1st first

TTThird

lame

If they want to no-offer you that badly, I doubt eager beaver tactics will change anything. It's probably more a matter of firm economics. (Or, someone decided they didn't like you. Which is pretty much a death sentence.)

Quality advice from Elie on this one, condensable as follows:

(1) You will almost certainly not receive an offer.
(2) You should still work your ass off. If you still get no-offered, it will have only cost 10 weeks of your life.
(3) If you get no-offered anyway, you should set the building on fire (I think Elie implied that).

Also, you just started. Why would you be disfavored? Do the other SA's avoid you? Do you smell? Did you show a particular interest in REIT formation when you interviewed? Very curious.

WEll, you can always go for a secretary job. I hear they have an opening at Bingham.

To Marin- your attempt at being funny does not work. It is off-putting. You are one of the many reasons, but probably the biggest, this blog is beginning to suck.

Duh. You're getting no-offered.

THIS passive aggressive crap is why I can't stand big firms. An ibank would shit can you, cut you a check for six months and send you on your way.

But a firm? Spends the same amount of money trumping up reasons to lay you off (or no offer you). It's a waste of time, really. If they weren't all trying to woo the 200 people with big books in the business, then the entire exercise is futile.

Most firms would frown on a summer running around doing work for free that can be done by an associate and billed to a client. That is horrible advice from someone who has no real feel for how a law firm works.

Perhaps you could split your summer. Find another law firm to work in and clock in and walk out and work in the other firm and then clock back in. That way, you'd have Option B instead of surfing on the Web 24/7 which is a surefire way to get fired.

8 -

Your douchey, highly subjective opinion is noted. I find Marin very funny (and read her blog). She can be a bitch, but mostly she is very sharp and funny. Please impute your angry view (to which you are entitled), to the rest of us. In fact, kindly go fuck yourself.

Cheers,
I Heart Marin

Yup, I’m a summer at a big firm in NY right now. I got nothing to do except massage the same stupid memo I wrote yesterday. The associates won’t even talk to me. Oh they told us this will be a “competitive” summer. Yeah right. How can it competitive with no work???? This is bullshit. I’ll take their money and run. I’ve applied to JAG. Hopefully I’ll get it.

why is everyon so sure he's getting no-offered? It sounds like a lot of firms just don't have work for their summers, or (as in past years) work among summers has been distributed unevenly. That doesn't mean the firm is setting you up to be no-offered. Seriously.

This sounds very strange to me. I'd like to know more info, like how many other summers are there, are they getting work, have you talked to anyone about this situation, etc. I know that many firms want the summers to go through the "official" assignment process, rather than accept assignments from attorneys on their own, in order to ensure that assignments are divvied up appropriately across all of the summers. That may be what the assigning attorney here told the summer, and the summer may be misinterpreting the instructions not to accept assignments. Perhaps there is just a misunderstanding, and the assigning attorney thinks this summer has received assignments and thinks the summer is working on them. The summer needs to go talk to the assigning attorney pronto and get it sorted out. Lack of communication is a sure-fire way to get no-offered.

Urrgh, "don't impute" rather than "impute."

- 12

2=fail. This firm is obviously TTT. Sue it under Section 90 when it lets you go. MysTTTal.

I recommend that if you are offered work or have a chance to get work through a channel other than the assignment coordinator - take the work and ignore the assignment coordinator. As long as the partner you work for like you, you have a shot. The coordinator, even if s/he is a partner, is not going to tell another partner that s/he cannot work with a summer associate.

Dude, would you mind outing the firm? You are probably one of many in that boat, so it wouldn't really get back to you - one would hope.

http://www.amazon.com/Build-Better-Stealing-Office-Supplies/dp/0836217578

Volunteer to assist an associate or partner with writing an article (which means you will write the article yourself). At least it shows that you have a desire to contribute and it will give the hiring committee a written work product to review.

The problem with Marin's advice is that she assumes what's happening is part of a well-coordinated plan by The Firm instead of piss-poor management. Partners love to hoard associates, tell them they are prohibited from soliciting work elsewhere, and then ditching their asses once they no longer need a twenty-something on retainer. It happens all the time, and not just to summer associates.

