I see that hybrid tough love is more contagious than the swine influenza. The salary reduction equates to weak tough love. I would like to see salaries reduced to $110,000.00. More jobs can be preserved and with a steady salary, an associate won't run the risk of becoming a paying pawn under Obama's pernicious tax scheme.

DAMN YOU PARTNER EMERITUS!!!

Love #2

1 - no it doesn't. Your confusion is quite common. You think the cost savings from a paycut will be used to fund new associate positions? Layoffs and pay cuts come as a result of a lack of business. Even if they "save" enough to hire more associates, why would they do that when there's no work? People forget that THERE IS NO WORK and there's not going to be any time soon.

How about a "salary cut" chart? Number of firms cutting first year salaries and more senior salaries, with percentage cuts?

i'd like a salary cut chart and a layoff chart (lawshucks charts the firms the guy who owns it cares about with no rhyme or reason as to who gets included, because he's a fucking idiot.)

How long before King and Spalding cuts salaries, giving the rest of the Atlanta market permission to do so? Didn't King and Spalding already lay off around half the 2008 class?

The NY firms should cut salaries to 110. That'll make everyone wake up and realize that associates are overpaid, law school tuition is too high, and the big firm model is broken.

I can't believe this is happening right after the death of the supreme court counsel in DC:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yu_moia-oVI

At least wait until your Summer Associates (those you choose to offer) actually accept. The inapplicability of promissory estoppel to incoming associates is well documented. Bone-headed recruiting move...

The ship be sinking...

Is there a source for this story?

4 - I'm not number 1 but I think I can help. I believe his point is that they wouldn't bother reducing salaries (and incurring the publicity that involves) if they weren't going to hire any first years. If they were only going to bring in a few first years, the savings would be negligible, and probably not worth it. See?

Also, I'm confused by 3.

Wow -- good attention to detail on the renumbering after the deletions!!

New 4, i think you are dead on.

I just met with our GC and learned that our company is going to be doing well to hang on by our fingernails through the end of 2010 -- despite lots of wishful thinking to contrary. And we are profitable and positive cash flow. Although he may just be grumpy about his five percent pay cut not being rescinded, the fact is that outside counsel are getting as little work as possible until he gets his pay raised back up..

Deferred associates, incoming associates, will only be safe once work picks up -- and that will be on a firm by firm basis. There is no silver lining.

Right now, firms may be setting themselves up to do quite nicely under the pretense of the economy... ask any current SURVIVOR of a firm that's done the layoff/paycut double whammy: they're now doing more work for less money. Have the firms reduced their billing rates? No. But when firms cut associates, they take the opportunity to cut TOO MANY associates, so that everyone who remains is overworked, would never dare to say anything but "thank you, can I have another?" to a pay cut.

So firms have fewer mouths to feed, at a lower cost to the firm, and they're charging clients (albeit fewer of them, but this is ok since there's fewer associates to pay) just as much. Hmmm...

solzy friend solzy friend solzy friend solzy friend

"Is there a source for this story?"

There was a memo. Can someone please post it in the comments?

And the biglaw speculative bubble continues to lose air!

Agree with #8. Make it 100K. That’s still plenty of $ and most attorneys are starting off earning in the 50s or lower with way over 100K in debt.

At the rate this is going, the clawback is going to result in fourth year associates making $90K when this all ends.

Someone please release me from this nightmare. I keep onhaving cold sweats at night at the thought of paying my expensive mortgage, private school tuition, and Land Rover lease, on a salary of a public defender.

~Sixth Year Associate

Stop deleting my posts about marinating moobs!

I expect a bonus this year - on track to bill 2400, again.

- 4th year associate

21

Dream on.

More likely to get a clawback like #20 says. Pretty soon, we'll all be paying firms to work there!

Welcome to the deflationary spiral.....

10,

Do you think that a summer associate with more than one offer should accept multiple offers at this point? Just wondering. I think I would.

25

I'd do it.

You know who isn't getting any paycuts? The federal government.

