FIRST515!

7 days.

First...does that mean I will fail the bar?

Oh no! I read Comment #1!

What can I do to dispel the curse???

bar not scary. Elie pass. I pass.

I studied for 3.6 seconds, got drunk every night of the bar, and I got the only perfect score in history

3 - Huh?

8,

I think 3 is referencing "The Ring"

maybe playing on 1's curse.

whatever it was, it was epic fail.

Do I have to pay Bar/Bri again if I fail?

So what if you fail. Do you actually have a job with an employer that cares at this point?

to 7 and subsequent flamers.

We know...you're a rockstar.

omgosh!!!

honest questions:

1) what are odds of keeping biglaw offer if I fail?
2) what state has the hardest bar?
3) do I have to pay barbri again if I fail?

thx.

I actually suggest having a couple drinks after the first night like I did last year... But hell, I was only taking the IL bar and it was the highest pass rate in years... So you may not want to do that in NY

13 = Mormon

Georgia lets you bring a clear plastic gallon bag of snacks into the bar. I plan to fill it with cottage cheese. Bad idea?

At least in WA we don't have that damn MBE to worry about...

14

1) Typically firms give you 2 chances. But, in this economy, "failing the bar" sounds like a pretty good excuse to let people go, even if it's the first time.

2) I took the CA bar. NY and CA are generally regarded as the hardest. CA sucked b/c we had to be there for 3 days. And there was an earthquake on the first day.

3) No idea. Probably not though.

My plastic bag will have two pencils, a poland springs bottle filled with gin, a cigar, and a lighter.

I'm tired of studying--I think I am taking the weekend off, bad idea.

If I lose it during the exam, what is the most interesting way to go down in flames?

Drinking after the first day is a must. Totally took the edge off the second day. If you need to cram for the second day in the evening of the first day, you're already hosed. So kick back a couple, and let the buzz take you to a nice night's sleep.

14-

1) One in this economy
2) Agree with 19, though LA with it's code is suppossed to be a bitch
3) Don't know. Just email Convisor and ask him about Bar/Bri.

1. Be a sheep
2. Ask yourself "Good idea????"
3. (almost) everyone passes.

Everyone I know (including me) who passed the bar, was sure we'd fail the bar. Positive, The week before, feeling I knew nothing as in my law school in the mid-west we didn't study the material for the Bar as many other schools in the East do. I ended up in St Lukes hospital the week beforehand with anxiety and panic. I was not alone there, two other recent law grads were there too. We were a mess. I had a rash all over chest, a boil on my forehead. On the day when we all went down to the Javitz Center, I almost passed out from lack of sleep. I drank three Red Bulls and then couldn't concentrate or finish the essay questions.
I wanted to walk into the Hudson after the first day, especially after seeing al the blanks faced Asian students eating their sushi and giggling. After day two I wanted to get a on a plane and have it crash.
As I waited for the bad results life was hell, couldn't enjoy a minute of my summer. I prepared my excuse speech for my parents, friends, co-workers. I was a failure, wasn't meant to be a lawyer. Then when the result came out, I didn't want to know, I went home and looked on line, and I couldn't comprehend what I was reading, I had passed. somehow I had passed.
Now a year later I can't recall the extreme pain and shame of that period. But it was very, very, bad, the worst I've known. But I passed. Don't forget there's lots of not so great law students taking the exam, it's curved in your favor. Good Luck.

I heard Wyoming was the hardest. Followed closely by Ohidaho. Shepherds law is really confusing. Plus you have to get all those merit badges.

14:

3) BarBri has special 'alumni' rates. Example: http://barbri.com/uploads/GA/Enroll_App_GA_2008.pdf

So, people fail often enough that BarBri worries about capturing their repeat business. Have a great week!

Taking North Carolina--I've heard it isn't too bad, here's to hoping that I have studied enough!

I'd be panicking about employment, not the bar. I passed two state bar exams while doing contractor work awaiting my first real Lawyer job, and that was a few years ago... now things are even worse.

I'd be panicking about employment, not the bar. I passed two state bar exams while doing contractor work awaiting my first real Lawyer job, and that was a few years ago... now things are even worse.

Hard liquor, and lots of it.

Hookers and coke

32 wants everyone to drink so she'll be the only sober one in the testing center.

well played, 32. well played.

You will hate biglaw anyway so if you fail, you will be poorer, but less miserable.

33,

not during the bar. at least wait till you're working at CravaTTTh

26 is the first good comment on this thread :)

Sorry,

Forgot I wasn't at my old job. Easy women and booze for the bar.

-33

I'm a Seton Hall 3L who just started studying for the bar. Should I be scared?

39

no you have a year to cram it down (unless you a retard troll and meant I am a SH grad doofus)

On a quick survey, who still can't for the life of himself or herself, remember any of the definitions? I mean I'm able to get to the general sense of what the answers are (and get the results right half the time) but ask me any criminal law definition for example (e.g. what are the elements of first degree murder in NY) and I completely blank out. There are only so many acronyms one can remember before the entire brain goes on overload. Am I the only one with this problem, because from the Bar/Bri sample essay answers, the answers all seem obvious, until you realize to get them right you need to know 52.2 million different definitions.....Help! :(

Do kids with, ahem, ADD get special time, or for the first time in their lives will I be competing with those assholes (and crushing them yet again) on the same playing field?

Virginia is the worst.

I smoked fatties every day and night while I studied for the Oregon bar. Then again . . . . . I was not alone in this ritual.

The bar is easy. Stop being such a bunch of pussies. It does not matter since there are no jobs for you after you take it.

I suggest 40's and blunts are the way to take the edge off. However, the blunt still must contain fresh OR kindbuds . . . . . I heart Oregon. F all you CA bar studying tools. Just don't move up here after you fail. We don't need any more Californians runing our pristine state.

40 - I'm a retard troll

- 39

41

Everyone (me included) is in the same boat. Remember that the kids who got in law school via AA, will be taking the exam too!

Did Star Jones pass the bar?

Screw the bar

Someone tell me if Lat is a bottom or not.

@39/45

The first step is admitting you're a retard (whereas 40 just skipped a verb pointing out your epic fail at being a troll). The next step is killing yourself.

-not 40

Anyone else do the NCBE MBE-OPEs 1/2? Anyone's that's already passed take them? Good representation of the actual exam questions? Bad?

I have heard the second one is a good score predictor.

i'm just hoping that the 3rd time is the charm (or maybe 5th time since i took 2 bars each time before!!!!)
lolz

I heard NY and a couple of other states are going to be passing fewer people this year to correlate with the fewer jobs available. Glad I got in when I did...

52-

Arizona tried that a while, it ended up losing the lawsuit.

insert "ago" into the sentence, don't want my head ripped off, though in my defense cracked out on caffeine at the library doing essay questions

52 - They wrote the bar exam a year ago. The only way they could do that is to tell the graders to grade harsher. Even that seems like it would be hard to do, considering they have an answer key with points in front of them.

The PMBR book questions are much more representative of actual questions on the MBE than Bar/Bri's questions, but the PMBR class itself is the biggest waste of time anyone can ever sit through. Buy the book and replace those questions for any multiple choice questions Bar/Bri tells you to do. Also, both books give fairly cryptic reasons for their answers so beware.

48--He's a small, nerdy gaysian. What do you think?

Recent UCLA law grad here. I'm not stressed at all. I know lots of attorneys that aren't that bright and they passed on their first attempt.

Besides, if Elie can pass the bar then I'm virtually guaranteed to as well.

cottage cheese made me laugh!

Someone told me to rub my knob while studying for the bar as mnemonic device. Is anyone familiar with this technique? Do I have to rub my knob while taking the bar? I am in cali and I don't know if I can rub my knob for three days in a row (I'm used to studying in 15 minutes intervals). Wont it get sore after a while? My knob's kinda big, do you think anyone will notice?
Help!?!

Rubbin my knob in cali.

41 -

I think the majority of us think we're there but we're really not. We've done the work, it's all in our heads, it'll all come out so long as you've at least tried this summer.

That's my story and I'm sticking to it dammit.

Now.. what can the damn president be sued for again...

YOU ARE ALL GOING TO FAIL....

and then get anal warts

43 is correct

51 ---- just give up

60,

Since you're in the home of the porn industry go find a puffer to slobber on the knob

i am hungover and reading ATL comments. will i fail?

As someone who has passed both the NY and Cali bar exams (comfortably) at the first shot, this is my advice:

Have an INSANE amount of sex this weekend. Do whatever is needed to make this happen - role playing, threesomes, watching porn together, using toys, whatever.

Works like a charm. Believe me.

51 = PE

64- 51 here- you shouldn't say disparaging things- i studied all my barbri materials on the schedule---some of us just aren't as 'gifted' taking tests but we are gifted in other ways-- lots of you t100 people always tell me such things but i think you are just jealous about my lr and my top job coming out of what you would all call a 'ttt'

i hope you aren't feeling so small when we meet in the courtroom!

Advice: Just relax. Remember this exam has a lot to do with confidence. Stress causes you to forget things, confidence eliviates stress - you get the point.

It sounds stupid but you have to believe you will pass. You probably shouldnt be in here reading 50 comments most of which are negative.

Just remember: stupider people have taken this exam and passed. Need proof look at 90% of the posters in here.

69-

If you really are 51 and are telling the truth, go a) become a paralegal, b) kill yourself becasue you ain't passing the bar son

So a friend of mine told me that she heard from a friend of hers that he heard the following:

The passing rate for first-time bar takers of the NY bar who do the BarBri course and who graduate from a New York law school and speak English as a first language is around 95%.

I seriously hope that is true, and I hope I am not the 1 in 20 who fails.

NY Test Takers - Pieper People Pass - If you took the Pieper course you will be fine.

someone please explain impleader in five words or less

25 has it right.

1. On the essays, be a sheep - create a new heading for all issues you see and give some BS rule and analyze some facts, finish with a conclusion...Pass
2. Dont freak out on the MBE, most people around you know less than you do, so when they are in the hotel saying how hard it was, just ignore. Trust your intuition, you're probably right if you have studied. Have a few drinks each night so you can get to sleep....Pass
3. (Almost) everyone passes! Its true! Lots of idiots pass.

71- i will make you eat those words! i bet i become a better lawyer then you because i have the spirit and hope that makes a great lawyer- negativity will get you nowhere! didn't your mom teach you anything?

74

Fund-mulitple claims lawsuit determines

Hit the books, you losers. And remember: when in doubt, PANIC!!!

You studied all summer, you've have done thousands of questions, tons of essays, you have re-written your notes over and over, talked about hypos with everyone who will listen.

You are going to do great.

impleader = one stake, multiple claimants

You studied all summer, you've done thousands of questions, tons of essays, you have re-written your notes over and over, talked about hypos with everyone who will listen. You proofread better than I do.

You are going to do great.

i have only really hit the books hard this past week- taking an avg difficulty state (think il,md,pa,ma,tx)

am i totally screwed?

76-

1) Since you can't pass a bar you can't be a lawyer
2) I will make more money than you
3) Breaking other's souls is a) fun b) profitable
4) You will dorwn in debt while I am on my yacht
5) 100 bucks says you fail yet again
-71

I passed the bar, but I can't shake these crabs.

82 -- no, actually. Odds are you are going to pass, and if you really studied hard this week, you are fine. You won't pass by much, but you will pass.

I realize many of the commenters here are super-douches, but common, have some heart - the people who are about to take the bar are seriously stressed, they're breaking out in hives and freaking out and not sleeping. Can you curtail your douchness for just this thread, perhaps? Perhaps tell them that everyone (almost) passes? that the world will not come to an end if they don't? That they don't need to memorize the definition of every single thing in their BarBri materials to pass? Trust me, there will be plenty of other threads for you to be your normal, mega-douche self.

The best and easiest way to pass the NY Bar is to take the Pieper course. Oh, sorry, too late for all you Barbri SUCKERS. Hope your homebrew "outlines" are up to snuff! Mine was spoon-fed to me and it worked like a charm.

I have it from very relible sources that most state bars intend to drop the pass rate to the lowest level in decades as a means of reducing the number of practicing attorneys, which in turn increases the chances for practicing attorneys to earn a decent living. Bottom line: It doesn't matter how hard you've studied or how right your answers, many of you fuckers are going to fail.

@79

I haven't written a single essay. All I do is read the fact pattern and look at the sample answers...

Did anyone else do that and still pass? Or should I be concerned...

@86

Taking the bar and like you describe, but I appreciate the douches and making douchie comments helps relieve stress. Keep at it kids, the meaner you are the funnier you are

-Stressed but will pass (maybe)

Some of you will fail, and it won't feel good. It'll suck for you.

80 - it's interpleader you're thinking of.

88 . . . and you're reliable source is your ass?

@90

86 here; you're a good sport. Good luck on the exam; trust me, you'll pass.

If you are going to freak out and vomit, be sure to vomit on the person(s) next to you. That will help the curve. It also might start a chain reaction of upchucking which also helps the curve.

And if you are short on time and need to micturate, just go on yourself. It's far better to be known as that person who micturated themselves than to fail the bar.

77, 80 - I hope you aren't taking the bar. If so, review civil procedure. For your own good.

Impleader - defendant joins third party defendant

INTERPLEADER - what you guys said.

Senior professor emeritus?

"The passing rate for first-time bar takers of the NY bar who do the BarBri course and who graduate from a New York law school and speak English as a first language is around 95%."

No F-ING way, is that true? Can somebody please verify that? If so, I might actually get some sleep this weekend.

Ritalin, but snort it, do not take it orally. Keep pills in your pockets along with quarters and crush them up right on the desk. Not only will you scare the fuck out of the people next to you, you will get a little pep in your step!

@86

Well now my mom has some company holding that belief . . .If I wasn't I would be dead by now . . .thanks for the vote of confidence

-90

66- my husband thanks you for your sage advice.

what do i do if a girl from boston is seated next to me?

