KIRKLAND??????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

First year associates don't do much work anyway, but get full pay and benefits. So having them take a vacation at half pay is still a bargain for the firms.

sigh, join the club!

Cahill has not formally announced but corporate work at the firm seems to be showing life so it's possible they may not defer.

Now that the gravy train’s toppled,
And we watch our bank accounts wobble,
We’re getting so desperate
That we’ve started grasping at
Dubious claims of estoppel.
--Above the Limerick

post amlaw

The list of non-peer firms that are adopting my hybrid tough love is growing everyday. This momentum fuels my hope that the management committee at my firm and other peer firms will eventually adopt the changes that need to be made to correct the flawed infrastructure of peer firms (i.e., lockstep compensation, partnership track models, American law school recruitment, etc.). Believe what you want but this economy is getting worse everyday under the leadership of President Obama.

This Partner Emeritus remind me of Stern. No nonsense sumbitch!

The ship be sinking...

Comment removed by moderator.

The Mexican government is blaming this place for the outbreak of swine flu:
http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/story/12840743/porks_dirty_secret_the_nations_top_hog_producer_is_also_one_of_americas_worst_polluters

Reading this article will leave you with a real sense of faith in the government's desire to protect us from industry.

Can't believe Sonnenschein: deferred to January 2011 with a $10,000 stipend. Wow.

Seriously, Kirkland?
WTF. Figure it out.

PE: the flawed infrastructure to which you refer was not created under the presidential leadership of obama. do not blame the inability of goliath law firms to adapt and thrive even in tough financial times on someone who took office little more than 3 months ago.

Can a moderator please remove 10?

Foley and Lardner is TTT . . . what a joke.

Make no mistake, friends: You are part of a cartel. You are bought and sold like meat. And no amount of money can fill the void that exists at the centre of your soul.

Man, I sure am glad I went in-house.

irell is any monday after the bar exam and NO LATER THAN november 1.

it's misfiled in weasel's list.

Everybody sing along...A DEFERRED START DATE IS A DEFERRED LAYOFF.

Quinn remains

What's wrong with Kirkland and Arnold & Porter?

You really should look into the fact that some firms that advertise multiple start date "options" don't actually give most of their incoming associates the option to start on the earlier dates.

pretty sure covington belongs in the first group

Edwards Angell Palmer & Dodge is cutting associates salaries this week too.

Kirkland is quickly becoming the laughing stock of Chicago.

N. Wacker Stud

Ummm -- STROOCK?? You There?

Cahill's in much better shape than most---no debt, inexpensive office space, flexible practice areas, virtually no laterals with compensation guarantees, and a piece of the GM restructuring (on the lenders' side). My guess is no deferral.

Irell is incorrectly placed in November. It should be with Munger and Quinn as "any Monday after the bar exam." November 2 is the latest Monday you can start (Not November 1 you retards -- that is a Sunday).

Psssst......"Michael Ray"........your name is spelled Micheal, not Michael. Look it up.

funny thing is, the kirkland people would be just as annoyed if they got their start date in January but hadn't had it confirmed by first-class mail every 2 weeks since then. you'll get your date when you get it, and it will be what it will be.

Hey, you lawyers are supposed to be so smart, right? That guy, John Yoo, figured out a way around the Constitution so that I could lock away American citizens indefinitely without charges or a trial, torture high value detainees, listen in on all of your telephone calls, and read all your emails. How come you people couldn’t figure out a way so that I could’ve served a third term? Cheney couldn’t help me, that dumbass flunked out of Yale Law School. Rove flunked the LSATs. Harriet and Alberto were too much in lust with each other to care. Don't you people remember how well the financial sector was doing when I was President? Don't you remember that people lined up every day outside of auto showrooms to buy cars made by the Big 3? Don't you remember how the economy boomed when I turned that $500 billion surplus into a $1 trillion deficit? That Partner Emeritus guy has got it right, the bad economy is all Obama's fault. Things were so much better when I was President.

17 -- Make no mistake, I had sex yesterday with a Skadden associate, and she blew my mind. Some of the best sex I've ever had. And she was rewarded for it.

30, fuck you

How come Kaye Scholer is in the 2nd list but not the 1st, and how come that's the first I've heard of it on this blog (beyond the obligatory Kaye Scholer is TTT).

