O'Secondy and Seconds

Shearman was a v10 before they Lathamed their associates, right?

LOL Latham. Enjoy the ride down.

3, Shearman's transgressions were not nearly as bad as Lathams.

Elie, I gotta say, after being in the BigLaw biz for over 20 years, with more years then I'd like to count as a partner, I'd take firm culture over prestige in a heartbeat, and anyone else should as well. But be careful about the culture thing. Many firms talk the talk, not all of them walk the walk.

CC is probably too highly ranked

Linklaters and Clifford Chance both axed a huge number of associates. CC over a few different rounds and Linklaters in one massive chop - more than 100 as I remember. Not sure how many of those were US vs UK, but I understand that a fair percentage of the cuts came on the US side.

I'd be surprised if the UK firms kept moving up in the rankings after this year. They really are nowhere near the domestic firms they like to claim as peers - and fittingly, aren't listed with any of them. There appears to be a very different culture of loyalty over there. Of cCourse, they're no worse than anyone else on this list - so maybe they're right about where they belong.

@ 6 & 7:

Magic Circle outfits continue to get short-shrifted because Vault only seems to care about "prestige" in the US. As most of us are well aware, Americans are idiots. Nobody's heard of Wachtell anywhere outside of American lawyers, but Clifford and Linklaters are each a huge deal elsewhere (I'm looking at you, Hong Kong).

Yeah, and Linklaters no-offered a significant portion of its summer class. No official count yet, but looks like ~30%. Calls were being made today.

Quinn is like the "new money" family on the block. They shouldn't be there, and everyone knows it. If you advertise in airports, you shouldn't be in the Vault rankings. If you advertise in the Burbank airport, you should have an 888 number for all of your Spanish speaking clients who injure themselves while at the 99 cent store.

CC NY has laid off or lost in partner defections close to 100 associates since September 2008. The firm might be high profile abroad, but in the US they cannot recruit top students and regularly fuck over the mediocre ones they do get.

What is a Linklaters?

I HAVE NEVER HEARD OF THESE FIRMS BECAUSE THEY ARE SO BAD. WHY EVEN RANK BEYOND THE TOP 5?

@8

You do realize that the rankings really are directed towards US practices, don't you? Might explain why Vault only cares about prestige in the US. The simple fact of the matter is that as good as Magic Circle practices might be, their US practices simply aren't quality yet. I've worked on cross-border transactions where Links or CC handled the non-US portion of deals, but where the clients (or the UK partners) don't seem to have trusted Linklaters' US capacity.

I think you've got this the wrong way around - magic cirlce firms are only ranked so high in something like fault *because* of their international reputations. On their own, magic circle firms in the US are extremely weak. You think anyone's going to hire Linklaters for a serious litigation? Neither do I.

@10 FTW!!!

If job security were a measure of prestige, being a public high school teacher would be the most prestigious job in New York.

http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2009/08/31/090831fa_fact_brill?yrail

WilmerHale > Ropes & Gray

Is Wilmer Hale even in Boston anymore? Boston is a one shop city. Who doesn't know that?

Ropes & Gray ROCKS!

For 2Ls interviewing with O'Melveny, FYI: They will flat out lie to you. They'll tell that there's an offer for everyone at the end of the summer, and then no-offer a large number of summers. Don't get me wrong--they can do what they like, but there's no excuse for dishonesty.

oh, the magic circle firms.

i've seen how this turns out- sterling cooper was a way better NY firm before the brits took over.

I think R&G only had 1 person fail the bar ... and that was someone in MA who failed the NY bar. I heard many Wilmer peeps failed the bar.

16 - With regard to layoffs, it's not "job security." It's a firm's ability to attract lawyers who are so good they would never be fired i.e. Wachtell. This in addition to the usual business strategy/management skill arguments.

Hogan & Hartson is definitely Best Dressed but Ropes is Most Popular.

This is f*cking ridiculous.

Did anyone else hear the Managing Partner and Chairman of Mayer Brown flew down to Charlotte to hold individual meetings with all of the partners in that office????

