.

Really, I'd just like a job at this point. You know, I'd be happy to start paying off my mountain of debt. Just lookin' for that sweet, gainful employment! Any money that you might use to forgive student loan debt should just go to create jobs in government. For example, maybe you can resolve the crisis of underrepresentation in our criminal courts? Or give poor people access to the legal system by funding poverty lawyers? Any of these would be preferrable to cutting the loan debt of someone whose goal in life has always been to make $100k +. kthnx.

Sorry, I mean 260, I feel for you. 259.

263, 261 again. I read 260's tale. Ironically, not too much different from mine. Only difference is that I did some research before law school and understood that it was a big gamble. Before applications, I told myself that I would not go to law school at all if I did not get into a top law school because the cost/benefit/risk analysis just did not make sense without the extra help that a top law school's reputation/alumni network/perceived desirability of grads provided. Hell, I would not have gone to anything outside of the T14 without significant scholarships from the school. Too many law students don't consider cost and risk and only think about the $$$ at the top of the salary heap that only a few make.

That's said, I do feel for 260's situation. Not enough to forgive the debt. Like entrepreneurs opening a business, like investors seeking a return and like everything else in the world you take a risk to get ahead. Nothing is guaranteed.

Are you kidding? If my rent were $500 I would wet myself with glee. We don't all go to law school in Kansas.

242 is right. H and Y folks have absolutely nothing to complain about where student loans are concerned so I am sure they are not on here complaining. Elie is a poser.

If you think the "educated, elites" are what vaulted The Great Messiah" into office, you're smoking crack and deserve to suffer in the unemployment lines. Every generation struggles with student loans. You really need to get over yourself. I could support a bill to delay student loan repayment until the economy turns around, but there's no way you should be forgiven the loans completely, just because you can't have the lifestyle that you envisioned. Spoiled assholes like you shouldn't have even gone into law. There's something to be said for suffering in silence - you should try it.

263--You are right, we are seeing the results of the baby boomers--just not the way you are implying This generation if full of whiny, self-important, emotionally crippled individuals--the term adult does not apply. The self-absorbtion and lack of resiliency that this generation exhibits is frightening and a direct result of helicopter mommies and daddies who did everything for their children, demanded that everything be be "fair," ensured their little darling never had to be disappointed (e.g., everyone gets a trophy), and held them accountable for nothing. Consequently, you didn't learn to handle dsappointment, adversity or defeat. It must be difficult to find out that life isn't fair when you are twenty-something. People used to learn that in grade school. Stop whining, grow up and act like an adult. You took a risk and lost. Now what are you going to do about it? The answer to that question will not only determine your future but the fate of this country.

Jesus, get over this shit. Social-work students, for instance, have to take out loans, too. They get out in two years instead of three, but end up with jobs paying $30,000 a year if they're lucky. When they economy goes south, they lose their jobs like everyone else. They aren't happy about this, I'm sure, but they know that there are plenty of people who are worse off than they are. So they keep their whining to themselves.

Suck it up, tough it out, do the best you can.

Without crazy student loans, schools could never get away with charging as much for tuition. They'd have far too few students. Thus, tuition would be more reasonable, and no one would have these outrageous loans hanging over their heads for decades.

I agree with what 23 said.

Just like people who took out mortgages beyond their means, it's your own fault if you studied bullshit in college and now you can't pay back your loans. You should have studied something more lucrative (e.g. business, science, or engineering) you little bitch.

So, no one wants to feel cheated, and a lot of people on this site would feel cheated if some [former]students received a free graduate education. Why? 'I paid, you should too!' That is the logic of college fraternity hazing. I do not expect, or need, a government student loan bailout. I do, however, think that as a nation we should all recognize how few advantages our status as "developed" confers upon as compared with the rest of the "developed" world. For all of our taxes, hard work and strife, we don't get health care, we don't get free or merit-based college education (generally, unless by "merit" you mean parental wealth), and we don't get to retire or die with dignity. Call me a hippy. A socialist. A communist. But right now, I'd rather be a French citizen with all the benefits appurtenant thereto in terms of free health care, college education, maternity aid and more.

278---By all means, go to France. One less socialist douchebag to deal with.

Too many posters miss the fact that they took out loans for an education/degree which, in fact, they received and which no one can take away. Once you have the degree, it's yours forever, whether you pay back the loan or not. What a sweet deal. What happens after you graduate is irrelevant. You got what you paid for, or didn't pay for, as the case may be! There was never any guarantee or promise of a job. Seems pretty different from the mortgage situation.

