More Trauma For Duke Law School Students
This seems like a stressful time to be enrolled at Duke Law School. The news of firms pulling out of on-campus interviewing at the school continues to grow. The latest big name firms to partially pull out of Duke recruiting are DLA Piper and Kirkland & Ellis. Here’s the email Duke students received late last week about DLA:
We received notification from the employer, DLA Piper (Austin, Dallas, CA offices), that they will be canceling interviews. You will not need to contact them as we have forwarded your resume on file to them (unless you wish to send an updated resume). In addition, they have posted a resume collections via Symplicity for your convenience. They will review your resume and contact you if they are interested in speaking with you further.There is nothing else that you have to do at this point. I am sorry for any inconvenience this may have caused and wish you well in your other interviews. You will be removed from this interview and your interview schedule will reflect this change.
At least they can still interview for DLA New York.
But today, Duke students found out that K&E was also dropping them. K&E Chicago never signed up to recruit on-campus. K&E D.C. dropped out today:
Unfortunately, Kirkland & Ellis’ Washington, DC, office just contacted us to say they will be canceling their on campus interview schedule. We know this news is frustrating for you. They have posted a position and are soliciting resumes on Symplicity, and we strongly encourage you to apply.To reflect the change, you will soon see the firm removed from your interview schedule. As you plan and conduct both your on-campus interviews and outreach to employers, please stay in close touch with the Career Counselors so we can help you maximize your success.
But as summer opportunities continue to dry up, Duke Law students are still trying to figure out whether they’ve made it onto law review. And once again, what should be a simple notification process seems totally screwed up.
More details after the jump.
On Friday, we reported that the process for notifying Duke students about which journals they have been accepted to was flawed. But the school assured students that the problems would be worked out quickly:
We are working to redo the selection process as quickly as possible, and will be working through this weekend. We expect to have this process completed by the end of the day on Monday and have the corrected selection lists sent to the journals then.
By Monday, no results were posted. Instead, Monday night, the Duke Director of Publications sent around this message:
Dear Students,I am writing to update you on our efforts to correct the calculation errors in the journal selection process. When I wrote to you Friday, I indicated that several Law School administrators would be working through the weekend to address the problems and redo the calculations necessary to each journal’s selection process. We did so, and have made excellent progress. As part of our efforts, we also have worked with journal editors to review and confirm all original data and
selection criteria. Because we want to be absolutely certain of the accuracy of this process, we were not ready to release the final, correct invitation lists to the journals today. I will update you on our progress tomorrow.I understand that many of you are anxious to know the outcome of this process, and we appreciate your understanding as we work through this complex data. If you have specific questions, please feel free to contact [Redacted].
Well, it’s now Wednesday. And Duke students still don’t know their journal placements. Instead, they have another email from the publications director:
Dear Students,As promised yesterday, I’m writing with another update on our efforts to correct the calculation errors in the journal selection process. We made good progress again today. Unfortunately, we found some additional problems in the data submitted to us, and this has further complicated the process. Still, barring any unforeseen circumstances, we are committed to completing these calculations in the next few days and to delivering lists to the journals by Friday.
We appreciate your continued patience. Again, if you have specific questions, please feel free to contact [Redacted].
I think Duke Law students are just getting Punk’d. One tipster says:
No credible law school could display this kind of incompetence, unless they are doing it on purpose. What purpose? Somehow Duke is going to put everybody on law review, to help recruiting.
Try to remain calm Blue Devil friends. Soon this will all be sorted out. Some of you will make law review and some of you will almost certainly get jobs. It’s going to be okay.
Update (1:15): A tipster highlights an important factor to consider when assessing the situation at Duke Law School:
The only reason Duke has to notify students of each firm pullout is because they made them bid in June. Duke isn’t notifying the whole class of each pullout, just the impacted students .It sort of looks like employers are fleeing Duke when they’re really fleeing everywhere but most schools don’t have kids already commuted to interviews.