I hate to say it, but I agree with Elie. The worst case scenario is that they don't give you an offer, but guess what, you're not going to get one waiting for the stars to align.

It's not like you have to just sneak in. Go to other partners, ask them what they're doing and offer to help.

Fuck the ones who tell you not to do that. Take charge of your own career and stop waiting for permission.

Break out the knee pads, friendo, and start sucking.

Former Thacher partners keep calling me in the middle of the night and saying . . . things. Angry, sexual things.

Ditto 22. Be proactive. Worst case scenario, you still get canned. nothing to lose.

Even if you were getting work, it would likely be no-brained busywork, given your BigLaw summer pedigree. BigLaw firms have been giving summers "no work" to do for years in the form of deposition redaction and "Memo to File" assignments.

But partners and associates aren't even talking to you? I detect an odor problem lurking in this situation.

"Blessed be the Lord my strength,
Who teaches my fingers to fight, and my hands to war."

Amen.

12 and 16=Marin. The typo gives it away.

"Thank you for responding to my letter!"

-- SotomayOR!

I am going to interrupt here to provide some serious advice. Way back when I was a summer associate they told us to always go through the official assignment process. I sat around for a couple of weeks doing nothing and then realized that the busy associates were ignoring this and building relationships with associates and (if lucky) partners in the areas they were interested in. The real lawyers would then give them assignments and call the assignments in to the assignent database specifying that they want the particular summer to do it. The reality is that a lot of associates don't want to deal with a formal assignment request but will gladly take on an interested summer. At this point you have nothing to lose by going out and asking for work (official and billable, not Elie's rediculous idea).

Elie, are you suggesting the SA is getting his shit pushed in?

Roger, first of all your girlfriend is a looker.

2nd- Rest assured that your legal "experience" would have been limited had the market been in full upswing. I think if there is anything we can learn from this downturn is that ANYONE can do a partners job, and the realistic mastery of any practice area of law takes a phenomenal 1 year.

Go start a firm when you graduate.

Woof Woof Woof. Woof Woof Woof. You are going to get canned. Woof Woof Woof.

Fact #1: They have no billable work to give.

Fact #2: It is highly unlikely you will get an offer, and even if you did, it would be a contingent offer, contingent on the economy improving and the firm existing in 2014 when you could conceivably start, among other improbables.

Listen to Red. Get busy living or get busy dying. Do SOMETHING. Someone there must have a book project in waiting. Find it and get busy. If you just sit there and take it up the ass, all you are is a whore, and you'll never be anything more.

Welcome to life. You have to hustle, or live on crumbs.

Signed:

Moderately satiated partner with busy SA.

steal underwear during the day . . . . step 2. . . .profit

I'm about to withdraw my name from consideration due to personal reasons.
--SotoMAYor

36 - better her, a veritable liberal Thomas (i.e., half-literate), than someone like Kagan or Wood, who would be more dangerous.

Err, I mean, Woof Woof Woof.

10,

I disagree. Any unbilled work that the summer does will probably be duplicative and/or add little to no value. The point is to show you're making an effort to be involved and want to be there. It won't work anyway, but if you're desperate it's all you can do.

Just do what Mystal does when he panics, eat your weight in sandwiches and show everyone your moobs and belly piercing.

Grow a pair and seek out work. What is your assignment coordinator going to do if you go over his head... stop giving you work?

30 is right - screw the assignment coordinator. Go to every partner yourself and ask for work. Even if they have nothing for you, it allows you to introduce yourself, make a good impression (hopefully), and show them that you are willing to take the initiative.

Go talk to partners and associates, get work that way.

Go find someone with a pro bono case and do some work on that.

Get out of your office and do something.

In addition to the advice offered above, I'd also suggest that you take proactive steps (to the extent possible) to put yourself in good stead for on-campus interviews in the fall (and after). For instance, if there were (non-BigLaw) firms that you turned down to accept your current position, it might be worthwhile to renew your contacts there. Additionally, you can investigate internships/externships and positions with legal aid and non-profits -- both during your 3L year and after graduation. It's a cruel market out there, right now, but whatever you can do to stay afloat (and gain some practical experience) will serve you well once the economy recovers. Don't just take what your current firm dishes out. Try to take some control, however hard it is to do so. Good luck.

