Latham Sucks!

I have an interesting situation, and I'm hoping I can get some advice from the ATL crowd. I'm a top 10% 3L at NYLS. If I choose to interview with one of these firms, should I disclose that my MPRE score is two points shy of the NY state requirement, or should I just pick a firm and then retake it, never letting them know I 'failed' the first time? Thanks in advance.

Elie...you never cease to amaze me with your disgusting typos and pitiful grammar. I know it's late on a Friday, but that is no excuse. "Hughes Hubbard has also cracks..." seriously?

Katten gave out offers today. Anyone else hear? I am hearing that it was a slaughter.

That Bracewell and Locke Lorde have moved up in any ranking system demonstrates that the ranking alogrithm has a fatal flaw.

Locke Lord Houston smells like feces and rotten milk. Fucking disgusting and embarrassing.

V&E Houston associate

Locke Lord is a total shithole. Everyone I know that works there is miserable.

Have the lawyers at these T4 shitshops even passed the bar? Does the ABA know they peddling their shitshop shitdrivel?

Hey Mystal, suck my ass, you fat racist walrus!

BOOM!

Katten did give out offers today, and it was a slaughter.

However, a few hot TTT females got pussy passes into Katten Corporate in New York, to join the pussy passes already there.

11, you sound angry. Why would you be angry about hot girls getting a free pass? I think all hot women should be given a free pass in nearly every conceivable situation. I mean, hot girls are so fun to look at.

Bracewell is the top energy firm in Texas. Known as a great place to work.

9, surprised (and doubtful that) you passed the bar given your grammar. I'm sure you're an equity partner at some biglaw firm -- ha. Yeah, right.

locke lord? give me a brake- isn't that a british joint? didn't we bomb that country back into the stone age during WWII ?

-SEC SECure !

Mystal is the Cocke Lord of Walrus bloggers.

Simple Jack

Katten Chicago was supposed to give offers today but told all their summers they were not ready and they had to wait another week.

6 - You're an idiot. Thomson Reuters' U.S. Capital Markets Review ranked Bracewell as the top issuer legal advisor in U.S. High Yield Corporate Debt during the first quarter of 2009. In addition, the people there are great. Very relaxed and friendly culture.

I've heard of maybe four of these firms.

--Latham Secure

Bracewell is fine.

Locke Lord is an absolute cesspool.

B&G has been pushing to the top for a while now, and it looks like it finally paid off. From what I've heard, those guys were very strategic about picking practice areas to grow. That said, rumors were rampant that they no-offered half their Houston summers. Never heard whether that was verified.

Katten sounded like it was on major death watch this summer. Best of luck to all you summer associates, if it's true that offers and no-offers went out today. I would be very curious to hear what the results were.

How many were summers were offered positions for Katten NY? I have an interview and would like to know if it's worth it or not.

Does anyone actually think that Oh. St. has a chance of winning tomorrow? I say they lose by three TDs. Jackass midwesterners. If I had to root for Big 10 school, it would definitely be UPenn.

18 - the lady doth protest too much. Is there a firm anywhere in the top 200 that can't find some ranking somewhere that ranks them near the top in some very narrow area? And could you have been any more defensive?

Baker & Hostetler has had at least 5 associate layoffs in the Orlando over the past year. There's only 20 or so associates at any given time, so 5 is a lot. The firm has also laid staff members in that office.

13/18 works for bracewell and giuliani

Where are those D.C. Venable summers? How many got offers? There were ten....

Locke Lord Houston is the laughing stock of Texas.

Trust me.

18 - so in probably the worst market for issuing junk bonds in history (Q1 2009), B&G came out on top? Kudos to them, but would have probably taken convincing about two issuers to do offerings - and likely at astronomically high coupon rates. You could look at them as pioneers or as "replacement" scrubs playing during a major league strike.

What's with people jumping on everybody's case? A ranking is a ranking. Y'all trash firms and glorify others in the same breath. Get back to doc review, plebs.

Baker Hostetler has had layoffs - both staff and attorney - at several offices (at least LA, Orlando, Cleveland) and a terrible offer rate for summers. Not sure how this has stayed off the radar but it would be nice for someone (ATL) to dig a little more on this story.

Incisive observation, 27... Personally, I get all of my insider information from people who have never stepped foot in the office, let alone Texas. But that's just how I roll... Houston to $190K!

Locke Lord

Hughes Hubbard is a great place to work. Laid back people, no layoffs, above-market bonuses, no deferred start dates (none whatsoever), and offers to summers.

Oh yeah, and #2 on the Amlaw list this year (read: HHR associates have actual lives).

Bracewell did not break into the rankings this -- they were already there.

Didn't Finnegan only give 1 SA an offer out of over 20? What a dump.

Mystal, you racist walrus fucker, you.

suck my ass

24

I believe Ohio state has a chance to win tommorow. Granted, it is the same chance that the laid off latham first year has at finding a girlfriend, but if they manage to pay USC enough money, they can score...er.... I mean win.

13/18/33 - one man's "inside information" is another man's biased useless trolling

Will you people shut up with your goddamn conspiracy theories and just talk about offer rates!

alright, please, for the love of god, nobody give 3 any advice. I can't take it anymore.

18 = 21 = incoming associate Rudy pole rider

Skadden NY interviews tomorrow. Anyone have any tips?

Dorsey cut salaries 10% and froze them earlier this summer, this recruiting season they announced they are halving their 2010 summer class.

Alright, I'm calling bullshit. No way in he'll at least three of these firms aren't just made up names to see if anyone's actually paying attention. Kat Munchin'? Sounds more like a pornstar than a law firm.

22, please elaborate.

Why just NYC? What about CHI? What would Katten's (NYC or the whole firm's) options be? Dissolution? Merger? Merger, just NYC or the whole firm?

Re: 22

Don't feed the trolls. Katten is no better off/worse off than other firms. Lit is still strong, the one big financial client is still there, rates are still lower than other V100 firms, no heavy exposure to subprime OR high leverage. It's not on "death watch."