Ummm -- STROOCK?? You There?

LOL @ Weil

32: What was her name?

Kash--

Please do not say things like a "majority of firms" have deferred start dates.

What is your sample of 'firms'--the AM Law 200? Vault 100? If you are simply referring to all law firms, then that statement cannot possibly be correct. Small shops and many larger 'boutiques' do not have 'incoming classes', just new hires.

Also, even if that statement is accurate, it does a disservice to a significant portion of your readership. Biglaw partners whose firms have not deferred start dates or announced dates yet, or those that have and now can feel like they are just following the market feel like its OK to defer start dates.

Bottom line is that no one needs encouragement to defer start dates. Rest assured, law firm partners will defer start dates if there are not enough hours for the incoming associates and doing otherwise would decrease incoming revenue for the firm more than a first year ordinarly would. We don't need them feeling like the 'majority of the market' is already doing it, so they can as well.

--Incoming 1st year Am Law 200 associate at a firm that has not announced start dates, but now expects to spend the fall living with his parents.

Anyone got an answer for 34? This is the first I've heard about Kaye Scholer pushing back start dates.

Can a moderator please tell 15 to simply avert his eyes if he wants to avoid damaging his delicate sensibilities?

Anyone got an answer for 37? This is the first I've heard about Skadden women being amazing in bed.

38: "majority of firms" implicitly means majority of firms that matter. kthxbye.

Can a moderator please tell 15 to simply avert his eyes if he wants to avoid damaging his delicate sensibilities?

29 -

Check the archives, yo...my crafty Jew lawyer already called me out fo that.

The ship be sinking...

I keep looking for Weil's start date, and it takes so long to scroll down that i just bored looking...

I second # 23. Why isn't Covington in the first group?

#15, you suck. Moderate yourself in front of a bus.

Just heard from an insider...next round of PHJW cuts coming soon to an office near you. However, they are regressing back to the "performance" model.

Any word out of Pillsbury?

Why has ATL not picked up on rampant rumors that Weil has already committed to no-offering a number of this year's summers?

Please move in with your parents. This will give you a stronger fighting chance when the food riots/violence commence this winter -- and make the single siege more invigorating (and ultimately more profitable) for the cannibal horde.

Lord Humungous

I'll be working at the Texas firm Haynes and Boone this summer. I don't see them on the list...does anyone know what is going on with them?

That Foley deal sucks. Five month deferal, $10,000 and no benefits?

Come on ATL. Can we get a post on the AmLaw 100 numbers that were announced put up earlier today? Lets see those PPP and how far Cravath slipped!!!

@34: Don't know why it hasn't been reported here, but Kaye Scholer pushed back start dates to January and granted a $10K "salary advance" (i.e., must be paid back out of your first few paychecks) that incoming associates can claim in August. No word yet on bar support, so it looks like the firm expects incoming associates to take out a bar study loan for the summer. Total cheapskates; don't go there if you have a choice. My friends who showed me the memo wish they weren't going there, but it is too late for them.

52:

"In the next few months, you will receive some information from us regarding your summer stipend, moving allowance (if applicable) and your start date. Although we have not set your start date at this time, we can tell you it will not be on or before October 1, 2009. We hope this helps you plan any post-graduation/post-clerkship plans."

--from HB recruiting coordinator.

--38

WSJ Law Blog's piece on the AmLaw 100 -

http://blogs.wsj.com/law/2009/04/29/the-amlaw-100-firms-partying-like-its-1991/

Cravath slipped to 6th in PPP.

If the swine flu gets to pandemic portions, EVERYTHING will be deferred.

Just sayin'.

It's a good thing that Obama accurately diagnosed our problem as Bush's gigantic deficit, focused on it like a laser, and quintupled it in a matter of months. CBO projections now show it sinking to unrecoverable depths by 2019, the start date for most '09 graduates. Good luck everybody, and keep voting Democrat.

48 - This is so obvious. Everyone knew that PH's first round of "economic" cuts would not be nearly enough. But, with the summers arrriving...discretion would be the better part of valor.

Kirkland needs to announce already so that Sidley can do whatever Kirkland does. If Kirkland pushes start dates beyond November 2009, we all know Sidley will quickly do the same....

38/56,

Have they given any clue as to why they're taking so long? During OCI they seemed so proud of how financially "set" the Firm is. Should I be looking to do a 3L letter writing campaign?

