As we mentioned in Morning Docket, late last week the University of Massachusetts board of trustees approved the plan to convert the Southern New England School of Law into the state’s first public law school. The vote went 14 to 4. The Boston Globe reports:
“A public law program will fill a conspicuous gap in the Commonwealth’s public higher education curriculum,” said UMass president Jack Wilson. “It will give our students the public law option that exists in 44 other states. . . . This is about students and about educational opportunity. It is not about which private law school may face more competition.”
Oh please. This is not about the students. And it’s certainly not about educational opportunity — unless by “opportunity” you mean the invitation to saddle yourself with tens of thousands of dollars of debt in exchange for a degree from an unaccredited law school in the midst of the worst market for legal jobs anybody can remember.
We all know what this is about: money. Lenders have it, the state wants it, the financial future of citizens of the Commonwealth be damned.
After the jump, we don’t even have to read between the lines to see the true motives in Massachusetts.
I’m not surprised that state law makers and state educators would conspire to bilk prospective law students that don’t know any better. I am a little surprised with how bold they are with their student bilking intentions:
UMass Dartmouth chancellor Jean MacCormack had previously laid out plans that said the public law school would operate free of taxpayer dollars and eventually funnel millions into UMass Dartmouth and the state through expanded enrollment. Officials have estimated that the school would grow from 235 students to 559 by 2017.
And you’ll have jobs for those 559 graduates, right? You know, jobs, those things that make going to law school a non-economically ruinous endeavor. You’ve done the economic impact studies to show that the Massachusetts legal market can support all of the new graduates you intend to churn out?
Southern New England can’t find jobs for the 235 people it has there right now. Remember just two weeks ago we told you about a woman who was in the top half of her class who couldn’t pass the bar and is now trying to get her debts discharged through bankruptcy. You can see why the four people who tried to stop this madness voted the way they did:
Jennifer Braceras, a UMass trustee, said she voted against the proposal because it was being proposed at the wrong time with the wrong institution.
“The university is about to create a law school on the backs of an unaccredited and failing school,” Braceras said.
But from the perspective of law school administrators, “jobs” is somebody else’s problem. All they are worried about is making sure the tuition checks keep following:
The school’s primary source of revenue would come from tuition and fees, to be $23,565, nearly half the amount charged by Suffolk and New England law schools in Boston.
$23,565/year x 3 years + no job = still totally screwed. Is there a study available that shows roughly $70,000 of debt is a smart investment in this legal economy? Is there a study available that shows a significant market rebound just around the corner? Is there a study available that shows there is a community or social good provided by lawyers who start out $70,000 in the hole and have to take the highest paying job possible to pay off their loans? If Massachusetts needs more med-mal lawyers, I want to see the numbers.
In short, did Umass officials study this proposal, at all, on any metric other than “how much we can charge/how much we have to invest?”
It is against that backdrop that Umass president Jack Wilson had the gall to fix his mouth to say this proposal is all about “the students.” Yeah, Umass really cares about them. You can tell by all the research and analysis Umass has done about the legal market in the state and whether its prospective students can afford to go $70,000 into debt to be a part of it. That “screwed with your pants on” sensation is just what love feels like in Massachusetts.
UMass trustees OK a public law school [Boston Globe]
Earlier: Southern New England School of Law Prepares to Fight
Discharging Law School Debt in Bankruptcy Doesn’t Get Any Easier When You Are Old
YES!
And every chick in Boston sharted in unison…..
The new school is going to be a joke
- Western New England School of Law Secure
Fifthie!
Seriously…what are these morons thinking?!? Why are we opening up more law schools?!?
Elie, don’t be a snob. U.C. Hastings is a standalone non-ABA-accredited law school that’s part of a broader state system, and it’s graduates do okay for themselves. You can find many of them working as paralegals at prestigious personal injury firms in the California area, and others have found success in a wide variety of non-legal careers. We should give the new school the same chance.