Listen good V81-90... look up... look down... one of you won't be here (or anywhere) next year.

48, I hope you are right, but 22 please elaborate. Please.

44, just be like, "listen, skatten muchin rosenman is a legendary new york firm. it has been a life long DREAM of mine to work there." trust me, it will work.

By reason of previous posters, I declare that any positive comments about any firms must be made by "pole riders." Infallible logic.

Welcome, Katten pole rider.

This post is in response to comment number 12. I echo your sentiment that attractive associates are an asset to a firm, as so-called "eye-candy" can make long evenings in the office more tolerable. When interviewing a candidate for a position at my firm, the prospective associates' looks are most certainly part of the factor in determining whether he receives an offer.

PE = Lat

Evidenced by homosexual slip at 54.

Discuss.

PE = Lat

Evidenced by homosexual slip at 53

Discuss.

PE = Lat

Evidenced by homosexual slip at 53

Discuss.

finnegan stealth layoffs.... discuss. quietly.

18,

Is your argument REALLY that one quarter at the top in a shitty market makes a firm great, reputable, elite?

It figures you work there. I had you idiots do some very basic work for me and I got a bill for 25k. Needless to say, GC pulled the plug on the Bracewell experiment.

6

OMG Partner Emertius--I thought you were straight!

OMG, it's like finding out that Santa is a Pedophile.
I'm shattered. Truly, I am. I look for your comments.
For the past year I've always perked up when you
had something to say. And now alas, I know you're
just a quick witted gay guy, which makes you not
at all original. I'm crushed by your revelation. Now
I see you in your silk black undies, legs crossed at the
hairy knee, typing with one finger, while you sip a cherry something from a straw.

Bracewell is rising while most firms sink. That is all.

How many attorneys has Finnegan laid off?

Ohio State has not a chance tomorrow. UPenn to win the Big 10!! Roar Lions Roar!!! Only Ivy with a great football team! JoPa rules!

Unpatriotic freedom-hating motherfuckers bashing America's mayor on 9-11.

Did you notice that ATL stealth un-tagged/never tagged Finnegan? Look up under the post... this post is tagged with every other firm name. Even Rudy's shitty firm has a tag.

Hey, 62- It's UPenn State, dumbass. You just made JoePa cry, and wet his Depends.
Anyway, I heard that recruitment at the Philly satellite campus is way down this fall. At least they have the football season to distract them while they aren't busy preparing for interviews.

Whatevs, 62. We all know that Michigan has the best law school and football team in the Big Ten -- much better than UPenn State.

Go Blue.

Can we list the rest of the Vault rankings individually so we can milk this thread a bit longer? Thanks.

66 - classic attention-craving Michigan douche bag. Nobody cares about your school. Its average, both in academics and athletics. But unlike other average schools, you guys never seem to shut up. Your acceptance rate is way too high to be an elite school, and your record is way too shitty to be an elite football team. Just accept that, and go back to making fun of Michigan State people.

Finnegan has a history of doing stealth layoffs and blaming it on performance. Some of the people laid off were not the strongest performers but they refused to acknowledge the economy was a contributing factor.

Baker and Hostetler Cleveland was a total slaughter this summer.

McGuireWoods summers haven't heard anything about offers. Very considerate of the firm.

If they make me an offer, I'll take it, but once jobs are easier to come by, I'm out the door.

@71 - If you're going to leave before you're profitable, why would they hire you at all? Way to push the firm toward no-offering most of the class. Jerk.

68 was rejected by Michigan Law and was even more depressed to hear that some Michigan Law student screwed his sister last night.

WHY do liberals hate liberty?

Those little fascists! Rid this nation of them! Send them to Canada! They're a threat to us all!

Confirm or deny... Skadden NYC cancelled their summer program part way through the summer and had their existing SAs sign a confidentiality agreement not to talk about it.

Could someone please elaborate on the Katten NYC deathwatch.

To the Michigan kids. Yes, you have a great law school. Frozen like Han Solo most of the year, but great nonetheless. But what's with the new Wolverine Scholars program? That has to be the most crass, cynical attempt to game the rankings system I've ever seen. Mich should be ashamed. I hope graduates lobby their law school hard to change such a thinly-veiled dishonest attempt to not report scores.

--UPenn St. Nittany Lion

If you can't practice in one of the top 10 firms, you might as well quit law and become something else, like a trash collector or possibly teach high school somewhere unimportant. There's the top, then there's everyone else. Pesonally, I like being at the top, because it provides a great view of all you losers out there.

Re: 53, that is the same way PE interviews his latin catamites.

#76.

Re: Katten deathwatch.

Back in 2006/07 Katten took on way too many laterals into corporate NYC. They were literally taking on ANYONE with a pulse. The usual Biglaw credentials did not apply. Some of these imposters have managed to hang on by the skin of their teeth. Back in March Katten did lay of some attorneys, but have thus far avoided the blood baths of other firms. However, the reaper is calling.

They took on way too many summer associates for 2009. As with alot of large firms, Katten did not want to send negative signals about their firm by cancelling or cutting back on 2009 summers. You don't want potential clients to think you are in big trouble. So it's simple. You hire the usual number of summer associates, and then simply no offer a large percentage of them. Alot of firms did this in 2009 to buy them some breathing room. Summer associates were sacrificed for the "business as usual" perception that firms wanted to keep up.

75 - Confirmed. Cannot say more.

75, 81:
What do you mean, they just told everyone to go home halfway through the program, but said, don't worry, we're giving you offers to start in September 2011?

Ohio State will win today.

-Fisher College of Business Secure/ unfortunately went to G'town law.

Locke Houston and Dallas are doing awful, and have been for a while.

Bracewell is doing pretty well, but they're definitely not the top energy firm in Texas- VE is. And BG no offered more than 50% of the summer class in Houston. Things have really slowed down there.

Why didn't someone tell me that being on law review 2L year is a miserable experience. WTF?

