foisties!

Not the mailroom!!!!

The staff cuts are proof that firms are moving toward the direction of foreign based outsourcing. Or do you really believe peer and non-peer firms will pay you know nothing associates a handsome salary to make your own copies and lick your own stamps? For you 3Ls thinking about enrolling in the LLM practical skills degree program, you might as well obtain an LLM from the New Delphi Law School.

Record keeping...

San Francisco K&E also lost 14 staff on Friday.

It's New Delhi you MORON!

Partner Emeritus my ass!

You know, the same people who bitch and moan about ATL reporting about staff cuts and layoffs at regional firms would be the same people bitching and moaning about ATL not covering the "warning signs" from firms and regions about to conduct attorney layoffs. If you haven't noticed, staff cuts are typically the first sign of an impending associate layoff. If the staff cuts don't significantly change the firm's bottomline, the next group is the associates, followed by partners.

Keep reporting these non-attorney layoffs. Unlike many of the douchebags here, I like know about industry/firm trends rather than sticking my head in the ground and my ass in the air waiting for someone to kick it to the curb.

pe, when were you laid off? b/c you have way to much time on your hands.....all you do is post multiple times on every single atl article? and the funny thing is, you have nothing interesting or funny to say. you are almost as annoying as t-10 1L.

I think pe is funny. keep doing your thing pe.

"Or do you really believe peer and non-peer firms will pay you know nothing associates a handsome salary to make your own copies and lick your own stamps?"

No, I don't. Good thing for me that I'm already independently wealthy, and am just getting my law degree for kicks.

IT'S OFFICIAL, PARTNER EMERITUS IS A FARCE -- Probably an over-educated biglaw paralegal and recent "A.B." grad from Williams or Bowdoin (who failed 3rd grade geography). Excellent job calling him out #7; saved the rest of us the trouble.

BE GONE PARTNER EMERITUS, or keep entertaining us with your banal schtick. Either way, you're irrelevant and pathetic to read a comment board meant for associates. Get a life.

This comment is addressed to post no. 7.

I see you have become familiar with the New Delhi Law School. Good luck with the LLM program. A word of advice, bring plenty of mouthwash to counter the curry taste of Indian food and save money to buy a new wardrobe since you will undoubtedly lose about 100lbs of lard weight from your New Delhi diet.

Lawyers are so bad at business. Why are you laying people off? I was speaking to Geithner the other day and he mentioned a program by a program in tandem with the federal reserve where you can sell law firm debt and get cash in return, you can even tell them the value for the debt, if its not liquid. this could float you for several years until you balance your books. then you can raise salaries for first years to get the best of the best and give bonuses for your partners. man you guys are so slow.

This comment is addressed to post no. 12.

The reason I come to this board is to preserve my stone cold resolve in treating associates in a degrading manner. You have shown no compassion for others who have been wiped out by the economic tsunami while your job hangs by a thread. I will take great pleasure in eliminating your job or your counterpart's job and sentence you to a life of penury for having an underserved "self-entitlement" disposition towards life. You can believe I am a farce, law student, college student or associate but I can assure you I am very real and I will haunt you when you become unemployed or when your student loans bury you alive.

the amount of worthless staff (and associates) at big firms like kirkland is why good ppl should not worry about their jobs even in this economy.

when firms fire hundreds or attorneys, this is clearly worrisome. however, firing 20 ass clown associates or 50 useless secretaries who do no work, is hardly huge news.

a good number of very smart associates (and staff) at these firms have no skills other than research and doing what they are told. these people don't deserve to have a guaranteed 7 yr. position, making $200-500K.

getting fired from a top firm for not being a top lawyer is not that weird. the economy has just brought this to a head, whereas before, these ppl could float by for years and take in nice salaries.

unless it's a huge latham-style firing, i wouldn't be worried.

yawn

LOL @ 3

What's with people jumping on PE as of late? If you don't like his schtick, don't read it. Of course PE's picture is that actor who played the president in Clear and Present Danger or whatever (as someone complained about late last week on a different thread). I didn't think that anyone actually believed his posts. Again, if you don't enjoy his over the top pronouncements, don't read them.