This happened to me last summer too. You have to email two or more partners that you are looking for work to do. Make your request very subtle like "I'm taking tomorrow off for a friends wedding but I have completed all my tasks and I will be in at 7am this Monday. I will stop by your office for additional assignments Monday morning.". Forward all emails to a personal account and if they non-offer you because of low billables, forward your emails to them where you requested work and they will make you some type of offer to get you to keep quiet. It worked for me!

This happened to me last summer too. You have to email two or more partners that you are looking for work to do. Make your request very subtle like "I'm taking tomorrow off for a friends wedding but I have completed all my tasks and I will be in at 7am this Monday. I will stop by your office for additional assignments Monday morning.". Forward all emails to a personal account and if they non-offer you because of low billables, forward your emails to them where you requested work and they will make you some type of offer to get you to keep quiet. It worked for me!

This happened to me last summer too. You have to email two or more partners that you are looking for work to do. Make your request very subtle like "I'm taking tomorrow off for a friends wedding but I have completed all my tasks and I will be in at 7am this Monday. I will stop by your office for additional assignments Monday morning.". Forward all emails to a personal account and if they non-offer you because of low billables, forward your emails to them where you requested work and they will make you some type of offer to get you to keep quiet. It worked for me!

In addition to the advice offered above, I'd also suggest that you take proactive steps (to the extent possible) to put yourself in good stead for on-campus interviews in the fall (and after). For instance, if there were (non-BigLaw) firms that you turned down to accept your current position, it might be worthwhile to renew your contacts there. Additionally, you can investigate internships/externships and positions with legal aid and non-profits -- both during your 3L year and after graduation. It's a cruel market out there, right now, but whatever you can do to stay afloat (and gain some practical experience) will serve you well once the economy recovers. Don't just take what your current firm dishes out. Try to take some control, however hard it is to do so. Good luck.

In addition to the advice offered above, I'd also suggest that you take proactive steps (to the extent possible) to put yourself in good stead for on-campus interviews in the fall (and after). For instance, if there were (non-BigLaw) firms that you turned down to accept your current position, it might be worthwhile to renew your contacts there. Additionally, you can investigate internships/externships and positions with legal aid and non-profits -- both during your 3L year and after graduation. It's a cruel market out there, right now, but whatever you can do to stay afloat (and gain some practical experience) will serve you well once the economy recovers. Don't just take what your current firm dishes out. Try to take some control, however hard it is to do so. Good luck.

heres the best advice anyone will offer you...Work the ten weeks, take the mney pay your loans off and quit law school...go get a job that society values or work for the big federal government...its not worth working hard anymore in the US unless you own your own business. Without bonuses its not worth working hard... to quote the great ricky henderson..."if they pay you mike gaego numbers, then you play lime mike gaego and nothing more..."

heres the best advice anyone will offer you...Work the ten weeks, take the mney pay your loans off and quit law school...go get a job that society values or work for the big federal government...its not worth working hard anymore in the US unless you own your own business. Without bonuses its not worth working hard... to quote the great ricky henderson..."if they pay you mike gaego numbers, then you play like mike gaego and nothing more..."

Don't listen to 8. Marin, call me!

- not Marin

i'd also suggest sending emails only once to each partner because after submitting an email it may take several minutes to appear. But basically you need to find someone who looks busy, best thing then is to COME IN EARLY like six or seven or as long as it takes. Busy people are more likely to talk to you and be impressed in morning, and they are the ones with work.

45-47: I would like to hear more about this. How did you approach your firm with the e-mails? What was the outcome?

If you are not going to get an offer anyway, which seems likely, then I would agree with what everyone says, get proactive.

First, I would go to the assignment coordinator and talk to her, straight up. Let her know that you don't have any work (though she probably already knows). Tell her you are eager to do something to display your talents. Talk to her firmly, but professionally.

Second, if she doesn't get/create work for you, then you have to branch out. Ask other associates, partners, and even other summers.