What's the deal, they cut non-equity partner compensation 15% and no one reported it. Anyone got info?

Eighttteen,

Really? Ropes isn't your local sports team.

But if it were, it would be the Toledo Mud Hens.

I'm with 23 - what an unbelievable waste of time. "Prestigious"? Gimme a break. What, are we back in junior high?

Go Mud Hens!

8: For the most part, Vault only cares about prestige in NYC, so it's not just the Magic Circle firms getting overlooked.

And, like 14 pointed out, this Top 100 Vault ranking is based on practice in the United States. There's an entirely separate Vault ranking for UK law firms where many of the top Magic Circle firms are ranked higher than the top US law firms with UK offices. The link is ridiculously long, but if you muck around the Vault site, you'll find it.

I vote 26 for Most Likely to Lose Virginity at the Age of 40 to a Walrus.

Echo 27. Go Hens!

Tho it is a good analogy, 25--The Mud Hens are awesome (if you have to be in Toledo).

Also, @20 FTW. Hilarious.

The Mud Hens were back to back champs in 2005 and 2006, so Ropes should take the analogy as a compliment.

I have a feeling that Boies Schiller will be a top contender for years to come.

Haha, Ropes and Gray. Enjoy your continued sub-WilmerHale status. I'm also eagerly awaiting the Ropes young associates who jump in to tell us why both Vault and The General Perception of Non-Ropes Lawyers everywhere is incorrect.

That, or you can find a grammatical mistake in here to defend yourselves.

Irrelevant- Cravath remains supreme...

34 - yeah, firms that hire 160 summers and defer for a year are reeeeal prestigious. all the HLS law review types go to cravath, as opposed to munger, williams, kellogg, bartlitt

How is the Queen of First Year layoffs Latham & Watkins ranked higher than any of these firms? Quinn, Boies, Hogan and MoFo at the very least have weathered the downturn much better than this hell hole.

Latham has deferred half the class of 2008 indefinitely

It's really a shame that Shearman gets bashed on as much as it does here. I've been at Shearman for a year now and have had a very positive experience. It may differ from practice group to practice group, I suppose, but most people seem to be pretty happy.

Guys in my high school used to Magic Circle (Jerk) all the time. It was no big deal.

- Frat stud

QUINN REMAINS

behind O'Melveny.

Irell craps on all those firms.

32 - I agree, assuming David Boies doesn't die of a heart attack.

In hindsight I do think Shearman has received more than its fair share of bashing. In fact, Shearman is no different from anyone else. Yes Shearman has laid off a large number of people, but so has Cleary. At least Shearman was honest about its layoffs in the last recession. Firms like Cleary deserve to be bashed even more for its hypocrisy.

19: Not true, O'Melveny said there is an offer for everyone to EARN. Big difference! O'Melveny was completely honest all summer.

Who cares.

38,

STFU. Your TTT gets bashed because it Lathamed a bunch of people.

16

Not Lathaming everyone in the private sector is a measure of prestige because it suggests you're well managed and diversified, unlike Latham.

24 -- I'm not sure that the cuts were across the board. But I do know that there were compensation cuts, both to equity and to non-equity partners at Mayer Brown. And associate layoffs will continue in the coming months, though the firm has chosen to do layoffs stealthily now.

definitely not a shearman shill here, but to be fair. even as it falls nationally, it remains #12 in the NY-specific rankings. i was shocked when i saw this, but it be true.

The Mayer Brown posts are funny. I don't understand why people waste their time making up lies to post on blogs... seriously?? who are you? and why do you care?

Goodwin > Ropes > Mintz > Wilmer

Does Ropes still have that gay kiddie rapist associate from parts down south? That's prestige for you.

Umm, who cares?

52 -- an associate from Rapes and Gay?

51: Wow, Goodwin > Ropes? Mintz > Wimer? This is about as credible as the Cooley Rankings. In terms of their Boston offices, I'd rank the four:

1. Ropes
(very small gap)
2. Wilmer
(gap)
3. Goodwin
(huge gap)
4. Mintz

And, in terms of national presence, I'd rank them:
1. Wilmer
(small gap)
2. Ropes
(gap)
3. Goodwin
(huge gap)
4. Mintz

#44: You're naive.