So, are we all in agreement that the earlier USNEWS leak was legit???????????

- panicked GW student

For the class of 2009, Kirkland still has not released start dates or summer stipends...

Seconded, 21. I don't get why Kirkland's delaying this much. Really hoping for some news today.

21,

damn that is nutty

start dates!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

There had been rumors for a while that a reorganization of the secretarial pool was coming, with a smaller number of secretaries handling more lawyers' work each. I guess there's this new thing called a computer that is reducing the demand for support staff. Leaving behind the 80's tech relic that is the AON center probably made some other support staff redundant.

Not to make excuses for K&E. Layoffs at this point suck, no matter what, and it's possible things could have been handled better. But some of this might have happened no matter what the economy.

K&E is a screaming flail of a firm.

N. Wacker Stud

I am so fed up with PE's shtick that I throw up a little any time i see the picture of Donald Moffat. Given that the guy is a non-stop poster, my whole desk is now covered in vomit. That's why i'm sure he's a partner, actually.

START DATES! START DATES! WTF! START DATES!

Why doesn't PE just point out that his messages are "[dictated but not read]"? No actual partner emeritus at a "peer firm" would degrade himself by hunching over a keyboard to write a letter. Does he also change his own oil? Of course not. That's what secretaries and mechanics are for: productive labor.

Furthermore, a partner emeritus does no work. That's what the emeritus bit means. He just hangs out at the firm, soaking up expensive AC and squatting in valuable corner office space, and offering antiquated, unsolicited, and unheeded advice to working lawyers (e.g., on non-compete agreements). He cant go home because after 40 years of living at the firm, his wife hates him and his children don't know him.

Regarding KE, I find it amusing that associates feel "pretty safe." I suppose they think that the few hundred thousand the firm saved by sacking the guys who put out the daily calendar is the difference between any one associate staying and going. Financially, this is little more than digging in the lobby couches for loose change. Its a compromise to assure the weak-willed "cool" partners that the firm will have done all they could do before dropping the hammer.

K&E's secretarial pool has been "tightened up" for the 21st century. Next in line: cleaning up the incredibly BLOATED administrative/managerial group. It is really something to behold. They wanted to take a group picture but Soldier Field wasn't able to accommodate all of them.

Its true that Kirkland has yet to release start dates for incoming associates ; however, we did receive our stipend information (at least, those of us going to the Chicago office have received that info) - Kirkland Chicago offers a choice between a $10K stipend if the associate does no legal work, or a $28K stipend if the incoming associate participates in the PILI program.

There had been rumors for a while that a reorganization of the secretarial pool was coming, with a smaller number of secretaries handling more lawyers' work each. I guess there's this new thing called a computer that is reducing the demand for support staff. Leaving behind the 80's tech relic that is the AON center probably made some other support staff redundant.
===================
Retired partner here: When I started practicing law, there was one secretary for each attorney. Some years down the road, we moved to one secretary for two attorneys, but the rule didn't apply to those of us who were partners. Later, we moved to two attorneys (one associate/one partner) per secretary. Shortly before I retired, we had three associates per secretary, with one partner/one associate per secretary. I had the same secretary for over 30 years. In today's world, I'm not sure there is any need for associates to have secretaries, and only a little justification for partners.

The ship be sinking...

Our Kirkland brothers,

We would be glad if you joined our protest on May 1st considering lipstick is across from citigroup building. Let's meet at Barnes and Noble.

"The cuts only took place in Chicago, New York, and D.C."

Your hard-at-work sources suck. There were plenty cut in LA and SF as well.

Any European or Asian changes?

Talked to a staff member today. She said, "When I die and come back, I am NOT going to be Staff!"

I agree that a staff layoff is the leading indicator of the health of a firm!

K&E attorneys you're next, you can take that to the bank, if they aren't shut down!

