We hope you 3Ls haven’t signed leases in your new cities if you haven’t gotten a definite start date yet from your firm. Though it’s already mid-April, firms are continuing to assess their work levels and are determining that they won’t need new associates this fall. And, in some cases, maybe not even next fall.
Thanks to the really sucky economy — we’ve given up on putting this eloquently — many law firms have pushed start dates back to 2010, and even 2011. The announcements have been rolling in at a rapid clip, so we’re bringing you a new round-up.
DLA Piper is one of the latest to tell its incoming associates to write off 2009. From a recruiting e-mail sent around yesterday:
First, we expect that Monday, January 11, 2010 will be the start date for the next incoming class. In addition to the bar stipend program, the firm will pay you an additional stipend of $5,000 per month in November and December, 2009. This stipend will be paid to all members of the class and is not dependent on when you join the firm.
Second, since the incoming class may also be larger than our workflow needs in January 2010, we want to encourage you to try and secure a pro bono or community fellowship for up to one year prior to joining the firm for which we will compensate you… Should you choose to participate in such a fellowship, we will pay you a stipend of $5,000 per month while you are actively engaged with the fellowship, for a period of up to one year (January 1, 2010 to December 31, 2010), provided you obtain a firm-approved position with a government, civic or non-profit organization serving the public interest. We encourage you to consider this option, particularly those of you who are focused on a transactional practice area since we expect the financial markets to continue to be slow overall.
Finally, while we are offering the pro bono and community fellowships now as a voluntary option, we will continue to monitor the economic climate and our work force needs between now and January 2010 and reserve the right to offer a fellowship assignment in lieu of a Firm assignment.
So…. DLA Piperites can maybe start January 11, 2010, but the tone of that e-mail is just short of pleading them to seek out a public interest gig for the year.
Getting a taste of the nonprofit life is not the worst thing in the world. At least Biglaw-bound associates will get to experience a normal 9-to-5ish work schedule before putting on the golden shackles and resigning themselves to 10 p.m. order-in sushi dinners at the office from 2011 on (assuming market conditions improve!).
Check out the latest round-up of start dates at firms across the country, after the jump.
(Ed. note: We’re continuing to update the list as new tips come in. The last update occurred at 5:49 p.m. on April 18. Thanks to all of you who have sent us tips!)
This list is mainly based on reports from tipsters, and so we consider it an “unofficial” round-up. Feel free to send us corrections at tips@abovethelaw.com with the subject “Nationwide Start Date Watch.” We prefer e-mail to receiving tips in the comments.
Here are the dates incoming associates (hope to) start. We’ve only noted deferral stipend amounts, not “normal” stipends or other extras, like bar exam fees. Many of you have asked us to note the firms that are not offering stipends. We have done so when we know so, but if you have more information for us, you know our e-mail: tips@abovethelaw.com.
Akin Gump - January 2010 ($10,000 stipend), or March 2010 ($15,000 stipend); September 14, 2009 for some Houston associates
Allen & Overy - September 21, 2009
Alston & Bird - January 19, 2010 ($10,000 stipend)
Arent Fox - November 1, 2009 for some; February 1, 2010 for others ($5,000 stipend)
Ballard Spahr - September 2010 ($45,000 stipend)
Baker Botts - November 16th, 2009 (Houston office)
Baker Hostetler - October 15, 2009
Baker & McKenzie - January 2010 (no stipend)
Bingham McCutchen - has not yet announced
Blank Rome - “deferred until at least January” 2010 with no information provided yet as to a definitive date or stipend
Bryan Cave - January 19, 2010 ($10k stipend)
Cadwalader - October 5, 2009
Cahill Gordon - has not yet announced
Cleary - staggered options: September 14/ October 12/ November 9, 2009 or January 11, 2010
Clifford Chance - 20 incoming associates will start in January 2010 ($10,000 stipend); About 30 others will start in October 2010 (stipend of $3,335-$5,000 per month).