And heck, Hastings is even getting accredited soon: http://www.uchastings.edu/site_files/newsletter/eNewsletterNov.html
“The ABA will visit Hastings early in 2008 as part of the accreditation process, and we welcome your thoughts on curriculum, faculty, student body, support services, alumni and community relations, and any other subjects related to the school.”
I think we should give SNELS the same chance. Snob.
Shameful.
The proposed tuition is $23,500 a year….hardly cheap is it? SUNY is 16k a year, and it is cheaper to attend UConn Law as a Mass resident at $17k a year.
This is really about cushy jobs for profs and administrators with fact salaries and pensions in the Umass system. Of course the trustees are going to vote for it…it would be like you and your fellow employees voting on whether they should get a pay raise and bonus. Gee…I wonder how that vote will turn out.
As for “competition”for Suffolk, NESL and the rest of the Boston schools, even with UMASS law, the law schools will all be vastly oversubscribed anyway.
A pointless waste of money. We do not need more lawyers in Mass……
6,
Hastings is already accredited. That message is regarding the RE-accreditation process. Get a clue.
- Non-Hastings 2L
Do chicks in Boston really shart that often?
can the ABA please stop this madness?? STOP ACCREDITING NEW LAW SCHOOLS
do they really NOT shart that often?
7, it ain’t that easy to get into UCONN. If I could start over, I’d sure as hell spend $23k on UMASS Law than $38k at Northeastern. Better to default on $100k in student loans than $200k in student loans.
- unemployed Northeastern motherfucking ‘07
can the ABA please stop this madness?? STOP ACCREDITING NEW LAW SCHOOLS
Only in the crazy world of sky high law school tuition could $23,500 a year in tuition look like a good deal. Well, I guess when you compare it to the $42k charged by toilets like Suffolk it looks relatively cheap!
At sticker you will still graduate from UMass law with $130k in debt…..$70k in tuition and $60k in living expenses (which is a conservative estimate)and your law degree will not be considered any different from a Suffolk, NESL or Northeastern degree.
Ok, so you will not have $190k in debt that you would graduate from Suffolk law with…..but still…it’s a heck of money.
Not to mention the fact that there are NO JOBS in Boston..or anywhere else. The market in Boston is completely saturated. These grads are in for a rude awakening.
14, it sure as hell doesn’t cost $20k/year to live in Dartmouth/New Bedford, Massachusetts, unless you are buying a house. That’s like equating COL in Buffalo with COL in NYC.
The Justice Department needs to investigate the entire legal education system which is one giant racket.
Are you kidding? This is a wonderful idea –it will create dozens of jobs for middling, quasi-talented lawyers today, the future be damned.
I am SO applying. Um, for a job.
#15- Students, most of whom will be in their early to mid 20s, are not known for being frugal. I don’t consider $1600 a month in expenses to be over the top for every single expenses incurred outside of tuition.
Heck you could go out every saturday night during the month with your friends and blow $400 a month on social alone. Chuck, in food, rent, bills, books, travel, etc….
even if you make it $12,000 a year in living expenses….which I highly doubt is doable…that is still $106k in debt…..
Quick search on internet revealed about $800 – $1000 for a 1BR in Dartmouth or New Bedford (adjacent seaside whaling-cum-textiles-cum-failing city of ~100,000 people). Soooo, unless you only shop at Whole Foods, spend too much time at nearby Westport Vineyards, or buy a BMW and a lot of recreational drugs, I just don’t see how living expenses would accrue anywhere remotely near $20,000, 7’s “conservative” estimate.
In my opinion, Obama’s green czar should promulgate a resolution foreclosing UMass from creating this school.
In my opinion, Obama’s green czar should promulgate a resolution foreclosing UMass from creating this school.
Excellent post Elie, I completely agree. The school was approved solely to “funnel millions into UMass Dartmouth and the state through expanded enrollment.” Screwing over students to fund their failing, over-entitled state.
- An Elie-hater (and Lat lover)
Eli’s an idiot. By the time the law school is up and running, and has graduates, we won’t be in this recession anymore.