23 - you missed something. The article only calls for forgiving federal student loan debt. This is a max of ~$20,000 per year, which isn't even enough to cover tutition at most law schools. So the idea (which won't happen anyway) isn't really punishing people that took out loans and lived frugally, because those people would have had to take out at least $20k anyway.

I got into some of the "best" and most expensive undergraduate schools, but I decided to go to the "party school" that gave me a full ride (and had a really good degree program that I was interested in). After graduating at the top of my class from that I applied to and got into some of the "best" and most expensive law schools, but I decided to go to the in state law school that cost less for three years than the others did for one year AND is still in the top 50 of the rankings for whatever the rankings are worth. Then, I STILL got a 160k job offers from top firms.

There should be no bailout for people with student debt. It would be blatantly unfair to those who turned down the opportunity to go to the "best" schools because of the massive amounts of debt they would have been required to take on.

Why should I have to pay for somebody's Stanford, Harvard, Yale, etc. education when I accepted scholarships to my state schools and work my ass off to pay the rest of the tuition all while staying at the top of my class.

As a forty-eight year old businessman and father of two young college-age children, I find that the sarcasm and logic of this letter to President and Mrs. Obama makes for a humorous reading. However, to have been written by a law student, the oxymoron in his argument implies that had he not gotten an education, and therefore not borrowed for student loans, as he was supposedly "poorly advised," that he would be in better shape?

Allow me to share my perspective with the young author:

I regret that our economic times are making it tough for everyone - - educated and uneducated.

The alternative consideration is "who is most likely to come out ahead in the end?"

The urgency and pessimism of the immediate crisis seems to have canceled the original logic for which people made their initial decisions to invest in their educations. As for me, 27 years since I graduated from college, I have never used my degree - - - but I have used my education to great benefit throughout the course of my varied career experiences. A share of stock is still the property of the owner regardless of the share price. It seems that people, like the author of this letter, are dismissing the increased latent value of "their stock in themselves."

Since the government has started bailing out institutions and struggling homeowners, his implied sense of "entitlement" seems to be part of the rampant "give me money too" attitude that is overwhelming our good sense as a nation. Truly, to what are we as Americans really entitled? Life? Liberty? The pursuit of happiness? As much as I would like for his meritorious idea to forgive student loans to become policy, there is little likelihood that it will. Instead, I urge him to get busy and "pursue happiness" with a stronger zeal than the next guy or gal, and quit whining. Somebody's going to win. And in a tight economy, the prizes will go to the most competitive.

That's what's missing! Competitiveness. He should recognize that he's in a much stronger position to compete than someone who doesn't have his "tens of thousands in student loan debt" - - - nor his law degree!

He can chose to become a victor, instead of feeling like a victim. He is no more a "victim" than anyone else in America. So, if he's not seeking to "significantly up his game," then to him I say, "Too bad!" (Remember: "Pursuit of happiness" suggests that you have to capture it.)

Anyway, all of this "stimulus" is functionally borrowing money against future tax receipts in order to get people spending - - borrowed money. That means that ultimately, it will still have to be paid back.

Our problem in America, is that we don't want to face the fact that we must become more productive, and increase our GDP Growth in excess of the growth rate of our Federal Budget Deficit. To do so will require investment of real capital - - - like human capital - - - like that which comes from having an education. So lets start with that!

The more educated, the greater ones capacity to produce. More than a good idea, nowadays, its a responsibility!

Whether paid for with cash or credit, the return on investment yields when one produces at their attained capacity. As frustrated as he may be, our harsh realities are not going to be resolved by government intervention. The "stimulus" is put forth to initiate a "response"; a desired and appropriate response to the challenges of our economic times.

His article's "response," although entertaining, is not what President Obama has in mind.

Where is the entrepreneurial spirit anymore? What better means for creating value than through the proper application of one's trained intellect? The solutions are out there. Who better to be at the center of the solutions than those who are educated in law?

I sincerely hope the young author does get his "stimulus" from the President.

But if not, then I hope these ideas will serve him equally well instead.