As an indifferent observer, I find it amusing that an individual like #6 would purport to personally spend $25,000 on legal services in a comment thread. It's a bit comical that any individual with that much spending power would be wasting their time on a legal tabloid blog. I not only call bullshit on this, but suspect that all the negative hoohah about BG was spread by this one turd. Even if it was true, this person is a douchetard for complaining about payment for services he or she contracted for with open eyes. Welcome to BigLaw.

Another bullshit point -- How can Katten offer calls have gone out, yet no one is reporting being no-offered? Aren't firms obliged to call everyone at once? Serious question, TIA.

83, I like the bravado. But Oh. State has no chance of winning today. They'll be lucky if they don't get embarrassed. I'm actually hoping that they do get embarrassed so we can stop talking about the damn Big Ten. What a joke of a conference. Seriously. 35-13, USC.

--Former Federal Employee Secure/(Unfortunately, T10 law school grad who will likely be nixed at his current hellhole of a law firm.)

Ohio State sucks very huge bull dicks. There's nothing out there to do, other than suck huge bull dicks.

OK, I am a bored lawyer and I have been successfully trolled by your collectively stupid comments.

But any of you who don't understand that Finnegan Henderson is a VERY prestigious IP firm are basically clueless as to the actual reputation of firms, notwithstanding what the idiots here spew. If the firm is screwing associates now, that sucks, but doesn't change the fact that it's about as "prestigious" (I don't why all you little shits are so obsessed with that) as it gets in the IP world.

86 -- as an indifferent observer, I find it amusing that your reading comprehension skills are so miserable. #58 obviously is an inhouse counsel and, in that capacity, gave an assignment to B&G for which they charged what #58 -- and #58's boss (the "GC" (hint hint) mentioned in the post) -- considered to be an outrageous amount. If you were actually in Big Law, you'd also know that clients have every right to -- and they often do -- complain that the work performed by outside counsel was not worth the cost. Sometimes clients are right (outside counsel is inexperienced, slow, padding, etc.); sometimes they are wrong (the work just took a long time and client had an unrealistic expectations).

Finally, w/r/t to Katten, I have no idea other than to say that firms can do whatever they want when timing the making of offers...

89, I've never heard of them. I think that, in and of itself, undermines your central thesis. Trust me, I'm a prestige whore, Vault-devoted dbag. You're just a victim of your own inferiority complex. That's fine, just be more self-aware. TYIA.

--Totally Prestigious Dbag Attorney

91,

You haven't heard of them because you're too stupid to do IP law. I know that I am. I work for a "Vault Top 15" firm in DC and we encourage many of our clients with major patent litigation to go to Finnegan. In fact, go look at which firm is arguing one of the biggest patent cases this decade before the Supreme Court this term. Idiot...

91-
Yes, you are a prestige whore. Finnegan is one of those small number of boutiques that handles the same clients and pays the same money as the white-shoe GP firms, but employs likable people who go home at 6. Plus the work done at the associate levels is much, much more interesting. What exactly does your prestige buy you?
-FHFGD hopeful.

92, you're the idiot. Saying a firm is prestigious in IP litigation is like saying a college is the "Harvard of [insert TTT state here]." No one outside of that TTT state knows what the hell you're talking about, which, as I pointed out earlier undermines the very notion of what prestige is. Clown.

WEMED and Morrison Mahoney want 2200 hours a year for 70k!!!!!

Pathetic.

89 -- I assume you must mean hard IP only? I've done a decent amount of soft IP and honestly haven't heard of them. I would've named places like Irell, Wilson Sonsini, Fenwick...

I'm also on the west coast -- maybe they're better known on the east coast?

When I worked for McGuireWoods in Chicago, there were FLOORS that were practically empty.

I'm not crying about not working there anymore. The partner I worked with is a chauvinist pig.

Hey Bill L., have you taken down the pictures of you with playboy bunnies yet? How about the Playboy magazine you so proudly displayed in your office? It is too bad you can't refer to your male associates as your concubine. My eyes are filled with tears.

It is a good thing you left Jamie H. alone. You would have been the reason for her permanent absence due to "personal reasons."

Isn't Finnegan the largest IP firm in the world? They have something like 400 IP attorneys. It is hard to imagine somebody that worked a lot in IP that hadn't heard of them. They are consistently ranked as either #1 or #2 in every major IP firm ranking (including Vault).

As a former King &Spalding associate, I can honestly say this firm was the worst place I have ever worked at -- not just worst law firm, but worst workplace period. I thank God every day that I no longer work there or have to list them as my employer. The firm is grossly mismanaged, compounding repeated terrible decision-making with a dog eat dog culture (a bunch of independent contractors sharing space to reduce overhead) that makes the firm's touted "no jerk" policy look pathetic and ridiculous. I have painted my description of King &Spalding with a broad stroke because although there are some good people at the firm, these few individuals are, unfortunately, not in positions of authority, so they are unable to control the wretched decisions made at the top. I would NEVER recommend this firm to any client, much less anyone looking to begin their career here.

I apologize for my late post. I was handling a case pro hac vice out in the Midwest, this week. And furthermore do not appreciate the fact that I have to fix some mess an associate made on a Saturday (he will be let go Monday). Now, no one has ever heckled the President on the House floor. Even though some of you ungrateful youngsters on this site feel like my comments hurt the party, out here, we are people of candor. And I must say that my support of Senator Wilson’s actions has nothing to do with my Republican leanings, as others mask their discomfort of Obama with various forms of feint political partisanship. I simply do not like that he is colored.

whether you like the angry ex-lathamites or not, latham is clearly falling apart, and they're one of the symptoms.

- never a lathamite but sympathetic to their plight

Reading these comments makes me want to punch each and every one of you little shits in the face. Wah your firm sucks, wah no it doesn't, wah yes it does, wah I've never heard of these firms, wah I hate paying legal fees, wah I'm so much smarter than everyone else posting on a message board. Shut the fuck up, ALL OF YOU.

The people that I've worked with at Finnegan have been really nice. I'm guessing that not having an office in NY helps keep away the riff raff from Westchester and Long Island.