These firms are evidence that rankings should never extend into the 20s.

FYI - the way the laid off NY Latham associates act on ATL only makes me think more highly of the firm for cutting such douches when they had the opportunity.

Well played, 54.

8- The Vault is an American organization which focuses on American firms. Take your pathetic spite somewhere else (Hong Kong, I am looking at you!)

What is all this talk about Boston?
As #28 pointed out, Vault cares mostly about prestige in NYC, not Boston. This thread is on the Vault rankings. Only BU, BC law students care about Boston rankings.

Stay on topic, please.

Hey 50, you obviously don't work at Mayer Brown, or you would have gotten the firmwide "welcome to the office this week ..." email.

Or maybe you're just in denial bc you think 50% utilization is "just fine"

Oh, and I care because I have friends there that actually do work, very hard, and I would like to see them keep their jobs, thanks!

OMM laid off first-years.

I hope this helps.

38, most people are happy at Shearman for a year or so. Then you start actually having to interact with the sociopathic misfits that pass as partners at that twisted shithole of a firm.

This would never hapen at Widener.

40 - Not for long

-QUINN REMAINS (the real one, I swear)

@64

That is exactly true. S&S is a shit hole. You have been warned.

The Fort Hill Cafe at R&G is so kick-a$$ that R&G should move up four spots. Sometimes they even serve breakfast food....FOR DINNER... on Friday nights. How about that? What a country!

44: I'm with 56, but let me add you're also an idiot. Why in the world would you want to go to a firm that 'permits' you the opportunity to "earn" an offer. In fact, they said there's an offer for everyone that's competent.

If you think they're telling you the truth, then that translates into upwards 50-60% of summers in some offices as being incompetent. Do you believe that? Tell you what: Keep drinking the Kool-Aid. You'll need it if you have a hope of keeping your job when the economy doesn't turn around. O'Melveny is poorly managed--just like any firm that would mass fire 1st and 2nd year associates, and fail to give offers to large numbers of summers.

fall recruiting thread aka the suicide thread

This is seriously the most wack (wackest?) series of ATL posts ever. The vault rankings - based on a survey of associates taken late last year - have very little to do with the reality of fall recruiting right now. Nevermind the fact that the rankings are essentially meaningless anyway.

That said, 10 and 13 are my favorite comments of the day.

55 is correct.

does anyone have the vault "best places to work" rankings? I think ropes was ranked high on that

I enjoy how most of the commenters on these Vault threads are first year associates and law students. People who know absolutely nothing about their own firms or other firms and who have absolutely no basis for comparison.

And it's laughable that you'd mention "firm culture" with almost any of these ten - "less hellish place to work than Wachtell" does not equal "firm culture".

Does anyone else doubt the worth of "national" rankings? Some of these firms are fantastically prestigeous in certain areas of the country--Hogan in DC, Ropes in Boston, O'Melveny in Cali. Shouldn't that count for something against the firms like Shearman or CC who are kinda mediocre everywhere?

Vault is the prom-voting of law firms it means JACK SHIT.

QUINN REMAINS remains. Plus their lawyers are weirdos

Agree with 71 that 10 is comment of the day, but also give props to the Mad Men comment @20. Great show. And I'm sure that all of the Gen-Y douche bags on here watch it in despair as they see what you used to be able to get away with in the office...

about shearman & sterling: in just about half of my reviews, partners praised me for work on cases that i'd never worked on. shearman has been doing stealth layoffs for a year now, having learned from their 2001 shearmanations and this year's lathamations that stealthy is the way to be. from what i hear, the grounds for the so-called performance-based layoffs are based on concocted nonsense rather than actual flaws in substantive work. based on my review experience, i wouldn't be surprised if shearman partners are firing associates thinking they're someone else. also, they've fired first years. s&s deserves to drop out of the top 20. i would love to know which practice group #38 is in.