102

vicks vapo-rub under each nostril

72 - It says on the NY Bar exam website that 90% of first time test takers who graduate from an ABA accredited law school passed last July (and that's including the Cooleys, etc.). If you can beat 1 out of 10 just graduated 3L's, you're in. If you are an American, first time taker from a tier 1 law school you really have to try to fail.

When have you ever worried about being in the bottom 20% of anything? 80% pass rate means it's an simple test and you should easily pass. On the other hand, if you fail you should probably just stop with the law, buy a helmet and audition for the next Life Goes On remake with the other Corkys.

88, that's complete crap, The bar passage is set by each state individually. So unless you know tons of people at tons of the 5 who are in charge of regulating NY and similarly low numbers at all states, you're just a flaming douche.

104 -- THANK YOU!

Is the pass rate for New York really 90%?

Only taking NJ cause I am lazy. Have studied anywhere from 6-10 hours every day since july 4. Before that, had all my outlines done and tried to at least keep up with practice MBE questions. Flashcards finished for every subject last week. Now just reviewing and doing questions. Got a 117 on the MPQ2 full day at the beginning of the week, hope that sets me up ok. Plan on doing about six to eight hours a day from now until the exam, but will still get a round of golf in the day before the exam to just relax, and am still going to the gym daily to stay healthy. I am pretty stressed, but I am just putting faith in the effort I already put forth....

108,

Evidently reading comprehension not your strong suit

"The average pass rate for graduates of New York law schools taking the July [2008] exam for the first time was 91 percent, surpassing the same group last year by 2.8 percentage points and registering one point higher than graduates of law schools outside the state whose schools, like all law campuses in New York, are certified by the American Bar Association."

I heard that 1 in 4 bar exam test rooms is actually a gas chamber this year.

I plan on wearing a Yale Hat, Harvard sweatshirt and Stanford zeebu pants. I will also be eating cans of baked-beans with brocolli before both nights, and wearing old unwashed gym clothes on exam day.

All candidates = 74%
First time candidates = 83%
American first time law school candidates = 90%
American first time NY law school candidates = 91%

108 - No, the pass rate is 74%. Foreigners with an LLM only pass 44% of the time, and retakers fail like crazy too (forgot the exact stat). 90% is for American first time takers.

113 = bostom female

77 responding to 74:

You are a fucking idiot. He said "impleader" not "interpleader" fuckstick. Quit acting like you know what you are talking about and go back to surfing midget porn.

74: third party claim for indemnity

Your welcome

A Partner here;

The key for me was knowing that I had a secure high-paying job. This was my motivation for passing. I did not want to be embarrassed walking through the halls of biglaw.

60

Just want to give your glorious post a shout out so that it will live infamy. Fucking hilarious. Well played.

Dude, only taking NJ and studying that much, you gotta be retarded. All NJ tests is the common law.

Kids taking NY haven't even looked at the NJ materials, were all just gonna glance over them the day after the MBE. You'll be fine, chill the fuck out! Oh, and take a real bar exam. NJ is a joke, The only real tests are NY and CA. . . the rest, if you don't pass you don't deserve to be a lawyer.

114

So it seems that NYers are in fact 1% smarter than the rest of the U.S. population.

121,

Your forgot to mention they are 100% douchier

26 -- THANKS FOR YOUR STORY. IT HELPED.

41 -- same boat here, bud. Good luck!

Was on the brink of a breakdown this morning but pulled back he reigns. Whew!

121, yes we are. :) and further, think that covers all the shitty tiered schools in NY too. . . most out of staters takin NY are the cream of the crop from those schools with the NY biglaw jobs. NYC FOREVER BABY!

First to say that this is ATL's way to get high page views over the weekend.

AHHH LAWW SCHOOOL
AHHHHH THE BARRRRR
AHHHHHHH RES ISPA LOQUITORRRRR

i think our entire profession needs to chill out...
...starting at the bottom!

that's why i've been drinking ever night of the bar prep summer starting at 5:30!

nooooo joke :)

and don't worry - chances are if you're reading ATL, then you're halfway aware of the law and probably in the 80% pass margin !

-121

See 124 for a prime example.

-122

122, you have to learn how to write. "your forgot to mention" . . . proves the NY point retard

122, you forgot to learn how to write a sentence. "Your forgot to mention. . . "

EPIC RETARD FAILURE!

127

We second.

1-123, 125-27

41 - yes, you are the only one who cannot remember those critical definitions and you should expect to fail.

The average pass rate for graduates of New York law schools taking the July exam for the first time was 91 percent, surpassing the same group last year by 2.8 percentage points and registering one point higher than graduates of law schools outside the state whose schools, like all law campuses in New York, are certified by the American Bar Association.

128-129

Chill the fuck out. It was a stupid typo. And for Christ's sake it's Friday afternoon. Find yourself a brown paper bag and get to it. While sticking a straw up your nose.

Ah so one extra r defeats my point? I beg to differ and youR (r intended here assholes) attacks on me and mocking of special people proves my point

122

PS go play a game of hide and go fuck yourself

haha @65 it's a fluffer not a puffer...

The best piece of advice I can give to you bar takers is this: be mentally prepared for your computer to fail. It happens to at least one person at every testing center. I personally know two members of my class who had their machines blow up on them. The first calmly requested bluebooks and kept going - he passed. The second flipped out and cried a little - she failed (but passed the next attempt).

133, I will own your obese acne faced midwestern ass. OWN IT MOTHER FUCKER!

Will there be anything about contracts or property on the exam? Oh, what about constitutional stuff? Will that be there too?

Scored 135 on PMBR 3-day test. Do you really add 36 to that and how realistic is there test to real exam?

@135

I checked the urban dictionary for puffer and it had this: "on a pornset, responsibile for keeping the male erect." Thought I was safe, but then again that's what I get for using urban dictionary as a reference. But at least you got the point!

65

visit http://bit.ly/N6nGZ

Everyone chill the fuck out. I dont know what the hell interpleader is. I aint worried about it. THe chances of that being an essay are about .01% and even then the max points it can be is 2. Chill out. Learn what you need to know. Chill out.

137=angry little man

143 = fat chick with herpes.

144=137

144 = asslobster

141 - that looks like a link to something that will fuck your computer up . .

137 owns it - just like he owns the title to that double single-wide trailer from which he'll be practicing gay porn contract law.

147

It's just a short link. But don't click it anyway--not worth your time.

BREAKING NEWS: Both Google and Microsoft's new Bing have SCRUBBED stories about Obama's missing birth certificate; previous top entries from the only organization covering the issue (WorldNetDaily) were dropped to the bottom of the search and REPLACED with lefty links to the HuffingtonPost, MediaMatters, Snopes, Factcheck.org, and host of others.

THIS NO JOKE.

As soon as the story becomes national, the left-wing search engines go to work! Probably at the request of Obama!

http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=104947

147-

It's a short link to godhatesfags.com. I can't believe I clicked on it. It's retarded.

I prefer this urban dictionary def of puffer:
A PUFFER is directly farting into the mouth of another while they willingly inhale the fart fumes into their lungs, similar to the way an asthmatic uses their "puffer" hence the name. Puffers are only administired by females to a male or female partner. This is not to be confused with a BOOFER, which is a male farting into a female's mouth.

Scored 135 on PMBR 3-day test. Do you really add 36 to that and how realistic is their test to real exam?

152

How would a court rule if using the plain meaning of the word in a K?

Anyone bar veterans have any tips for the MPT?

I realize I am a bit late weighing in on this story. I think the NY Bar exam is too easy. Most plebes can pass this exam without a problem. My advice for your last 72 hours is to relax, preferably at an establishment such as Rick's Cabaret, that is, if you can afford it. If you fail the bar exam, your failure will not resonate as much as in prior years as there will be many unemployed legal peons, regardless of whether they are licensed attorneys or bar exam failures. I will warn you that if you fail the bar exam, you might as will hang up the legal career. When my firm begins hiring JDs for paralegal postitions, we will be requiring our candidates to have passed the bar on the first try, no exceptions. If you find yourself at the Javits Center this Wednesday or Thursday and decide you want to abort the exam, come join me at Rick's Cabaret. I will be there on those two days from 1-3PM. At this point you don't need luck in passing the bar exam. However, you will mostly likely need a miracle to break into my beloved profession.

OCEANS RISE

CITIES FALL

EEK!

153

The 3-day exam is much harder than the real one. They've given you all moderate and difficult questions (i.e. no easy ones). It doesn't really matter what you would add to your score, because you are probably going to be so far ahead that it won't matter, and you could probably bomb the essays and still pass.

155 -- there a billion ways you can earn points on the MPT. Just calmly outline your answer, and then write as much crap as you can. You'll get the points you need, no problem.

117 - The only thing I dislike more than ignorance is ignorance displayed by someone attempting to ridicule others for their ignorance.

An impleader is not limited to claims for indemnity. It includes, among other things, contribution as well.

I WILL pass this damn exam.

PE

About fucking time you made an appearance. . . And since I am leaving to go home for the day done with studying, I can surmise you too are done. . . .Good luck next week.

150 - you troll. Here's some bread.

Perhaps the engines are removing deceptive stories because they are PATENTLY FALSE and MISLEADING.

I, for one, am GLAD that someone is trying to relegate the boneheaded comments and "stories" and "facts" to the rubbish bin where they belong. I'm all for freedom of speech - just not deceptive speech.

/end troll feeding.

60 lofl

PE,

No need to worry about admission costs at Rick's. Free admission here:

http://www.ricks.com/NYC/

this ain't sea world,
it's as real as it gets,
IM ON A BOAT MUTHAFUCKA DONT YOU EVER FORGET

150,

Those search engines acted stupidly.

154--

An issue would arise if the employer, knowing the prospective employee thought "puffer" meant "fluffer," took advantage of this fact and tried to force the employee to puff rather than fluff. In that case, the employee would not be required to fart in the actor's mouth, and would likely be excused from performance altogether.

-152

This comment is addressed to post no. 164.

Getting through the door at Rick's Cabaret does not guarantee instant relaxation. For that, you will need access to the VIP lounge, which I doubt most of you louts can afford. I will, however, be with the rest of the plebes in the non-VIP section this Wednesday and Thursday, from 1-3PM.

And to the idiot that asked Bruce, the bouncer, to identify me, I have instructed that you or any person asking whether certain partners frequent Rick's Cabaret be labelled persona non-grata indefinitely.

http://www.ricks.com/NYC/images/menus/RNY_Bmenu.pdf

-Fuck, look at the bottle prices at Rick's. If you're going to get drunk and grabby, you're going to pay for it.

RE: 26

i love now racism towards asians is so cool, when no one would ever dare say something like "i was so scared at lunch cause all the darkies around me taking the bar might rob me and take my laptop"

PE was disbarred in 1972. Since then he has been institutionalized at the Buffalo Psychiatric Center. His recent upgrade to "Non-threatening" status allowed him to have personal items such as a computer. Please play along with him. Role playing is good for his therapy.

PE,

No need to worry about identification. I'm rolling with a crew and am just going to beat the shit out of everyone I see in there.

-164

PE is NOT a law student or a lawyer.

He is a shill for Rick's. He always talks about it. You're going to spend two days there in a row and you don't work there? Get a fucking life man.

170: LOL. Hilarious but true.

26: don't need your comforting if it's from a fucking rascist. You may pass the bar but you fail at life.

The failure rate is going up all over the country. This is a fact, just wait and see. Dr. Doom is looking over your shoulder, and he's going to shit down your throat. The end is near. Fuck each and every one of you.

175 Fuck you you hilarious fucking bastard.

I was laid off and am taking my second bar. I find it hard to concentrate since i'm constantly thinking of suicide. Elie, any suggestions on how to either kill self or concetrate?

Doesn't really matter. I'll probably be dead before Nov results come out.

I'm a CCN grad who had to retake the CA bar after failing it the first time. I studied 10-12 hours/day for 2+ months and destroyed the MBE. But I rolled straight 60s on the essays. What happened? I got cutesy. My essay answers looked just like my law school exams. I was so busy talking policy and theory, that I failed to hit all the issues. I actually highlighted the similarities between the essay fact patterns and precedent (i.e. "this fact pattern is similar to that faced by the Supreme Court in United States v. ..."). Am I a moron? Yes, but not because I didn't know my stuff. I got too cute. And then I got to explain to my friends how I was one of <10 people from our graduating class that didn't make the cut.

Please believe me, the bar exam really is designed for simpletons. The examiners just want to see that you've put in the effort. Identify the issue, cite the rule, devote 1-2 sentences to analysis, and move on. Show your comprehension but stay at the surface. You will only hurt yourself by digging any deeper.

FYI: there's still redemption for those of you who don't pass the first time. I went on to clerk at COA and second chaired a case argued at SCOTUS this term.

Good luck. You guys are going to nail it!

HELP!

I am handwriting, and they say to write single spaced. My handwriting is ok, (average) but will probably get worse as the day goes on. Also, writing single spaces leaves no room to add things that you forget. Will I be penalized if I write double spaced?

Please, be nice....

179 - the barbri guy said if your handwriting is really bad, go with double spacing. Also, one of the lecturers said to just throw whatever you forgot at the end. Say, "in addition . . . ."

175: Totally unfazed - failure happens to those that deserve it. Maybe you? You sound slightly bitter and totally unemployed. Or like a negative little bitch with nothing better to do with your time in this economy than try and take people down along with you.

153,

I also got a 135 on the Kaplan 3-day practice test! Can we be 135 pals?

It's kinda like being BFFs, except it doesn't last forever, because of the Rule Against Perpetuities, and let's face it; we're not running a charity here.

pass rate for Canadians writing the NY bar is nearly 100%. I like those odds.

Say the following when you enter the testing center and you'll be OK:

What.

The.