However, if it turns out that no summers have any work, then I'm not sure it's a safe bet that you're not gonna get an offer. It may just mean the firm doesn't have the work to dish out (in which case no one may get offers, but if it's a top firm, they will still give most offers to save face).

Also, I know it sounds mean, but seriously, check your hygeine. I know that at my firm, very early on, those that stink, don't dress well, dont look professional or normal, don't get attention - particularly from associates. Do your best to look professional and clean.

Either way - first talk to your assign coord, then other partners. Skipping that step could hurt you in the long run.

You people are nuts. This kid is screwed.

Also, fun fact for the summers at my firm ...that memo you're writing? The one with the hard deadline that is so important? Is also being written by five other people in different offices. The hiring committee is just going to compare and rank them 1-5 when they are doing reviews at the end of the summer. You'll never know, absent actually speaking to someone in these different offices about this competition.

Most summers will have 3-5 of these in his or her file. To get an offer you need a 4-4.5 * and * decent work on all of the other matters.

So when we say you're not competing with the other summers in the office. We're not lying. But we're not telling the truth either.

-The super fun summer committee female associate who has no power over anything but has seen and heard too much.

Dese fret-zles are mekkin me fuhrsty.

Dese fret-zles are mekkin me fuhrsty.

Go stand outside the coordiator's office and wack you wad. Keep doing it until he/she gives you something to do other than wack your wad.

Jesus they pay you idiots $2,500 a week? What a rip off.

Okay, I'll give a serious answer. Lonely summer associate, I suggest you disregard the prohibition on finding work on your own. Show up in the offices of powerful partners in the practice area of your interest. Explain that there is no work for you, and that you would like to do something useful. Is there a non-billable project Power Partner might like you to work on? Summary of recent case law, perhaps? Write up something about recent work the firm has done for marketing purposes? You'll take anything, and you'll bill it to any internal firm account, or no account at all -- Power Partner's choice.

You've got nothing to lose, and potentially a powerful ally to gain. Even if you don't get an offer, having such an ally is huge.

Do not send emails. Especially with partners. Those will probably just get ignored. Pick up the phone or, better yet, stop by someone's office. Most people aren't overwhelmingly busy, so they'll at least take some time to talk to you. If they don't have any work themselves, most decent people will tell you who might have some work to share.

62 is right. e-mails, unless necessary or from someone more important, are generally ignored. Period.

Shit. Not all firms run this way.

We have summers in our office who are doing real work--- I'm filing an appeal tomorrow, and I've got a summer associate doing a full-blown, last minute search to make sure there isn't anything out there I missed. She's already sent me some notes and one or two obscure cases that I'll probably throw in.

This is routine at some places. I've had summers write memos that served as the substantive basis for getting experts dinged from cases.... or even creative arguments on getting evidence admitted...

Firms have treated summers the wrong way for years. The right way to do it is say, look... this is real work... get it done... see if you can hang. If they can hang, great. If not, they should find something else to do.

You should start applying for clerkships now, because you're definitely getting no offered and there's no way you'll get another firm to hire you during 3L on-campus interviews.

why doesnt ATL do a story about whether its legal to hire only hot girls as law firm recruiters?

I agree with the sentiment behind 45-47, though not sure about the quasi-blackmail...

If you are not getting any work and your assignment coordinator refuses to let you get work from others, then you had better be on record (e-mails, keep copies and forward to your personal e-mail account unless that violates policies) multiple times for having asked for more work, made clear you needed work and had none/little to do, and were explicitly told not to accept work from others.

On the accepting work from others, if let's say another partner asked you to do something, I'd think a response like "thanks, that's great, I'll notify my assignment coordinator but it shouldn't be a problem because I have lots of time and want to do this" and then e-mail the coordinator "FYI, since lawyer X asked me to do something, I said that should be fine but that I'd let lawyer X know if you have a problem with me doing it" but more diplomatic.

The point being, to avoid being insubordinate you need to inform the assignment coordinator, but phrase it as "a lawyer asked me to do this so I will unless you say no" not "may I please do this".

I like that approach, 67.

64,

For litigation I agree. Every 2L can do research and write memos (at least, they should be able to). So summers can be useful in that area.