75-- Vault has whatever meaning we assign it. Clearly, people care about where their law firm is ranked. You, for instance, read the above the law post, opened the thread, read through it, and decided to comment anonymously about how little you care. Vault may have little bearing on how law firms operate, but it clearly has some meaning for you.

75-- Vault has whatever meaning we assign it. Clearly, people care about where their law firm is ranked. You, for instance, read the above the law post, opened the thread, read through it, and decided to comment anonymously about how little you care. Vault may have little bearing on how law firms operate, but it clearly has some meaning for you.

Boies moved up because so many other firms announced layoffs and they did theirs on a stealth basis though these sites seem not to know that. Also their PPP spiked because of the antitrust settlement on a five year old case. They don't really have any more huge high profile litigations to replace the ones that they had at their peak four years ago and when the king hangs up his crown it's all over.

79/80 you're right, there is a quantity of worth to it... exactly jack shit.

Mayer Brown is a festering TTT in decline.

what do i do if i want to work in cali? everyone shits on mofo, latham and OMM. which one is safest?

84 - Gibson

oh, and don't forget to shit on Orrick too.

84: Quinn, Munger, Manatt.

What you people don't understand is that layoffs, deferments, etc. don't automatically or necessarily have a bearing on the "prestige" of a law firm. So, while many of the lesser-known, less prestigious law firms did not have to lay off or defer, it does not at all mean that the quality of the lawyers, work product, clients, etc. is better. Actually, quite the opposite. I am no fan of Latham, never have been, but whether they fired 30% of their firm or not, the people who are still there are still among the top talent in the legal world. Thus, they are still "prestigious" in that sense.
I mean, just look at Skadden, Cravath, Weil, DPW, etc. These firms have had deferrals and/or layoffs (albeit stealth), but still represent the best and brightest in law. While I agree that layoffs and deferrals can and should affect how we view firms, it is not the whole story. You have to look behind the scenes.
E.g. Cravath has their whole deferral nonsense... but their ranking was virtually unaffected. Why? Because their situation was simply a by-the-numbers blunder. Too many offers were given out, and too many people accepted offers. Their work volume and client book did not decrease...but their numbers did, extraordinarily so. So they are on a course correction, that it's clear everyone realizes.

However, the other firms...Latham, White and Case, even Weil for that matter, have no easy excuse for their actions.

I have a few cases with Quinn Emanuel - everyone of their associates in NY are douchie(y), nerdy goobers. It feels like a Star Trek convention every time I go over there. It's all I can do to refrain from re-iterating the Shatner skit on SNL:

William Shatner: You know, before I answer any more questions there's something I wanted to say. Having received all your letters over the years, and I've spoken to many of you, and some of you have traveled... y'know... hundreds of miles to be here, I'd just like to say... GET A LIFE, will you people? I mean, for crying out loud, it's just a TV show! I mean, look at you, look at the way you're dressed! You've turned an enjoyable little job, that I did as a lark for a few years, into a COLOSSAL WASTE OF TIME!

[ a crowd of shocked and dismayed Trekkies.... ]

I mean, how old are you people? What have you done with yourselves?

[ to "Ears" ] You, you must be almost 30... have you ever kissed a girl?

[ "Ears" hangs his head ]

I didn't think so! There's a whole world out there! When I was your age, I didn't watch television! I LIVED! So... move out of your parent's basements! And get your own apartments and GROW THE HELL UP! I mean, it's just a TV show dammit, IT'S JUST A TV SHOW!

Charlie: Are- are you saying then that we should pay more attention to the movies?

William Shatner: NO!!! THAT'S NOT WHAT I'M SAYING AT ALL!!! HEY, YOU GUYS ARE... THE LAMEST BUNCH... I'VE NEVER SEEN... [ walks away from podium ] I can't believe these people... I mean, I really can't understand what's....

This pretty much encapsulates every encounter I have had in the halls of QE. If we were in high school I'd beat them up.

Mayer Brown announced firm-wide that it's raising first year salaries to $125,000.

85 and 86 - thanks. but what if i HAD to choose between those three?
-84

90
Quinn. Just know that they're notoriously cheap about associate perks.
Ignore what 86 said about Manatt, that place is barely hanging on.