Elie, you are wrong. $70k is way less than $150k. As someone who is still carrying ~$60k in law school loans from ten years ago, there is a very real difference between being in debt and not. Look at it this way: if going to a $47k/year school doesn’t guarantee you a good job and you are just going to have to hustle and potentially hang a shingle after graduating, why not pay $23k instead? If this is about being prestigious, or whether the education provided there is good enough on the merits, that is another thing, but you are wrong about the money. There will be a market for this place that is not immoral.
Mystal, do you find it hard being a walrus?
As for estimating living expenses…people have a natural tendency to underestimate them.
A good rule of them is estimate them and add 33%.
Oh, I see – 18 is a douche. If I were attending a TTTTT tier law school (5T’s since it is unaccredited), I would not be blowing $100 every weekend drinking with my buddies. I would be studying every Saturday, since I would hopefully realize that maybe 1% of the class will gain decent employment. Sorry, law school ain’t meant to be a party.
Also, there are few places to drink in Dartmouth (downtown is mostly strip malls, and the periphery is mostly farmland and zillion dollar waterfront mansions), and New Bedford, as Massachusetts goes, is a pretty dangerous place to be drinking at night. Lots of crime, lots of gangs (again, as MA goes – I’m not comparing it to Watts or Bed-Stuy, but it’s still no picnic). Plus, you always run the risk of pissing of some fisherman (New Bedford is home to the country’s largest fishing fleet), and have your ass handed to you. A couple years ago, some guy killed like five people in one of the strip clubs.
Given how low COL is in NB/Dartmouth, I would say total debt incurred would be equivalent to total debt incurred going to UCONN as a Massachusetts resident (who under the “New England Compact” get reduced tuition 1L, and in-state rates 2L and 3L).
#19.
So you get your 1 bed for $900. $100 for bills. $70 for cell phone.
And tuition does not include the fees and mandated law school med insurance…insurance will be about $2000 a year or $160 a month…..
Law books? $900 a year or $75 a month…..etc etc…
so we are already up to $1305 a month before you have bought a loaf of bread.
So before you have bought any food you only need to spend another $350 in the month to get to the $1666 a month expense limit.
Car payment? Gas? food? Social?
Unexpected expenses?
It is not difficult to see how you reach $20k a year in expenses.
30 here again. To clarify, I’m not saying one SHOULD go to UMASS Law. What I am saying is that since going to Northeastern (my alma mater), Suffolk, New England, or Western New England is an equally retarded idea, one might as well spend a lot less money on their retarded decision.
I would be thrilled if I only owe $106k ten years from now.
It’s Monday. Where is “My Job is Murder,” by Susanna Dokupil?
New Bedford is definitely not a place you want to be in at night. That tis a rough town.
A guy who grew up in Quincy.
With “prestige” being so heavily weighted in law school rankings, and higher rankings = better employment, it’s a wonder why ANY school would create an up-start law school.
How many decades would it take to gain recognition and even break into tier 2 (if ever)?
Suck it up. Get a roommate – now rent is $450/month.
Buy a used shitbox for $3 grand – believe me, there are plenty in New Bedford. That’s $83.33 for three years.
Don’t get a fucking data plan for your phone. You’ll survive. Now payment is $40/month.
No need for living expenses to be anywhere close to $20k/year. Why live it up if you are going to an unaccredited law school in an economically depressed region? 12% unemployment in Oct (1), compared to 8.9% for Massachusetts as a whole. (2)
(1) http://www.bls.gov/web/laummtrk.htm
(2) http://lmi2.detma.org/Lmi/News_release_state.asp
University of MassachuseTTTs.
36 — Um, isn’t the point of going to law school to improve your life? Yeah, I suppose your scenario is feasible, but it would also be feasible for someone with a GED and no student loan debt who works at Radio Shack.
38, that’s just what law school administrators want you to think. I honestly wish I had just a GED and no student loans and worked at Radio Shack.