Fuck.

i've been laid off please euthanize me i can't take it anymore

Say the following when you enter the testing center and you'll be OK:

What.

The.

Fuck.

Had trouble getting motivated for studying. Graduated 1st in class and just felt, well, no way could I fail the bar. Studied a couple hours each day from May on, but mainly just by doing MBE questions. Took a total break of two weeks in July. This week I started up again with bigger hours, 5 or so, reading outlines, answering questions. I don't know. Kind of worried because the stakes are high. But I know the damn law and I write good, concise, to-the-point essays. No, I won't pass with flying colors, but I only need to pass.

So part of me reads about these people cramming for months and thinks I blew it. But a larger part of me thinks, again, I know this stuff. Guess I'll find out in November.

183

Stats from where?

Starting to freak out. Like 41, I feel like I don't know so much of the stuff!!!! Argh.

Kicking myself already for giving serious advice here, but just don't panic. When I took the bar there was a subject BarBri said our state had never tested on, ever. Made a big show of having us all rip out that section of our Bar Review outlines. Guess what was the subject of question #2?

I read it, laughed, made something up, and moved on. Lots of people panicked. Worst pass rate in the history of the state that year.

Bottom line, keep your cool. Making up something and moving on is better than freaking out.

Watching the T.O. Show on VH1. Semi-interesting.

190: Isn't this a story that BarBri tells -- some obscure subtopic of Texas oil and gas law, and how the people who made just up a logical enough sounding rule ended up being correct?

I'm like 41- I didn't get through law school because I was able to memorize my outlines (can't memorize much of anything for more than 2 days). I'm just a quick thinker and good at logic- so I did well in law school.
But the bar exam seems like it requires memorizing and regurgitating buzzwords and elements of crimes. Will I still pass if I explain myself but can't remember too many of the buzzwords? Not worried about MBE- but my state counts essays for 2/3 of score...

Bar Thread already to 190!!!

I'm like 41- I didn't get through law school because I was able to memorize my outlines (can't memorize much of anything for more than 2 days). I'm just a quick thinker and good at logic- so I did well in law school.
But the bar exam seems like it requires memorizing and regurgitating buzzwords and elements of crimes. Will I still pass if I explain myself but can't remember too many of the buzzwords? Not worried about MBE- but my state counts essays for 2/3 of score...

Say the following when you enter the testing center and you'll be OK:

"Bring it on bitches" . . . "Let's get this mothafuckin' party started bitches" . . . "I'm gonna rock this bitch" . . . or some variation thereof, be creative : )

Also, remember that after it's all over, everyone thinks they did worse than they actually did. If you're one of those people who are totally convinced that you passed, then you probably failed. I was 100% convinced I had not quite "rocked the bitch" to the point of passing and, whadayaknow, I made the pass list! Seriously tho, good luck to all.

Flashdancers > RIck's Cabaret

who are these bar examiners? i want to terrorize them

Former Thelen and current Orrick partner The Glass Cock here, demanding that Partner Emeritus shut the flying fuck up about Rick's Cabaret. That is a partner only hangout and like the Glass Cock said before, we don't need a retired partner, a veritable barnacle on our ship of profits, telling everyone in the world where we go to get shitfaced and grab some ass.

As for the bar exam, here is the Glass Cock's advice: Start smoking. The Glass Cock quit smoking in June of the year he took the NY bar and started smoking again the day before the bar. Having the sweet embrace of nicotine in the bloodstream as you take your first break from the exam will make everything seem less important. Or perhaps, if you hate smoking, you can start shooting up heroin. Same effect.

Funny story about the Glass Cock's experience at Javitz for the bar...on the second day the very fat guy in front of the Glass Cock (think Elie, but white and 200 lbs more) was having a very hard time breathing. It sounded like an asthmatic choir. As the breathing became more labored, the Glass Cock looked up just in time to see the lardass' seat collapse (obviously from being overloaded) and the white Mystal collapse to the ground as if in slow motion, slamming his head against the Glass Cock's desk and knocking the Glass Cock's Armitron watch to the floor.

It being New York, the only proper thing to do was to grab the watch and continue with the test, without even looking to see if the fallen test taker was alive. The roaming proctors even yelled at the one idiot who tried to stand up to help fatso.

The Glass Cock would like to close with a reminder...the only thing passing the bar does for you is give you the chance to be berated by me as I expect you to read my mind and draft compliance certificates while taking notes on a conference call that you have nothing to do with. If you fail the bar, consider yourself blessed.

Glass Cock, out.

Dear 160:

While you are correct in stating that impleader can be invoked to assert a claim for contribution, typically such claims will be asserted as cross-claims against defendants who are already party to the suit, thus no need to implead. A claim for contribution more often than not arises out of the same transaction or occurrence that is the subject of the plaintiff's complaint. In states that maintain joint and several liability, a defendant may use impleader to assert a claim for contribution against a third-party defendant. However, in states where joint liability has been abolished, a defendant may not use impleader to assert a claim for contribution because he has no right to contribution. Ergo, while impleader CAN be used for contribution, it ALWAYS has to be used for claims for indemnity.

So you see, my inexperienced cocky know-it-all, what may be a technically correct answer on the bar exam (which I hope you pass... I really do) is not necessarily the correct procedure or the one that is most commonly used in practice.

But given the fact that you knew this much, you should be fine to pass the bar exam. Good luck.

While I'm waiting for my rice to cook, I might as well share the secret to picking up strippers as was told to me by a very wise man.

One lonely night as I was "making it rain", none of the ladies were paying me any attention. I look over to my right and see a black man, around his 40's, not dressed well and barely any cash on the table. Interesting thing was, he was draped with the hottest dancer in the club. So as I'm blowing money and wondering what the hell he's doing right that I'm not, I finally get my chance to ask as it was time for his arm candy's set. I trot over and say "so what's your secret? I haven't seen you drop a dollar or buy a drink and the ladies love you...."

The secret, verbatim "You have to treat them like they're human...." I had the most confused look on my face.

"They ARE humans!?!?"

"No, you can't treat a stripper different from a girl who works in an office, no matter how demeaning you think their occupation is... they are still women and want to be spoken to with respect. You treat them like strippers, they treat you like clientele. That means they come by, take your money and move on."

I felt enlightened. I gave it a try and my conversations started sounding like this "Hey sweetheart, I bet your feet are killing you dancing in those heels all day...," or "wow, that guy was really a creep... I bet you run into a lot of weirdos all day." He was right, spent less money, got lots of stripper numbers and plenty of the attention. Damn, I'm such a jerk.

I've been living in the library and I think my brain will explode.

I wish I could resign myself to failing, but I'd hate to be one of the 8% or whatever that fail the NY bar.

World of pain.

Want it to be over!!!!!

PE = law student

The charade is obvious, your commenting this week has dropped more than ever, as you prep for the Bar exam.

Good luck with the Bar exam.

My thoughts:

-- do outline essays at least somewhat before writing so you don't forget issues
-- be a sheep (IRAC is king). No policy crap!
-- don't skip around on essay questions reading one question, then deciding you'll do it later, etc. Have a plan and stick to it
-- don't lose track of your budgeted time for looking at the file on performance tests (California)
-- recognize that after the mutli-state multiple choice day you're going to think you have failed, because you will have to guess between two remaining choices many, many times
-- ignore the a**hole next to you who finishes the multistate 30 minutes early in the morning; either he/she is a genious, in which case, who cares? -- you don't need to be that smart to pass; or he/she is going to fail
-- recognize that if you went a good law school, anywhere from 75-90% of your class passes the first time, depending on state and school. Were you in the bottom 25% of your class? No? Did you essentially follow BarBri and study a lot, even if you didn't do all the practice tests and extra junk? Yes. Breath easier.
-- go by the exam center the evening before to familiarize yourself with it
-- review ahead of time the instructions about all the stuff you can and cannot take inside
-- mentally prepare yourself for the possibility your computer will freeze or crash (I wrote 20 minutes of one essay while mine rebooted); I know someone who had to write a whole day in California: he passed
-- DO NOT EVER talk to your friends about your answers on the first day, or at any time on the first two days (California) NEVER!!!
-- take a hot bath every night, pamper yourself a little with bathsoaps and sh** if you're in a hotel
-- don't be afraid to review at night, but don't do so just because you think you have to, and don't do so if it just makes you more nervous and upset that you didn't study more in June
-- recognize that almost nobody else is getting any more sleep than you're getting the night before it starts
-- try to go to bed early though so that after you've laid awake for three hours before falling asleep you still get decent sleep
-- if you have really not studied enough (by which I mean, you really, really slacked), then no matter how smart you are, you may be screwed; but, take it anyway, because you never know. Girl in my row didn't come back after the first day; I KNOW she failed.

WE FEEL YOUR PAIN. But this too shall pass.

201,

THANK YOU. Just excellent stuff there my friend.

-ATL single male community

Thanks 204. That's reassuring.

you guys are freaking hilarious...i'm like 41 can't remember an element to save my ass but imma go rock it and if all else fails...which in my case it might...there is always february...no stress...i'm gonna take a shot of patron and call it a night...it's been a long ass day of doing essays and Full Day AM Qs...

Two in the Blood; One in the Mud.

WWTD?

What Would Thio Do?

Unlike 207, the thought of being able to retake (even though I wouldn't lose my job if I had to), does NOT comfort me. I don't want to waste another minute of my life like this, preparing or actually taking. THIS IS HELL!

takeaway = if you are a (genius / policy wonk / mental deficient / drunkard / j.d.) you may or may not pass and/or fail

also... unless you have a knob-oriented study-plan, you will not enjoy taking this test and you might end up covered in vomit.

KEEP IT SIMPLE STUPIDS.

IRAC.

Have a few beers and a nice din the night before. You won't really sleeps....those patterns you see on PMBR practice tests? They actually repeat themselves on the MBE.

Take your time on MBE and read the f'n question.

Seriously, i sucked up the LSAT and passed the bar w/ flying colors the first try. Practice your nuttles off.

Good luck!!! I'll be talking shit about you next year when you can't distinguish a privileged doc from a table of contents (even though you're soooo smart b/c you passed the bar)!!!!

BILLY MAYS HERE, I'M DEAD!

212- the ciiiiiiiiircle of life........

I didn’t pass the MPRE in November and did not take it in March because I was at a friend’s wedding. I spent the last 2.5 months splitting my time between studying for the August MPRE and the Bar. Can anyone tell me if the Bar is as hard as the MPRE.

215: Please tell me you're not serious. And, if you are and you failed the MPRE while putting in any good faith effort whatsoever, that really doesn't bode well for your bar performance...

215 = weak flame.

Oh, and I'm the douchebag who will finish the MBE an hour early. I'm not doing it to be a prick, and I'm not a genius. I just happen to be a fast test-taker, have been since grade school. I'm not going to do any better or any worse than you, I'll just get a slightly longer lunch break and hit the liquor store a little earlier in the afternoon.

Good luck to everyone. Most people pass.

I'm not 215- but I thought the MPRE was hard! People say it's easy but really it's just scored "liberally"- most Qs have no correct answer and I guessed on most of them.

now, now....be gentle on 215....

Scaled MBE=168, passed. Attended TTT law school. All of you will pass if you follow Douglas Adams' advice, "Don't panic."

hey, as long as you're the kid of a latham partner, you don't need to pass the first time.

Okay, can anyone tell me exactly which types of Executory Interests are cut off by the RAP, and why? I have spent the last 3 weeks studying NOTHING BUT PROPERTY and still can't figure it out. I'm so going to fail.

222 - ha. ha. ha.

Out-of-stater, taking CA exam in San Mateo. Anyone for going out after the first and second nights?

224 -- intriguing...a mid-bar booty call...m or f? Ah hell, it doesn't matter! Let's hook up somewhere.

222 - the answer is... draw an elephant

http://funnyexamanswers.com/2007/09/30/elephant-in-the-way/

Texas, bitches! (But no law jobs here, so don't even ask)

Even amid the recession, Texas boasted the best economy in the nation -- for the third year in a row, according to the CNBC survey. The state also was No. 1 in transportation and infrastructure.

Texas ranked in the top 10 for technology and innovation, cost of living and access to capital.

Unemployment in Texas rose to 7.5 percent in June, its highest level since January 1993, but it's still 2 percentage points below the national rate.

No state has more Fortune 500 companies: Texas had 64 this year. Texas has no state or corporate income tax.

Screw all you NY/NJ/CALI douchbags! And Governor Perry is telling Obama that we don't want his flaming heap of Health Care legislation. SUCKERS!

http://seperac.com/bar/calc-bar-f09.php
NY Feb. 2009 Bar Score Calculator

Assuming you've studied, the best advice--Take 2 Tylenol PM at 8 p.m. at night before each exam day (expect to be out by 10 p.m.) and when you get up at 7 a.m. (or whatever), take 2 NoDoz, Large Dunkin Donuts Coffee and 2 glazed donuts. At 10:30, drink a Red Bull.

I'm serious about the sleep aid, cuz your mind is going to be going 180 mph and if you don't have a chemical helper, you'll find yourself tossing and turning all night, and if you're scrounging around for the Simply Sleep at 4 a.m., YOU ARE SCREWED!

204 is the man (or woman). My theory is that half the commenters that talk big here are just trying to overcompensate. Anyway, thanks 204. I may not know any law - but I sure as hell studied hard and I think I can strictly apply IRAC. Wish me luck! Good luck everyone!!!!

229 -- decent advice -- but I'm going to try nyquil and deep breathing....and rubbing one out right before bed.

remember . . . if that moron who gave the ConLaw lecture for BarBri can pass on her first time, so could you . . .

Is it true that the barbri practice MBE question sets are harder than the real thing? tonight every question I'm doing just seems to be asking something really picky and/or obscure...