Chadbourne & Parke - January 2010
Cooley Godward Kronish - January 4, 2010. ($25,000 stipend, including bar stipend)
Cravath - October 2009, November 2009 or January 2010
Davis Polk - September 14, October 19, or November 16, 2009
Davis Wright Tremaine - January 2010 ($7,500 stipend)
Debevoise - 2009, baby! September 21, October 12, October 26, or November 16
Dechert - October 5, 2009
Dewey & LeBoeuf - January 11, 2010 ($5,000 stipend)
DLA Piper - January 11, 2010 ($10,000 stipend)
Dorsey & Whitney - November 30, 2009
Edwards Angell Palmer & Dodge - March 1, 2010
Faegre & Benson - delayed until “at least October, 2009”
Fenwick & West - has not yet announced
Finnegan - November 2, 2009
Foley & Lardner - September 7th, 2009 (Boston office)
Fried Frank - January 28, 2010 ($10,000 stipend); Fall 2010 ($70,000 stipend)
Fulbright & Jaworski - January 11, 2010
Gibson Dunn - November 16 and November 30, 2009
Goldberg Kohn - “Indefinitely deferred,” March 2010 at the earliest
Goodwin Procter - January 2010 for half of its 125 new associates; October 2010 for the rest ($60,000 stipend with pro bono work)
Greenberg Traurig - January 2010
Hogan & Hartson - November 30, 2009
Holland & Knight - January 11, 2010
Holme, Roberts & Owen - October 2010 (Can accept a one time payment of 15K or 30K in installments, contingent on accepting a public interest job)
Hunton & Williams - November 2009 (D.C. office); January 2010
Irell & Manella - As early as the week after the bar exam; November 1, 2009 at the latest
Jenner & Block - November 2009 (Chicago office)
Jones Day’ - October 26, 2009
Katten - February 1, 2010 ($15,000 stipend)
Kaye Scholer - January 11, 2010
King & Spalding - January 19, 2010
Kramer Levin - October 26, 2009
Latham - December 2009; October 2010 ($75,000 stipend)
LeClair Ryan - January 2010
Linklaters - September 2009
Locke Lord Bissell & Liddell - January 2010 (no stipend, no health insurance, no salary advance)
Mayer Brown - January 19, 2010 ($5,000 monthly stipend and subsidized medical benefits during the deferral period)
McDermott Will & Emory - December 1, 2009
McGuire Woods - September 2009 (but salaries have been reduced from $160K to $145K)
Milbank Tweed - January 25, 2010 ($10,000 stipend)
Mintz Levin - January 11, 2010 ($15,000 salary advance)
Morgan Lewis - October 2010
Morrison & Foerster - November 2, 2009 will be the earliest start date
Munger, Tolles & Olson - 2009! (Any Monday after the bar exam)
O’Melveny & Myers - December 2009
Orrick - January 2010; March 2010; or Winter 2010 ( $60,000 “honorarium”)
Nixon Peabody - January 2010
Paul Hastings - October 12, 2009
Paul Weiss - September 14, 2009
Pepper Hamilton January 19, 2010
Perkins Coie - January 4, 2010 ($7,500 stipend)
Pillsbury - has not yet announced
Proskauer Rose - January 2010 ($10,000 stipend) or March 2010 ($20,000 stipend), or pro bono deferral option with start date of January 2011 ($60,000 stipend)
Quarles & Brady - January 2010
Quinn Emanuel - 2009, any Monday after the bar exam
Ropes & Gray - January 2010 (no stipend)
Schulte Roth & Zabel - January 28, 2010 ($20k stipend); Limited number of public interest deferrals until Fall 2010 ($70,000 stipend)
Seyfarth Shaw - October 19, 2009
Shearman & Sterling - December 2009 at the earliest, or September 2010 with a $65,000 deferral stipend
Sidley Austin - November 2 or November 16, 2009
Simpson Thacher & Bartlett - September 21, October 26, and November 30, 2009
Skadden - October 2009
Snell & Wilmer, LLP - December 2009 ($5,000 stipend)
Sonnenschein - 20 associates have start dates between September 2009 and Fall 2010 ($5,000 stipend), but nine have been deferred to January 2011 (a paltry $10,000 stipend!)
