I hate that we have to keep talking about this farcical notion that the President of the United States, a man who has not held a mere press conference in 538 days, is somehow going to VOLUNTARILY sit down for intense questioning by a federal prosecutor. “Will the dog figure out how to pee in the toilet? Find out next week.” No! THAT’S NOT SOMETHING DOGS NATURALLY DO!
If you want a dog to pee in a toilet, you have to hold the dog over the toilet, against its will, while it tries to bite you, until some pee comes out and gets all over you but also a little bit in the toilet. Similarly, if you want Trump to talk to Mueller, you’re going to have to subpoena him, fight it out in the courts while his hand-picked Supreme Court justices try to bite you, until Trump squeals “Fifth Amendment” and doesn’t answer your questions anyway.
But, we are compelled to play this game so… From ABC:
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President Donald Trump’s attorney Rudy Giuliani tells ABC News that he believes his team will have negotiations wrapped with the special counsel regarding an interview with the president by September 1.
During a live interview on his colleague, Jay Sekulow’s radio show – Giuliani took a question from ABC News, asked if there is a deadline to respond to the special counsel.
“This should be over by September 1st. We have now given him an answer, he obviously he should take a few days to consider it, but we should get this resolved. If there is going to be an interview, let’s have it. If there’s not going to be an interview, let him write his report,” Giuliani said.
According to reports, Giuliani does not want Mueller to ask questions about Trump’s possible obstruction of justice.
And, my friends, that’s how you know this Giuliani “offer” is a fraud. Not because Mueller would never agree to ask only the questions Donald Trump wants asked (although… I don’t see any universe in which Mueller would agree to only ask the questions the president wants asked). Not because the September 1st “deadline” is an obvious media ploy. The Giuliani letter is a fake offer because talking his way out of the obstruction charge is actually the only GOOD LEGAL REASON for Trump to agree to an interview at all.
It’s a bit counterintuitive because Trump is a dumb liar with the legal instincts of Cthulhu, but I can break it down.
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- Trump thinks that he can walk in there and say “no collusion” and Mueller will have to believe him because nobody (that we know of) has directly implicated Donald Trump dealing with Russian agents. In Trump’s mind, “no personal collusion” means the end of the investigation. Arguably, he wants very much to say “no collusion” to Mueller’s face because he thinks Mueller maybe hasn’t heard him say that yet?
- But what Trump continually fails to understand is that the investigation is into Russian interference in our election and whether the Trump campaign had anything to do with it. Trump could have directed it, but he also could have honestly not known what his campaign operatives were doing in his name. Or the campaign could have been “unwitting” conspirators. Either way, Trump’s “no collusion” mantra is just one data point. Even if Mueller believes Trump, that doesn’t make the investigation go away.
- As if it wasn’t already pretty obvious, Donald Trump Jr. and Paul Manafort seem like the most likely suspects for direct collusion. There’s a reason Mueller wants to interview Trump and hasn’t tried to interview Jr. yet. Mueller probably wants to see if Trump will take the fall for Jr., or — much more likely — throw Jr. under the bus to save his presidency.
- On the potential obstruction of justice, however, Mueller already has pretty much every thing he needs. Trump has all but admitted to trying to obstruct the investigation, multiple times, across multiple platforms. The only thing Mueller wants on that inquiry is to offer Trump a chance to explain himself.
- The question won’t exactly come out his way, but essentially Mueller needs to ask Trump: “Were you intentionally trying to obstruct justice, or are you just too stupid to know what you are doing?” And Trump’s answer to that is, kinda, relevant. Since what’s likely to happen is that Mueller merely issues a “report” on this, rather than actually trying to charge the sitting president himself, Trump’s level of idiocy is pretty important.
Thus, “obstruction” is the only thing Trump can really talk himself out of. The thing that he has already admitted to doing is also the thing where his intent probably is the most relevant. The only legal reason to sit down with Mueller is so Trump can say, “I am a very dumb man who didn’t know what ‘obstruction of justice’ meant. Sorry, it won’t happen again.”
Giuliani suggesting that Trump is willing to talk about everything other than obstruction entirely misses the point of the interview.
An interview that is never going to happen anyway. Jesus Christ. I just spent 800 words breaking down an interview that is NEVER GOING TO HAPPEN. The fuq, man? I’m going to eat until I forget.
Giuliani: Negotiations with Mueller over Trump interview will be over by September 1 [ABC]
Elie Mystal is the Executive Editor of Above the Law and the Legal Editor for More Perfect. He can be reached @ElieNYC on Twitter, or at [email protected]. He will resist.