Good point. Duke’s early bidding process is forcing firms to proactively cancel interviews with people who have already signed up. Firms may be backing out of other peer schools without having to publicly admit to the decision.
Earlier: Duke Law’s Notification Process for Journal Acceptance Is A Total Train Wreck
Ballard Spahr And Thompson Hine Cancel Their 2010 Summer Programs
(172) Comments
Comments
The sky is falling and the ship be sinking.
Typical Dook
This journal notification process is really weird. At my school, I think the board just sits down, picks its people, and then calls them to notify them. We don't have some weird computerized calculating system.
Typical Dook
Fourth.
Locke Lord stopped going there a long time ago.
Sergent SMU
3=TTT
K&E pulled out of Hastings as well, though our career office has decidedly not been informing us of movement on Symplicity.
The ship be sinking...
I'm sure the class of 2010/2011 will be just fine......... haha, think NOT
Hello,
I am Dave Thomas, founder of Wendy's. We will be pulling out of Duke as well. In these current troubled times, it is not economically prudenttt to hire from this school.
Don't forget to Biggy-size!
Thanks,
Dave
This is what happens when you pull out too quickly, you get DOOOOK everywhere. Gross.
duke 2Ls to litigation paralegals!
@7.
Agreed. Any decent school uses a system similar to duke, even if it only has 3-4 journals.
Maybe 3 was recently notified of acceptance onto university of phoenix law review by phone.
haha. Now I feel better turning down Dook for a full ride at Gonzaga. Gonzaga OCI up 30% this year plus Orrick. Gonzaga FTW
thats okay, if any Dukies have a problem finding a job they can always come work for me in my personal glory hole! it'll be awesome baby!
- Dickey V
dook = TTT
I am a jobless rising 3L at Michigan and I am going to kill myself
dook - now sucking at basketball AND law.
wow, they are really taking it up the Duke chute
I am a rising 2L, and my plan is to split my 2010 summer between two firms. I think that this is a good idea because I basically will be diversifying my risk exposure to 2 firms instead of just one. What are the odds of going to 2 firms that are in trouble and can't make offers? Also, this is good for the firms since they have less of a financial obligation to me for only half a summer. I think everybody wins. Thoughts?
The only reason Duke has to notify students of each firm pullout is because they made them bid in June. Duke isn't notifying the whole class of each pullout, just the impacted students .
Dey tuk er jerbs!
How you like me now?
CHANGE! HOPE!
Sweet. Let's whine and complain to ATL. That'll help me keep my spot on DLJ!
Yea, the administration made a MAJOR fuck-up, but c'mon. Quit whining. Shit will get sorted out, it's not the end of the world.
-Rising 2L @ Duke
3 is actually at a 3L at a T5 school, and on the board of one of its journals (not THE Law Review, but a fairly competitive one nonetheless). There may be behind-the-scenes work that I'm not aware of, but I think (1) Law Review makes its decision and notifies the other journals of who is still available, and then (2) the other journals notify whoever they select. Some journals require students to accept; others let them choose between multiple offers. But at least the students my journal picks are notified by phone. I presume other journals do the same.
What does TTT mean?
21=delusional 2L thinking he will get two offers.
third tier toliet
15, since when does Orrick interview at Gonzaga?
28: Totally Terriffic Tiaras!
dook students,
Get ready for a year of joblessness and a quick exit from the tourney in March.
thats okay, if any Dukies have a problem finding a job they can always come work for me in my personal glory hole! it'll be awesome baby!
- Dickey V
thats okay, if any Dukies have a problem finding a job they can always come work for me in my personal glory hole! it'll be awesome baby!
- Dickey V
FALL RISES
DUKE FALLS
QUINN REMAINS
21: You are probably on to something.
If you're on the journal these days, it better be b/c you're trying to change the world, otherwise you're idiots -- who cares about journals anymore, you'd be better off getting a part time job to control your debts.