MoFo at 27????!! Asslobster Dalton fucked up again.

81 is a hater whose got no facts.

81 is a hater without the facts.

69: I call bull shit. Name the office. I am aware of no office that gave less than 70% offers.

#38 are you serious?

#38 are you serious?

I can see it in your eyes.You don't have a single fucking offer.

I see you every time you walk down the halls. You recover from your zombie-like trance just long enough to avert your eyes away from mine. The semester has worn you down and what do you have to show for it? You are a stump of a man.

You hope I don't start up a conversation with you because you know it will lead to the inevitable. That talk and pitter patter about plans for the summer. Great summer plans of getting wined and dined in some far off city. Great plans of meeting new people and getting paid to do nothing. Because you didn't get a single fucking offer. And I can see the pain in your eyes.

I had more callbacks than you had first-interviews. I had more offers than the number of firms who would even deign to look at you twice. I've been to more cities in 4 weeks than you or your grandchildren will ever set foot in during their entire lives. Chicago, New York, LA. I can tell you which airlines fly from which terminals and how many feet you have to walk to get to the 6:50 flight to LaGuardia from the 5:30 flight from O'Hare. I've had more money thrown at me on a single dinner than you spent on food in an entire month. Because you had heard about the stories of excess. And they wouldn't even let you glance inside the window.

For me, normalcy begins again when I write my last exam for my last final of this semester. But for you, it never begins. I see you in the library paging through your casebook. I see you rush to each of your classes: a sense of urgency in the way you move. Because you lost the 1L race, and you'd like to move just a little faster for the 2L one.

@84: All of these firms are very respectable in LA now, in no particular order:

Gibson, Munger, Quinn, Horvitz & Levy (appellate), Greines Martin (appellate), Kirkland (IP), Irell, Jenner & Block, Paul Hastings (labor), Lavely & Singer (entertainment), Klee Tuchin (bankruptcy), Pachulski Stang (bankruptcy), some people might put Skadden up there and possibly a few others I'm forgetting.

@84: All of these firms are very respectable in LA now, in no particular order:

Gibson, Munger, Quinn, Horvitz & Levy (appellate), Greines Martin (appellate), Kirkland (IP), Irell, Jenner & Block, Paul Hastings (labor), Lavely & Singer (entertainment), Klee Tuchin (bankruptcy), Pachulski Stang (bankruptcy), some people might put Skadden up there and possibly a few others I'm forgetting.

@84: All of these firms are very respectable in LA now, in no particular order:

Gibson, Munger, Quinn, Horvitz & Levy (appellate), Greines Martin (appellate), Kirkland (IP), Irell, Jenner & Block, Paul Hastings (labor), Lavely & Singer (entertainment), Klee Tuchin (bankruptcy), Pachulski Stang (bankruptcy), some people might put Skadden up there and possibly a few others I'm forgetting.

Come on Mayer Brown, start giving out the no offers already.

84 - OMM is a rancid shithole. Go to Latham for Southern Cali or MoFo for Northern Cali.

I decided to rank these 10 based purely on their Web sites.

Despite 10's gem, Quinn is easily the best of this bunch, far outpacing a pack of what appear to be sites built by the same drunk, unimaginative college drop-out.

CC would have stolen last place with ease, as its site seems more apt to allow you to book a flight than review its legal services offerings, except for the fact that BSF's site appears to be, no joke, broken.

David Boies is no spring chicken, and he's far and away the lead dog, hell nobody else is even pulling the sleigh! When he goes, that whole place is going to splinter into what it was originally, a cluster of regional local firms that came under his banner (though the Manhattan firm now boasts two felons among its alumni). One of the other head partners is even older and another is - well, let's just say if the current law school voting contest on here were about people, he'd sweep right through to the title in a rout!! They had a good run in the early part of the decade, but firms like Quinn are much better and less riskier bets going forward.

66: How's it taste?

--40

Does anyone give a sh-t about Vault 'prestige' rankings or whatever? It all comes down to $$$. does any one of these firms even hit $2mm PPP??