I actually think this one would have passed. Excellent analysis.

http://funnyexamanswers.com/2007/09/30/describe-the-graph/

232 -- that is an awesome flame. Hahaha. How many will bite, I wonder.

232, props.

I thought the full day they gave us for today and tmrw was insanely difficult. if you notice at the front of the MPQ book 2 under the copyright there's a notice that 87 of the 200 on the full day in the book were revised released q's from the NCBE. Just for me i did MUCH better on those than the Barbri created ones.

Wait til the PM portion of the practice, Question 109 is hilarious and almost impossible to answer.

222- unless you're taking in a jurisdiction that asks perpetuity essays, don't even spend another second. And even if you are, this should help, at least on the MBE. A lot.
Look at the list of interests, and find the first one that isn't to a specific person (i.e., to "children" "sisters" "brother" "son" "daughter", etc) that first general interest is valid. The next interest after that is valid. Everything after that is void for the Rule Against Perpetuities.

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Latham NY Lathamed all the first years who didn't pass the bar except for a partner's son

i agree with 238

237 you are a sanity-saver.

I quit after the first 50 sample questions today. Not happy with score, not happy with guessing so much on the questions, about to throw self out window.

BUT, I just double checked and I only missed 1 (ONE!!) out of the 18 of that 50 which were revised release questions (as opposed to BarBri-created).

seriously, thanks...

--233

242- no worries. I was freaked out by it too. Odd they'd want to rip us apart 4 days before the Bar vs boost our confidence a bit. Good luck.

242- no worries. I was freaked out by it too. Odd they'd want to rip us apart 4 days before the Bar vs boost our confidence a bit. Good luck.

-237

Hey, just curious,

What do people feel about the MPT. Should I give it a go this weekend?

Thanks,

" for so long as property is used for ...." and then an executory interest. will be invalidated for RAP b/c the person or their heirs could decide to stop fulfilling the conditions 100 years from now. so that violates the RAP. shifting executory interest.

just to clarify if would have to say, "To A, then to B for so long as property is used as a farm, and if ever used for commercial purposes, then to C" C has a shifting executory interest, but invalid under the RAP b/c who knows when the condition would be violated. Violates the RAP b/c its going to someone other than the grantor. If it goes back to the grantor it can never violate the RAP.

225 - See 66.

-224.

I've been having sex while studying all week. I've been doing pretty good, but then I was slamming this Boston chick and she stuck a Usufruct up my ass. Any tips?

247: Correct, just remember also the charity to charity exception (if BOTH B and C are charities, it doesn't violate RAP).

And, if you see a potential RAP issue on an essay question, you probably want to write something about whether your state has adopted a RAP reform statute like USRAP (where it's ex, 90 years instead of 21 years, and they actually look to see what happened in reality, as opposed to making up some hypothetical of how it could violate RAP).

@ 237

Holy shit, a bobcat?

is it possible to get 98 percentile on Bar Bri/Kaplan and screw up on the actual test?

247: not just if it goes back to the grantor, but if the gift is already vested then no RAP either. only for class gifts / contingent remainders (charity to charity exception). Yeah, I'm gonna pass this shit.

251- yep. that one, ridiculous isn't it? i threw my pen against the wall. it's about five layers deep into the rule. Wild animal-strict liability, unknown trespasser-no duty, but here i thought the woman was a known trespasser they disagreed. and the vet's negligence, combined with the sign warning people walking across the lawn. pretty much the most ridiculous question i've ever seen.

I dunno about you all, but I am having so much fun right now, that I just might do it again in February

Relax and get a good night's sleep the night before. That's pretty obvious (I think even the Barbri outline recommends it...), but finish your studying during the day, see a movie or something and go to bed.

First put your wallet/photo ID/admission ticket/glasses/laptop if applicable/whatever else goes in clear plastic bags in a pile so it's ready to go the morning of. Arrange with family or friends (or hotel if you're travelling to write the bar) to give you a wake-up call just in case - you probably don't need it in addition to the alarm, but just eliminate the risk.

DO NOT bring study materials with you, the morning of they'll just freak you out and be annoying to carry (and are there lockers or not, do you end up discarding them, what?). Bring a newspaper or something you can read to try to relax while still remaining mentally active and then discard it (sorry, put it in the proper recycling bin...) when it's time to go into the exam. At this point you know everything you need to pass, all you have to do is get enough sleep and stay calm and focused. Or, if you don't know enough to pass, freaking out and/or trying to study the morning of won't help.

After the first day's exam DO NOT talk about it with others, just go home/back to your hotel and have a nice meal (or have a nice meal elsewhere then go back), watch some TV and go to bed with the same alarm/wake-up call backup/everything ready to go for the next day.

To succeed there are a couple of things I've been told to do:

1. Go to bed early (even if you toss and turn you'll likely fall asleep within 2 hours).

2. Use Ritalin

3. Get a little stank on the hang-low both nights.

239 is a trolling racist. Go out buddy, it's friday night in the summer.

my advice on taking the ny bar:

TAKE EARPLUGS. the proctor right in front of me talked throughout the entire first day of the exam.

do your best to memorize the definitions of the various laws and ny distinctions. even if you think you're not retaining anything, keep working on it. you'll remember enough to pass.

right now it's time to focus on reviewing what you do know, not trying to improve on your problem areas. at this point, it's all about maximizing points in the areas you can do well in.

i focused on learning the material, with practice questions coming second. i know many other people who focused more on the practice questions, so it's whatever works for you. i probably wrote out 10 essays total and read over/issue-spotted another 20 just to make sure i could handle the format/timing.

good luck everyone! just stay strong - you're almost there!

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REGARDLESS, if you get stuck, just incorporate this legal truth into your essay: Obama is an undocumented illegal alien from Kenya.

48 - He is.

I am pleasantly surprised. There are actually some good pieces of advice in here (mixed in with the usual crap).

quinn WANES.

263 is right. Here's some more advice: Obama should either release his birth certificate or resign.

Is it a bad idea to pull an all-nighter on Monday night to figure out the difference between a Covenant and an Equitable Servitude?

Just think: in 6 long, grueling days, we will never have to hear the word BLACKACRE again!!!!!!! That alone is worth going through all this shit!

266 - Yes, it's a bad idea. You should get a full night's sleep on the two nights leading up to the bar (so Sunday night and Monday night, for people who sit on Tuesday).

Don't sweat the bar. Barry Obama has already killed the legal profession as we know it.

Thanks Obama.

-laid off Latham first year

Its times like these, studying for the Bar, that I think the wrong side won the Cold War.

I mean, no property, contracts, or con law? Its almost worth forfeiting basic freedoms and swigging vodka by the tumbler.

14:

as to 1) let's hope we don't fail and don't have to deal with it.

If you fail - maybe because you read comment #1 - don't worry, it's not the end of the world.

Look at this list of bar exam "famous failures," who went on to have excellent careers after failing (in law and other fields):

http://www.abovethelaw.com/2007/07/the_bar_exam_a_list_of_famous_1.php

Ellie jerks off to cured meats. For realzies.

-kash's ass lobster

Does anyone know how the barbri essays in the practice book compare to the ones on the bar? I know the law from the outlines, but it seems every essay I do brings up issues and parts of law that we didn't cover.

Not only that, but I've found dozens of answers in the essays that completely contradict/misstate the law that we've been taught.

I would be curious to know if people are having similar experiences. Right now, doing a practice essay seems to sap all of my confidence from me.

Taking the bar in MA, fyi. Good luck everyone.

233 - Yes. That's on purpose. Don't sweat it.

227 - The economy in Texas does seem more resilient.

The problem is, you have to live in Texas.

Can anyone who has taken the bar before comment on how the actual bar MBE compares to the barbri practice tests?

Barbri sets the goals lower (sometimes only 50%, sometimes 60%) than what you actually need on an MBE, so the prevailing wisdom among bar studiers this year is that barbri questions are a bit harder.

tyia

274

Some of the essay questions in the Barbri books are longer than they will be on the real thing. When they added the MPT a couple years ago, apparently they started building the essay questions with one or two less issues. In the front of the NY essay book it tells you which ones were edited down to be more like what we'll see on Tuesday.

Also, yes, I think the model essay answers contain some contradictory and/or wrong law. I've taken it to mean that really, if you think about it, you don't have to be right about every little detail in order to give a really good answer, not exactly - just be close and make it sound like you're a lawyer. Throw in what you know and reason out the rest and keep it simple - don't sweat the small stuff except on the NY multiple choice (man those are picky picky)

178 - Nice post, thanks for the advice and wishes of good luck!

Tried to comment on the Herbstreit thread.

Just going to give a shout out to Elie (really?) for quoting Lee Corso on the "not so fast my friends" comment. Nice work.

This gives me the thought that maybe Elie actually likes sports, which makes me at least want to respect him. Even if I wanted to, it would be tough, especially in light of his previous argument on the good samaritan law.

Anyway, as for the Corso reference, well played Elie. Well played.

On youtube--

there is avice from the great--Charles WHitebread
on the BAR.

Knowing to much is as bad as knowing too little.

The Cal bar is 3 days--the most challenging thing
to deal with is the endurance!

After the 1st day--stress and the exam take its toll.

Just be positive! You can only do your best.

Spoonfeed the examiners--something the Ivys t-20
forget abot.

Don't assume the examiner has the same level of knowledge.

good luck

274 - I don't know if MA publishes sample answers, but if they do, have you looked at the sample answers on the bar website? For the CA test, they're waaaaay more simple and short than the barbri answers, and often are completely wrong, yet they're the answers that were selected as the best and published as examples. The Barbri answers are definitely more in depth than you need to go on the actual bar to pass (and yes, the Barbri answers are often wrong and miss completely obvious issues, way to go Barbri!)

oops, 274, sorry I didn't notice you were taking MA and not NY. Check the front of your book, see if the essay questions will be any different than in the samples.

And really, don't sweat it. I think some of the model answers are ok and some are a little sub-par. I've noticed same fact patterns that repeat - sometimes the model answers repeat the same law blurb, and then other times they don't mention the issue at all or say something contradictory. I think the details like that don't matter so very much - so long as you have the core, settled points down pat, you'll be fine. -279

19

1992 bar? also had some dude that had a seizure--it sucked

Guy next to me in some t-3 school asked about the subpena duces tecum--sp?

was intimidated I was t-20

Somewhat random results very bright people failed and the converse.

Just be rational--at this stage your knowledge level is determined--

main thing is to be calm and to do your best

and do not write after the stop notice--one guy continued nd was flagged
do not know what happened.

also in CA some attty failed 3 times--had his wife--a jammer
passed earlier--big law take the exame for him in disguise

I don’t think #26 is a racist. He’s just emotional and honest. The poor guy comes out of the exam, after being hospitalized for anxiety, covered in a rash, with a big boil, or maybe two or three by then on his forehead, probably sweating, dehydrated, sure he’s failed the exam, suicidal and there he sees a couple of cool, attractive Asians, with no affect whatsoever, eating sushi as if it’s any old day, and he feels like a total alien to their coolness, not their race.

-282:

Thanks for the advice. I did find the real essays posted on the MA site, and even though there are no posted answers (that i can find, anyway), it will still be useful to go through them.

Besides, if i get really confused I can always call the barbri attorneys for help. They're fantastic at reading the paragraph related to your issue right out of the book over the phone, even though it doesn't answer any of your questions. Good times.

Any recent takers care to comment on how representative the released MBE questions are of the most recent actual MBE questions?

Hate to ask a substantive question, but here it goes anyway:

For the MBE, what is the default standard for attempt? Is it the "Dangerously Close" standard, or the "substantial step" standard?

Thanks.

dangerously close

The bar/bri essay answers don't use headers. Should we state the issue in the heading and then restate it again? Or write/underline the issue as a heading and then start writing with the rule of law?

Also, those taking two bars - have you started studying at all for your second bar? I am literally just going to read the distinctions the night before.

-Mass 2nd bar.

don't forget to underline

famous failure Jerry brown, Hillary: Yale
Sullivan Harvard

dumb it down to a degree

advice on Whiebread bang-on

surfs out in La

December pass rate for cal
less than 39%

so if not cali--no excuses

if cali--lots of non-aba

But lower ranked schools more bar prep.

No matter how poorly you feel you dead after 1st don't let it affect you

i thought I bombed after 1st--decided either do my best or implode

passed

most people on here probaly keen intelligence--
ATL 99% pass!

237 - You are awesome for pointing that out! Took that test today, did fine overall. Figured my score for the non-Barbri creations and I did well.

Much appreciated.

266:

If the plaintiff is suing for money damages do covenant analysis. If the plaintiff is suing for an equitable remedy--like enjoining the defendant from building something--do equitable servitude analysis.

NO PRIVITY NEEDED FOR SERVITUDES. That's the big difference.

HTH

I'm going to throw out an old-school, non-hateful comment: 75% of us are going to be fine. I went out and got trashed tonight. It's 4:20 central time. Hopefully it will work out. If it doesn't, we can work in real estate or something.

I want to go POTTY!

66 is hands down the best advice on this thread - nothing like some hot sex to get your mind off the bar exam. And if you do fail, at least you had a weekend having lots of sex!

Here's my advice for a lot of you- get ready for disappointment- whether you pass or fail, most of you will not have jobs in August or September or even later. The bar exam tests minimum competency in this profession, and passing it is not much of an accomplishment and certainly no golden ticket to employment or Willy Wonka's chocolate- it is just more of a scarlet letter should you be stupid enough to fail.

You have no experience and there are no jobs to go around. You are preoccupied with the bar, but when that passes, the reality of unemployment will set in and there will be thousands of you with no experience looking for 4-5 jobs. It will be awful. Glad I'm not you.

WHERE IS JOHNMCCAIN4PREZ?!??!?!?!!!!

290: You don't need to study for the Passachusetts bar. Even Elie passed on his first time.

Ladies -- remember that the swimsuit portion of the competition is Wednesday morning.