The federal government is a good ticket out of BigLaw. 40 hours per week, retirement, matching contribution...

Even when the economy picks up, still consider ditching the 70 hour per week rat race and having some quality of life.

SUMMERS RISE

SALARIES FALL

QUINN REMAINS

Notice how salary stays 160K for patent associates. That must mean that their patent group has work.

I just got a raise at Small Law and those KS dbags get a cut. I feel soo sorry for them.

bwahahahaha....

Big Law Bitches can't get those Fed Jobs. Only vets and people that have worked hard will get them. I love seeing elite brats scurrying for survival. This recession is truly meteing out sweet justice. More please, MORE.

29, where does it say that? Did i miss something?

So, I was trying to think of a good way to really encapsulate that certain firm culture that really sets Thompson Hine apart from its competition... what is that certain zazz that a TH partner has, that keeps all of us associates (and, increasingly, the staff) such content and happy employees?

And then it occurred to me. Now, most certainly one should never delude themselves that Thompson Hine is by any stretch of the imagination a peer firm.

And, yet, we have so many partners that remind me of Partner Emeritus. We were the first firm to embrace the hybrid tough love package. And, let me tell you, the Thompson Hine partners really went out of their way to support that package. As I understand it, they are skilled at providing full throated support to packages.

But, sadly, at the end of the day, the Thompson Hine partners aren't Partner Emeritus. Instead, we toil in mediocrity with masters that use the yoke and stick per PE's recommendations, but lack the prestige, brilliance and ability to land mega-clients shown by PE during his long and distinguished career. Perhaps this aura of awesomeness is why so many TH partners are enamored with and giving full throated support to your package...

THOMPSON HINE - we frequently give full throated support to Partner Emeritus' package!

29, read much?

Anybody seen my dildo?

-Thompson Hine associate on the rag

Wait...Kilpatrick has a patent practice?

why does every elie post start with "X years ago, we reported", or "Back in ___ we said _____. Today we can tell you____"?

Uh, 29, they laid off patent associates in their last layoff. What do you think - indicative of the associates' quality or the firm's patent work load ???

37-

why does it matter?

2 (The rising 2L who calls himself Partner Emeritus),

Go away forever.

- Everyone.

Nice "0" in "Co" Diane

40 FTW.

It's hilarious that some lawfirm partners are really like that. PE isn't funny, but that is.

42,

Yeah, but that is what makes PE funny. He is a satire of all the worst characteristics of BigLaw partners.

A character like PE is sort of like a baseball player, if he makes you laugh .300 of the time, then he's doing really well (but is still missing the other .700).

That's my $0.02, anyway. I can see how he gets on others' nerves (mine too many times).

what is the new pay scale for all associates?

29 here. My bad. How silly of me to think that recent news would be posted first instead of emails from years ago.

RA, where you been? Please don't get busted, dude. I worry.

PE, you are a loser, go away

"Only vets and people that have worked hard will get them. I love seeing elite brats scurrying for survival. This recession is truly meteing out sweet justice."

Your pettiness is both revolting and amusing.

Yesiree!

Another Atlanta law firm following the big bloody dooky of also-ranism and salary cuts made popular by Atlanta's WorsTTT Law Firm™: McKenna Long & Aldridge

YES!! RA is back. I really missed the "thompson hine sucks balls" schtick when he was away.

Hey RA - I noticed that you don't type "Theyarepayingmetowritethis" anymore. Did you get laid off? Is that why you were gone? Was it for your posts here? I don't like Thompson Hine either! Write back, k?

DLA (Atlanta) and KillStock at 130K, McKenna at 125K - K&S, A&B, Sutherland, to 130k soon!

NYC to 190!

Kilpatrick Stockton appears to be built like a Mongolian skyscraper.

52 - Thank you for the indisputable proof that McKenna Long & Aldridge is truly Atlanta's WorsTTT Law Firm™. We set the floor on legal competence, firm culture and salary!