Kirkland Los Angeles start date = Nov 2

30 nailed it! I can't imagine there is another Biglaw firm with anywhere near the proportion of administrative staff to productive members of the firm. The firm is so top heavy with management, I'm waiting for the new building to keel over and fall into the river. PPP would skyrocket if Kirkland got rid of 50% of these do-nothing people.

38: source?

PE is so old, he remembers when he dated the Delphi Oracle.

Associates have been cut as well. My understanding is that they are still "active" K&E associates but do not get benefits and pay. They are on an unpaid leave. I hear they have been doing this with MANY associates. Also my source told me that the corp. practive area among others are in the tank and they are getting rid of poor performers and taking others and putting them in stronger practice areas - like it or not. Seems like litigation group is what is keeping the firm alive!

LA has had the Nov. 2nd start date set for awhile. It's the other offices that haven't. Kirkland's the only V10 firm yet to announce (outside of the LA office). Why the delay?

42 - Good work. This thread was desperately lacking in wild rumors.

I heard that they closed down the bankruptcy practice, and have actually paid Blockbuster and General Growth to pretend to go bankrupt as a cover.

Also, the real reason they moved out of the old building is they killed so many associates to keep them quiet about this that they could no longer get all the blood out of the carpeting.

39, my secretary answers ALL of my phone calls, reads my e-mails and responds to many of them, deletes spam, etc. Also, I've recently taken away the responsibility for preparing document binders and files from a legal assistant who was inefficient and given them all to my secretary to handle -- with no cost to the client. Reinvent the secretary's role, but certainly don't eliminate it. Especially in a biglaw firm where I've never even met the receptionist/operator and certainly don't want him/her being the gateway for my clients.

45, 39 here. I certainly hope you're giving your secretary more to do than answer your phone and check your e-mail. Creating binders is a start, but I'm sure she can handle more than that, too. Does she format and/or proofread your documents? Does she enter your time and handle your travel plans? You'd be surprised how many tasks your secretary could complete if given the chance.

39, what I mentioned in 45 was only a fraction. She does all of the tasks you list -- and more.

PE:
You're a stuffy idiot!

Years ago, when attorneys were more conscience of making a good impression on judges, their peers and clients they were more critical of presentation of their “work product.” Thus, a skilled professional secretary was crucial to an attorney's career. Today, when attorneys type their own briefs and letters filled with "garbage speak" and grammatical errors they feel they don’t “require” staff to add perfect to perfection. The legal field will continue its decline to a profession of highly paid idiots!

Partner Emeritus you idiot, this is not a sign of outsourcing, it is a sign of attorneys being more self-sufficient and needing less secretarial help.

As far as associates being self-sufficient, how about all those documents that are corrupted and crash because of all the copying and pasting from outside sources? Word processing, secretaries and help desk end up repairing and cleaning up the document or even stripping it completely and reformatting and putting in numbering schemes and styles.

Is it really cost efficient for firms to bill clients several hundred dollars per hour for the associate to clean up their own documents?

Firms are contributing to the bloat of unemployment by throwing their staffers out.

49 - Contrary to your misguided belief, most associates are highly capable of typing up a brief/agreement without an unacceptable number of errors. Forgive us for not interrupting your internet surfing/gossiping/eating to add "perfection" to our documents.

Sorry you got laid off.

49, I hope that post was ironic. Otherwise, you really should have had your secretary proof-read that mess before you posted it.

"conscience of" --> "conscious of"
"judges, their peers and clients they" --> "judges, peers and clients, they"
"more critical of presentation of" -->"more critical of the presentation of " (or try "more assiduous in presenting")
"grammatical errors they" --> "grammatical errors, they"
"its decline to a profession" --> "its decline, ultimately becoming nothing more than a profession"

Aside from the bad grammar, the stylistic choices are universally poor.