48 and 60. This is old news. My tipster confirmed it last week.

How are Willkie, A&O, Linklaters et al. able to absorb new bodies in the fall?

WALL OF SHAME
(Firms that are both V100 and AmLaw 100, but have yet to announce)
------------------------

Arnold & Porter LLP
Boies, Schiller & Flexner LLP
Covington & Burling LLP
Crowell & Moring LLP
Dickstein Shapiro LLP
Fish & Richardson P.C.
Howrey LLP
K&L Gates LLP
Kirkland & Ellis LLP
Patton Boggs LLP
Reed Smith LLP
Stroock & Stroock & Lavan LLP
Williams & Connolly LLP

Seems as if there are a lot of smaller firms (that still pay market) not on these lists. Is it because they aren't pushing back dates or just aren't on the radar of ATL?

S&C is wrong. DPW is missing, although I think they've announced. I bet Skadden is also wrong.

52/62

The firm is financially set. They have no debt except for month to month overhead. The market just sucks, and associate hours at every firm are well below 2000. They are not announcing start dates precisely because of the same financial conservativism that lead to their stability. They will wait and see what other firms in Texas are doing (and the ATL list is pretty complete) and then do something similar.

If you are going to do transaction work, no letter writing campaign. The only firms that would be hiring and would have more work for you than HB are bankruptcy or litigation boutiques, some of which pay 160 plus bigger bonuses than big law. So if you are interested in those areas, maybe do some research and send some letters to those firms. Otherwise, sit tight and pray for the best.

--38/56

59 -
You are so right. This whole economic tsunami hit us on January 20, 2009. Before then, everything was going gangbusters. Don't you wish I was still President?

Paul Hastings actually reached out to incoming summer associates about a month ago after their economic layoffs to assure them that they would not be planning on deferring the start dates for incoming associates. It seems pretty shitty that they would play this card after giving assurances that they wouldn't.

I can't believe Weil has deffered for a full 1 1/2 year. Unbelievable.

70 - But that is typical behavior for them! They wait until EVERYBODY else does it, then they reneg on their earlier statement in the stealthiest/sleaziest way possible.

72 - Yes, every word that comes out of their mouths is a lie, including "and" and "the."

Law schools must retool legal education,

"You're producing a product that very few people want. "You're like the auto manufacturers who produce a product for which there is no demand."

Massive discovery demands have shifted legal work away from thinking and analysis to product management, said another attorney. "When we were in law school, discovery meant two or three banker boxes of documents. Now it means two or three hundred boxes. That demands widgets -- not thinking," he said.

58 - Mexican swine flu is out of control in New York City. Bloomberg isn't wasting resources on tracking just mild sickness anymore:

NEW YORK, April 28 -- The number of confirmed and suspected swine flu cases spread today beyond the Queens high school that has been its epicenter here, with new cases now suspected at a Queens public school for autistic children and a Catholic school in Manhattan, and additional scattered cases in Brooklyn and the Bronx.
Moreover, Gov. David Paterson and state health officials said possible swine flu cases were being investigated in all regions of the state.

New York City remained the hardest hit, with now 45 confirmed cases and many more suspected. Mayor Michael R. Bloomberg (I) said the numbers likely include "hundreds" of students, staff members and family members from St. Francis Preparatory school in Queens who have become ill. He said the city would be testing only severely ill people, because most of those hundreds of others can be assumed to be suffering from the virus and testing was not necessary. The school was closed Monday and Tuesday.

73 - They also told Brownie that he was doing a "heckuva" job!

For all those inquiring into your start date, it is never going to happen. They don't want you. Go where you are needed like nursing.

Can 3Ls with deferred start dates look for other employment - there are other sectors hiring - and thereby rescind their acceptance? Or is there some unwritten code that you cannot look for other employment since you accepted an offer from a firm? Do you get blacklisted or something?

same question as 64

50 -- Because those rumors are not true. HTH.

Can someone give me information on Fish, Darby, Kenyon, Townsend, or any other IP shop, besides Finnegan?

-IP law stud

K&L Gates announced their start date back in February, and ATL reported on it (though for some reason the firm doesn't appear on the ATL start date list). The date is 1/4/2010.

http://abovethelaw.com/2009/02/kl_gates_recession_measures.php

Take it for what it's worth but I I have heard that Paul Hastings plans to only offer 50% of it's incoming SA's jobs.