- unemployed Northeastern motherfucking ‘07
All the graduates will funnel into state govt jobs as the cycle of life continues.
At least you had a chance to pay down some loans. I graduated from Northeastern sans job in 200-fucking-7, and still have no job. You should see what happened to my student loans…
39: I totally agree, I wish I had no student loans and a job at Bloomingdales. I spend my days applying to waitressing jobs on the food / bev / hosp section of craiglist. Serving tables at a fancy restaurant pays more than doc review and at least it is tax free.
you all make it sound that by having a public law school Massachusetts is making it mandatory to go. people understand that every job market is tough right now, and the fact that a lot of the posts so far that are blasting this decision are from law grads who are just pissed that there will be more competition for the jobs they are looking for doesn’t mean that a cheaper state law school is a bad thing. i think the school is a good idea, no one is being forced to go, and if people want to rack up debt then that is their decision. why is this a bid deal?
Suffolk Law school is the Bunker Hill Community College of Boston area law schools.
Its a big deal because the law schools mislead the students as to the employment opportunities. They point to the $100,000 plus salaries of a very select few to justify their yearly increases in tuition (some of which are double digit). the fact that this lawschool plans to double its student body and rake in the money shows the intent is not to help the students, but help the faculty, administrators, state, etc.
Even assuming the law profession makes some comeback, it will be a long time before we have anything resembling the heady days of the early 2000s again
I don’t get all the hate. Do you believe that you are actually in competition with graduates of an unaccredited law school? Do you really support such a paternalistic policy as preventing adults from purchasing legal education in whatever form they desire? Unless you are attending or recently attended a truly shitty law school or you are a communist, I don’t see how you could have a problem with UMass seeking revenue through an unaccredited law school.
SMU is the Harvard of Texas.
Northeastern Law School is the Suffolk Law School of Boston.
30/32 –
By no means is either Suffolk or Northeastern on the same level as NESL or WNESL. The later are shithole institutions; no explanation required. Suffolk — arguably a better law school than Northeastern — has a solid regional reputation. I’m not saying that Suffolk is on the same level as BU or BC, but it is well respected in New England, especially in Massachusetts. In terms of how many Super Lawyers it produces, Suffolk ranks 33rd nationally. I know these rankings are flawed, but still…
Let’s clarify a few things:
1. This is an EXISTING law school; they are not creating a NEW law school. Southern New England is not ABA accredited, but graduates can currently sit for the MA and CT bar. They are planning on expanding the school, but who cares — if people are willing to pay, let them. It is a little paternalistic (maybe socialist?) to think we should control the number of people entering law school.
2. Public law schools are a GOOD THING. They create lawyers that can afford to go into government/public interest work. In MA right now, there are a lot of law schools. But three of them (BC, BU, and Harvard) send most of their graduates out of state. The graduates who remain in state are joined by the other MA law school graduates, none of whom can afford to go into goverment/public interest (though some do because they can’t find anything else). For these people, a public law school may have been the best choice — who cares if Suffolk, Northeastern, and Western NE face cheaper comp.
@53
You are either a stupid person or a greedy person.
TTTTT law schools are a bad thing for both the students that take out six-figure loans without ANY hope of paying them back and the taxpayers that stand behind those loans.
What we’re really talking about is how the federal government should be investing public funds– that is, should the government be spending $150K to create an unemployable loser as opposed to doing something else with the money?
Why all the hate?
Because greed is annoying. I can handle that I flushed any chance of a normal life. I can’t handle watching people repeat the lies that sucked me in. Rot in hell, 53, you lying polluted rim of pond scum. You think you’re in good with the people doing the screwing, so it will never be your turn? Think again.
Why all the hate?
Because greed is annoying. I can handle that I flushed any chance of a normal life. I can’t handle watching people repeat the lies that sucked me in. Rot in hell, 48, 53 and all the rest, you lying polluted rim of pond scum sucking toilet water. You think you’re in good with the people doing the screwing, so it will never be your turn? Think again.