The only reason we're told about firm pullouts is because we had to bid in June. So while at most schools they just pull the firm listing, Duke has to notify impacted students
http://tarheelblue.cstv.com/sports/m-baskbl/spec-rel/021209aaa.html
21--according to your logic, why stop at 2? There is massive upheaval afoot, and your diversification strategy seems profoundly anachronistic. Times are tough, think beyond possibility of getting offers (on the low side) and more about why you went to law school in the first place and what your real interests are.
Honestly. I know three kids at Gonzaga who turned down T10 schools. Our OCI is up 30% this year and Gonzaga is now the go to school in the PNW
I'm going to put a different spin on this, and say this might actually be good news for law students.
As has been mentioned here before, current law students have the ability to adjust their post-graduation plans given the current economic climate, such as pursuing a clerkship or other government work for a few years after law school, in the hope that the market will recover and firms will begin hiring a few years down the road.
I would be more worried if I was a young associate at one of these firms. What conclusion could you possibly draw from your firm reducing its OCI particpation (particularly at a top school) other than your firm is in fiscal peril?
So, in other words, current law students (especially 2Ls) should use this an opportunity to readjust expectations and their post-graduation strategy for obtaining employment. You can't say the warning signals weren't there for you.
21 - you are retarded. the firm doesn't care if you save them $15k. you are less likely to get a single offer, not more likely to get 2 offers.
In state, NC. I'm glad I went to UNC and not dook. Let's see... 15k per year or 45k per year for the same education. Hotter women at UNC, and the same employers coming to interview. ... (or not interview)
As a Duke alumnus, this type of incompetence by the administration is typical and affects all areas of the school. Poor Duke -- Chemerinsky left, swine flu outbreak, journal drama, employers leaving…. Why don’t we start a pool on what will happen next?
21:
Please let me know when you invent those two law firms.
Comment dooked on by Mystal.
42 - then you know 3 morons.
On the up side, North Carolina is one of the most beautiful states in the union, and supports a high quality of life even on a modest income.
Agree with 44.
I want to go POTTY!
Lets be fair, 42 could just know 3 liars.
Lat,
I just need some clarification about something that's been confusing me: are you a gay homosexual? Or is your boyfriend the gay one in the relationship? Inquiring minds want to know. Thanks buddy.
Dook is the joke of the T14s.
GULC night class is not even as much of a train wreck
21--at the end of the summer, please have a talk with any rising 3Ls you may know who summered at a firm this summer. Please by kind a what until after they stop crying. Then adjust your expectations for your 2010 summer by applying at the Gap. Admittedly you will never be able to pay a cent of your student loans, but don't worry, that debt will only last until you die.
Best
Orrick is doing OCI at 'Zaga?
Should I be scared about this?
Seton Hall summer at Orrick
1. UNC does not nearly have as many employers as Duke. It PALES in comparison.
2. Duke isn't T-14, it's T-10, motherfucker.
3. Sam Seaborn went to Duke Law. Enough said.
better than overhiring then firing half the class like Latham
Hey guys, what did everyone have for lunch today?
2. Duke isn't T-14, it's T-10, motherfucker.
More like top 12, right?
wow, 3 Dook students had the same thought at the same time.
not entirely surprising.
It's top 10 if you think being tied counts and 12 schools can fit in the top 10.
moron.
-T5 2L
58-60
learn how to post once muTTThafucka
Sam Seaborn is...how you say...not a real person
'nuff said.
58-60
learn how to post once muTTThafucka
58-64
lol
great example of why DOOK is FTT
Richard Nixon went to dook law. Enough said.
62 - I live a block-and-a-half away from the office, so I was able to head home and make a turkey burger with lettuce and tomatoes and a side of brown rice. I watched television while eating.
How about you? Everyone else?
Mike Nifong -- pround UNC undergrad and law school alum.
'nuff said
From the link in 40, this gem had me laughing. Of course, I'm a Tar Heel.