101,

You are talking out of your ass. Latham is "clearly falling apart" because of a big round of layoffs? That was months ago. Business is up, they gave 90% offers to summers, and are recruiting strong again. They have a long history of fine lawyers and great work, and will be just fine. PPP was down to a measly $1.9mm. PROFIT. Yeah, falling apart. Mistake of overhiring/leverage over, learn from it, move on.

If they are falling apart, then so are White and Case, O'Melveny, Davis Polk, Kirkland & Ellis, Orrick, Clifford Chance, Allen & Overy, etc., since they had layoffs too. Good one. You're an idiot, don't be sad since you were probably never qualified to work at Latham or another firm of its hiring and work standards.

102 - time for a quaalude

102 - time for a quaalude

Welcome, Latham pole rider.

104

Partner departure emails keep going out at Latham. That place is in trouble.

Baker Hostetler is not a pleasant place to work.

what the hell is a WEMED and why would anyone care about it?

Clayton - you are a racist!

73: the whole "you're just bitter because you didn't get accepted" line is something that other law schools can use, but not Michigan. See, everybody gets into Michigan, so there's no rejects around to get bitter about it. I actually went to a top 5 school that you probably consider a "peer" school, except nobody at Michigan got into my school. You and I actually have very little in common, except of course that we both got into Michigan (along with everyone else who applied).

- Buckeye fan who is thankful that his ability to get a decent LSAT score saved him from having to go to Michigan

OBAMA gave a speech today and 15,000 showed up!

Meanwhile, 2 MILLION people marched on D.C. to protest the creeping fascism that he supports.

100-republicans aren't faking their opposition to Obama's policies. His healthcare plan is fundamentally flawed.

I though that all the losers who got fired at Latham died of starvation already. Nobody cares that you got fired. Basically you suck!

115

your anti-laid off latham associates vitriol is getting old. i also question your motives. why the fuck do you care?

Don't panic. Everything is fine. I promise several more chats at hearth's edge until things calm down.

117

Sounds eerily similar to Bob Dell's "no layoffs" promise.

*frantically sends out resumes*

Clayton, you are too much

I heart Mr. Bigsby and white people

Katten insider here.

Want do you want to know?

I am in New York office, possibly the most run down office on Mad Av. People are nice, but there is a deep undercurrent of resentment. Most partners I speak to hate the Chicago office, and the feeling, I understand, is mutual. We are very underpaid, and it is worse in our sat offices. I had heard that some associates in DC and Charlotte are being paid under $100 and in LA people are under $115. All pay was cut by 20%. I am in lit, but I understand some in RE here in NY got hit between 30-40%. That sums up the firm, while it is nice they cut pay instead of mass cutting of associates, really all they have are very unhappy lawyers - see Am Law Survey.

As for death watch, not as a firm or as an office, but the summer offers will be terrible. At least 1 if not 3 sat offices will no offer (so I heard). NY and Chicago are debating whether to be honest and no offer over 50% or to suck it up for another year with over 75% offers, while no offering the sats. While Chicago and NY will have summer classes next year, which will be very small, as far as I can tell from internal email, no other office will.

Also, there will be a mass cull. Expect Real Estate to finally lose the dead weight it has (honorably) carried thus far. No inside information on that, just common sense.

I like working at Katten, and think it is a good firm. But unless pay is sorted out I will be leaving. I don't mean to sound entitled, but earning less than $160 for my level is not practical in this city. And the headhunters are calling again.

Finally, I wish there were pussy passes in this office. If you know the NY office you wouldn't make that comment. Women are either fried or dried. So that comment is either bull or wishful thinking. Our summer class wasn't even a tiny bit hot this year.

Katten insider here.

Want do you want to know?

I am in New York office, possibly the most run down office on Mad Av. People are nice, but there is a deep undercurrent of resentment. Most partners I speak to hate the Chicago office, and the feeling, I understand, is mutual. We are very underpaid, and it is worse in our sat offices. I had heard that some associates in DC and Charlotte are being paid under $100 and in LA people are under $115. All pay was cut by 20%. I am in lit, but I understand some in RE here in NY got hit between 30-40%. That sums up the firm, while it is nice they cut pay instead of mass cutting of associates, really all they have are very unhappy lawyers - see Am Law Survey.

As for death watch, not as a firm or as an office, but the summer offers will be terrible. At least 1 if not 3 sat offices will no offer (so I heard). NY and Chicago are debating whether to be honest and no offer over 50% or to suck it up for another year with over 75% offers, while no offering the sats. While Chicago and NY will have summer classes next year, which will be very small, as far as I can tell from internal email, no other office will.

Also, there will be a mass cull. Expect Real Estate to finally lose the dead weight it has (honorably) carried thus far. No inside information on that, just common sense.

I like working at Katten, and think it is a good firm. But unless pay is sorted out I will be leaving. I don't mean to sound entitled, but earning less than $160 for my level is not practical in this city. And the headhunters are calling again.

Finally, I wish there were pussy passes in this office. If you know the NY office you wouldn't make that comment. Women are either fried or dried. So that comment is either bull or wishful thinking. Our summer class wasn't even a tiny bit hot this year.

Can anyone explain to me why any white person would have voted for Obama? I mean really, what possible reason could exist, other than liberal guilt.

116-cry me a river. kill yourself

and only thousands showed up to the angry redneck protests in dc, typical fox5 hyperboles

i haert white people too

-115

124

anti-laid off latham associate is getting psychotic!

Fox News Translator:

racial tensions: racist white people are making things difficult for people of color, again

right v. left: racists v. everyone else in the country (Obama voters)

i call bullshit 121. no one at katten is earning less than 100k. typical shit stirring from above the law. katten is doing fine.

My understanding is that Michigan is so easy to get into that it was overrepresented when Latham laid off incompetent first year associates. Can anybody confirm or deny?