I make 12,000 a year at a full-time entry-level crappy job and have over 80,000 in loans. Hate me and call me stupid if you want, but some help sounds great. I feel like I am drowning. I did not know myself well enough to pick the right career and now I know what I would like to do but will never be able to realize it thanks to the mountain of debt. I wouldn't dare add to it before I have it paid off. I would love to live in a part of town where I don't have to worry about stray bullets. And NO I can't get help from my parents even though their income was included as a factor with my school loans. They don't give a f$%^.

284--You are an adult. Your parents don't owe you anything.

282 - 181 here. I couldn't agree more.

210, that sounds like an interesting idea, but ultimately untenable. Tuition will never lower especially at decent schools. It's great that your school has a great endowment but that endowment could have come from a donor that expressly conditioned their funds to be built towards those dorms. All but the most elite schools are struggling to keep good faculty from leaving and to fund their chairs and tenure. The economics of funding at law schools prevent your idea from ever becoming a reality, you profoundly misunderstand how the system works.

Also, 211 = Asshat. My original post was intended to address the original post and those shaneless freeriders that supported it.

And also, I believe, 210 = 211 = Asshat twice over.

I'm 210/180. And no, not 211, but good use of "Asshat"

I didn't suggest my idea was practicable, I just said it might help resolve the issue that everyone who took a scholarship is whining about. And yes, the donor did expressly direct the funds to build a dorm bearing his name. BUT we don't also need $900 chairs in every single classroom a billion times over. I went to a public undergrad, sat in plastic chairs, and was fine.

I just don't understand what you're so pissed off about. Yes, I go to Stanford. Yes, you got into T5 schools too. What is your point? I made one choice, you made another. Congratulations to both of us. But why are you putting everyone down? I can stoop to your level and point out all the errors (grammatical and spelling) in your post and suggest that if those showed up in your applications, it's not surprising you didn't end up at HYS. But I won't. Oh whoops, just did.

My bad.

Oh, and I was referring to your post at 181, just for clarity.

If this actually works, I'm definitely going back to school.

I paid off my student loan debt, you pay off your own.

It is a said state when people shirk the responsibility of dealing with the consequences of their own choices.

A bailout isn't the answer. Expanding the possibilities for debt forgiveness might be. For instance--the government currently forgives a certain amount of your Stafford loan if you perform various public services, such as teaching in a low-income area. Well, as a community college professor teaching in a low-income area--whose salary is actually less than what most secondary teachers in the same place are earning--it seems to me that I should qualify for the same forgiveness program, but I don't. The distinction between high school and community college in this case seems completely arbitrary. I serve the public; I'm a state employee; my students are based almost wholly within the immediate vicinity; my work directly impacts my community. Now, I enjoy my job, and stay because I believe it makes a difference. But I really don't have to. I could take the same job in Cairo or Tehran. Or just move to a better American city. The lack of incentives like these really tells you that the government isn't yet prepared to expand their definition of public service, much less reward it.

I have a $120,000 student loan which is 50% interest from Sallie Mae. I had to go to an expensive private university because it was the only thing available at night. I am a contractor and that is basically the only employment available through an agency, where you work six months and look for another job six months later, then give your job to offshore labor, no benefits of course. I never made enough to pay the loan and then again was paying income sensitive where it didn't do any good to even do that. The interest was 8.25% and it still is 8.25% and there is nothing I can do about it. I wrote to President Obama about it but it might be all for not. I finally filed a Chapter 13 to have the interest stopped. I am paying $1000 a month for five years with no interest. However, the bill will be down to $30,000 but it cost me my credit. That still is a lot of money and pain to suffer through. What hope do we have unless we get the same bailout plan that mortgage owners have? I am 56 years old and I sure don’t want to pay for this when I retire. I just hope the Government considers that even forcing student loan companies to drop the interest on all student loans, not just the new ones would let people pay back loans quicker. I don’t care about the company’s problem; I care about mine and not paying their extravagant interest. Predatory is right!

I have a $120,000 student loan which is 50% interest from Sallie Mae. I had to go to an expensive private university because it was the only thing available at night. I am a contractor and that is basically the only employment available through an agency, where you work six months and look for another job six months later, then give your job to offshore labor, no benefits of course. I never made enough to pay the loan and then again was paying income sensitive where it didn't do any good to even do that. The interest was 8.25% and it still is 8.25% and there is nothing I can do about it. I wrote to President Obama about it but it might be all for not. I finally filed a Chapter 13 to have the interest stopped. I am paying $1000 a month for five years with no interest. However, the bill will be down to $30,000 but it cost me my credit. That still is a lot of money and pain to suffer through. What hope do we have unless we get the same bailout plan that mortgage owners have? I am 56 years old and I sure don’t want to pay for this when I retire. I just hope the Government considers that even forcing student loan companies to drop the interest on all student loans, not just the new ones would let people pay back loans quicker. I don’t care about the company’s problem; I care about mine and not paying their extravagant interest. Predatory is right!