"Duke fans believe spending 196 hours in a tent indicates passion and devotion. Carolina fans believe 196 hours in a tent indicates a telling lack of other social engagements. The undergrads inhabiting Tent 1 in Krzyzewskiville staked their claim on Dec. 26, 47 days ago. Added over four years of college life, that's 188 days--over half a year--in a tent to watch four losses."
Mike Nifong -- proud UNC undergrad and law school alum.
'nuff said
Not so subtle UVA trolling.
What's up everyone? Hey 67, how's your sister?
UVA is going the way of DOOK soon enough.
-not a UVA troll
62, a grilled cheese sandwich undercooked.
dang, if duke ain't good enough for K&E what chance does a TTT have
and K&E was supposed to be one of the healthy ones!
I lied, and jobs for Duke Law School students died.
I'm Barack Obama?
"No credible law school could display this kind of incompetence"
I attended an extremely credible law school, and I have to say the administration was incompetent. Most of my friends from other top schools had similar experiences.
Not surprised that Orrick has OCI at Gonzaga. Once the economy recovers law students will remember what firms had major layoffs. In two years from now no one at a T14 will even consider Orrick
63 and 65 = FAIL
52 = PE
73
she's great, she just got pregnant by swimming in our local municipal pool
Most law schools are run by degenerate fucks who have no idea what they're doing.
82 = Roxana
21 - Please tell me that's flame.
You'll be lucky to get 1 offer this year and, no, splitting doesn't make things more attractive for the firm. Why would I spend $15K on a kid I only have a 50% chance of getting, when I can spend $30K and basically have a 100% chance (assuming I want them)?
The kids I've seen that split are all HYS. I've never seen a kid from Dook or one of its peer schools (UPenn State, Michigan, etc.) who was allowed to split, even in the best of times.
83 = ?
85 = Roxana
Could be worse, you could be a Suffolk sTTTTudent.
At least Dook wants their students to be lawyers after they graduate.
At least Sam Alito's son is going to Duke Law next fall.
Nixon wen to Whittier Undergrad. 'Nuff said.
Dear Dookies:
I am starting my own firm and hiring paralegals. Please apply,
sincerely
Suffolk top 50% grad.
This doesn't really change anything. The only students who choose Duke are those who couldn't get into a higher ranked school. Those same students will continue to choose Duke until their ranking drops, which it probably won't because the same students will keep attending entirely based on its USNEWS rank. Dukies should thank USNEWS for helping them perpetuate their ill-deserved ranking.
You are all missing the point. Duke law is awful because it's in Durham. Easily the worst place I have ever been (wife went to Duke Law she is now in-house counsel at a bank).
Id rather sit on a large steak knife than hang in Durham for 3 years
43 is either mad or a student trying to comfort himself (or, not unlikely given the profile of students nowadays, both). It is obvious that the Class of 2011 is going to be seriously screwed, more so than any other batch of lawyers I've seen in a very long time. The Class of 2011 is the lost generation of lawyers.
43 = Roxana
The class of 2011 is going to be the lost generation, but the class of 2012 is the stupid generation because they are choosing to enter when they should know the job market will be saturated for a few years even after the economy improves. At least the 2011 students couldn't have know better.
93: is there some reason why 2011 is somehow more screwed than 2009, the first class that had to secure post-grad work after the financial meltdown, or 2010, the first class that had to secure 2L summer work at that same moment?
I'd give the nod to those two classes. By May 2011 when those kids are graduating, there will have been some measure of recovery.
92- How many places have you been to? Durham is also right next to Chapel Hill and Raleigh, which are nice. Some areas of Durham are bad, but it's certainly not the worst place out there.
88
Nice. When he graduates, he doesn't have to worry since he can clerk for Sam Alito's best friend, John Roberts. Go directly to SCOTUS, skip the COA process, and collect $200.
96: Don't forget class of 2008, who were the first to have start dates pushed back and the first to experience the axe as a first-year. When we bought our houses and moved to our new employers' cities, we had no expectation that they could axe us within four months of starting. Later classes at least were put on notice.
91: "The only students who choose Duke are those who couldn't get into a higher ranked school."