98 - that was probably the douchiest thing I have ever seen. Calling you a pathetic snot-nosed little punk would be an insult to pathetic snot-nosed little punks.

My only hope is that you come to my firm and work under me, because there's nothing real lawyers enjoy more than watching some arrogant prick who's never accomplished a thing in his life get schooled repeatedly by those of us who've been takin' shrapnel in the trenches since you were crappin' in your hands and rubbing it in your face.

The fact is, this blog was a helluva lot more entertaining before it became overrun by law students like you who don't have the slightest clue about how the real world works.

It's past your bedtime. Run along back to school and back to autoadmit and learn some respect for your fellow man.

108, I've flamed successfully here in the past so I need to come clean on this one. It's recycled ATL/Autoadmit schtick, circa 2007. It appeared many times on this board. See also FRAT STUD and Loyola 2L. I thought more people would get the joke. Obscurity fail. If it makes you feel any better, my offer got rescinded.

But I sure as hell do not need you on that wall.

- 98

@ 103--Latham over OMM? Hahahahaha. Good one.

Don't know where the OMM haters are coming from. Frankly, I think the reason to hate on OMM is that they canned stellar 4th and 5th years so that firsties could rest easy and so that they could give offers to all summers who weren't complete flames.

I practice at a top biglaw firm and we had a big antitrust case against Boies Schiller, we were appalled at a junior partner's conduct at depositions, her incompetence barely outweighed her belligerence. Reflected so poorly on the firm bc traditional biglaw shops don't just send out people like that in big cases. I mean so sloppy but do nasty. It became a running joke among multiple defense counsel which were many, if that's the standard those chaps are doomed to a slippery slope

20: No idea what you're talking about. Got some Greek art thanks to that deal.

107: Quinn is more than $3m PPP. Lick my sweaty balls.

42 & company: Although word on the street is that Boies Schiller falls off the map once Boies retires, that's a really uninformed perspective.

Have you seen who works here? And do you have any idea of how our firm actually operates? Probably not.

Let me simply say this:

There are partners in every BSF office who bring in significant business. I know, you're probably thinking, "Yeah, partners in Albany. Or in New Hampshire. Or in Orlando. Who wants to do BIG FLORIDA LAW?" This is, of course, the retort of stupid people who still think every big case ever has to be run out of a New York City office with a team of 4 partners and 16 associates. These are the same people whose guiding principle is that lawyers can't do any meaningful or substantive work until they are in their 2nd or 3rd year. These are the same people whose firms that are laying off hundreds of attorneys at a time.

So in every BSF office, there are partners working with clients who have never had any dealings with David himself. Many of these partners are so well-established - on their own merits - that they will continue to bring in new clients... regardless of whether or not David remains at the helm.

Since law students might read this particular post for feedback on firms, I just want to say that I work at BSF and I love it. Does that means its easy? Hell no. Working here is very demanding-- both in terms expectations and the sheer number of hours. So if you want a "lifestyle firm", look somewhere else. But if you want to do BIGLAW for a few years, you're willing to work hard, and you really want to learn something... then check this place out. I wouldn't want to work at any other firm.

115 is wildly off the mark. Sure, there are partners in every office who bring in SOME business, but not much. I mean, Boies aqcuired a family law firm in Florida -- yes, that's right, family law. I don't think David Boies is too busy bringing in family law clients.

And you're right that cases are not staffed with 4 partners and 16 associates because there are so many nonequity partners. So it would be more like 16 partners and 4 associates.

115 nice, firm recruiting coordinator? so are you confirming that it's true that the firm is mostly working on leanly staffed small matters now where junior associates get loads of responsibility? I thought this was a "biglaw" site but whato do I know, I'm staffed on bigger cases which is against your regional, small town America business model! QR!!!!

115 nice, firm recruiting coordinator? so are you confirming that it's true that the firm is mostly working on leanly staffed small matters now where junior associates get loads of responsibility? I thought this was a "biglaw" site but whato do I know, I'm staffed on bigger cases which is against your regional, small town America business model! QR!!!!