Squire Sanders - January 19, 2010 ($10,000 stipend)
Steptoe & Johnson - has not yet announced
Sullivan & Cromwell - November 2, 2009
Sutherland - January 2010 ($7,500 stipend)
Troutman Sanders - January 2010 (no stipend and no health insurance)
Venable - January 2010
Vinson & Elkins - November 2, 2009 or January 4, 2010
Wachtell - September 14 or October 12, 2009; November 2, 2009 for clerks only
Weil Gotshal - January 2010 ($15,000 deferral stipend); January 2011 for others ($75,000 stipend)
White & Case - November 2009 for 40% of new associates; 2010 for the rest (with a $45,000 stipend, or a $75,000 stipend if they pursue volunteer or community service during the deferral period)
Wiley Rein - January 11, 2010 for some; October 2010 for others with $5K/month stipend
Willkie Farr - September, October, or November, 2009
WilmerHale - January 20 or March 17, 2010 ($10k stipend for Jan,; $15k stipend for March); also offering $75,000 stipend with fall 2010 deferral option
Wilson Sonsini - January, 2010 ($10,000 stipend)
Winstead - February, 2010
Winston and Strawn - January 19, 2010 ($15k stipend + health insurance)
Earlier: Previous Start Date Coverage on ATL
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Comments
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Is there any way you could also do this list in calendar mode? To see how the firms are staggered? THANKS.
By this summer, start dates will be pushed back to 2011.
Simpson Thacher & Bartlett: September 21, October 26, and November 30
Falsely advertised: Firms that fall short of what they claim to be
The Worst Ten
1. Sonnenschein (You’re dumb if you even consider this firm.)
2. Greenberg Traurig
3. Luce Forward (3L offers revoked; summer program cancelled)
4. Orrick (20% of associates fired)
5. Pillsbury
6. White & Case
7. Cooley Godward (13% of associates fired)
8. Squire Sanders (2L summer offers revoked; 7 wk summer program)
9. Arent Fox
10. Alston Bird
I did not choose BigLaw to do pro bono work.
DLA requires all associates to pay back their bar stipend after joining the firm. Are they going to do the same with these 5K amounts?
Piper? I barely even knew her!
Where are KIRKLAND start dates?
am 1L at a T50 public school and also top 10% in class. What are my chances of landing a vault T20 SA like DLA for next year?
Kirkland start dates are not prestigious enough.
N. Wacker Stud
Horrible. Corp associates essentially being told they must defer until 2011... Sounds like a veiled layoff to me.
am 1L at a T50 public school and also top 10% in class. What are my chances of landing a vault T20 SA like DLA for next year?
How are the Simpson dates not up yet? They have been available for about a month now.
I smell section 90
10 = Skadden? Regardless, I agree.
Promassory Estoppelobster
No health insurance w/ that "voluntary" DLA 2011 deferral either...
The ship be sinking...
Whats an N. Wacker Stud? A Nut Whacker?
I can has jobz waiting for me in 2010?
N. Wacker Stud = Stud on N. Wacker
21,
Like a hot ripped man on top of an N. Wacker?
PROMassORY ESTOPPELobster
Hey Biglaw Firms - instead of spending all of this money on deferral stipends why don't you use it to lobby Congress to provide a student loan bailout. I was only planning on working for your firm for a couple of years anyway to help pay down my loans, then I was going to make my way to a smaller firm making a good living without the biglaw hours. So if you don't want us around that's fine, but I'm not going anywhere until I can knock my loans down to under six figures.
any chance firms that already announced and didn't offer a stipend will cough one up to meet market?
*not holding my breath*
ummm section 90 yet?
Pretty sure the STB/DPW start dates aren't up yet because the firms haven't actually contacted 3Ls to confirm who gets which start dates (potential for pushbacks).
What are the chances of 3Ls actually starting at these firms?
Also, are 3Ls going into litigation in a better position than those going into transactional?
C'Mon Kirkland. What the fuck?
DLA blows hard chunks. This firm merged with everyone they could -- global expansion for the sake of global expansion -- whoops -- this is what happens when you pay no attention at all to the quality of lawyers that you are merging with -- there was a reason that the firms DLA merged with were not able to charge super premium rates -- their lawyers weren't of that calliber -- there is a reason why clients are now deciding not to use DLA and their over-inflated rates (and egos).
Then they lost their #1 rainmaker. Then they cancelled holiday parties. Then they no-offered tons of summers. Then they had mass lay-offs. Then they froze salaries. Then they raised $$ and told all income parterns they could simply become equity partners if they bought in for $150,000. Then they froze assocaite salaries. Now they're pusing back start dates. Is there anything left for this firm to do? Yes. Fold. Bye bye DLA.
I am not gay. I have not had buttsecks in three months.
Glad Elie finally decided to show up for work today...