Yes, this is how the USNews rankings work for the most part, especially in the T14. If you don't get into Yale, Harvard, or Stanford, you go to Columbia, Chicago, or NYU. If you don't get into CCN, you go to Michigan, Virginia, Penn, or Boalt. If you don't get into MVPB, you go to Duke, Northwestern, Cornell, or Georgetown. Only then, if you don't get into any T14 school, would you start to consider schools more by region (because at that point, where your school is might dictate where you have to work). Ex, BU if you want to work in Boston, UCLA if you want to work on the west coast, Vandy or Texas if you want to work in the South, etc.
97 -- Even though it is only 7 miles away, none of the Duke students live in Chapel Hill because the commute is 40 minutes whether you take 15-501 or Erwin. Who is going to live in Raleigh, which is at least an hour, if traffic is light? If you go to Duke, you are stuck with Durham except maybe on Friday and Saturday nights.
What little culture Durham does have is firmly set against Duke. I don't think you can find a town that hates its biggest employer more than Durham hates Duke. And do you know why? Because Duke makes no effort to have its students interact with the community in a positive way. Durham is too small for Duke to pretend that it is the white castle on the hill above the mess that surrounds it, and yet it does anyway.
92,
Could've been worse. You could have been in Boston for three years.
45: Well said. You also have many professors who teach at both law schools. So those very bright Dook students are paying more than three times as much to receive exactly the same education.
102: If he was in Boston for three years, he might have been at Harvard.
The correct response is: Could've been worse. You could have been in Ithaca for three years. Everyone, Duke lovers and Duke haters alike, can agree that they'd rather be in Durham than in Ithaca.
99: Credited, didn't think of that aspect. I'd still argue that 2009 was basically just as blindsided, and know plenty of people who have had their post-grad offers yanked. No houses bought yet, but not going to be any either, you know -- lots of debt and no employment offer = balls. Bottom line, 2011 is not the "lost generation"; that honor belongs to 2008-10, for sure.
101 - I'm a Duke Law student and I live in a nice area in Chapel Hill. It's only 10 minutes away.
durham vs ithaca - better barbecue but less cliffs to killself off of = wash?
107: Winter weather seems like a good tiebreaker.
I think what 102 means is that he was stuck in boston at the TTTTTTTT that is suffolk....yea that would suck for anyone - but 3 years in cambridge anyone would take
101 -- Then daddy bought you a house just on the other side of 40, and even then your commute is only 10 minutes in your dreams.
101 - you are wrong. Plenty of Duke Students live in Chapel Hill. Plenty of UNC students (and professors) live in Durham. The side of Durham that is "anti Duke" is the part near East Campus. Once you go south of West Campus, towards Chapel Hill, everyone either 1) is a Duke Student (mostly grad students) or 2) works at the Hospital (nurses and research assts).
101 - you are wrong. Plenty of Duke Students live in Chapel Hill. Plenty of UNC students (and professors) live in Durham. The side of Durham that is "anti Duke" is the part near East Campus. Once you go south of West Campus, towards Chapel Hill, everyone either 1) is a Duke Student (mostly grad students) or 2) works at the Hospital (nurses and research assts).
111-112 -- I used to live south of West campus near the Harris Teeter on MLK, and you don't know what you are talking about. There are certainly other Duke students around, but *most* people are still not Duke students and share the opinion of those residents who live near east campus. Just because your roommates are all Duke students doesn't change the demographics of the area.
96, it's 93 here. In short:
2009 - screwed but for the most part, the damage relates to deferrals (since offers already extended)
2010 - screwed but chances are, damage would be largely limited to deferrals (for fear of reputation loss on the part of the firms) - no firm would dare offer 10%, for example, so they would offer and defer.
2011 - Firms either don't go for OCI, or go for OCI merely to have presence and not for substantive interviews, since they have backlog of Classes of 2009 and 2010 coming in for 2011 in a bleak economy.
Accordingly, 2011 is the most screwed.