I’m on the fence about this. MA already has way too many lawyers, so adding another law school probably isn’t in the MA legal community’s best interest. If only it were a zero sum game and either WNEC or New England Law School, which may be the two worst schools in the country nevermind the state, went out of business as a result. Of course that probably won’t happen and the result will be that WNEC and NELS will just take even dumber students because they’ll be pushed down an extra rung by UMass Law School.
That said, I think it’s ridiculous that MA has gone this long without providing a public option for law school to its residents. Your choices as they now stand if you want to practice law in MA are to either leave the state to go to UConn (at a reduced but not fully in-state rate), or stay in MA and get raped by a private law school like WNEC or NESL. I think MA owes it to its residents to provide an affordable option for law school. It’s not the Commonwealth’s fault that there are already so many terrible law schools out there and they should not be punished for it. Rather, the anger should be directed at those crappy schools that charge obscenely high tuition, and offer grand promises of rewarding legal employment, only to completely abandon them once they graduate. So don’t be angry at MA. Be angry at WNEC and NELS and demand better out of them.
The proposed school IS a crappy school that charges obscenely high tuition.
52, I went to Northeastern. I have no job, and $200k in student loans. From where I stand, it is MUCH FUCKING BETTER to go to Western or Southern New England and have no job with $100-120k of student loans. They are fifteen years of payments ahead of me, assuming I can ever get a fucking job with my overpriced, overrated piece of shit fucking degree.
Unemployed Northeastern motherfucking ‘07
What is really funny/sad/ironic is that I went to stupid Top Law Schools.com, and there is actually a fucking thread of a kid debating whether to go to Northeastern or Cornell, and was leaning towards Northeastern, as were most of the commenters. Stupidity knows no bounds.
58 obviously got rejected by WNEC
- Western New England School of Law Secure
Let’s clarify a few things:
1. This is an EXISTING law school; they are not creating a NEW law school. Soutrhern New England is not ABA accredited, but graduates can currently sit for the MA and CT bar. They are planning on expanding the school, but who cares — if people are willing to pay, let them. It is a little paternalistic (maybe socialist?) to think we should control the number of people entering law school.
2. Public law schools are a GOOD THING. They create lawyers that can afford to go into government/public interest work. In MA right now, there are a lot of law schools. But three of them (BC, BU, and Harvard) send most of their graduates out of state. The graduates who remain in state are joined by the other MA law school graduates, none of whom can afford to go into goverment/public interest t(though some do because they can’t find anything else). For these people, a public law school may have been the best choice — who cares if Suffolk, Northeastern, and Western NE face cheaper comp..
59 are you speaking in absolute terms or relative terms? Because all law schools except for UC Davis (for now) charge obscenely high tuition. Relatively speaking however, the proposed school, while it will be initially “crappy,” will undoubtedly over time get a much better caliber of students than it’s private competitors because it’s tuition is so much cheaper. I anticipate UMass Law School in 5 years being below HLS, BU, BC, around the same region as Northeastern and Suffolk (but possibly better because of the lower price tag), and certainly better than WNEC and NELS. So the new law school’s tuition may be high in terms of pure dollars and cents, but at least it’s a lot cheaper than some of the private school that it will certainly pass over in the next 5 years or so.
59 are you speaking in absolute terms or relative terms? Because all law schools except for UC Davis (for now) charge obscenely high tuition. Relatively speaking however, the proposed school, while it will be initially “crappy,” will undoubtedly over time get a much better caliber of students than it’s private competitors because it’s tuition is so much cheaper. I anticipate UMass Law School in 5 years being below HLS, BU, BC, around the same region as Northeastern and Suffolk (but possibly better because of the lower price tag), and certainly better than WNEC and NELS. So the new law school’s tuition may be high in terms of pure dollars and cents, but at least it’s a lot cheaper than some of the private school that it will certainly pass over in the next 5 years or so.