Anyone know what's going on at Fulbright? How are things?
As Kirkland lacks the prestige of those firms that are south east of the river, I am not surprised.
N. Wacker Stud
SERIOUSLY KIRKLAND. THIS IS RIDICULOUS.
Ron Jaworski says Fulbright is fine.
There is only one image in my life that makes me consistently happy no matter when I think about it.... and that image is of a beautiful deferred 3L going to Winston Strawn.
If I were a young lawyer coming out of a top law school, i would use the current environment to f**k off for a year or two, without that hurting my subsequent employment opps. too much.
it is time for violence. wall street and biglaw partners must pay for taking the economy down. they knew the easy debt was a scam.
So we know that 30 got rejected from DLA.
They are pushing back start dates...? Shocking!
N. Wacker Stud, please stop it.
WHY ISNT JONES DAY ON THIS LIST!!
@36: There is no such person at Fulbright. Try again, friendo.
promassory estoppelobster could easily be applied to these facts.
Mayer Brown Chicago just pushed back the MAJORITY of their incoming class to Jan 2011 with no guarantee of actually starting then...they will be "reevaluated." They also indicated that that Jan 2011 will be the earliest start date for Class of 2010 graduates.
How can MB even pretend to be in the same class as Sidley or Kirkland anymore? What a miserable firm.
Hello 40, 30 here -- actually, I'm someone who chose to leave DLA (and VERY happy I did leave when I did -- saw that plce for what it was and picked up a better law job when the economy was still good). Anyway, sorry you can't disagree with anything in my post. Now go back to your equity partner status -- nice job spending $150,000 to buy it -- wonder where that money will be in another 6-12 months?! Bye bye DLA. And bye bye to your $150k.
how about a post about the pitiful bonii DLA offered to its hundreds of laid off attorneys?
this firm is the worst of the worst
Is it me or does Eliot Spitzer look like he has terminator skull?
Kirkland doesn't hold a candle to MB's prestige. What the hell are you talking about? Kirkland is a fucking festering toilet of greedy sluts from Indiana.
N. Wacker Stud
I will be in Boston this weekend.
45, I work at MB Chicago and haven't heard that - are you a SA who just got a new email? Your post directly contradicts what they said in their press release (and which was discussed here ad nauseum) 2 weeks ago.
So if third years won't be starting the BigLaw jobs until 2011, when will 2Ls start work? 2012 or even 2013? Why are people still signing up for law school again?
4 is a Latham troll for not putting it in the over-rated list. They are deferring start dates by as many months as other firms but without offering a deferral stipend or health insurance.
49 - Please, if everyone at Kirkland was from Indiana, they would have stayed at the Aon. It's so convenient to the Metra that runs to that godforsaken state.
http://newamericanteaparty.com/
47, I think you just posted it.
N. Wacker Stud, are you really a stud?
Texas.
38 - I did not take on $150K of debt to f around for 2 years. I agree with 5. I applied to work at a LAW FIRM for a reason.
This is not some great opportunity to 'find myself' in Europe, this is an sh*tty opportunity to find myself living in a cardboard box when I can't pay off my loans.
Williams & Connolly--mid August 2009.
I just started.
51, yeah it does completely contradict the press release. we got calls on monday about our new "option," which is really not an option at all. its only for people who did not get the practice group they requested which is apparently a significant number of incoming associates.
We're All Whores, I miss you.
4, put Proskauer up there on your list. Behind only White & Case in percentage of associates of NY firms laid off. Also, much more show than substance.
Several major partners are about to leave Kirkland. Its a sinking merchant vessel festering with Somalis.
No news from Cahill yet?
Sutherland pushed back start dates too. Totally sucks.
Umm 45, the majority are pushed back to Jan 2010, not 2011. The few assigned to busy practice groups will start earlier.
Samoans.
@36 - That is not true.
My Womble is wobbly.
In my opinion, Covington is far more prestigious than Williams and Connolly.
39, you sound like that psychopathic Lathamed first year who used to fantasize here about taking out his old firm.
QUINN REMAINS
Quinn Remains...as a firm that hasn't given a start date
Skadden is West Wacker. For now.
70 - so what is the truth?
62, really? I haven't gotten a call.
I am the truth.
N. Wacker Stud
Foley & Lardner (Milwaukee): September 8, 2009
DLGAY
stop posting this gross fetus picture
62, really? I haven't gotten a call.