On a sidenote, I have to say that there have been a million and one postings on other threads on ATL which allude to the same point. So, I'm surprised you even had to ask.
how will class of 2013 fare?
101: What the hell are you talking about? Are you walking from Chapel Hill to Duke? Raleigh isn't even 40 minutes away. Chapel Hill is AT MOST 15 minutes away if there's traffic.
If you're not from Harvard, Yale, Stanford, Columbia and soon-to-be-TTT-NYU, you're probably not much of a marketable law student to begin with. I expect most of the students from these five schools to have problems getting half-decent jobs (or just be given half-baked opportunities in the law firms that hire them purely as a face-saving tactic), so I'm not even sure why the JD students at other law schools aren't just dropping out (and rushing for the prestigious paralegal posts in Biglaw that represents their glass ceiling in this economy).
110 - There's only traffic if you take 15-501. I live off Erwin and that's only bad for a bit at 4:00 when the elementary school lets out. Otherwise, it's 10 minutes.
If you're not from Harvard, Yale, Stanford, Columbia and soon-to-be-TTT-NYU, you're probably not much of a marketable law student to begin with. I expect most of the students from these five schools to have problems getting half-decent jobs (or just be given half-baked opportunities in the law firms that hire them purely as a face-saving tactic), so I'm not even sure why the JD students at other law schools aren't just dropping out (and rushing for the prestigious paralegal posts in Biglaw that represents their glass ceiling in this economy).
116 -- you must live in Duke manor or not have a working clock. I know Dukies spread the rumor that they are 10 minutes away from Chapel Hill, but that doesn't make it true. It takes 20 minutes just to get to RTP, if you think Raleigh is less than 40 minutes away you must drive a private jet.
Jeff Gordon guest lectured my NASCAR law section last year. it was gosh darn exciting.
114 is correct, but with a minor edit:
2010 - screwed but chances are, damage would be largely limited to deferrals and potentially lower offer rate at some firms. But (for fear of reputation loss on the part of the firms) no firm would dare offer 10%, for example, so they would mostly offer and defer.
Class of 2011 is the new fillet-o-fish.
Does anyone envision salaries dropping to $120k or so for BigLaw once the entire bloodbath is over? I suspect that soon, $160k will be nothing but a pipedream, a past that once was.
Thoughts anyone?
120 goes to UNC... only a tar heel think you "drive" planes.
If I were from the Class of 2011, I wipe my backside with the JD degree that I expect to get. Toilet paper might be worth more.
if things are going bad at Duke, just imagine in what pitiful straits grads of third tier and 4th tier schools find themselves...
117/119 - Not so subtle Chicago trolling. Sorry you didn't get in.
117/119 - Not so subtle Chicago trolling. Sorry you didn't get in.
125 -- Nice grammer yourself.
125=Duke student
130 - grammAr
45 - That may be what UNC tells you kids, but I assure you the education there isn't as good.
130 must have meant "grammer"....lol
125 == disgruntled Duke student
Its funny that the best things said so far in this 130+ post threat about Duke are that Duke is close to Chapel Hill and Raleigh. Awesome, what a reason to attend.
130 must have meant "grammer"....lol
125 == disgruntled Duke student
Its funny that the best things said so far in this 130+ post thread about Duke are that Duke is close to Chapel Hill and Raleigh. Awesome, what a reason to attend.
129 = Student who clearly failed to get into one of the TOP 5 schools mentioned in 117/119 (and therefore reassures himself that his school is in the top 5).
Did Aunt Judy and Uncle Ermit"s
"kinnda Like Lawyers"(c) Paralegal
service, the Mount Pilot office cancelOCI as well?
Horizontally rising 2l
136 nailed it. 128/129 is sad.
When I was at Duke a million years ago, class of '84, the top ten percent of the class got Law Review offers automatically from the current LR staff. Then others had a chance to try to write on. Everyone on LR read all the (anonymous) submissions; then we had a big meeting and hashed them out. The administration wasn't involved at all. How things change. Perhaps the current administration ought to go back to the old system, which seemed to work reasonably well.