82 -- ATL just updated its list this afternoon to include K&L and a couple other firms.

70: Yep, and that is how they treat their brand new people. You can extrapolate from that an imagine what it is like after you have been there 5 years. They are shameless and they lie. Period. And they don't care that they are doing it over and over and over... I hope ATL calls them out on this new round of "layoffs."

@ List of Shame: Covington has already announced that they are not deferring, and the entire class at W&C is clerking, so that firm has no reason to announce start dates.

the political rantings on these posts are lame. I don't mind an occasional joke making fun of Bush or Obama, but take your agendas somewhere else.

when is Kaye Scholer's start date and are they paying any stipeend or salary advance?

White & Case - $45,000 stipend, or a $75,000 stipend for *some* to pursue volunteer or community service - does that mean that not all deferalls are invited for 75k option?

Kirkland - Nov. 2009. Sourced.

85: That would be expecting too much. My source tells me that the PHJW "stealth" list has already been drawn up. The cuts will ensue in drips and drabs.

i'd be interested to know what the deal is on health benefits for deferred associates at these firms. a friend's got one of the better deferral packages, but has to pretty much not get anything more than a cold between now and october 2010....

KIRKLAND!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Start dates for Kirkland (LA) are Nov. 2nd. We've known that since February.

90: what is your source? I know they said they are sending out start dates early this week. did you get the fed ex packet? which office?

91: Doesn't surprise me. There are people still on the website that got canned months ago, so it will be tough to track.

mcguirewoods is sept 14th

96: Yes, that is the Paul Hastings way. Always flying under the biglaw radar.

96-But I'm sure the lying pieces of shit had a grand time at the Carlsbad partners junket.

99 Morale couldn't be worse in the NY office, which is like a ghost town. We are all sitting ducks.

100 - It's not just the NY office... They'll have fun explaining this to the summers (most of whom will be looking elsewhere, but that's probably exactly what they want).

101 -- Looking elsewhere? Where else could they go??? The cartel has made its decision, and none of you is safe.

Man, I sure am glad I went in-house.

101 But they cannot outrage their principles by being honest about anything.

85: What is your source?

101: No problem explaining it to the summers -- Just let them know that PH is still looking for a few rate insensitive clients, and once those roll in we'll all be good to go!

104- One of the Carlsbad junkees had diarrhea of the mouth. He's feeling much better now.

Really 96, like who?

Really 96, like who?

108 There are too many to list.

107 = PH partner that doesn't have anything to do but troll and thumb his bag. Like I'm going to write frickin names on here. Jesus fing christ some people are stupid.

105: Yes, and hopefully none of their endless litigation cases will find a way to settle.

88 - Kaye Scholer announced its start dates weeks ago (Jan 11, 2010). The firm isn't paying ANY stipend...it is only offering a $10K salary advance that must be repaid. They are still covering all bar and moving expenses, but to not give ANY sort of stipend (even $5K) is incredibly cheap and inconsiderate. It must be 1 of a handful of firms that aren't offering ANYTHING other than a minimal salary advance.

Who here actually believes that anyone will start in January '10? These firms need to come clean and just tell us that there is no hope of starting until there is an actual economic recovery. If there are no signs of economic life by, say, December 2009, I bet anything the firms will defer again.

And that is going to suck so hard.

I would bet that most firms keep the January start date. It seems obvious that the economy will be better in the fall - not fully recovered - but better. Work is already picking up, not to 2007 levels, but not January 2009 levels either.

114 -- I hope you're right, I really do. But the more I think about it, the more I suspect that these firms deferred us because they didn't want to deal with us right now. They are just delaying the inevitable -- which is that there is simply not enough work for all of us. Something will have to give.

If my firm calls me in December with the bad news, I honestly don't know if I will be able to hold back my anger. I may very well lose it on the partner who calls me.

A&O redundancy programme ends with 247 layoffs
29 April 2009 |

Allen & Overy has completed a redundancy programme which has seen at least 247 partners and staff lose their jobs globally and cost the firm £44m.

The consultation process, which was launched in February with the firm citing global market conditions as the cause, was designed to cut nine per cent of partners, fee-earners and support staff.