59 are you speaking in absolute terms or relative terms? Because all law schools except for UC Davis (for now) charge obscenely high tuition. Relatively speaking however, the proposed school, while it will be initially “crappy,” will undoubtedly over time get a much better caliber of students than it’s private competitors because it’s tuition is so much cheaper. I anticipate UMass Law School in 5 years being below HLS, BU, BC, around the same region as Northeastern and Suffolk (but possibly better because of the lower price tag), and certainly better than WNEC and NELS. So the new law school’s tuition may be high in terms of pure dollars and cents, but at least it’s a lot cheaper than some of the private school that it will certainly pass over in the next 5 years or so.
59 are you speaking in absolute terms or relative terms? Because all law schools except for UC Davis (for now) charge obscenely high tuition. Relatively speaking however, the proposed school, while it will be initially “crappy,” will undoubtedly over time get a much better caliber of students than it’s private competitors because it’s tuition is so much cheaper. I anticipate UMass Law School in 5 years being below HLS, BU, BC, around the same region as Northeastern and Suffolk (but possibly better because of the lower price tag), and certainly better than WNEC and NELS. So the new law school’s tuition may be high in terms of pure dollars and cents, but at least it’s a lot cheaper than some of the private school that it will certainly pass over in the next 5 years or so.
61 I wouldn’t have applied to WNEC even if they offered to waive my application fee, offered me a full scholarship, and provided me with hookers and blow throughout law school. But I take it you went there without getting that kind of deal. Good decision. BTW, how you liking Springfield? You better enjoy because you’re never getting out.
61, can I get a job in Springfield?
- unemployed Northeastern motherfucking ‘07
The idiotic , myopic obsession with rankings and “prestige” is damaging to legal education. It prevents law schools from varying/experimenting with their curricula for fear of falling in the rankings, and it can dissuade students from going to a school more suited to their needs (or if they do choose a non T14 school, it will prevent them from getting a job).
2L Here, at SNESL….Just got a job in Fall River. Since you all are so smart you know about the poverty in Fall River and New Bedford. Also, I am sure you all are helping the public……No; you are writing these misrepresented stories….get a life, are you that weak? God forbid we create a school that encourages attorneys to practice in the public sector. We are so bad!
2L Here, at SNESL….Just got a job in Fall River. Since you all are so smart you know about the poverty in Fall River and New Bedford. Also, I am sure you all are helping the public……No; you are writing these misrepresented stories….get a life, are you that weak? God forbid we create a school that encourages attorneys to practice in the public sector. We are so bad!
2L Here, at SNESL….Just got a job in Fall River. Since you all are so smart you know about the poverty in Fall River and New Bedford. Also, I am sure you all are helping the public……No; you are writing these misrepresented stories….get a life, are you that weak? God forbid we create a school that encourages attorneys to practice in the public sector. We are so bad!
2L Here, at SNESL….Just got a job in Fall River. Since you all are so smart you know about the poverty in Fall River and New Bedford. Also, I am sure you all are helping the public……No; you are writing these misrepresented stories….get a life, are you that weak? God forbid we create a school that encourages attorneys to practice in the public sector. We are so bad!
2L Here, at SNESL….Just got a job in Fall River. Since you all are so smart you know about the poverty in Fall River and New Bedford. Also, I am sure you all are helping the public……No; you are writing these misrepresented stories….get a life, are you that weak? God forbid we create a school that encourages attorneys to practice in the public sector. We are so bad!
2L Here, at SNESL….Just got a job in Fall River. Since you all are so smart you know about the poverty in Fall River and New Bedford. Also, I am sure you all are helping the public……No; you are writing these misrepresented stories….get a life, are you that weak? God forbid we create a school that encourages attorneys to practice in the public sector. We are so bad!
2L Here, at SNESL….Just got a job in Fall River. Since you all are so smart you know about the poverty in Fall River and New Bedford. Also, I am sure you all are helping the public……No; you are writing these misrepresented stories….get a life, are you that weak? God forbid we create a school that encourages attorneys to practice in the public sector. We are so bad!