101: sounds a whole lot like Notre Dame's relationship with South Bend.
-Notre Dame graduate
139 failed Maths. Class of '84 is not a million years ago.
Wlliams and Connolly recruiting schedule (in short, shut the hell up about Duke).
School
Date
Chicago
August 25, 2009
Columbia
August 12, 2009
Duke
August 28, 2009
Georgetown
August 25, 2009
Harvard
August 24-25, 2009
Michigan
August 18, 2009
Pennsylvania
August 31, 2009
Stanford
August 31, 2009
Texas
August 22, 2009
UVA
August 21, 2009
Yale
August 18, 2009
133 = Duke student who hasn't realized how many of his prestigious professors also teach UNC law students.
With all these firms dropping out, it must be tough to work in big law recruiting. What are they going to be doing when there is no summer program, no laterals, etc. I would hate to be someone doing that job.
Apparently a lot of the issues are due to the fact that the Duke Law Director of Publications has put off most of her work this year in favor of "canoodling" at TGI Friday's with a certain rising 2L with predilections for older women and pandemics.
durham is not that bad of a place to live for a few years. if you think it is, you either grew up in a major city, in which case of course it doesn't compare, or you never actually bothered to find things to do in durham because you listened to the whiners who say there's nothing to do. i've lived worse places.
Regarding the Duke/UNC thing, all I can say is that people at Duke Law pay no attention to where UNC Law is ranked.
Losers. We love DLS. Good luck getting in next year.
I'm surprised they even waited until the middle of July to give out journal assignments. I think my year DLJ started making offers at the end of June and students were getting offers from firms they met with well before OCI started. Given the economy, I'd think they'd want to give students as much time as possible to find a job and not just rely on OCI.
144 - I have no sympathy whatever for the HR subhumans. Easiest job on the planet and they still do it badly.
I love Duck!!!
Williams and Connolly dropped Cornell and Northwestern and UC Berk?
Look, I know you 2Ls are freaking out about jobs. You should be. But throwing your school under the bus every five minutes on ATL is not going to help. It makes your school look bad when we really just have the same damn problems as every other school in our tier. (Anyone go to a T14 that doesn't have at least one or two incompetent administrators?) And it makes you look bad because firms really love to hire people who bitch to ATL every time something is "not fair!" (OMG, an administrator sent an e-mail. Better make sure Elie knows about it, ASAP!) Worse, you keep doing this right before your OCI in an awful economy. If you social fuck-ups don't get jobs it will be because you suck, not because Duke does. So in the interest of your own self-preservation just STFU.
--- Not a Whiny Duke 2L
153=Dookie with no offer
153 - A Show-off Non-Duke 2L (which is even worse than a Whiny Duke 2L)
Thank you, 153.
-26
Why go Dook when you can go Hahvard or Eayle or Standfort? Or Koh-Lom-Bia, or CheeCarGo or En Why Yoo ?
146 - Spot on! Durham gets kicked around a lot, but overall, the whole Durham-Chapel Hill-Raleigh triangle is great fun. Good eating, plenty to do and (in spite of some of the earlier comments from people who can't tell time) hardly any traffic. Not to mention cheap, good housing.
UNC has a law school?
another gem from the link in 40:
"Duke has 6,340 undergrads. Assuming a fourth of them are seniors, that makes a class of 1,585 that will graduate in May without ever seeing a home victory over Carolina. Perhaps that's why they're a little angry. "
@159 --> Yes we do and a basketball team as well!!
Hey, look at it this way, you always have beautiful Durham, NC to hang out it in...
BAHAHAHAHA EPIC FAIL!
147: What a shame. If you did pay attention, you would realize that there is a well-respected law school 8 miles from you that is a third of the cost. You'd also realize that you're paying an extra $90,000 over three years to (1) say your law school is ranked 16 spots higher in an arbitrary law school ranking system, (2) attend a school with a pathetic social atmosphere, and (3) have the opportunity to write onto the Alaskan Law Review. For your next major decision, you might want to pay a little more attention.