Finnegan v. Knobbe. Please discuss

Libs live in such a dreamworld. Here's a overhead pic from the Washington Post. Looks like only a few dozen to me!

http://michellemalkin.cachefly.net/michellemalkin.com/wp/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/live912.jpg

Ha, ha. America hates socialists. Too bad the Dems nominated one.

128

Is as retarded as a latham partner. the smart ones are jumping ship to stable firms.

Bracewell and Guliani is a festering TTT.

Honestly, I can't believe anyone is defending Latham right now. It's nothing personal against Latham, I just don't think anyone should defend any of the poorly- managed law firm that have had layoffs. I think we've all seen the true colors of big law--green and black. Very sad.

Are you serious, 123? Do you honestly wonder why any white person would have voted for Obama, or are you just an ignorant jackass?

- white lawyer who happily voted for Obama

134, don't fall for that type of trolling. Obviously, he's just saying outlandish things to get a response.

--McCain voter

Suck my ass, Mystal, you fat fucking racist walrus!

JUMANJI!

I really wish that this site required logins (with traceable IP addresses) for every comment made. That would keep some of the racist, homophobic, hostile, mentally ill people that frequent this site from being so fast and loose with their comments. Disgusting animals. You embarrass me!

137, grant it, the pigs on this board are all terrible in their hatred. But, I don't think outing people for their opinions is a good way to police the site. Very Big Brotherish (though again, I do share your sentiment that the pigs on this site are terrible).

ATL Community

What has happened to us? There used to be a time when race, political leanings, and sexual orientation were not good reasons to hate others on this site. The only good reasons to hate people were because they work at or attended a TTT or because they are Elie. Oh for the good ole days....

Hey, how about sticking on topic and leaving politics and racism and football to other blogs?? MGW rules!

140, how is football ever ever off topic? Go Buckeyes!

#3, I assume you're joking, but in the off chance you're actually serious, relax. You have no need to disclose anything until it effects your ability to perform a job at the time you're expected to perform. In other words, if you pass the bar and fail the MPRE every time you take it such that you're not actually admitted to the bar after passing the bar exam, disclose it. Until then, just spend 6 hours studying for the MPRE instead of 30 minutes and pass it next time.

133-latham attorneys were fired, not laid off

139-the only racist on this site is Clayton

100-did you attend the dc protest rally?

--Palin 2012

121/122 is not a troll. My biggest hunch on this is the fact that he dropped the tidbit that the NYC office is a hole. It's so so true.

Hard to imagine the combined stupidity, ignorance and bigotry assembled today in D.C. CNN interviewed many of the "protesters"; I haven't laughed harder in days. Combine that with the mind-numblingly idiotic, racist and inaccurate signs these pathetic shlubs brought with them and you have the most densely packed group of stupid white people since the last Republican national convention. I honestly feel awful for my highly educated, intelligent conservative friends; they are caught between ignorance on one side and the lack of a real political party on the other.

Katten summer here. I called on Friday and was told no decision had been made. How can we be in September and no decision made??

145, are you that condescending to the Kool Aid- drinking, knee-jerk Maoists who make up the left wing of the Democratic party? Yes, the right wing is scary stupid. But the left wing is equally as dumb, just with a veneer of sophistication (largely due to leftist dominance in the media).

--Educated Conservative

Calling someone a walrus is racist?

I think its obeseist.

100, he is not Senator Wilson. he is a house member, moron

Sorry, 147, but the last time the "knee-jerk Maoists who make up the left wing of the Democratic party" (that this characterization is no longer even remotely true will be left to another argument) assembled in such large numbers in D.C., it was to protest the Iraq War, a war that most of the country (including intelligent conservatives) largely condemn as unnecessary and not worth the cost and American lives lost.

The equivalency arguments always fail because the wackos on the Right are actually much more numerous, dangerous and stupid than the ones on the Left.

-145

143-No, I did not attend the rally. I was busy out here saving the firm from losing a client, today. However, I did submit a donation to Senator Wilson's cause. Now, as for me being a "racist"--that is wholly inaccurate. Generally, the sentiments of the contemporary white male in the U.S. are analagous to what a balding middle-aged man feels or the insecurities of a growing woman who is losing her coke bottle figure. The only time minorities probably feel the pride we felt during the Reagan years and before them is when they take their U.S. passports abroad to some developing country. You call people like me ignorant. No my friend, we know very well what we have lost, and we want it back.

Locke Lord Houston smells like feces and rotten milk. Fucking disgusting and embarrassing.

V&E Houston associate

clayton, it's "analogous"
you sure are a right-winger, you don't know who wilson is (senator or congressman) and you fund his cause only because he disrespected the office of the president held by a black man
just like you voted for the palin-mccain ticket
stupid republicans

none of the katten summers are getting offers
the letters went out, yesterday

154 - source?

143

Yes, Latham associates were in fact fired. Details on the scandal are scheduled to be released in the Times this Monday.

How can Bakers be in trouble when they have nearly 3,000 attorneys worldwide?

Baker Hostetler offered 50% of the Houston class. Bracewell was a slaughter and is apparently a terrible place to work (especially for women--I've heard horror stories).

154 is talking crap. I can assure you that hot bod from Northwestern is getting an offer for the Chicago office.

137, i also wish there were usernames, so I could ignore all of ur gay posts. E.A.D.

158 - Can you elaborate on Bracewell? I was interested in them, and I'm female... eep.

You have to look at Katten NYC Corporate and wonder how some of their female associates got a job in Biglaw. Just look at some of their credentials.
It's a joke.

162, that is crap I am talking about. There is only one bad law school there, 2 if you count rutgers, and she is one of the most respected lawyers in the firm and in her practice area.

I am assuming you have not even looked at the website and instead are just another crummy lawyer who assumes all women get hired based on looks. Keep convincing yourself that is why we wouldn't hire you.

154, offers will be made but it will be well down from previous years and next year's class will be smaller. In other words, Katten is being responsible for the lawyers it has, and not caught up in prestige crap.

Katten is a good place to work. But I echo comments about pay. Please fix this soon.

Shut up about Kattten. McGuireWoods is where its at!