Please dress to impress. Thank you.

I didn't take any review courses and failed last summer. I was close, but I definitely failed. Did the same study routine this summer, but worked a little harder on the MBE questions. I don't mind the test itself, it's having to read all sorts of boring crap for 2 months and focus on distinctions that never occur.

Frank: Well, um, actually a pretty nice little Saturday, we're going to go to Home Depot. Yeah, buy some wallpaper, maybe get some flooring, stuff like that. Maybe Bed, Bath, & Beyond, I don't know, I don't know if we'll have enough time.

This sounds loads more than learning Commercial Paper. WOSSUPP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

293:

Much thanks for your answer. Can you give me an example of an Equitable Servitude (other than the common development scheme)?

302 -- great Old School quote. As for commercial paper, if you know WOSSUPP and the HDC MADFIFI4 crap, you're good to go.

303 -- that's the only one you'll need to know. If you've got that down, you are fine.

I passed the NY and IL bar exams, each on the first attempt (I took BarBri for the NY exam but not for the IL exam three years later). That doesn't make me feel special because most of the people who took those tests passed as well.

I'm not sure that studying advice is going to be helpful with only seven days left, but here's a bit of encouragement for many of you:

If you have been studying consistently since graduation (or since your bar course began), and you're reasonably intelligent, you wil almost certainly pass. This is true even if you didn't study 20 hours a day. If you've been studying at a slow boil so far, making your flash cards, reviewing your condensed outlines, you'll be fine.

But with seven days left, you'd better carry those flash cards around everywhere you go. Every meal, every subway ride, you should be doing those flash cards, and looking things up that are cloudy in your mind.

Day of the test, pretend you're on the first rise of a roller coaster. There's nothing you can do about it, so try to enjoy the ride. Remember that however crude and anonymous, the bar exam is at the core an intellectual undertaking, a challenge. If you enjoy trivial pursuit or crossword puzzles, maybe you should view the bar exam as that type of challenge, albeit on steroids.

So relax on the night before the exam, and the days of the exam. There's nothing you can do but answer the questions, so breath and do what you can. And if you have big plans for going out and partying after the last day, I think you'll be shocked when you find that you're too mentally and even physically exhausted to do much of anything.

Now turn off the computer and get back to your flash cards. You've still got some marginal return on your studying investment, and if you fail by one question (as happened to a friend of mine), you'll be kicking yourself in the ass in sixth months when you're back in the same studying hell.

P.S. there were no RAP questions on the NY or IL bar exams that I took. In fact, there was a minimal amount of that "fee simple defeasible, springing interest, etc." stuff from property. So if that stuff stymies you, you might want to spend your time brushing up on other topics that you actually get get a handle on.

303 - an equitable servitude is jus a covenant where you are seeking injunctive relief - you don't need privity because it's not a personal judgment

(there's probably a better explanation for why but who gives a crap?)

304 & 306:

Much thanks for your help re: Equitable Servitudes.

304:

Would you suggest that in lieu of studying for Commercial Paper, that I flip through my checkbook a few times?

Would it reflect poorly on Character & Fitness if I hired Blackwater to steal a copy of the Bar?

So I had a dream last night where I got to the Javitz Center and was greeted by the Shawshank warden, "Put your faith in the Lord, because your ass belongs to the Bar Examiners."

If I dream about the Sisters getting to me in a movie projection room, I will not be happy.

THREE HUNDRED AND TENTH!!!!!!!!!!

eric holder in due course

Any person that fails the bar should be very scared. If going to BigLaw, perfect excuse to let you go. Face it, if you fail the bar, you are an idiot. I mean, even Elie passed the bar (I'm assuming). I hope most incoming first years at my BigLaw firm fail, because then there will be fewer first years running around trying to get work. I hope the bar examiners grade the exams this year on a crazy curve.

ok, 109 on the PM exam is more total bullshit, but it's good bullshit. because there is a question on the released questions at the back of the MPQ2 in which the asshole trespasser goes to the wrong cabin in the woods and the asshole cabin owner left the gas on with a lit match or some other crap. KABOOM! trespasser goes up in smoke and sues. Now, the right answer is no liability due to trespass...unless..you took the Barbri 1/2 day exam in which case, if the owner of the cabin knew about the gas and match problem, then it was forseeable that someone would come into the cabin unannounced. cabin owner liable. Barbri has its head up its ass onquestions like this. Bottom line: "this is what happens when you fuck a stranger in the ass." Kill the trespasser every time.

The best way to avoid freaking out is to avoid other test takers. Go to the test center, take the test, leave, watch mindless television, show up the next day.

Best way to avoid freaking out: get somebody eat your asshole out.

Good luck everyone. You'll do fine. Most people pass on the first try and odds are you're one of them.

And even if you fail, think of it as a blessing in this economy. You'll be like a World War I soldier who got shot clean through the head on his first day in the trenches.

OMG.....OMG.....OMG.....THREE DAYS TO GO.........
PAAANNNNIIIICCCCC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Why do lawyers have to be suck di*ks to each other? Why do you all have to treat each other like failing the bar = death? What a pathetic load of crap. IT'S JUST A TEST PEOPLE. Like the Lsat, like the SAT. If you fail, you take it again. You're worst enemy is crap like the stuff above. Lawyers try to psyche each other out so if you fail, they look better. This is why people hate lawyers. An inflated sense of self. Passing the bar on the first go does not guarantee anything--nor does failing it.

My advice: Relax, ignore this bullying crap, you know what you know. Write quickly, go home and have a life. End of.

Why do lawyers have to be suck di*ks to each other? Why do you all have to treat each other like failing the bar = death? What a pathetic load of crap. IT'S JUST A TEST PEOPLE. Like the Lsat, like the SAT. If you fail, you take it again. You're worst enemy is crap like the stuff above. Lawyers try to psyche each other out so if you fail, they look better. This is why people hate lawyers. An inflated sense of self. Passing the bar on the first go does not guarantee anything--nor does failing it.

My advice: Relax, ignore this bullying crap, you know what you know. Write quickly, go home and have a life. End of.

I don't think 26 was RACISM per se...

BUT I can see how if you put that whole sentence together it sure smells fishy with some gratuitous racial stereotyping.

How about those black people breaking into their own houses? Was gates playing basketball or eating watermelon when he was arrested? Like how black people always get arrested?

I just saw this black guy with his hat on backwards get arrested earlier, just reporting what I saw.

I have hives all over my body (likely induced by stress). Anyone have good advice?

321:

Go hate on some Asians, apparently that helps.

305, your entire post is really kind and great advice, so I hate to nitpick:

"And if you have big plans for going out and partying after the last day, I think you'll be shocked when you find that you're too mentally and even physically exhausted to do much of anything."

I do not care if I physically lose the ability to use my legs after question #200. I will crawl, inch by agonizing inch, summoning the very last of my strength, to get to the bar, where I will do a shot of patron for every exception to the hearsay rule. If you still live in IL, watch for me on the news.

most people are a bunch of babies about the law exam. It is not that hard. Remember that a lot of effing idiots become attorneys -- I'm sure you all know some.

I passed the bar on my first try under the following circumstances:

a) worked full time and went to barbri at night
b) only took two days off before the bar exam
c) only studied from the barbri lecture outlines.
d) was sitting next to a distractingly attractive member of the opposite sex during the exam

You'll pass. The failers are people who _really_ didn't give a fuck at all.

Patron is for strivers. Get some Herradura or El Tisoro. And a cigar the size of your forearm. That's my plan, anyway.

I took NY. Few days before the exam I was sure I was going to fail. So did all my friends. Then we all passed easily. There was some statistic that 91% of 1st time test takers from ABA law schools passed last summer. I wish I would have known that before the exam so I wouldn't have gotten so nervous.

Bar/bri, etc. really overprepare u for the bar exam. That way, even if u have a bad day u'll still pass. The people I know who didn't pass simply didnt put forth the effort or have enough time to study. As long as u prep for NY ull be fine.

CA is a different story. I know some smart people who still failed that after prepping for months.

Um, I definitely know failers who put a lot of effort in. Except for Massachusetts and Illinois, and New York, if you went to an accredited school and speak English as your 1st language.
However, if you're taking Virginia or California, God be with you...

When (not if) I pass the bar, it is going to be because I unplugged my television this week.

Does it really matter if you pass or fail? If you fail, at least you won't have to pay for stupid CLE courses or bar dues. You will likely be unemployed regardless.

If you got past comment 300, you are either way too panicked, and your fear will lead to your failure, or you're so confident you have lots of time to kill before the bar, that cockiness may end up biting you in the ass.

Either way, once you read 300 comments. You will fail.

If you do fail, BigLaw will definitely tell you to not let the door hit you on the way out.

Seriously people, I passed the NY and CA bar back to back and partied every night in between test days. If you can't pass the bar, you shouldn't be a lawyer.

Anyone who took louisiana this past week- we did it, baby.

You "common law" lawyers with multiple choice "multistate" sections can suck the situs of my usufruct.

Good luck everybody! You'll all do great!

LOOK at what our immigration policy has brought this nation:

Four Phoenix [immigrant] boys are behind bars. They are young, only between 9 and 14 years old, but allegedly committed a heinous crime. Police say the four boys raped an 8-year-old girl last week.

The boys allegedly lured the girl into an empty storage shed July 16th, offering her gum. There they restrained the young girl and sexually assaulted her.

In a devastating twist, the girl's parents disowned her. Police say the parents blamed her for the attack and said she brought shame to the family.

The girl is in custody of Child Protective Services.

Investigators say the girl and the four suspects are all Liberian refugees. The girl and three of the suspects all live in the same apartment complex.

The 14-year-old boy is being charged as an adult with two counts of sexual assault and kidnapping. The other boys are being charged as juveniles.

Wait, this isn't a take-home exam?!

@308

Blackwater is Xe not doofus, get it straight. It would only reflect poorly if they got caught in which case you would have a Res. 90 claim against them.

-Hating Family Law at the Moment

330

you're an asshole

Passed NY in 95 and CA in 2003 both on first tries.

My suggestion on essays. Graders literally have stacks of responses to one essay question. They spend a minute or two at most reviewing each response. So make it user friendly (ie, neat handwriting if you choose to write, short paragraphs, minimize passive sentences, underline issues, etc...). A friend in SF told me he saw someone grading bar exam essays while commuting to work in the MUNI! So you get the picture here. These folks have day jobs and they're looking at this when they have time so make it easy for them. Another important piece of advice -- Use IRAC like your life depended on it! In the end it's about spotting issues and graders will check off when they see issues spotted. Once you spot the issues, write the rules down and do some prof forma analysis, you're done.

Issue spotting should be done two ways: (1) active; and (2) passive. Passive is when issues jump out at you when you read the question. If you studied, that'll get you maybe 60% of the issues. The remaining issues can usually be spotted by cross checking issues in a given topical area which I call "active" issue spotting (here I would suggest writing down the common issues on a paper as soon as you identify the area(s) of law covered in the essay question and see if you can "force" in an issue or two or three). This allowed me during my exams to identify about two to three more issues per essay. I came out feeling confident that I spotted and addressed most of the issues in a question. Feeling like you did as much as you could with a question relieves anxiety until the week before the results come out (and even that week).

Regarding time management on essays, you are better off spotting 60% of issues in each essay than burning precious time to spot remaining issues in one or two questions. So my suggestion here is to apply the active issue spotting approach described above but don't go crazy with it where you miss out on a question. That's a capital sin in Bar Exams! If two additional issues jump out, write about it and move on!!! I also mention that because I started working in a new firm, I made it to only one BAR/BRI class. I outlined the Conviser mini-review and found that to be more than adequate for essay preparation. Do don't go nuts with thos crazy long books except to cross check a concept that might be unclear.

For CA performance tests, because I took it after having worked for a number of years, it was rather straightforward as you're used to taking a bunch of materials and distilling into a coherent memo or brief or whatver. The performance test freaks people out because you can't study for the substantive law (since you don't know). Here, what I fould was that prior Bar exams were very very useful because it provided the different types of work products requested and if you can see how the materials ended into the "model" answer in terms of mechanics (and there are really only 5 or 6 types), then you are set. In other words, identify the steps from materials to end product in each type of performance test (ie steps 1 through 7 or 1 through 10 depending on the type of question and work product requested). I found the performance test to be the easiest part of the test but again, I think work experience helped me -- but it's nothing some preparation on the mechanics of these types of questions can't surmount if you are a recent graduate.

I also note that in CA, I didn't take the multi-state as I was already an attorney. That gave me the second day off which was a big advantage in my mind. I was fresh my third day and I could see the toll on the three day takers. How to mitigate the wear and tear? I do encourage a beer after the first day to take the edge off. Also go workout and avoid eating crap. Sleep 8 hours -- Being fresh will give you energy and help avoid anxiety during the exam.

So in the last week, you make sure you memorize your outline of the outline (or flash cards) but also spend some time breaking down the mechanics/ingredients of model answers and give some thought as to why they are good. You'll notice that good answers tend to have similar traits. Also, don't thikn you have to write the model answer. As long as you get comfortable with them and the way they are structured, you'll be fine. Some of those model answers sugest to me the person skipped half the essays to get that answer right (which would be very stupid). Sometimes students overcompensate for fear leading up to the exam (esp final week) by diving further into substantive law that yields very little incremental benefit (unless you haven't studied in which case you have some catching up to do -- in which case outline Conviser mini-Review). Take a step back and try to figure out the test and environment in which it will be graded (ie above remarks about the graders). They'll spend two minutes on your essay and maybe 4 or 5 max reviewing performance test responses.