Alert: just got a tweet that another firm canceled at Duke Law
163 --
When everyone who is currently at Duke was deciding on a law school, the UNC building was crumbling as fast as its spot on the rankings. It went up this year, but who knows whether UNC will be #30 or #40 or #50 in any given year? A Duke freefall is considered dropping to #12. Usually you have somewhere between 65% and 70% employed at graduation. Duke fluctuates between 95% and 100% at graduation. Fifteen to twenty percent more Duke students score firm gigs. The last numbers I found had the average UNC grad making $90k (with only 65% reporting...), while Duke is up near $125k. Considering Duke gives out grants like candy and that every firm goes deeper into a Duke class than a UNC one (if they even interview at UNC at all), it's not a hard choice if you're looking for biglaw.
43 here, I know this is a little untimely, but what the hell. I want to respond to some of the comments.
First, I am not mad or a law student. I'm a practicing attorney (2006 graduate) still thankfully employed.
The point of my post is that current law students have a chance to adapt to the current economic climate, by (as I said) pursuing employment in the government or clerkships. The Class of 2009 has no such luxury. Therefore, they are more screwed because their offers have been deferred (or the 2008 grads have been laid off), after the time for them to pursue clerkships/ gov't work has already passed.
Further, while the Class of 2011 may not have as many opportuntities to work in big law immediately out of law school, it is NOT THE END OF THE WORLD. Get over yourselves, and lose you god damn sense of entitlement. There is more to life and the legal profession than big law. Is going to work as a law clerk or for the government -- gaining actual experience while the market recovers -- really the worst thing in the world? Sure the money may not be as good, but, assuming don't live outrageouly beyond your means, you will still be financially stable. You can always transfer to a big or mid-size firm a few years later (and yes, contrary to what most people in this site think, it is possible to transfer or lateral in from government work as a 4th year attorney. It happens quite frequently at my firm).
So, really people, gain some freaking perpsective. The Class of 2011 is NOT the lost generation, unless they CHOSE TO BECOME the lost generation by not adapting they plan of post-gradution employment.
My god there are idiots on this board.
164: 95-100% employed at graduation....that is hilarious. Kudos to Duke's Admin for their magic work there...I'd love to take a close look at that employment reporting. Based on the number of Duke kids that end up in NY/NJ and the number of UNC kids that end up in NC, the $90k vs. $125k is actually closer than I'd expect. I guess if your sole desire was to end up in NYC, and you couldn't get into one of the Ivy League law schools, Dukes not a bad option. Different strokes for different folks.
153: Agreed.
I'm disappointed with whatever Duke 2Ls are sending this shit to ATL. This is all private to the Duke Law community - there's no reason to share it with everyone. Every school has problems, but most students seem smart enough not to make their degree granting institution look incompetent or weak in a struggling economy.
And I'm sick of people complaining about the journal process. Big deal - you have to wait a few days to find out about journal membership. Boohoo. As 153 said, quit whining.
Hey, the journal competition situation is all settled. Every Duke student is on a journal, so they gave leftover spots out to other schools.
I am the newest member of THE Alaskan Law Journal.
athank you.
Seton Hall, 2L
Will today finally be the day?!?
No.
If you screw up at your job, would you want everyone freaking out like this? Cut this woman some slack - yeah, I can't understand why it's taking this long, but who cares? If they had said from the beginning that it would be announced July 24 or August 1 or any other day, people wouldn't be complaining. What's making Duke look bad is not the fact that they screwed up our journal selection, but the fact that the Class of 2011 appears to be composed of whiny brats. I really hope this gets worked out soon so I don't have to hear about it all next semester. I also hope I get on DLJ so I don't have to hear people complaining about how they should be on DLJ (because of a mistaken phone call, not because they actually earned a spot) but aren't.
Thank you 171. I hope you make DLJ.
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