However, except for the most menial of closing tasks, summers are mostly useless when it comes to transactional stuff.

The fault, dear brutus, is not in the stars but in ourselves.

Emails asking for work are very important. It's your receipt for willingness to work. Withot those emails, you have no way to rebut the firms accusation that you are a lazy screw up. If you call askig for work, make sure you get that conversation recorded. Firms will use everything at their disposal to get rid of you even for the most trivial reasons.

Emails asking for work are very important. It's your receipt for willingness to work. Withot those emails, you have no way to rebut the firms accusation that you are a lazy screw up. If you call askig for work, make sure you get that conversation recorded. Firms will use everything at their disposal to get rid of you even for the most trivial reasons.

Emails asking for work are very important. It's your receipt for willingness to work. Withot those emails, you have no way to rebut the firms accusation that you are a lazy screw up. If you call askig for work, make sure you get that conversation recorded. Firms will use everything at their disposal to get rid of you even for the most trivial reasons.

Emails asking for work are very important. It's your receipt for willingness to work. Withot those emails, you have no way to rebut the firms accusation that you are a lazy screw up. If you call askig for work, make sure you get that conversation recorded. Firms will use everything at their disposal to get rid of you even for the most trivial reasons.

Emails asking for work are very important. It's your receipt for willingness to work. Withot those emails, you have no way to rebut the firms accusation that you are a lazy screw up. If you call askig for work, make sure you get that conversation recorded. Firms will use everything at their disposal to get rid of you even for the most trivial reasons.

Emails asking for work are very important. It's your receipt for willingness to work. Withot those emails, you have no way to rebut the firms accusation that you are a lazy screw up. If you call askig for work, make sure you get that conversation recorded. Firms will use everything at their disposal to get rid of you even for the most trivial reasons.

67: quasi blackmail? When is defending yourself against a wrongful accusation considered blackmail? Are you smoking crack?

Is there some idiot out there that thinks some little emails whining about not having enough to do is going to save you or somehow give you leverage over the firm if they no-offer you? Think again. Threatening a firm like that is a surefire career killing move in this environment. That story will, without question, get passed on to people at other firms.

Use email to seek out work if you just want to "paper your file" and go through the motions. If actually want some real work to do, go seek it out by talking to people face to face. Show some goddamn initiative and aggressiveness, two things that make a good lawyer.

22, 30, 61 and 62 are right on the money. Follow that advice.

Nobody pays attention to the assignment coordinators. And nobody goes out of their way to give work to summer associates. If you can't hear them they don't exist.

Stop by every week or so, in person, and quickly ask what's up and if there's anything you can do. Sound like you know what you're talking about.

1) get a nice haircut (or go all the way bald if you are balding)...
2) exercise during off-hours (e.g., run and do sit-ups), and see if you can lose a few pounds during the summer. think "gotta get lean"...
3) buy some apparel that's befitting of a young person
4) as for work - you can start with asking any associates or partners if they would like to have their work product (whether it be a brief or patent application) reviewed for typos/errors... (the more tedious & careful you are in reviewing work product - the higher the reward)...
5) for work you can also review recent cases in relevant areas of law and, for a particular case, prepare a presentation of the facts/issues and holding for summers/associates/partners...

if you do these things five, you will have outwardly demonstrated a choice made within - i.e., a choice to not be "no-offered"....

As a followup to my previous post.... regarding point 5, if the firm has a recent litigation win, then you may want to select that case for presentation to those in the firm who were not involved...

Many SAs had this problem last year in my firm and they all got offers. First thing I would suggest is to ask other SAs in your department whether they have anything to do. If the majority do, then you need to be proactive. If you have any partner mentors, "friends", etc, ask them (in person, preferably over lunch- if they take you to lunch) if they need assistance with anything.

Now, if the SAs in your department have nothing to do as well, then the firm is slow and/or cannot put an SA on any of the matters they have pending. It may not be as bad as you think.

Now, if you think that you smell, get on that now. A firm doesn't want a smelly, overweight, pimple-ridden attorney. I know that sounds bad, but take a look around the firm. Do the other associates look like you or better than you? If better, it is time to up your game.