Best of luck everyone, stay within your self! If you talk to people after each day, it can be therapeutic but unnerving. I'll leave by giving you one funny anecdote. After the first day of CA bar, I went to the hotel bar next to the convention center to grab a beer (or maybe two). Of course there were others there talking about various essay questions. This one guy was so confident about his issues in the essays that I for a moment got a bit nervous because some of those issues did not register with me. As this group continued the discussion (and by this time I joined the furious discoussion), he let it be known that this was the fifth time taking the CA Bar! That relaxed me instantaneously - I knocked down a gin and tonic and went off to get a workout. So stay within yourself and even if you feel a bit uneasy after the first day, you have a second (and in CA third) day to focus and deliver.

@327

That wasn't a coherent thought

For the guy/girl with Hives:

First, try some benadryl. It will make you crazy sleepy so don't take it the day of the exam. Also, Aveeno makes a great bath soak for hives. I'm allergic to a common food dye so I deal with hives frequently and know how uncomfortable they are. If that doesn't work - call your doc pronto. A quick burst of steroids (prednisone) should take care of it. Pred does have a lot of side effects but will actually give you a good amount of energy for the next couple days AND get the hives under control. At the least, your doc could rx a low dose anti-anxiety like xanax or ativan to take the edge off and maybe your hives will go away. I wish you the best!

330

I know who you are and just because you can get away with doing coke and ecstacy in between test days and every weekend does not make you cool, it makes you an incompetant fool

Why don't:

a) these jerkoffs ever record deeds
b) just ask to borrow the shit instead of breaking in to the house at night without intention to premenantly deprive of title
c) turn the fucking juice off in the abandoned power wires
d) go to a courthouse and actually get married
e) move the protest to the park across the street from the government building.

I mean seriously people

337,

Thank you. Your advice is very helpful, particularly on the two ways to spot issues. I've also heard that we should find an issue "home" for every single fact in the question. If they tell you that A is from State X and B is from State Y, and the accident happened in State Z, you know you need to talk about personal jurisdiction.

Glad (and terrified) I only have to study for two more days......

Just giving a shoutout to Erica Fine, Esq., who gave lots of shoutouts during her lecture -- eat a bag of dicks, fatty!

I took Florida last year and ended up with a 165. I studied at the pool the day before.

Read one or two old essays in your worst topic (property for me) the morning of the exam. You may push some stuff to the front of your mind that gets you through.

also

1) Don't have an affair and not use protection when still married
2) Don't let people steal your bearer paper
3) Don't move out of state with the kids
4) Don't do be an idiot at your gov't job and get fired
5) Don't fly through the state where you have a pending lawsuit, they're gonna serve you and having to explain why it's valid wastes my time
6) Housewives are ok, lazy housewives are evil
7) Seriously do you really need to give all those life estates from the grave?
8) Common Plan- put it in the deed asshole
8a) It's a common plan for a reason follow it so I don't have to explain why you're dumber than a monkey for building a factory in a housing development

-Still bitter

Somebody please explain difference between a bilateral and unilateral contract, and then give some clear examples. Thanks.

If doing PMBR practice tests, what's a decent percentage correct? What am I aiming for? I knew at one point, but all this damn law has driven that critical piece of information straight out of my head.

So I have no idea if I'm okay or not. 70%? 80%?

Here's another tip: STOP LOOKING AT THIS THREAD!

I've been checking this thread because like the rest of you, I'm nervous as hell and taking the CA bar.

I've read several tips about not talking about the exam after each day. It dawned on me that coming to this thread is basically the same thing but before the exam. Misery loves company and it can make you MORE nervous. There's no point to it. I refuse to keep doing this to myself.

SO FAREWELL TO ALL, AND GOOD LUCK. I SINCERELY MEAN THAT.

@346

bi-2
uni- equals one

Examples in your outline, book, notes . . .not wasting time spoon feeding you. If you have none of these references you're FUCKED!

346 - Unilateral is when the only way to accept the offer is via action. "If you want to accept, start painting my house."
Bilateral is everything else.

@348

Quitting is for pussies

348 = arguably the biggest jackass ever

352 -- I'd say 349 is definitely in the race.

@346 --

Bilateral contracts require an exchange of promises. Unilateral is an exchange of an act for a promise. To accept a unilateral contract, you MUST perform.

349 is right, I'm taking this stuff right out of the CMR, and so could you. Of course, 349 is still a jackass.

353,

If you are asking that K question this late in the game and are so stupid that you can't look in any of my cited reference material you are an idiot. If the question was about something complex that's different. I stand by my statement and upon further review 346 is fucked since not smart enough to go to the reference material.

349 (and yes I am pissy since taking the bar)

354

Glad you agree with me. I prefer stressed to jackass. Still no one has faulted my reasoning.

349

356- Hahaha. Yeah, I hear ya'. Although it is good to feel like you "know something" that somebody else doesn't. If that piece of knowledge is the difference between a bilateral and unilateral contract, so be it -- that might be enough to help me sleep easier tonight.

- Stressed and pissy, too

Anyone else just taking Connecticut?

Although the typical dbags are out (e.g. 349), don't the commenters on this thread seem to be nicer than on the typical ATL thread?

Good luck everyone! You'll do fine - most of you went to good schools and/or graduated around the top of your class, and you're competing with the idiots from my TTT who are unemployed because they couldn't even find a summer position.

Looking back after one year, it's clear that the bar exam's only purpose is to weed out the morons. Otherwise, it doesn't test anything of importance. It's a moron test. If you fail, you are a moron. Period.

359 -- I personally several TTT unemployed students who have busted their ass working hard this summer to make sure they pass this bar. So no, that really is not comforting. If anything, those who did better in school or went to a better school probably did not study as hard. Not trying to discourage (because I am in that boat and sure don't want to feel more nervous), but the assumption that an unemployed TTT kid will do worse is off.

359,

I am not a typical douche bag and challenge you to fault my reasoning. I feel you are one of the inhabitants of the bar exam world that should be sterilized and declared incomptent and have a guardian apppointed so that you don't sell blackacre 6 times to the children your wife had out of wedlock or through IV fertilization that you stupidly held out to be your own children.

349
PS read 349-357 asshole before you pull an Obama and talk without all the facts

Hey now 362, he apologized and even called the officer up to joke with him! See, it is alllllll better now!

363

I would have loved it if there was some contraband in plain sight and Gates got arrested for that. Did officer have PC to be in the house? Was it in plain sight? Search pursuant to a valid arrest? Am I losing my mind that I relate everything in the world to the bar?

349/362

364, it's plain view, not plain sight. i took the bar a year ago and still remember that. you're screwed.

365

interchangeable terms asshole. Last year you say? How's unemployment treating you?

364

Legit question - when dealing with diversity jurisdiction, when is it OK to aggregate claims against a single defendant? Can all STO claims be aggregated to meet the 75K threshold? If so, then what is the relationship to supplemental jurisdiction (because if all claims can be aggregated, then supplemental jurisdiction is never needed for a diversity claim - but barbri made a big deal of saying that supplemental jurisdiction cannot be used for diversity claims)?

@367

Now that's a legitimate question unlike 346. Ok clowns who busted my balls, step up and answer the question, because I sure as hell don't know the answer off the top of my head

-349

you sound very confused 367
Instead of posting on here, pull out the big outline, not the Convisor, and just read that section again, it's not very long.

Not really sure what you're trying to ask, but if I had to make a guess at what your question was....

1. Multiple plaintiffs can aggregate against a single defendant for a joint claim (or I have seen the words single undivided claim).

2. In short, your impression that supplemental diversity jurisdiction can never be used in a diversity claim is wrong. Again, re-read the long outline, there are certain procedural devices that cannot be used in a claim solely based upon diversity

remove the word "diversity" from between supplemental and jurisdiction in 369 in number "2"

Can aggregate any claims against single defendant whether factually/legally related or not. SJ can certainly be used for diversity jurisdiction, but not by a plaintiff against any party joined compulsorily/permissively, as an impleaded party or a party seeking to intervene AND not by a party seeking to intervene as a plaintiff or compulsorily joined as a plaintiff.

even though sight and view are probably interchangeable, why would not use the "buzz" words one the test??? In addition, I have not seen the word "sight" every used interchangeably in any scholarly writing discussing the plain view warrant exception.

367, and everyone else freaking out about law-school-exam nuances in the law:

Odds of that issue being on the exam: very little
Likely value even if it does appear: 0.5 points
Expected value of that issue: arbitrarily close to zero.

It's a closed-book, minimum-competence exam.

373 -- thank you.

Let's face reality folks:
1) If you didn't put in 2 months of solid studying, you most likely will not pass.
2) The motivation to study came from the fact that I had a nice job waiting for me in September. Moving back in with Mom & Dad for an indefinite amount of time after taking the bar would make me quite depressed. Bleak outlook = bleak performance.
3) You must be delusional if you don't think that the passage rates will not go down significantly in response to economic outlook for attorneys. Even if the examiners grade the same, the curved will be adjusted, as necessary. 83% first time taker passage rates are a thing of the past.

If I were a girl taking the exam, I would dress up provocatively on the days of the exam, to distract your competitors. That's right, they are your competitors and you are all vying for very limited spots on the pass sheet. You think you're nervous now? Until the bar results come out you will be the most nervous you have ever been, especially those who have positions waiting in BigLaw... let's not be delusional -- if you don't pass, BigLaw will show you the door. No second or third passing chances allowed in this economy.

You sad fucks... I feel so bad for you.

When you are in federal court under diversity jurisdiction, each separate claim must satisfy both requirements (i.e. complete diversity and amount in controversy). The only time that claims can be aggregated to meet the amount in controversy requirement is if they ARE BROUGHT BY THE SAME PLAINTIFF. ONE plaintiff is the key. Multiple plaintiffs cannot join together in order to satisfy the amount in controversy requirement if none of their claims separately would do so. Supplemental jurisdiction can be used if one of their claims would satisfy both requirements and they arise out of the same T/O. However, the court doesn't have to hear the claim, it can remand it under 1367(C).

There is one small complication with Supplemental Jurisdiction - a Plaintiff in a diversity action cannot use Supp Jur to overcome a lack of compelte diversity. That's it, the role is not broader.

Aggregation of claims 1P against 1D has nothing to do with it. P can't use supplemental jurisdiction to implead someone from their own state as a D after they got into federal court on b/c all Ps were diverse from all D's. Makes sense no?

As for the bar, I am unnecessarily breaking out for the first time since I was a preteen. Damn you, BOLE.

@375... that's some crazy ass drivel. How exactly could the bar examiners in every state justify a substantial drop is pass rates? A coincidental wave of stupidity perfectly timed with a recession? If they intentionally decide to change the standard this year, they'll be a nice class action lawsuit waiting for them.

Statistically, Delaware has the hardest bar exam; lowest first time taker pass rate averaged out over the past decade.

what are the qualified privileges for defamation? schechter told us past employers and recommendation letters, or statements made to police detectives but new ones keep popping up all over the place. statements made b/c you know it will interest the other party? wtf? is there a list?

5 qualified privileges

When recording any official proceeding (you cannot be liable for defamation if John Kerry tells John McCain during a senate committee hearing that that he is a donkey and looks like one... reporter can report the defamation and not be liable)

When statement is interest of publisher to protect/defend personal reputation, property, or actions. When statement is in interest of both publisher and recipient or when statement is in interest of recipient (e.g. person asks for recommendation) or when statement is made to person protecting/acting in public interest (like to the cops like you said).

364,
MBE of 168. Employed in a 5-yr partnership track. Not taking the bar again. All is good. Thanks for your concern with my unemployment, though. But if I were you, I would show more concern for your knowledge of criminal procedure.

365

I would totally eat lobster out of Kash's ass. And drink champagne out of her belly button.

Having passed 2 exams, including VA, here's my 2 cents:

1. Do NOT talk to others during the lunch break or in the evening about the questions, how hard/easy it was, etc. You don't need the distraction.

2. Each essay answer may take you 30 minutes to write, but write them so that each answer can be fully read and understood in 2-3 minutes by the grader. Tell the reader the conclusion up front, and then do your legal analysis. Do not make your reader have to go through the entire essay in order to figure out the result. Number or letter the subparts of each answer, when possible.

How is Elizabeth Wurtzel doing?

164 raw MBE, something like 176 scaled, and barely studied the essays. The trick to this exam is to do really well on the MBE so that you can stumble your way through the essays. Most states essays are graded on a positive points only system; i.e. you get credit for every correct point you hit, but no points off for all of the gibberish and BS you put down. Moral = knock out the multiple choice and then law dump on the essays. You'll pass. I passed DE and NY with this strategy.

382,

Congrats, you have unemployment to look forward to instead of unemployment. Bar is a side gig for me only taking it on a lark. Comfortable in my Crim law abilities and if I don't pass the bar for a single vocab word then such is life, at least I am not you.

-364

PS What kind of douche clown brags about his MBE score? Got nothing going on in your life other than work? You're gonna be sad when you get fired!

Now for some actual advice.

1. I concur with all of those who advise to not talk with examinees during breaks or after the exam. If you are going to post-mortem the exam, do so with your significant other or someone that doesn't practice law.

2. Create easily identifiable headings and sub-headings in your essays.

3. Don't study on the test days.

Sincerely,
365/382

376 - wrong.

ONE THOUSANDTH!!!

first!

The popcorn you're eating has been micturated in. Film at 11.

Look, at this point, unless you're taking NY and 1, you either are prepared or you are not. There is very little substantively you can do to get better from now until Tues/Wed. So review a little bit on the stuff you don't know. Glance at an essay or two. And CHILL OUT.

WE. ARE. ALL. GOING. TO. PASS.

Chant this repeatedly. Then take a bubble bath if you're a girl, or take a bubble bath if you're a guy and then tell everyone you had a shot of tequila. And relax.

i know i know we're all going to pass. but i still have two questions:

1) what is the deadline for registering for the feb bar?

2) will i need to pay the full fee again?