SkaddenLA is February 2010.
it's past noon and elie is still not posting articles between meals?
I should have never accepted my Kirkland offer. This sucks.
I should have never accepted my Kirkland offer. This sucks.
Foley & Lardner DC is Sept. 8.
@82: I agree. I've had a baby and the fetus picture still makes me a little queasy.
88, when did Foley confirm this start date?
Kirkland has about as much prestige as Ryan Seacrest in a bowl of pudding.
N. Wacker Stud
Stop saying Fetus.
82:
/agree
I will be in Provo, Utah for a document review on Friday. That is all.
That fetus has more prestige than Kirkland.
N. Wacker Stud
FETUS!
55
I predict a massive shift in V100 rankings next year. Out of the V70 firms, only 3 pushed out start dates to 2010 with $0 for bar or deferral stipends.
Goodwin Procter
Ropes & Gray
Dewey & LeBoeuf
As a 3L heading to one of these firms who had offers from other non-ranked and ranked firms that are offering $10,000 +, I feel like puking every time another firm announces and I remain one of the few that will be piss poor for six months after graduation.
I've tried cases on facts similar to these where I have used Section 90 of the Restatement to prove that my clients relied on the income promised them by the defendant; and have recovered that lost income for my clients. Seems to me that the deferred associates might be able to make a similar claim on promissory estoppel (ie reliance) grounds.
Magungo & Latuka in Timbuktu announced retroactive start dates for July 2005
i heard that king & spalding allegedly told its 3Ls that - if they were willing to have sex with a client - they could start immediately, otherwise the start date would be in January of 2010 ...
Paul Hastings is offering free coat hanger services to any female associate deferring until 2011.
98: Don't forget Baker and McKenzie
98: Don't forget Baker and McKenzie
98,
The list is much longer than that. King & Spalding is giving NOTHING. That's right, NOTHING.
Why are some of the dates in red?
So Baker & Mckenzie is no longer paying the $15,000 bar stipend?
101:
Sold! Ok. . . .who is first?
95 and 108, i heard that king & spalding allegedly told its 3Ls that - if they were willing to have sex with a client - they could start immediately and expense their sex toys to the firm, otherwise the start date would be in January of 2010 ...
I am looking for some information about what is going on at Skadden, Arps, Slate, Meagher & Flom LLP. Can anyone tell me what is going on at Skadden, Arps, Slate, Meagher & Flom LLP?
99 = Ambulance Chaser
Is gender reassignment surgery prestigious?
Cleary and Debevoise 1st years - have your start dates been confirmed yet?
Did someone call my name?
PROMassORY
ESTOPPELobster
I think Kirkland is delaying the news because of the Chicago office's move. Other big Chicago firms are either starting by November (Sidley, Jenner) or January (Winston, Mayer Brown). This makes me think that it can't be later than November.
If they are deferring start dates though, they should really be more considerate and tell us about it - soon! The wait is getting frustrating.
I can confirm the Cleary start dates - my friend is starting there and said she could pick her start date out of the 4 choices.
I just watched Sound of Music this past weekend for the first time in 15 years. Is it weird that I am in love with the Julie Andrews in her 30s? She was muy caliente in that movie. She's aged pretty decently, but looks quite different now.
That was four hours you could have been billing -- Julie Andrews doesn't sign your paychecks, Buddy.
how the hell is paul hastings starting in the fall?
117 - has she received confirmation on her choice?
hi
can someone explain the ass lobster thing
kthnx
121 - 117 here. I'm not sure. She is confirmed for one of the start dates right now but is thinking of moving it back to the next start date instead. Not sure if she was approved for the new start date - but don't see why she wouldn't be.
Venable? Crowell? Stroock? Schulte?
Venable? Crowell? Stroock? Schulte?
Hey 94 I know some good places to eat in Provo if you are interested.
Hey 94 I know some good places to eat in Provo if you are interested.
120: As someone alluded to before, the reason that PH can start in the fall is because it only hired females who contractually obligated themselves to use their monogrammed PH coat hanger should the time come that they are pregnant. Imagine the health cost savings realized by PH (no paid maternity leave, and no dependents to insure). PH has its shit down.
Venable? Crowell? Stroock? Schulte? Baby Ruth?