Surprised that this hasn't been mentioned....

If you are going to be proactive, I would focus on getting work from every lawyer on the hiring committee (assuming that your firm has one).

That way, when they vote at the end of the summer, you might have a few allies in the room.

the squeakiest wheel gets the oil, remember that.

What happened to the Dune guy? It's a perfect set up for the litany against fear instead of that prayer...

Anyway, emails are great to get your efforts put on record, but aren't going to work by themselves. Partners will just ignore them. You need to drop by their offices too so they can connect your face with the emails.

But, if there's no work, then you're screwed either way.

78 is a moron. The key to emailing is subtlety. "I need work" is not going to work. But "here is the assignment you requested, I look forward to the next assignment" is a good way to memorialize your efforts. You want to take pre-emptive measures to secure your job or to ensure that you get a good reference.

Whatever you do, make sure you're the first one at the office and the last one out. That ALWAYS works.

All of this advice is wrong--what you need to do is walk into the office sans pants and tell everyone that a bearded bandit just blew up a wig factory

Kiwi Camara got his ASS KICKED. No other way to look at it. What was different this time? Same lady, same judge (actually more sympathetic), same evidence, same RIAA. Just different lawyers.

Camara should be ashamed of himself. If you graduate Harvard as a teenager, you have nothing in common with normal people or jurors. The jury hated this guy. From what I read, he was arrogant, talked down to the jurors, interrupted the lawyers and witnesses, and pissed off the judge.

You think he likes all this media now? He better like pro bono work because no one will ever pay this guy to represent them. Way to go, Doogie. 24 songs for $2 million. Your parents must be so proud.

GGGOOOOODDDD, I wish people would learn to RELAX

There are two possibilities: 1) you're fucked and 2) you're not fucked

If 1, then either you can a) bitch, moan and worry or b) enjoy your fucking fat paycheck and score with the hot paralegal (or, as 88 suggests, SPREAD the news about the bearded bandit)

If 2, then either you can a) bitch, moan and worry or b) enjoy your fucking fat paycheck and score with the hot paralegal

what's it gonna be homeslice?

elie, you going to make a shawshank reference in every post? it's getting old, you fat fuck. we get it--you watch movies.

Who Framed Roger Rabbit--

Now you know how many of the current associates at your firm facing stealth layoffs feel. You go around asking for work, and there isn't any. Then, some partner comes into your office and/or calls you up and yells at you because your hours are low. You tell said partner you have time on your hands and can help with whatever projects he/she and/or your department have. (In the back of your mind you think, "Gee, instead of yelling about hours, how about offering up some work? Oh, that's right. You don't have any. Never mind.") Then, you listen to the sound of birds chirping, and then a defeaning silence sets in.

Within a few months, you're summoned to a meeting with HR at which they explain their position that you're a low performer and are being terminated for that reason. You explain that in years past--meaning years in which the firm actually had work--you knocked it out of the park on hours, and this year work is slow.

Then HR lauds the fact that X associate has Y hours. You explain that X associate attained that distinction by putting together binders, stapling and collating documents and performing other secretarial functions. In addition, you note your firm's policy of 1 secretary for every 9 lawyers, and there isn't enough secretarial work to around--even though you volunteered for it.

Then HR mentions associate A who billed B hours. You respond by noting that the janitorial staff had not been seen onsite for the last month, and that rumors were swirling that associate A had now become the janitorial staff. They explain that associate A is not afraid to roll up his sleeves and get his hands dirty (no money for gloves).

The mistake the current associates make by making these and similar arguments, however, is that associates think the facts should matter. They don't. Your firm already knows it's lying through its teeth. They're just hoping you don't have any basis for bringing a lawsuit against them and/or reporting their asses to the state bar.

Trust me. You're lucky that you're figuring this out now instead of being 8-10 years in (each with billable hours well in excess of 2100/year) and being told that you're a low performer in a down economy. If you can, get out now while the getting's good.

ADVICE: Go overboard drafting memos regarding new case law and proposed laws in the practice area in which you are working or are interested. Even if you have no work, do this for 10 hours a day. Someone should take notice of your diligence and ambition.