150, ah, I see. People assemble to protest an economically disastrous remaking of 1/6 of the U.S. economy that most of the public hates and they're idiots. (To some extent, I agree with you, they are. They don't know what they're talking about.) Contrast, a different group of wingnuts gather to protest an unpopular war, accuse the previous administration of planning 9/11, starting a war for oil, reintroducing fascism and accuse General Petreus of being a traitor, and they're somehow justified? Where exactly does the "equivalency argument" fail?

Yes, intelligent people on the left and right disagreed with the Iraq war. Intelligent people on the left and right also agree that health care reform (as proposed thus far) is pie in the sky buffoonery. You, apparently, can't seem to accept principled critique over your own policy biases.

Any white boy who votes democrat is suicidal. Normally, I wouldn't stand in the way of someone who wanted to kill themselves. But white boys who vote democrat are taking the rest of us down with them. In that sense, they are the suicidal type who kill 30 classmates before taking themselves out. The worst type of suicidal people.

All liberals hate themselves, and hate life. Their aim is not improving life; they want to put us on a downward spiral.

ADDENDUM to 166: Any white boy who votes democrat does so because he can afford to: he can buy his way into law school, he can have his daddy get him into the high-paying firms, and affirmative action, for example, is not a concern of his at all. SO, by supporting the liberal agenda, elite white boys make things harder for other whites who might be their only potential competition. Voting democrat is a win-win for elite white boys. It keeps them in positions of power.

-- Not an elite white boy

35 -- HHR isn't the best firm ever, and Amlaw has little to do with whether associates "have lives" .

Oh, you can't say there were "no layoffs"; just no official layoffs.

that said, they're a good firm and somewhat underated because they're so small.

the white man and racial resentment = modern GOP

I used to work at B&G. Great firm and great people. Good to see the rankings are rewarding them.

conservatives = logical, thinking

liberals = reactionary, uninformed

I second 152.

I second 152.

158 and 161: Bracewell houston -- 65%. NY, DC and CT - 100%. Not sure about the rest of Texas. In this economy, I don't think 65% is a "slaughter". Not sure abou the "women" comments -- never heard any horror stories.

70 - elaborate.

Oh. St. played like warriors. Kudos. Why did they go so conservative late? Go for the kill! Great game.

--87

I can't believe Hughes Hubbard isn't ranked higher. HHR gets at least of a 1/3 of its associates from NYU and Columbia -- while none of the firms on this list even get one or two. Vault is once again out of touch as proven by the fact that CWT is ranked at all on its list. No one goes to CWT that has an offer at another firm.

Hey everyone, we're all going to get Lathamed!

Irony: Elie is healthy, Kash has the swine flu.

Women are either fried or dried.

What does that comment from 121/122 mean?

I'm guessing it means overtanned or wrinkled.

former fhfgd here - Finnegan is a great firm. Those who haven't heard of them don't know IP and have never read a federal circuit decision.

In the past, they have treated associates very well - very generous, lots of perks. They have probably had to reel that in this last year. I have heard of the stealth-performance layoffs, but don't know how many there were. Not sure about 37's comment of 1 SA offer out 20 - doesn't sound like them, but if true, then they must really be feeling the pinch. Can anyone confirm, or was that just a flame/troll?

What were Sidley's NY and Chi offer rates?

Sidley NY was a slaughter.

Finnegan gave offers to way more than 1 out of 20 SAs. I don't know the overall number, but I know in one office it was more like 80%.

178 - Stop stealing my line

108 - just as many emails about incoming partners at Latham as outgoing, which you should know if you're seeing the internal emails. i think what you're really seeing is industry-wide movement as lawyers reallign with firms that more closely match their skils and their book of business.

Latham is not in trouble. did they handle the layoffs poorly - yes. did they take a hit with young associates and law students - yes. but the same thing happened in the early 1990s while most of you were sucking on your mommies, and they recovered. the bottom-line is that it doesn't really matter whether their prestige score on vault took a hit, because there are many, many more talented young lawyers looking for work, and very few positions at big firms. What matters is PPP so you don't become a TTT, like Katten.

Latham did not "handle the layoffs poorly." They in fact handled their layoffs at least as well if not better than other firms handled theirs. Latham was open and up front about what it was doing and gave terminated associates a severance package of about six months, which no other firm has topped.

Lock One, Lock Two, Lock Three...Lock Lorde...

-- Snotty

It is unfortunate that any associates must lose their jobs, but when it comes time to make necessary cuts the most junior associates SHOULD be the first to go. The more senior associates at that point have given the most to the firm and do not have youth on their side.

Last In First Out.

Have to agree with 188. Getting laid off sucks, but I fail to see how 6 months' severance constitutes handling layoffs poorly, when no one else has given more than four (I think?), and three is the norm.

Hey 177 - What does HHR have you working on nowadays after the case that provided 75% of its associates with work has settled?

HHR is probably a nice enough place, but it's a firm that nobody's really heard of (outside of the bottom quintile of NYU and Columbia, apparently).

Know a lot of good people from B&G. Down to earth, but definitely know their stuff.

98,

If you dont know the IP world, please do not give out false information. Finnegan is not the largest IP firm in the world. I can easily name few firms that have bigger IP practices than Finnegan (e.g., Fish).

89, while I agree that Finnegan is a great firm, I cant say "it's about as 'prestigious' as it gets in the IP world." Saying so would discredit Kirkland, Fenwick and Fish's high power IP lit groups.

Elie-
Seriously,I love your picture, and think you are so cute!
Keep up the good work, i think grammatical errors are sexy!

I will never get laid off, too smart.

192 - Didn't HHR get a big chunk of the Lehman bankruptcy work? I imagine that's keeping folks pretty busy.

(not 177, just saying.)

194--

I think the comments referred to Finnegan being the biggest IP boutique, not the biggest IP practice. Fish also has a corporate law practice.

198, you are wrong. Fish no longer has a corporate group (see threads posted two weeks ago). And I dont recall anyone in the industry calling Fish as a GP firm. Fish is and always will be an IP boutique.