With regard to the vast, labyrinthine K&E administrative bureaucracy:

Could anyone enlighten me/us as to the difference(s) between a "coordinator" and a "specialist"? When/how does a "Director" become a "Senior Director"? Or an "Associate Director"? Judging from the most recent firmwide directory, there are quite possibly more of these coordinator/specialist/manager/director types than there are equity partners. Unbelievable.

Specialists do things--it's just an inflated term for support staff grunt. Coordinators do things, and also coordinate the activities of specialists. Associate Director is a fancier and likely more expensive term for Manager--they coordinate the activities of one or more specialists, or coordinators if the department is large enough to warrant them. Directors manage Associate Directors--some used to be called Senior Managers. The distinction between Directors and Senior Directors seems arbitrary, and likely comes down to tenure and ego.

Associates have been cut as well. My understanding is that they are still "active" K&E associates but do not get benefits and pay. They are on an unpaid leave. I hear they have been doing this with MANY associates. Also my source told me that the corp. practive area among others are in the tank and they are getting rid of poor performers and taking others and putting them in stronger practice areas - like it or not. Seems like litigation group is what is keeping the firm alive!

i agree

52 -- ha! ha! you make me laugh. you have never created a brief/agreement from scratch in your life (at BigLaw). your true abilities lie only in that you use the copy + paste function, when lifting from precedent. you actually need to copy + paste special so you don't corrupt your brief/agreement -- but you're never going to listen to me because I am "only" a secretary, who wisely decided to keep my life simple (and happy).

don't kid yourself that you actually know how to create an agreement with few, if any, grammatical/formatting errors.

and no, I was not laid off. fortunately i'm still here at K&E (for now), as I am needed to fix your mistakes.

BREAKING NEWS : Partner Emeritus is doing one hour overtime work at the other side of the glory hole!

--Mohammad

53 - This is a blog and not a brief to be filed nor a letter to a client. I can write however I want in this forum. Most of us attorneys here aren't spell checking, etc. And I'm certainly NOT writing a book here. A secretarial review of my posts aren't necessary! Should ATL require that in the future, I certainly will request it.

The actual word is that further staff, Legal Assistants and some Associates will be cut either the week of July 15 or the following week. Mostly in the corporate group based on date of hire. That is the word. Remember Tech Dept. handles BES and sees all Network traffic.

If you're an LA at Kirkland hired in the last 3-4 years start planning now. If you're an associate in corporate no telling - but plan for the worst.

Notice BTW, that no one speaks of the severance packages that staff gets. Those least able to handle the economic downturn are cut loose first with a mere pittance. And how will that ever help balance the books of Big Law? It won't.

It is not until the bloated Summer Programs, and ridiculous Associate/Partner draws and benefits are slashed that Big Law will be back in the green.

It's really interesting that some of the comments seem to share a belief that secretaries and staff aren't needed today. It would be interesting if the clients of large firms like K&E actually started to question the billable hours and what they would think if they discovered that they were being charged attorney's rates for clerical services. It sounds like a ponzi scheme to me. ;-)

60:

You must be smoking the green if

"Revenue rose 7% to $1.4 billion, and profit per partner was flat at $2.47 million. Revenue per lawyer fell 3% to $1.05 million" is not "in the green"

http://www.jdjournal.com/2009/03/08/kirkland-ellis-revenue-up-profits-flat/

59 - I wouldn't worry about the use of punctuation or sentence structure here, but I think that 53's example of conscience vs conscious is germane to an argument about whether or not a law degree makes that person smarter (or more capable) than the average secretary.

60 - you obviously don't have a clue; more unfounded and unsubtantiated rumors. As already noted previously, laid off staff did receive severance, including health benefits.

60 could be on to something. Let the dust settle between now and late July (after the summer program has run its course).

60: You sound like a SR Legal ASS who thinks that their job is secure. GO back to work JD!!!!!

60: You sound like a SR Legal ASS who thinks that their job is secure. GO back to work JD!!!!!

The reason attorneys at big firms like K&E bill at such reasonable rates (:o) is overhead. Cutting out the secretaries and their salaries means they will lower their billing rates right? Oh wait....

losers