You big pussy. Lets shift all that debt to the taxpayers. You're telling me you used all that loan money for school. Please, get real you big pussy.

I was fortunate enough to have my parents pay for my undergrad degree, but I went to Berkeley and paid in-state tuition. When I graduated I went to grad school, then law school, because my long term career plans necessitate having both degrees. I worked through both degrees (and worked while at Berkeley too, saving up for grad school)--taking paid employment positions to supplement my loan income. My peers all did "volunteer internships" at prestigious institutions throughout the world while I was the one staying on campus teaching summer school to rich foreign brats so I could pay the bills and continue my research. Now I'm in my final year of law school and am working for peanuts at a retail job just so I can pay the bills. I regularly eat the discount food and beans and rice is a staple. Given that I've been living so smartly and frugally it's really shit deal that I'm now saddled with piles of loans, limited prospects of paying them back anytime in the next 2 decades, and a resume that has top-tier educational degrees but work experience consisting of bar and retail jobs to pay for it all. None of us expected the economy to go bust 2 or 3 years ago when we signed up for all this.

My request--loan forgiveness would be nice but is a long shot in the dark. Refinancing with very low interest rates seems to be the best option. A friend has been working for 3 years and only JUST starting paying off the principle. It's flexibility without forgiveness.

I went to law school because I wanted to be a public defender. After the first year I was in the bottom half of my class, but I owed $25,000 and thought I'd better finish and become a lawyer so I could pay my loans. I made it through, but couldn't pass the bar. I couldn't get a job for over 2 years (even though I sent out over 200 resumes). I'm not in default yet, but my total debt has almost doubled in 5 years (from $95,000 to $185,000) with fees, interest and penalties. I finally found a job as a legal secretary. I make under $30,000 a year. My student loan payments (government and private) are more per month than my take home pay. I send what I can, but they are going to go into default anyway, and the loan companies can add a penalty of 25% of the loan amount (more than $20,000). Is that why they won't help me avoid default by lowering my payments? The loan companies have no incentive. Some of you say "pay your student loans" but, even if I did, I'd still owe more than 100% of my original amount. It's a crime what these loan companies are getting away with. No benefit of my bargain, and no risk to the loan companies at all.

Ok so the United States is one of the ONLY richer industrialized countries that makes their youth pay for Higher education. I don't understand people. In a country like Norway, with is a socialist country there is barely any poverty, people get everything for free, yes their taxes are higher, but it covers everything that half your paycheck goes to anyway. It honestly disgusts me that people put their material needs ahead of the greater good in this country. So thanks to people who need 5 flat screen Tv's, a Mercedes SUV (or a Hummer is acceptable answer as well), and a house that is too expensive for them, the education system in this country will always be paid for out of pocket. Stop being so greedy America.

297, since European universities are so great, that must be why there are no European students studying in every American university, and why American students are flocking to study for full degrees in Europe.

Oh wait, it turns out you get what you pay for. If you want nearly-free education, go to a community college (where the quality is slightly better than public European universities with 200:1 student-faculty ratios).

When I started my education i was a single mother with 3 children to care for.I weny to vocational school for my L.P.N. That was 18 years ago.They have taken my Federal taxes since then only owed 5000.00 still owe more than what I started with.So tell me how this is fair ?Is there no end to it?Will I die oweing them?I will be 58 this year.The bailout would really help me,I'M sorry if some people don't think it's right but it's easy to judge when your not the one it is effecting.If you have a big paying job.A nurse dosen't make much especially when you have no one else to help you.

while this would be sweet, i'm not keeping my fingers crossed...

I somewhat agree with dismissing atleast a portion of the student loan debts. Any kind of financial help to tax payers would help stimulate the economy. After all, isn't this what America needs? And while we are on the subject of bail out, how about the President help us with our mortgage? Visit my blog at www.bailoutmyfatass.blogspot.com and read my story.
Thanks
Annie Fannie

I somewhat agree with dismissing atleast a portion of the student loan debts. Any kind of financial help to tax payers would help stimulate the economy. After all, isn't this what America needs? And while we are on the subject of bail out, how about the President help us with our mortgage? Visit my blog at www.bailoutmyfatass.blogspot.com and read my story.
Thanks
Annie Fannie

I totally agree. I started my own firm in Northern California. There is no way I can pay off my loans in a reasonable period of time.

to commenter #34:

The audacity!!! I can't believe you have the gall to say that to young law students/future lawyers.