I think Finnegan is the biggest IP specialty firm now that Fish laid off over 100.

There is an imposter in Katten NYC corporate dept

196, you were half right, you will never get laid.

196, you were half right, you will never get laid.

201, please tell us more. I am in NYC and I am annoyed how it is always our office that has to complain. Do the other offices not care? I know the pay cut is based on hours, but we are so far behind the New York market it is depressing. LA, DC, Chicago, have the balls to admit that the firm is shafting the associates.Part of the reason we feel so divided is that we are the only ones who fight. Even a simple we in Chicago are not happy either would be a start.

199--

They are closing their Austin office. They still do other corporate work, including securities and M&A. While most of their work is IP, I think Finnegan boasts to be the biggest firm that solely practices IP.

198

97, I'm sure we could swap some good (and by good, I mean disturbing) stories. Regarding your particular reference, with the common knowledge of how that guy behaved, I never could understand why they let him work with female associates. (Had never heard about the playboy articles in the office though, classy) I suppose every firm has some of those guys that have no fear of harassment charges.

205, if Finnegan is the biggest firm that solely practices IP (assuming you mean they have more attorneys staffed on their IP cases), then you may want to check out the latest IP law firm rankings:

http://www.law.com/jsp/iplawandbusiness/PubArticleIPLB.jsp?id=1196280358819

One thing for sure, more attorneys (or being the biggest IP boutique) definitely do not necessarily give a firm a better edge.

Do any of you know anything about Anderson Kill & Olick, in New York? Is it a solid place to work? Thank you.

"Hey 177 - What does HHR have you working on nowadays after the case that provided 75% of its associates with work has settled?"

We have a lot of cases including Lehman.

"HHR is probably a nice enough place, but it's a firm that nobody's really heard of (outside of the bottom quintile of NYU and Columbia, apparently). "

As a smaller firm we don't have the name recognition of many of the bigger firms. As for the bottom quintile of NYU and CLS, you won't see that here. We have a number of people who were law review at NYU and we have a 3.3 GPA cutoff from CLS.

Please know what you are talking about before making uninformed and stupid comments. I am guessing you are a laid-off Latham associate. Congrats on the prestige (lol)!

Wow, the Finnegan cheerleaders are pushing it hard here. Who do you think you're kidding? Half of the firm's practice is patent prosecution, meaning that half is getting priced out of biglaw by the day. Same goes for litigation -- they are getting squeezed between the Wilmers of the world and smaller firms that will handle those patent troll cases for half of Finnegan's rates. "People should know when they are conquered."

I interviewed at Finnegan awhile ago, and I highly praise their professionalism and kindness in treating every candidate that came through their door. Although the people there are wonderful people, it is still not enough for me to say that Finnegan is at the top of all IP boutiques. Fish and Richardson remains their fierce competitor. Maybe in time, Finnegan will rise and become king of the mountain. But for now, Finnegan still lacks the intensity to become the king. On the prosecution side, Oblon remains the one to beat. On the litigation side, Fish remains unbeatable. But if Finnegan wins the Bilski decision, then I cant say Finnegan is far behind.

209 - I call b.s. on HHR having a 3.3 gpa requirement for Columbia. I know people from Georgetown who got into HHR with a lower gpa.

#163

I have looked on the Katten website and there are definitely a few TTT pussy passes in the NYC Corporate dept.

53 = 59, and maybe 79. Nice try posing as an imposter of PE. Transposing the "t" and "i" probably was not noticed by 95% of the folks posting here.

112: the fact that you're a buckeye fan shows that you're too dumb to get into any T-14 school. settled fact...buckeye fans are just a bit dumber than people from the rest of the country...

oh...and some michigan law student did screw your sister the other night.

207--

i never said it did. my point was on the size, not the success, of the firm.

205

Nice to see that there are no positive comments about Baker Hostetler. The place was horrible when I worked there and seems to be maintaining its reputation.

215 is likely a Michigan Law student. Michigan is a good - not great - law school. It is adequate. Anyone who brags about being T14 could not possibly be more TTT. That is all. Carry on.

209--I know for a fact that 3.3 CLS gpa cut off is not true. HHR took about ten people from my class at CLS, many of whom had between a 3.0-3.25 and never saw an "A" in their 1l year.

218- Let us be clear. Only HYS can be considered "great." Everything else is good or TTT. All else besides HYS in the T-14 are the same.

206, 97 here, yeah, Mr. L was a piece of work. I believe her married a 21 year old. When she arrived, the associate closest to the door would email "it's Romper Room time." Then she would hang out and annoy our corner of the office for hours. Everyone in the office always knew what color thong underwear she was wearing....

207:

That link shows the total number of district court cases handled per firm. There is a lot more to IP than district court cases (e.g., appeals, licensing, ITC litigation, prosecution, etc.).

Of course Katten NY is on death watch. Look around. Remember the renovation plans? Now there's not enough $ for fresh paint

Latham is falling apart. They are stealthly layoff people again.

Partners that are leaving are from good offices and partners added are in Milan and Dubai (new useless offices).

Latham handled layoffs horribly because they laid off people based on nepotism, douchebaggery and sucking up and not work product and attitude. Latham is full of sharks and suckups who don't know how to do shit. You know, those people who stay there all night and get nothing done and when talk about how busy they are and how much stuff they are doing while always hanging around partners' offices.

Latham is falling apart. They are stealthly layoff people again.

Partners that are leaving are from good offices and partners added are in Milan and Dubai (new useless offices).

Latham handled layoffs horribly because they laid off people based on nepotism, douchebaggery and sucking up and not work product and attitude. Latham is full of sharks and suckups who don't know how to do shit. You know, those people who stay there all night and get nothing done and when talk about how busy they are and how much stuff they are doing while always hanging around partners' offices.

Latham is falling apart. They are stealthly layoff people again.

Partners that are leaving are from good offices and partners added are in Milan and Dubai (new useless offices).