25, yes I would. Whichever you don't go to may be upset (assuming both are still available), but in this market, do it.

RA -- I was worried you were busted too.

a little bird told me that Holland + Knight is making the move tomorrow. 20% average cuts for senior associates.

57 -- Holland & Knight appears to be as shoddily constructed as Kilpatrick. It's an amalgamation of Florida law offices with its core client base in the worst hit area of the economy: real estate development in sweltering, previously uninhabited swamp lands. The bird probably felt the firm 's foundation liquifying beneath its claws.

Rogue Associate--

I missed you. Welcome back. I hope you weren't discovered by TH and given a tough--sans love and lube--package.

9--

Now I'm going to have that fucking song in my head for the rest of the evening. Thanks.

Sorry 55 but Sutherland gets my vote for worst firm in the city.

Why not give deferred incoming associates an option to take a package of 15K + bar expenses to leave and pretend they never got the offer? I'm pretty sure more people would accept these offers than these big firms think.

-incoming associate

61, as other firms fall, your assertions become further from reality. I'm not sure of anyone who would take PoGo or MMM over Sutherland right now.

Sutherland: That's How We Roll!

Seriously, Sutherland is miles ahead of any of the other Atlanta firms in terms of prestige.

All,

Thanks so much for the messages of support and general amusement (heck, even dildo guy has his charms).

Worry not, I remain very much at large. Anyone still checking this thread, I've done a longer rant today in the Morning Docket thread.

And, oh yes.......

Thaye R steel peying mi to right this abowt thare laupherm. N-Joy! (lastly, I'm jealous the ATL staff got to meet the lolcats creator. Please tell him I'm a fan...)

63: Since PoGo no longer exists as a standalone entity, I would agree with you.

I think that they were roughly matching Fish in terms of staring salaries for IP associates - 165K. I wonder what they'll do for IP.

Sutherland - as mediocre and arrogant as K&S, but even more uppity.

68

Name me ONE firm that is ahead of Sutherland.

ONE.

I'll save you time; there is no such firm.

This blows. For firms that are frozen and cutting, Is the 10% off the currently effective rate, as I suspect, or is it off the 'unstuck' rate?

Depressed in Atlanta

For 15k? 15k?? Worst idea ever.

There's no way you can be an incoming associate at any BL firm and think that $15k would suffice. That or you didn't turn down other offers at medium sized firms.

I bet you are actually a partner somewhere tucked away in your ivory office in some big city skyscraper practicing your evil laugh as you typed that.

For 15k? 15k?? Worst idea ever.

There's no way you can be an incoming associate at any BL firm and think that $15k would suffice. That or you didn't turn down other offers at medium sized firms.

I bet you are actually a partner somewhere tucked away in your ivory office in some big city skyscraper practicing your evil laugh as you typed that.

Lemming effect.

Kilpatrick has been doing this all year. They wait for a few other large firms to do something and then they follow suit. There really isn't any thought process at all. Early in the year it was staff cuts. 5 or 6 other big firms cut staff, going 4 to 1 on attorneys to secretaries. Kilpatrick then saw it was "OK" to do this and followed suit. Then more firms cut associates. Again, having the "OK" from the masses, Kilpatrick canned 25 more associates along with some counsel (prompting Mark Levy to take his own life). Then came the trend of pay cuts. Once again, waited until a bunch of other big firms cut pay, then did their own cuts. The funny thing about it all is Kilpatrick Stockton's idea of the meaning of "competitive." "Competitive" I guess now means that when you're already lower than many of your peers, you do what is necessary to STAY lower.

71. No, I actually am studying for the bar as we speak. I have an offer with a firm, but would gladly walk with 15K and bar expenses. I know others who would too. Also - as I suggested it, this would just be an option - so people wouldn't lose their offers. This way those who are having second thoughts about joining a big firm or fear instability once they get there can walk with bar expenses and some cash for them to pursue something else. I know it sounds crazy...but there are people out there who'd do this. If only the hiring committees would wise up and recognize this...