395:

1. Usually a week or so before the July results come out. That's how they get ya!

2. Yes, but this time you won't get the "first-time taker" 10% discount.

Every commenter who has stated that essay graders will be stingy in awarding points in an effort to fail takers and prevent new lawyers from competing for business in a weak legal market clearly put up a perfect score on the logical reasoning portion of the LSAT.

They have also shown a keen eye for paying attention to what effects the downturn in the economy has had on small legal practices, since as we all know small practitioners and law school professors (the vast bulk of graders) are suffering intensely in this economy.

When DO the results come out? For Massachusetts?

399th! FML.

Why are we so uptight? We've spent the last 7-8 years in college and it all comes down to this single exam.

The fact of the matter is that law school hasn't taught us to do squat. At least the Vo-Tech dudes who graduated from HS with us have HVAC repair skills. And their biggest debt is an $1,100 obligation to Rent-a-Center.

If, like me, you have a liberal arts undergrad--what is there to do if the unthinkable happens--open a poem repair shop? If I fail this exam, the rest of my life is pretty damn bleak.

On the other hand, even if I pass, the odds of getting a job to pay back the mountain of ruinous debt I've incurred is incredibly small.

So, it really doesn't matter one way or the other if I take off the last few days before the Bar Exam. I'm done with outlines and headed to the pool.

Wow - 400 posts :) And I have to say, I like the fact that this thread is filled with encouraging comments!

If we all agree to stop studying NOW, and CHILL, then no-one will have an advantage over any other. It'll be a socialist utopia!

OK, in 3-2-1...STOP STUDYING and go to the pool.

I'll be right there. I just have to finish 1 last outline...

My best memory of the bar exam. With 30 minutes to go a frien pulled out a pint of bourbon and started drinking. he passed.

I was sitting for day 2 (of 3) of the Texas bar on my 26th birthday. That sucked. The experience as a whole, from the day Barbri started to the last day of the exam, was more painful and miserable than childbirth. But seriously, you've made it through the worst part already--the months of studying and worrying about the exam. If you can stay somewhat calm between now and test day (hard to do, I know), the test will be over before you know it and you then just have to resign yourself to the pass list waiting game, which sucks in its own, different way. My advice:

1. If you've studied well up to this point, then between now and the exam, take 2 days off. One of those days should be 2 days before day 1 of your exam so you can relax a bit, but still take comfort that you have one more day to study.

1A. If you haven't studied well, take one day (or at least one afternoon/evening) off. The rest will do you good.

2. Use the day before to do some general review, and refresh your memory about the items you're having difficulty remembering.

3. On one of your days off, do something escapist. Go see a movie, get lost in a good book--just do something that won't give you a chance to actually think about the exam. I wouldn't suggest hanging out with others studying for the exam- you'll only freak each other out at this point.

4. Create a mental arsenal of techniques you can use during the exam to help yourself stay calm and focused. Read up a bit on calming/focusing breathing techniques, practice a few, and be prepared to refer to them if you start freaking out because you have no idea how to answer the crazy fact pattern just thrown at you.

Good luck!

395 & 396:

Application for the Feb bar (in NY at least) is from Nov 1-Nov 30th. They don't "get ya" by making you apply before the results come out. A simple peek at the filing procedures on the NY Bar Exam website would have revealed the answer (seen below), but to 396--your conviction is admirable and will earn you those pesky 1/3rds of a point on essays even if you're wrong

"Re-Applicants please note: If you took and failed the immediately preceding examination, the deadline for re-application is the later of (1) the filing deadline above; or (2) 14 days from the date of the release of the examination results. Re-applicants who did not sit or show up for the immediately preceding examination must file their re-application in accordance with the filing dates set forth above."

I don't know about where you're at, but I just came back from a walk and it's perfect outside, high 70's and sunny with a slight breeze. I am now officially depressed.

404 here. One more piece of advice- if you're planning on taking an Rx sleep-aid (or think you might need to come test day), give it a try first this weekend and see how it affects you. I had trouble sleeping starting about a week before the exam, so I gave Ambien a try. It made me hallucinate and generally pretty loopy. I watched my lamp melt into my nightstand as I fell asleep. I also thought the right side of my body weighed more than my left, so couldn't sit up straight. I still slept well and woke up refreshed, so it didn't affect my test-taking abilities, but your reaction to your Rx might be different. Better to give it a try when you still have time to recover!

Just posting advice, no snark:

I took the CA bar in July 2005.

I was most afraid I wouldn't be able to sleep the nights before the test days, so I decided to find something that took very little brain power, so I'd relax, and would be interesting enough that I wouldn't be thinking about the test. For me, sad to say, that meant buying a bunch of tabloid magazines and reading them. I also had two glasses of red wine which helped me get calm and sleepy. Fortunately not many of you share my gossip fetish but there must be something - Harry Potter movies, video games, existentialist literature - that you will find engrossing.

I stayed in a hotel room two blocks from the test and brought a cooler full of all the food I'd need so I could stay in my room as much as possible and avoid the other crazy test takers.

I also agree that you shouldn't discuss the questions. I overheard some comments from unknown test takers which made me think I'd completely missed the point of an essay question, but found out months later they had been smoking crack. All the post-test chatter won't help and will most likely just freak you out. I only hung out with other test takers who also agreed not to discuss any aspect of the exam (except their annoying neighbor who mumbled or their wobbly desk - all safe topics).

I didn't study the day before the tests except maybe 30 minutes of flash cards. Even those could have been skipped.

What also helped get me through was the thought of how happy I would be at 4 p.m. on the third day that it was all over.

And while it may not help much, I knew dozens of people from excellent schools who didn't pass the first time and ALL of them passed when they took it again.

After reading the performance exam question, it's best to take a break, rub one out, and then go back to answering the question.

How much studying is enough? I'm taking Maryland. I went to all BarBri lectures, outlined every one as we went along, and did maybe 50% of the homework. Since BarBri ended, I did PMBR 3 day and I've been putting in 8-12 hour days of studying (mainly doing practice essays & flashcards). Can I afford to do a short day tomorrow & take most of Monday off? I still forget some buzzwords/elements of crimes...

I can't wait for the flood of deferral notices the Monday after the bar from all of BigLaw. Not all firms are as stupid as Quinn.

so fucked :(

Whatever sick freak came up with the idea of an MPT deserves to be bitch-slapped publicly and repeatedly by Thio.

Stupid.

I disagree, 413. The MPT is a pain, but you don't have to know anything going in and as long as you write something intelligent and well formated, you get easy points on 10% of the exam.

or 7% in my jurisdiction

379:

Delawhat? WTF are you talking about?

25 % somehow in my jurisdiction. Just cant seem to finish on time. Just a brain killer. Just had to do a fake closing argument, based on fake law. Hate it. Whatever, I'll pass.

- 413

Why doesn't the IL paced program recommend doing the full day test? Is it worth attempting like half of it tomorrow as a diagnostic?

Don't know if I'll actually do it tomorrow, probably better off just focusing on essays.

the mixed question sets in mpq2 seem inane for mbe practice

seriously - record your fucking deeds.

If you don't have a total-recall understanding of every conceivable Property scenario and every Commercial Paper nuance you can expect to fail the New York Bar.

The master speaks:

Don't get crazy with shit you know you don't know and will never know.

Take a nap if you have to. Wash the drool off your face and keep going. Don't mind the stares of the potential NYU undergrads who will laugh at you.

Your house is a mess. Don't clean it. Go somewhere else.

Get up early.

The dumbest lawyer you ever met passed the bar exam.

Get angry at the bar examiners. Who the hell do they think they are, standing in the way of your dreams?

Think of the people that love you. Dedicate the exam to them even if they have passed on.

Keep a nice steady pace, just like a marathon. I run marathons. No sprints.

Accept that fact that you don't know everything. Make a list of things that you hope are not on the bar exam. Put the list on your wall. Later, laugh at the list when you realize that none of that esoteric shit was on the bar exam.

The next few weeks are gravy. Even if you hit your head on the curb and are in a coma for the next few weeks, you will still pass the bar. I will be there when you wake up. So will your mother.

Monday night, go see a good movie.

Ignore the asshole shrieking about this term's Court of Appeals rulings in the test center immediately before the exam.

Bring a sandwich to the exam. Peanut butter sandwiches are very easy to digest.

Eat the sandwich alone because the assholes shrieking about this term's Court of Appeals rulings have now multiplied.

The assholes will all be eating SPARERIBS, BACHSPIES, and asking for JSTRAWS at the McDonalds next door. Avoid them even if you have to take a cab 10 blocks south.

Don't talk to anyone about the test Tuesday night. If you call me Tuesday night, I will enthusiastically agree with everything you say no matter how stupid you sound.

I promise that I will interrupt whatever I am doing at 9:00 AM sharp on both days of the bar exam and say a prayer for (all capitals) YOU.

Study! STUDY!

Just kidding, take it easy and relax.

But seriously, you better cram right now.

But takes some time for yourself and relax a bit.

THERE'S NO TIME RELAX!

did a few dozen pmbr q's in each subject
read all the barbri lectures
read some essay model answers

so fucked!

324 clearly didn't take the Cal bar exam or any of the other real exams.

418: did the full day MBE over three days. I did a little bit better than on the in-class full day.

So does BarBri just lie about the quality of essays required to pass? In my class they made it seem like you needed to hit 80% of issues and state the law on those 100% CORRECTLY to pass. I'm sure I can get almost every issue but whether I can state the law correctly is somewhat debatable.

421 - thank you. I believe the power of prayer has kept me sane during this time and am so thankful for all of those that love me that have been praying for me too.

Your post will mean a lot to a lot of people.

427- don't thank me. Thank John Pieper!

427- don't thank me. Thank John Pieper!

"You want my score? Two Points. Right there, there's your godamn score.Godamn cats crawling up trees, five times five is twenty five. FUCK THIS PLACE.FUCK IT!!"

"The last thing that went through his mind - other than that bullet - was to wonder how the hell the bar examiners ever got the best of him"

I recommend that you not shower until the exam. Go into the exam smelling like shit. You will distract the people around you and make the exam unpleasant for them. You will be immune to your own putrid odor and eliminate the competition. You might want to throw up some chunks of what you had the night before on the desk. Believe me, it will mess up the concentration of the people around you. Btw, once you pass the bar and you are unemployed, deferred or terminated, use some of your savings, unemployment benefits or stipend to pay for the CLE's you will have to take to keep your worthless license. HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Good luck everyone.

If you fail, you probably will get another chance at your firm. BUT, everyone at the firm will think you are an idiot.

Just remember, Teddy Buckland passed the bar (Alaska),

Ted: Oh sure I’m a lawyer but that’s only because I took the bar exam in Alaska and they only have like 4 laws and most of them are about when you can and cannot kill… seals.

“Finally, doctors, if there is a mistake, don't admit it to the patient. Of course, if the patient is deceased - and you're sure - you can feel free to tell him or her... anything.” — Ted

The lady that went to federal court claiming Barack Obama is not a citizen is a lawyer, a dentist, and a real estate agent. No joke. She passed the California bar exam. So can you.

People, will you please post more? 436 comments = not enough. I've run out of things to read. Don't make me read my outlines -- give me more angry, stressed, bitter comments.

I'd like to hear from all the people who felt totally unprepared and still passed. Alternatively, all the people taking NY on Tuesday who really slacked or procrastinated hardcore, so I can feel better about myself. Thanks.

what's the difference between personal jurisdiction and subject matter jurisdiction?

My MBE score was 21340 raw and 2004585623 scaled. I went to a top tier law school and did so well I was first in my class and the class after me. During OCI all the Cravath partners made like circus seals and took turns giving me BJs while the rest begged me -- BEGGED ME -- to go work for them. My current Big Law job consists of me sitting in my office while they hose me down with 1000 dollar bills. And doc review.

If you don't have a 4.56 starting from pre-school all the way to JD then you're fucked and you might as well kill yourself because there's no way in hell any decent law firm will ever look at you and give you the opportunity to review 2340 documents before lunch.

My MBE score was 21340 raw and 2004585623 scaled. I went to a top tier law school and did so well I was first in my class and the class after me. During OCI all the Cravath partners made like circus seals and took turns giving me BJs while the rest begged me -- BEGGED ME -- to go work for them. My current Big Law job consists of me sitting in my office while they hose me down with 1000 dollar bills. And doc review.

If you don't have a 4.56 starting from pre-school all the way to JD then you're fucked and you might as well kill yourself because there's no way in hell any decent law firm will ever look at you and give you the opportunity to review 2340 documents before lunch.

Guys help me out, I am about to have a

Shit, sorry I am so FUCKING JUMPY that I accidentailly hit the GODDAMN enter ckey and submitted the motherfukcing post before I finished writing it. I am so fuckign NEROUVS here goddmait, I am abou tto have a major fucking panic attack. Basically I have sstudied, some, but I have slacked off a big fucking time durign this summer. I am feel like I am BOARDELINE NOT GOING TO PASS THIS MOTHERFUCKER

JESUS FUCKIGN CHRIST I DID IT AGAIN. Cid you konw if you hit the MOTHERFUCKING TAB BUTTON the fucking post will post? I wanted to say that I feel like my panic comes in waves, sometimes, I am doing stuff, getting questions right, reading things and remembering them, but then other times i M aso fucking scared because di rememberd that i Haven't fuckign studying enoughg!!! JESUS FUCKING CHRIST. I have thrown up 3 times today and I almost shit every all over my bed (where I am studyinhg) because the pain in my smotach was so intesnse I couldn't make it to the b athromm in tome. Although evewntually I did, and it was ok, but OMG i rhoneslty thing I might fail thins thing. I have head tho much to drink tonight, in a effort to bascailly scared myself shit straight. afgter this ryear so ofli school you would think I have ould be ready for this Shit but I AM GOING TO FUCKING FAIL I AM AGFRADI> JEsus I hope I pass. I dpo thk ih ave ashit , but I'm not 100% sure and that is ascary as shit.