Just like a negro to look for another hand out. Just because you got a ticket doesn't mean you deserve a free ride.

So you want me to be punished for having the means to PAY for my education? Meanwhile, you take up a spot you didn't deserve and can't pay for, then have the nerve to ask for ANOTHER HANDOUT. Pretty stereotypical. Just like your people to beg for a handout and then renig on your obligations. You are filthy, worthless, lazy, scum.

-The Prestigious Southerner

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Hmmm--didn't know the CEOs of the US automotive industry and Wall Street bankers were "negros"--people like you should be shot and killed at point blank range--you're ignorant, stupid, vile and evil and should not walk the Earth--so yes, i do believe you are a Southerner (at least one with an antebellum white Kmart sheet mentality). Absolute sewer and gutter filth--ahh, you can take them from the trailer park but you can't--ahh, you know the rest.....

I am paying for the right to owe 40,000+ for my education. None of my hard earned dollars, forked over every month, are even being applied to the principal. We've been told our entire lives that education = awesome job opportunities. I don't recall anyone telling me that education = a lifetime of debt. Yeah, my last loan statement showed by final payment date as 2027, and that is only if I pay the full 400 dollars on time every month. So even under those unrealistic terms, I will be paying until I am 47 years old. Freakin awesome, huh!

Please let me know if there is an organization I can join or something I can do to promote the student loan bailout. I'm not going to live long enough to pay off the debt I owe. I am a teacher and I live in an area where there are no jobs or the jobs are given to family friends and relatives. Very discouraging with no hope. Thanks.

I am one of many US Military Veterans and after One Thousand Two Hundred class room hours . the un professional communists at spartan school of fraud , money racketering etc. messed me over like i was a communist or worst than dirt . After being turned down to continue school after my federal duty obligation and 20 years later with no liscense and paid 17Thousand dollars with facing 9% interest and only God knows how much longer to pay on this godless inhumane school loan. I pray for the United States of America to at least bare minimum to not charge us USmilitary Veterans no interest..In Jesus Christ i trust and no other.

I am one of many US Military Veterans and after One Thousand Two Hundred class room hours . the un professional communists at spartan school of fraud , money racketering etc. messed me over like i was a communist or worst than dirt . After being turned down to continue school after my federal duty obligation and 20 years later with no liscense and paid 17Thousand dollars with facing 9% interest and only God knows how much longer to pay on this godless inhumane school loan. I pray for the United States of America to at least bare minimum to not charge us USmilitary Veterans no interest..In Jesus Christ i trust and no other.

I can't understand how congress & Pres. Obama cannot see how this issue is hurting the economy. They keep talking bailouts of Corporate America Fatcats, but the struggling young adult cannot get a good start because thier credit is ruined because they cannot get a job or decent paying job to pay back loans.

My daughter was in heading into her senior year when her dad was diagnosed with terfminal cancer. She took the semester off, she was preparing to go back when her grandmother got ill and passed away (her last living grandparent. By this time her loans came due, she was unable to secure additional funding to return and bvecause of the job market, has not been able to find a fulltime job...she has no degree after being $45000, in debt.

Her boyfriend is in a similar situation...how can they start their lives together in this economic mess that will last them years to come??

How do we get the policy makers to look at this issue and take it seriously?

I can't understand how congress & Pres. Obama cannot see how this issue is hurting the economy. They keep talking bailouts of Corporate America Fatcats, but the struggling young adult cannot get a good start because thier credit is ruined because they cannot get a job or decent paying job to pay back loans.

My daughter was in heading into her senior year when her dad was diagnosed with terfminal cancer. She took the semester off, she was preparing to go back when her grandmother got ill and passed away (her last living grandparent. By this time her loans came due, she was unable to secure additional funding to return and bvecause of the job market, has not been able to find a fulltime job...she has no degree after being $45000, in debt.

Her boyfriend is in a similar situation...how can they start their lives together in this economic mess that will last them years to come??

How do we get the policy makers to look at this issue and take it seriously?