@63-66
Relative to the graduate’s job prospects (slim to zero) the tuition is obscenely high.
70-76
You must go to SNESL, you are too stupid to correctly post. Like an ADHD 9-year-old mashing the “post comment” button waiting for instant gratification.
@7
Not sure if this policy is still in effect, but MA residents used to get in-state tuition in CT and ME law schools because of the lack of a “public option” in MA. So the result of this effort will be that MA residents pay more for a (much) poorer quality education. This will suck for anyone from MA that would have been interested in going to a public law school, which, of course, is the opposite of what should be going on here.
Suffolk Law is the Bunker Hill Community College of Boston Law Schools- Tier 4- and only the top 1% get jobs that pay- limited to the geographic area of Boston.
90% of Suffolk Law Students can’t pronounce their “r”s.
40% of Suffolk Law Students are chubby Irish or Polish Girls
30% of Suffolk Law Students are former car salesmen.
Suffolk Law is the Cooley of Boston.
79 you’re only partly right. Mass. residents get a reduced rate at UConn and Maine, but they do not pay in-state tuition. That said, it’s fairly easy to get in-state residency in Connecticut after your first year, so you’d only be paying one-year’s worth of that reduced (but not in-state) tuition.
70-76 doesn’t know when to use semi-colons vs. commas. He has inappropriately used both in his multi-post. Congrats on living in Fall River, a city that has only lost 33% of its population since1920! Does your tenement overlook the Route 79 viaduct, the Brayton Point Coal Plant, or one of the 68 mills? Make sure you don’t get your dumb ass killed by Mara Salvatrucha or the ghost of Lizzie Borden! I’m sure you’ll find lots of paying clients in your chosen city, what with its 17% of the population living under the poverty line!
Also, Cooley is the Northeastern Law School of Detroit (or wherever it is).
William and Lee is a joke of school, and doens’t deserve to be ranked higher than eminently better law schools such as UC Davis, Hastings, Iowa, Wisconsin, Indiana or Ohio State. That is a fact!
William and Lee is a joke of school, and doens’t deserve to be ranked higher than eminently better law schools such as UC Davis, Hastings, Iowa, Wisconsin, Indiana or Ohio State. That is a fact!
Well said, 83.
60 — don’t you have coops that you can reconnect with? isn’t that the whole point of going to northeastern? how can you have multiple law school internships/jobs and not receive a full-time offer from any of them?
58, 63 = Suffolk troll….
reality check buddy: a Suffolk degree is just as worthless as a WNEC, NESL, or NU degree. There are two ways to get jobs out of any of these schools… either finish top of your class and get lucky or have solid connections and get lucky
BTW, Suffolk was demoted this year to FOURTH tier.
-Suffolk grad
87, my co-ops were at:
- state agency in hiring freeze
- federal judge who told me 1st day that he doesn’t look at NUSL for actual clerkships
- Fortune 100 company that “merged” with a Fortune 25 company; my promised job disappeared in the rubble. GC of the Fortune 100 has since died.
- mid-size law firm in a state I didn’t take the bar; firm has since dissolved
So, my ability to reconnect with coop employers is zero. Mind you, in a GOOD YEAR, only about 20% of a NUSL class gets offers (plus another 15-20% who get summer associate positions). Since each student has 4 coops, 20% offer rate = 1 out of 16 coops lead to a job.
Most of the people going to this school will not have gained admission to UConn. UConn is not a viable option for many people. WNEC, on the other hand, is, and even though it is a crap school, if you want to stay in the area, and graduate with honors, you can do fine.
55 nailed it.
88 this is 58/63. Actually I didn’t go to law school in MA because I wanted to go a state school (and did in fact). I happen to be from MA originally and my dad is still practicing law there, so I know a bit about MA law schools. I was just trying to be polite about Suffolk, because despite its inability to get its students jobs, it doesn’t turn out complete retards like WNEC and NELS. But if you really think your alma mater sucks as badly as those two schools, so be it. I won’t argue with you on that.