443 - THAT's what I'm talkin bout.

Keep it coming, people. The only way not to freak out about the possibility of failing a test 90% of people pass is to believe you are in a better position than at least 10% of the population.

- 438

I know it wasn't, but if that was real, it was freakin' awesome. I really hope that was real.

Holy shit moatherufcker, I am jnot joking, You think that I am having a good timem here doing this? I ahve been studyig VERY hard for the last 3 weeks approxmiate. Although even then, I have a masterbation problem /and addtionction sow whatehappns is i hbascilly take a break to jerk of and it ends up lasting about 6 hours. ,you thnk I'm kidding, but im' not, because I'm loking for the perfect clip ro wahtever to do it too, and it takes SOF UCKING LONG. and i swer to god, because of this addiciont, I have probably watsed about 10 weeks of per. ok btnot that long, but really it whas been a lton of time.

OK people why is it that you can't use a vicious dog to guard your junkyard (on account of it's using deadly force to protect property) but you can use poisonous SNAKES to guard a department store's friggin jelly bean contest and there its like - oh, he was an unanticipated trespasser so, you know, no biggie...

And someone PLEASE, once and for all, can you or can't you get child support raised in NY when the non-custodial parent has a positive change in income? I mean, the answers in the barbri essays go both ways and yet they're applying the same law about best interests of the child plus showing a change in circumstances... do you or do you not have to show some detriment to the child in this situation in order to let the kid share in the parent's good fortune ??? grrr

too many comments. you're all going to fail because you spent time reading comments and posting comments and not working on your flashcards. people, the common law elements of arson. it's the house of ANOTHER, fucktard. get back to work. if you sleep more than 3 hours a night between now and Thursday, your biglaw job will end more or less as soon as bar results are out.

if a 501(c)(3) is sued in NY, but that 501c3 has only made one transaction with someone in the state, is there personal jurisdiction to haul the 501c3 into ny? i have a feeling this will be on the exam. HELP!!!!

Wow 449 I think you made everyone go away.

NYC Biglaw senior associate here. If you fail the first time, you will be shown the door. Junior associates are a commodity. First years even more so. If you are such a spaz that you fail, get the fuck out of the way for someone else I'm not going to have to lose in January to go study again. You whiny, self entitled little fucks get one bite at the apple. And if the most recent crop of first years is any indicator, even those who pass won't be around all that long.

Fat_Guy_at_Willkie

450:

personal jurisdiction is a matter of where a company is incorporated/contacts/int'l shoe. 501c3 is the IRC. man you're either a troll or in a lot of trouble.

WTF is int'l shoe?!?!?!?!! i thought pennoyer was good law.

but aren't there different rules for personal jurisdiction for a 501(c)(3), especially when they're out of state and only have one contact in NY?

My favorite story was a guy who blanked
o his K essay--wrote something to the
effect I know you are a grader and need
cash--and that this test has no basis\
for legal aptitude.

Therefore as one actualized human to another
I agree to pay you $5000 to pass me--know one will know. And gave contact info. and password to a moneygram.

did this for all the essays--guess what

he was passed--cost him money--but ballsy as hell.

Was in Cali--

He did this for the other essays a

I straight up cried like a little virgin girl on my bed the day before the 2006 Cal bar.

didn't sleep the night before the test.

on the first performance test, I only managed to get my statement of facts on paper.

passed; gainfully employed in big law

Wear layers. When I took it last year at the Javitz Center, it was freezing cold in the test rooms. Some people were wearing shorts and short-sleeved t-shirts--I don't know how they emerged without hypothermia, much less passed the exam.

48 hours! AHHHHHHHHHHHHH

I plan on using the nasty ass rash I have on my arm to intimidate the person sitting next to me.

I tattooed difficult points of law and mnemonics down my arms, bad idea?

460:

Is that a nasty-ass rash, or a nasty ass-rash. Though the former would be mildly annoying, the latter would be vomit inducing.

Everyone be cool, 452 is exactly the kind they're going to show the door ASAP. Law Firms LOVE junior associates with that kind of attitude.

448, re Snakes v. Dogs: look for whether the trespasser was habitual/anticipated. Everything turns on that. And I think child support changes are based more on what the kid needs than what the parent can provide. Just mention the factors, state "BIC" and you're fine.

426 - as long as you spot the issues and write something plausible, you can make up some of the law on the essays and still pass (assuming you do well enough on the MBE). Don't ask me how I know this. :-)

Thanks 463.

My problem with the guard-animal / trespasser questions is about that "anticipated" trespasser rule. I mean, look, if you didn't ANTICIPATE that someone would try to sneak in the store, then why did you put down GUARD snakes to protect the merchandise? Or maybe - are rattlesnakes in a department store considered a "man-made" or "natural" condition? Or, did the warning signs adequately warn of the danger (I mean, considering the store was dark and there were only snakes there at night)? --that seems to me to be it for the negligence analysis based on the breach of the minimal duty owed to an anticipated tresspasser. It works whether or not you are talking about a dog or a snake.

But maybe the first point doesn't hold - i mean, maybe protection measures don't imply that you anticipate trespassers. I mean, does my locking my door at night make me liable for the safety of anyone who does break in?

Maybe the difference in the questions lies in the kind of tort theory they are using. Unanticipated trespasser might not have a cause of action in negligence, but maybe it could sound in battery.

In a "deadly force to protect property" situation, we're actually talking at some level about an intentional tort, right? Battery can include the intentional laying of traps, no? So unless you really, honestly, truly only put those snakes in the friggin store at night because you liked to see em wiggle (and not as guard snakes, which is what the fact pattern said), you are laying a DEADLY TRAP - in order to protect your PROPERTY.

oh, I'm getting too worked up over this and I haven't even had my coffee yet.

Best wishes to all of you - it is all going to be OK.
-

Dammmmmn!!! You mother fuckers are pathetic; 464 comments? WTF?

DOJ SECURE

Did you know that some people actually take a course to study for this exam???

467 - that is just based on rumor and conjecture. It's an urban legend that there is some sort of structured course, that when taken properly (i.e. instructions for taking said course are followed to the letter), the course taker is sure to pass.

425- thanks.

Out of the night that covers me
Black as the Pit from pole to pole
I thank whatever gods may be
For my unconquerable soul

In the fell clutch of circumstance
I have not winced nor cried aloud
Under the bludgeonings of chance
My head is bloody, but unbowed

Beyond this place of wrath and tears
Looms but the horror of the shade
And yet the menace of the years
Finds, and shall find me, unafraid

It matters not how strait the gate
How charged with punishments the scroll
I am the master of my fate
I am the captain of my soul

good luck to everyone!

If you are taking the bar and have read to this comment in the 400s, you are taking your chances and will likely fail. Go do some PMBR questions moron!

You are all pathetic losers and will never achieve anything in life.

FEDERAL RESERVE BANK SECURE

465:

Try not to get your torts twisted up too much. Whether the trespasser is "anticipated" can be thought of as whether the trespasser is an habitual one or not. This is why children are always "anticipated" and why children always get a reasonableness standard of care.

In the alternative, ask yourself if it was overwhelmingly obvious that a trespasser would show up. Look for fact pattern statements like, "The electric company knew that homeless people loved to steal the copper converters once the plant had been shut down."

Once you establish the duty owed, consider the deterrents used.

-463

462: nasty-ass rash, though who knows where it will spread by Tuesday.

Please forgive me, b/c I should know this, but do you need to go to an ABA accredited school to sit for the MA bar? I went to BU, the little-known sister school of New England School of Law.

465: Did you read the explanation to that question? If memory serves, the issue there was that the store didn't know about the deadly snakes. If they'd known, it would have been a different story.

And yes people, we're writing about deadly snakes and jelly beans contests. This is insane.

475, as long as you can produce acceptable femsharts you're OK.

416:

Look it up. Delaware has the lowest pass rate among first-time takers from ABA accredited law schools.

- 379.

help.

I need somebody . . .

Help!

Not just anybody . . .

help... you know i need someone

If you're still reading these comments...US-U-FRUCT

So the poor undergrad sitting at the desk in the law library just had the wrath unleashed upon him. . . .Who the fuck does he think he is making comments about how odd it is so many people are in the library today. . . I think I might be a little stressed. . . .Any thoughts?

476-

Yes; and I wasn't responding to the question directly, only trying to explain how trespass works. The snakes were brought in by an independent contractor, which didn't seem to help our friend figure out the underlying issue.

465.

I'm sick and tired of these motherfuckin' snakes in these motherfuckin' comments.

What stoner liberal thought that including the MPT was a good idea? Is it to help the kids who weren't smart pick up easy points? WTF? I am pissed I have to waste time going over this crap. The MPT should be replaced by 3 questions on admirality law, tax law, and mineral rights. That would weed out the morons.

~Bitter Bitter Quasi-Human (from a landlocked, resource poor state, who just wants to screw other people)

PE,

I know you're studying, but can you tell me the best place to get hookers and coke in the respective jurisdictions (CA, IL, NY, MA)?

~needing to blow off steam

488, just think of the MPT as the LRW portion of the bar exam.

My ass jiggles when I brush my teeth. That did not happen before bar review

To follow on 476's point, (not to argue, just because I am getting obsessed with this scenario now) - ok so the store didn't know about the snakes. But the store did hire an agent for the express purpose of guarding its merchandise (achem, jelly beans).

The security guard was an agent of the store. Principals are liable for the torts of their agents committed within the scope of employment. Here, the guard arguably was not acting within the "scope" of his employment when he put friggin SNAKES on the floor, (I don't know why that makes me laugh like every time I think of it) as that was not expressly or impliedly authorized.

However, his act was pursuant to a job for which force is an anticipated part of the job description. Thus, he was impliedly authorized to engage in acts which were in furtherance of his job mission (acts that furthered his employer's desire that he protect the jelly beans).

However, the implied authorization here would likely only extend to reasonable or customary acts - maybe the snakes are not, you know, "customary", while guard dogs are, and that would be a real difference between the store snake and junkyard dog hypos.

491

You're still doing personal hygiene? Sucker

~unshaved, unshowered, uncaring

491

You're still doing personal hygiene? Sucker

~unshaved, unshowered, uncaring

491, I've definitely been stress-eating as well. I rationalize it by saying that if, nay, WHEN, I fail, my offer will certainly be rescinded and my new fat stores will postpone death for a few days. But on the other hand, maybe it would be more calorically efficient to save my food until the onset of starvation and eat it then. But on the other-other hand, pooping is another nice stress reliever. Time for another Pop-Tart.

Dude, you need to let go of the snakes.

500 bitches!
(even if I had to cheat by clicking three times)

498?

500 bitches!
(even if I had to cheat by clicking three times)

500 bitches!
(even if I had to cheat by clicking three times)

500 bitches!
(even if I had to cheat by clicking three times)

500 bitches!
(even if I had to cheat by clicking three times)

Most people will not FAIL.

they're all going to laugh at you.

for the most part there is an inverse relationship between confidence walking into the bar exam, and pass rates. the fucking gunner tools who study every outline and the long convisor are the ones who can't see the forest through the trees and start winding on about minutiae that the bar examiner has never even fucking heard of - no matter that the gunner might be right.

all i studied were my ad libs from bar bri, and the multistate practice bullshit. i passed by over 60 points - top 5%.

OK - really, how much more can I possibly learn between today and tuesday morning? I know all this stuff and it's become incredibly boring.

I'm stopping.

Going to go start drinking now, go to bed early tonight totally happy and wasted and then sleep on the plane tomorrow and take a one last peek at my notes when I get to the hotel.

Who's with me?

506

I'm in if you're up for some hookers and coke too

If you're taking the MA bar, sit between two guys.

Future female Boston attorneys like to shart.

OK, so I think I'm going to pass this thing. But I hear that all people who think they will pass will actually fail. So now because of the fact that I think I can pass I am convinced that I will fail - so, in other words, yes - to both the hookers and the coke.

509,

Your answer resembles a barbri model answer, contradictions and then finally the real answer. Are you talking Spitzer call girls or Craiglist's cheapies? I am in the mood to splurge a bit.

492-

Again, consider the trespasser first. The trespasser was not anticipated/habitual, and no duty was owed to him at all. Thus, even the dangerous animals were not grounds for suit against the mall. This is enough to short-circuit the issues of agency.

If the trespasser here was anticipated such that a reasonable duty of care would be owed, then the issue becomes more complicated because (a) the guard worked for an independent contractor and (b) this is a battery. B/c I need to keep studying, the mall had to specifically authorize the snakes.

Cheers.

506 - Watch out for snakes.

I've been pooping 3-4 times a day since Barbri started. I used to just have one massive shit in the morning. I'm worried on Wed/Thur that I'll just have the runs both days. I'm going to fill my barbri bag with shit if necessary.

492,

It makes me laugh because every time I hear it I think of Samuel L. Jackson going: "There are snakes on this mother-f**ken plane!"

if you are introducing a crime for a MIMIC purpose, does the crime still need to meet the time limitations (not more than 10 years since release or conviction)? Or does the time limit only apply if the crime is being introduced to impeach?

Can't wait for the next 72 hours to pass...

513 - I have been shitting at least five times a day. I plan on wearing a diaper.

Last question, I swear:

Difference between a de jury corporation and a defecto corporation?

Damn worried. Taking NY. Did fine on all the practice MBEs. Good law school, better firm. My knowledge of the NY subjects is horrible though. There's so much and it's all become mush. I can write IRAC no problem. The only problem is that the R in my IRAC may be completely off. Um, help.

517: "defecto"? I think you mean de facto. A de jure corporation has conformed to all the necessary legal formations in incorporating and thus is obviously and clearly a corporation. A de facto corporation has not conformed to the requirements but has nevertheless held itself out as, and functions as, a corporation, and so in some states may be held to the same rules as a legally formed corporation.