120: As someone alluded to before, the reason that PH can start in the fall is because it only hired females who contractually obligated themselves to use their monogrammed PH coat hanger should the time come that they are pregnant. Imagine the health cost savings realized by PH (no paid maternity leave, and no dependents to insure). PH has its shit down.
116, I wouldn't count on Kirkland being no later than than November. No firm has announced an 09 start date for a while now.
131 - good point. ATL, it might be helpful to also list WHEN the start date decisions were made for each firm.
Out of curiosity: Which firm was the most recent to announce an 09 start date / when did they announce?
118 - I agree, Julie Andrews was hot in SOM. She was also looking mighty fine in Mary Poppins. Absolutely gorgeous. Maybe I like the goodie-two-shoes prudish types!
NY to Julie Andrews!
98, I know you aren't going to Ropes, because Ropes is covering all bar expenses: Barbri, PMBR, bar exam fees (including the $100 for laptops in New York).
Also, suck it up. Not every other V100 firm is giving stipends. Who do you think you are that you deserve money for doing nothing? Be happy with your interest free loan.
I'm jealous... I would have loved the deal Latham is offering. This years (I mean next years) Latham class totally hit the jack. They just got the best graduation present of all, a year long paid vacation.
Quit crying - deferred start date = deferred loans and partying in Brazil for four months. On the other hand, we junior biglaw associates will be here in our windowless biglaw offices, pushing the same paper around, waiting for the salary cuts. Immediately followed by bus pass purchases, paper bag lunches and the obligatory post-workday fifth of kentucky gentleman to dampen the sinking why-the-f-did-I-go-to-law-school despair.
What is Gardere doing?
Kash - Elie previously announced Orrick's plans. They're still missing from the list above.
60: What's your source?
136 makes a good point. Let's just declare Fall 09 party time!
60's source is incoming W&C associates.
As the second largest law firm in the world, Baker & McKenzie's decision not to pay incoming associates any form of stipend is embarrassing.
List is looking good! At what point does ATL start reaching out to firms that haven't announced start dates and asking them what's up?
I am still nervous about Dechert pushing back--come on Dechert, don't let me down
DLA blows hard chunks. This firm merged with everyone they could -- global expansion for the sake of global expansion -- whoops -- this is what happens when you pay no attention at all to the quality of lawyers that you are merging with -- there was a reason that the firms DLA merged with were not able to charge super premium rates -- their lawyers weren't of that calliber -- there is a reason why clients are now deciding not to use DLA and their over-inflated rates (and egos).
Then they lost their #1 rainmaker. Then they cancelled holiday parties. Then they no-offered tons of summers. Then they had mass lay-offs. Then they froze salaries. Then they raised $$ and told all income parterns they could simply become equity partners if they bought in for $150,000. Then they froze assocaite salaries. Now they're pusing back start dates. Is there anything left for this firm to do? Yes. Fold. Bye bye DLA.
Of the firms that have announced their deferral program, which firm do we think presented the shittiest situation to their 3Ls?
Could we start a reverse March Madness deferral tournament?
I like 146's idea.
146 - I would say that firms that deferred *only* until January are screwing their incoming associates the most. This is because, as we all know, nobody expects that anyone will actually start in January. They will probably have to revoke offers or defer again, leaving the incoming associates with even fewer options than they have now.
I would strongly advise anyone deferred until January to look for an exit option. Even if it doesn't pay as well, at least you will have an income.
KIRKLAND LOS ANGELES = NOV 2.
I already received my $10K bar stipend from K&S.
146: Sonnenschein wins, hands down. Come back in a year, don't obtain other legal employment, and here's $10K to help you out. Seriously, WTF?
Firms that deferred to January with no stipend come in a distant second.
149, send the memo/letter to ATL.
116,
Kirkland is delaying because they like to see what everyone else does, and then act. They do it every year for bonuses. They did it for their summer program dates. They'll do it for start dates. They'll do it for associate & summer associate salaries. And for everything, they will match the top of the market (minus Wachtell and W&C).
Look for K&E to follow Sidley in Chicago and DPW in NYC.
I think 153 is probably right. But, ultimately, I think DPW will start its associates sometime in the fall. And that Kirkland NY will too.