@116 and 117: 115 is spot on.

The "family law" practice to which 116 refers is a single lawyer who was part of a firm that BSF acquired. If you were to mention at OCI that you wanted to do that kind of work then you would be an auto-ding.

BSF is leanly staffed, and junior associates do get loads of responsibility. Hell, even the summers get loads of responsibility. On the downside, that means more hours. On the upside, the compensation system is fantastic.

Someone also wrote about how the PPP last year was so high because of a couple of settlements. That's true in part, but BSF takes almost half its cases on contingency or some alternate fee arrangements, and it will continue to get huge settlements.

A law school classmate of mine is at Boies and she tells me that most of the contingency cases are total dogs that never pay out so most attorneys opt-out for a slightly reduced billing scale instead of any supposed recovery. That one case was an anomaly and was four or five years in the making, they have nothing even remotely on that scale nowadays. Also, it was mentioned above, there's many many non-equity partners who get paid at the same scale as associates so the PPP was jacked for that reason with the settlement also, they've never been anywhere near that high a ranking in other years.

#78 is pretty much on target about S&S. From what I understand, all reviews were negative. Here's what I gather:

-Reviews from people you never worked with
-Reviews on matters you didn't work on
-Told that the firm neglected to mention negative remarks on your previous positive review
-Not being given any substance to the negative reviews, i.e. partners giving the reviews won't tell you how or why your work wasn't up to par.

Plus, S&S seems to be getting rid of the top and bottom of its associates. Is this a product of the seriously flawed billable hour business model?

#78 is pretty much on target about S&S. From what I understand, all reviews were negative. Here's what I gather:

-Reviews from people you never worked with
-Reviews on matters you didn't work on
-Told that the firm neglected to mention negative remarks on your previous positive review
-Not being given any substance to the negative reviews, i.e. partners giving the reviews won't tell you how or why your work wasn't up to par.

Plus, S&S seems to be getting rid of the top and bottom of its associates. Is this a product of the seriously flawed billable hour business model?

@ 115:

I mostly agree. Now I'm not saying that BSF won't take a hit when David retires-- it will. You have to admit that DB does bring in the lion's share of the business. But I certainly don't think the firm will crumble when he steps down.

Regardless, I don't see David leaving within the next couple of years. So that's a non-issue for lots of associates.

As much as I like it here and hope the firm stays strong for the long haul, what happens to BSF in 5 or 10 years doesn't impact me at all.

Get with the program, idiots. This isn't about making partner. This isn't about how many equity partners a firm has. This isn't about the what happens 5 years from now. This is about short term strategy. This is about working at a firm where you (1) won't get laid off (2) immediately get substantive work (3) can make bank and (4) can exit with a credential.

119 -- "single lawyer"? Really? Just run a quick search under the "matrimonial and family law" practice on the Boies web site, and you'll see it's actually six people who exclusively do things like divorces and pre-nups.

Look, the point is that of course there are folks at Boies who bring in some business. Just not enough of them, nor the types of cases that will sustain the firm when Boies leaves. The firm may well be a good place to work now, but when Boies leaves, I'm sure many people will start planning their exit.

124 - "start planning" = "scene from Lord of the Rings when the ring dissolves in the lava"

... what 123 said.

Is ATL going to report on the bloodbath at Linklaters? Atrocious offer rate. Word on the street is London put the kibosh on the US practice and its shrinking from here on.

what's the story of linklater no-offering?

Note about OMM: each office runs its own hiring. So, when people hate on OMM, know that they are either just pissed that they didn't get an offer, were actually misled or not working at the office you are interested in, or any combination. I had a great summer there, and they didn't make any promises that they didn't keep.

what was the linklaters offer rate?

50%

@131 where did you get that number?

I am outraged by the running dog degenerate corporate lawyers who control the Vault. My glorious regime is more profitable than all the corporate lackeys who masquerade as lawyers. They all will fall and I WILL REMAIN!

And after OMM laid off first years, OMM pretended to interview at schools for PR's sake.

@131. that's crazy. it's much higher than that.