Latham handled layoffs horribly because they laid off people based on nepotism, douchebaggery and sucking up and not work product and attitude. Latham is full of sharks and suckups who don't know how to do shit. You know, those people who stay there all night and get nothing done and when talk about how busy they are and how much stuff they are doing while always hanging around partners' offices.

Latham is falling apart. They are stealthly layoff people again.

Partners that are leaving are from good offices and partners added are in Milan and Dubai (new useless offices).

Latham handled layoffs horribly because they laid off people based on nepotism, douchebaggery and sucking up and not work product and attitude. Latham is full of sharks and suckups who don't know how to do shit. You know, those people who stay there all night and get nothing done and when talk about how busy they are and how much stuff they are doing while always hanging around partners' offices.

Latham is falling apart. They are stealthly layoff people again.

Partners that are leaving are from good offices and partners added are in Milan and Dubai (new useless offices).

Latham handled layoffs horribly because they laid off people based on nepotism, douchebaggery and sucking up and not work product and attitude. Latham is full of sharks and suckups who don't know how to do shit. You know, those people who stay there all night and get nothing done and when talk about how busy they are and how much stuff they are doing while always hanging around partners' offices.

Latham is falling apart. They are stealthly layoff people again.

Partners that are leaving are from good offices and partners added are in Milan and Dubai (new useless offices).

Latham handled layoffs horribly because they laid off people based on nepotism, douchebaggery and sucking up and not work product and attitude. Latham is full of sharks and suckups who don't know how to do shit. You know, those people who stay there all night and get nothing done and when talk about how busy they are and how much stuff they are doing while always hanging around partners' offices.

Latham is falling apart. They are stealthly layoff people again.

Partners that are leaving are from good offices and partners added are in Milan and Dubai (new useless offices).

Latham handled layoffs horribly because they laid off people based on nepotism, douchebaggery and sucking up and not work product and attitude. Latham is full of sharks and suckups who don't know how to do shit. You know, those people who stay there all night and get nothing done and when talk about how busy they are and how much stuff they are doing while always hanging around partners' offices.

224-230, maybe Latham laid you off because of your inability to understand simple instructions like "Please only submit your comment once."?

185 - which Finnegan office had an 80% SA rate?

174- Bracewell's offer rate in DC is standing at 50%. Both of my friends were the two summers there and so far only one has received an offer, the other was told that they might be able to offer in January pending financial considerations.

things are not good in cleveland at baker.

rumor has it that the offer rate for summers at baker was well under 50% in the home office AND a ton of secretaries were fired and at least 3 attorneys (and rumors have been flying that more attorneys - at least 3 - are on the chopping block).

and the firm management has been shitty about informing anyone what the hell is going on. for some reason they saw fit to fire people who had been there for a while but still bring in its full 1st year class. seems shady to me.

it makes you wonder what they are hiding since no one seems to want to admit that layoffs are happening (and though 3 or 5 attorneys doesn't seem high, keep in mind the cleveland office doesn't have a ton of associates, most people seem to be partners if nalp is to be believed).

Posted by guest | Permalink
Monday, September 14, 2009 12:13 PM

209--I" know for a fact that 3.3 CLS gpa cut off is not true. HHR took about ten people from my class at CLS, many of whom had between a 3.0-3.25 and never saw an "A" in their 1l year."

I call bullshit! 1. I doubt you know most of your classmates' gpa. Few people at CLS discuss this. The fact that one doesn't get an A in his/her year doesn't preclude that person from having a high average. I am guessing you were not a math major in college (assuming you went to college). Even assuming you (1) went to CLS and (2) spoke with ten classmates who got offers at HHR, it seems unlikely that this took place this year. Firms are constantly switching grade cutoffs. Quinn Emanuel, for example, used to take people with 3.2's and 3.3's from top five schools. Now, you pretty much have to be a 3.6 and above student to get a callback.

212-There is only two Georgetown lawyers in the whole New York office. One of whom graduated with honors and is a partner and the other is a very senior associate. Thus, your comment that you know someone who works there who graduated with a less 3.3 GPA is probably false.

Even assuming you are talking about the DC office, they presumably have different grade cutoffs and it seems most associates from Georgetown graduated cum laude.

So either you made the whole thing up or your friend was a lateral at the DC office.

Overall feeling at Finnegan Henderson is anxious. associates and summer associates are being screwed. we hear from the summer associates that very few got offers, and many associates are leaving (voluntarily?). Many associates complain that there is "not enough work" for them to reach the billable hours target and there is "no transparency at all" at the firm.

237 -- I'm a former FHFGD associate, and the lack of transparency is nothing new. Associates are leaving, especially in regional offices (DC has always had less turnover than the regional offices, especially compared to Cambridge and Palo Alto). Palo Alto has lost a non-equity partner (moved to another firm) and at least six associates (mostly biotech patent prosecutors) in the last three months or so. They have left for a variety of reasons -- some for other firms, some for in-house, some for clerkships, others for personal/family reasons -- but still, losing >10% of the attorneys in an office in this economy doesn't speak well of the firm generally.

It is my understanding that the firm sent a letter to all summer associates and all student associates in the class of 2010 indicating that they would not be able to make offers to all of them, that they did not know how many offers they would be able to extend or when they would be extended, and suggesting they consider other options. I don't know how that has played out since the summer, but it's typical FHFGD that they informed the summers in June, when it was far too late to register for OCIs. Classy. Mark Finnegan must be rolling over in his grave. . .

236,

I never mentioned a specific HHR office. I don't anyone who works in the NY office. I also didn't claim to be speaking about current associates. You read a lot into my post that wasn't there.

I would find it odd that the DC office would have a lower gpa cutoff than the NY office, since DC is a more competitive market than NY.

237 & 238 - when did Finnegan offers go out and in which offices?

239 -- 238 here. I have no idea whether offers have gone out at FHFGD or not.

Katten summer here. No offer. Oh well.

Can someone explain to me why apparently everyone hates Locke Lord? Where is this rep of it as a "cesspool" and shithole coming from?

Houston > New York