As a Kirkland associate, I know what I think Kirkland SHOULD do. Staggered start dates by practice group. Restructuring is drowing in work. Start them in September. IP is also really busy. Start them in October. General Lit is decent. Start them in November. Corporate is slow. Start them in January with some amount of stipend similar to what other top firms are paying.
120, 128:
What were they supposed to do? Keep somebody employed who wasn't cutting it anymore?
The overall sense of entitlement and whining on this board is sickening. Paul Hastings did the same thing nearly every other major law firm has done in the last year, they cut nonproductive associates. Is it their fault that Ms. Oh decided to commit career suicide by writing her tearjerker monologue and then blasting it out into the internet world? She should have done what many other laid off associates have done. Polished up her resume, used her network connections, not burn bridges with her former firm, use coworkers as contacts for a new job and hit the road trying to get an interview for a new job. I know a number of laid off associates who have gotten new jobs. None of them burned any bridges, they all left on the best terms they could muster and all left with their heads held high. I do not work for Paul Hastings, but I admire a firm that does not take personal circumstances into account when forced to do personnel reductions. They broke no laws and cut the least productive associates. It is not their fault that Ms. Oh had her "feelings" hurt and decided to commit career suicide. Who would you rather have on your side, Paul Hastings or Ms. Oh? I would choose Paul Hastings without hesitation.
SIdley is awful quiet since it told us Nov 2 and Nov 16. We keep hearing we'll get more information about start dates soon... which doesnt make sense since we already GOT our start date information, right?
right?
I ask again, WTF are those of us with March start dates supposed to do? No one wants to hire you for seven months, and with 10-15K for a stipend, you need to make some money to live on.
Should know that even if deferred associates pursue public interest on their own, if they did not receive a white & case public interest sponsorship, they do not get the 75k. Just stuck with 45k.
Can we get the start date talk back on the front page? That's really all that matters right now.
Baker Botts Houston associates are starting November 16th, 2009.
161: Are they offering any kind of deferral stipend or salary advance?
Baker Botts NY deferred to January 4, 2009
*2010 - my bad
DLA is the worst firm possible and I would caution anyone considering joining. Their days are numbered, and the market perception of firm is that they are over-priced strip mall lawyers.
What are Covington & Burling and Arnold & Porter doing?
What about Williams & Connolly? Mid-August 2009 can't be right.
BB Houston gives a $5000 bonus upon graduation along with bar expenses and moving costs. No other type of advance is being offered.
I'm ashamed to say my firm has engaged in more than a little obfuscation, obviously trying to push back start dates as late as possible for the majority of incoming associates without actually admitting it. Most firms picked dates at the beginning or middle of each month, but mine picked dates at the very end (reminds me of "only $99.99!"). And they claimed to give incoming associates a "choice" of start date, but gave all or nearly all incoming corporate associates a later than requested start date.
And nevermind that while pushing back start dates for people many months, they slashed salary advances by more than a third and said everything is being done "as in past years."
I really think those firms that have frankly fessed up to their situations, apologized, and made efforts to help grads make the best of it should be rewarded; and those that have tried to mislead and deceive their associates about the situation should be called out and shamed.
So glad I never chose the big firm route.
Where is this Baker Hostetler information coming from? Is it just one office? If so, which one?
I am set to start there in September and have not heard anything to the contrary.
Baker Hostetler information is incorrect. Start dates have not been pushed back.
firms who haven't announced plz get your act together
So what are people w/ January start dates doing? Taking a really long vacation or are there 5 month volunteer legal opportunities available?
So what are people w/ January start dates doing? Taking a really long vacation or are there 5 month volunteer legal opportunities available?
You should really add that Skadden is offering the "sidebar" program deferral for incoming associates--$55,000 stipend until Fall 2010 (and a "guaranteed" job according to the New York Times...)
For firms like Cravath, Cleary, DPW, and STB, who offer a number of "options" across a few months, are they really giving incoming associates a choice of those dates spread across many months? Or are they slyly forcing almost everyone into the later slots? Is it based on practice group or individual preference?
FYI, DLA just cut Of Counsel salaries 20-30% effective April 13. Accordng to the grapevine, associates are next. Reality hits the legal profession!
Looks like start date news is dead?
I think I am the only 3L left that hasn't heard anything from my firm. Shit.
Does anyone know what Gardere Dallas is doing?
Does anyone know what Gardere Dallas is doing?
Paul Hastings pushed us back to January 2010.