All those affected will have left by tomorrow, 30 April 2009. The firm declined to comment on the total involved, but a spokesperson said that once additional voluntary redundancies are included, the total number of job cuts would be slightly higher than the total of 247 that was initially envisaged.

As well as cutting 47 partners, 100 fee-earners and 100 members of support staff, Allen & Overy de-equitised a further 35 partners. At the end of the last financial year the firm had a total of 2,686 fee-earners, 474 partners and 4,949 staff. Particularly badly hit was the firm’s former flagship leveraged finance practice (9 March)

The process was officially launched with a partner conference call with senior partner David Morley in which he outlined eight principles by which it would be conducted.

They were: that the process should be market-led, comprehensive, in line with the firm’s culture and ethos and its global strategic focus, that it should be fair, put the firm in the best possible shape to get through the recession, quick and allow for alternativesincluding voluntary redundancies, reduced hours, reduced pay, sabbaticals, secondments and deferrals of start dates for new trainees.

As part of the restructuring, the firm de-merged its private client practice, which will become an independent firm, Maurice, Turnor Gardner with effect from 1 May 2009

105 - Ha! That was certainly the plan when I was there. Is it still? Too bad some of those clients don't even exist anymore, and a lot of the work basically doesn't either.

But don't worry: according to 114, we're fine.

Steptoe & Johnson also has not reported yet ... does anyone have info on this ???

Kudos, ATL. This is extremely helpful (organizing by date rather than by firm).

115-

If the economy still looks bleak this fall (which really is unlikely), salary cuts first, some stealth layoffs second, further deferral third, then rescinded offers. Rescinding offers to new first years is really the epitome of unprofessionalism. It destroys reputations, not just amongst 2L but clients. That doesn't eliminate the possibility - there is plenty of unprofessionalism going around these days - but I'd really be shocked.

117 - If it still is the plan, I have a bridge they might be interested in purchasing.

Paul Hastings has also been de-equitizing partners like crazy.

EDIT WHITE & CASE (and answer to 89)

$45K (including bar expenses - initially $4K for bar was additional)... the additional $30K was given to those who responded first to an invitation for pro-bono work provided by the firm. Those who did not respond quick enough (~20min) are shit out of luck, no matter if they find their own pro-bono work equally as worthwhile.

Kirkland sent out emails earlier this week explaining when to expect our bar stipend checks. No word on how long that's supposed to last us yet...

81 - large NY IP boutique incoming associate. We have start dates of Sept and October.

121-What do you expect??? I'm in the Paul Hastings NY office and you can fire a cannon ball down any hall at this time of night and not hit anyone. The next round of cuts is sadly inevitable.

Foley went from "market leader" in a good way (start dates of Sept. 7 or 8) to "market leader" in a bad way (start dates of Feb. 1 with only $10k). The firm will undoubtedly suffer reputational damage in the big-city markets and will have problems recruiting Chicago-bound students to come to Milwaukee. Yes, for those who want Milwaukee, it won't effect their recruiting, but otherwise Foley really made its situation FUBAR.

125-Are you the one who keeps flushing the head on 14? Congrats, I think we're the only ones here!

125/127 - I'm at another PH office, and it's been all-but-empty by 6:30 since last spring. Shocking compared to the place from which I lateralled (same market).

128 -- Yes, same thing in NY since the beginning of 08. Their absurd rate increases have not helped matters.

125- You think its really true that PH will only give offers to half their summer associates?

130 - Not 125 (but also at PH): I hope you're a 1L, JD/MD, a non-trad with pre-law work experience, or splitting. Anyway, good luck to you.

But do you even really want an offer to come back to PH in March 2012?

131- valid point lol thanks

Any idea when Pillsbury will call the incomings?

106 - I'm also hearing about the new stealth list. Incredibly, they assume the summers won't notice those being picked off by ones and twos.

Two of the smartest (and most down to earth) guys from my 1L section are going to Foley. One in DC and one on the west coast. Even if people say it is TTT - Foley at least attracts good people.

I like Hunton & Williams.

I do not like Winston & Strawn.

135: Which dump of a school do you go to? No one goes to Foley with decent creds unless they want to live in Milwaukee.

137: or they do IP.

Actually, I also know a couple top people from my (highly-ranked) school who are going to Foley, and they don't do IP.