Lunch.jpgSome lawyers love what they do. Those who don’t are vocal about how much they hate their jobs. So what would the naysayers prefer to be doing professionally? Above the Law editors have heard these “dream careers” tossed around: government intelligence analyst, writer/journalist, banker (so they can keep making the bank), and — for those who want to stay in the law, but not Biglaw — assistant U.S. attorney, judge, or law school professor.

Some people are content to stay in the law but need a creative/fun outlet. It’s an added bonus if that outlet also makes money. One such endeavor is to open a restaurant. (The belief that most restaurants fail in the first year is a myth, after all.)

We’ve written before about lawyer-turned-Subway entrepreneur Larry Feldman. But being king of a sandwich-shop franchise is not really the glamorous side of food service. The daydream version involves starting up a place with a bit more character.

For some, being laid off has been a push to tap into a culinary side. Here in New York, a first-year associate caught up in law firm layoffs used the opportunity to open a Taiwanese steamed bun cafe in the Lower East Side, called Baohaus.

Further south, in Washington, D.C., another casualty of the recession layoffs got into the eat-out business. Julie Liu, a former Katten Muchin associate, launched a restaurant in Dupont Circle last year named Scion. She was very thankful to Katten for her three-month severance: it “basically paid for Scion’s kitchen equipment.”

We caught up with Liu about opening a restaurant with her sister, and got some advice for other wannabe restaurateurs.


LIU_Julie_2007_Color.jpgLiu is a Northwestern law grad and former Teach for America teacher. She spent almost two years in Katten’s Chicago office. After being laid off last year, she moved to D.C. and opened the restaurant with her sister in June 2009. Liu originally planned to return to Biglaw but wound up landing a job at the Department of Education, so now she’s in D.C. (and the restaurant biz) for good.

ATL: How would you describe Scion?
We are a family-owned, neighborhood restaurant that serves great food and drinks. We aim to be affordable so that both my Teach for America friends and my Biglaw friends can enjoy a good meal at Scion. Our menu ranges from a diverse selection of appetizers to $9 burgers/paninis to $25 Buffalo Osso Bucco. We have the same goals for our cocktails and beers. There are fancy options and affordable options.

The long-term goal is to be a place where people want to come back over and over again because of the delicious food and great drinks and don’t feel like it would break the bank.

ATL: You’re working at the Department of Education and running the restaurant? How do you balance the two?
Resilience; and being ok with the fact that I’m pretty much tired all the time.
Actually, Joanne (my sister) is basically a machine, so essentially my role is to cover her on certain nights and weekends so that she can get some sleep or attempt to have a life. Joanne went all in for Scion Restaurant. She gave up her previous career completely and handles the bulk of the work and stress that comes with opening a new restaurant. She’s a CPA, so she handles all of the business and finance issues. She also is a total foodie and follows the food and wine industries very closely, so she works with the chef to create the menu and works with the bar manager on the beers and cocktails…

Joanne and I grew up in a restaurant family, which established our lack of need for sleep and ridiculous work ethic. I initially applied it towards academics (UVA then Northwestern Law) and then towards my initial careers (Teach for America and Biglaw at Katten Chicago). Now, I apply it towards Scion Restaurant, and words cannot describe how much more rewarding, motivating and fulfilling it is to see your efforts go towards your own small business. And to do it all with my sister by my side (and my parents very involved) has been an incredible experience.

When I first moved to D.C., I was offered a Biglaw job, a mid-size firm job (approx. 50 attorneys), and a job at ED (Department of Education). After less than 2 years in Biglaw, I was torn about leaving so soon, but that was mostly motivated by the fact that I still owe $175K in student loans to NU Law and not because I wanted to be a Biglaw attorney. What I realized is that if I could find a legal job that still allowed me to work on Scion Restaurant, it’d be an ideal situation. ED was the perfect solution, and I started chasing the elusive work/life balance and the myth I’ve heard that you can love what you do.

ATL: How’s running a business with your sister?
Joanne is really the brains and heart behind this entire project. She has an intense passion for the restaurant industry and often kids that I’m just her junior associate. We are each other’s #1 fan, but also each other’s toughest critic. We never hesitate to speak our minds and don’t hold back on our verbal spats. Growing up in a restaurant family helped because we learned that during intense moments, things get heated, but at the end of service, you have to let it go. We are constantly communicating (and not always kindly) and never hold grudges or go to bed without settling an issue. Sure, we can annoy each other, but we both agree that there is no one else we’d want to be in the trenches with for Scion Restaurant.

ATL: What’s your favorite part about it?
My favorite part is definitely meeting the customers. Biglaw was not the environment for me. After teaching in the inner city and going to a very social law school, suddenly I was thrown into a situation where I felt very isolated. I completed assignments for hours on end sitting in an office that became very lonely. Yes, I got client interaction, but that’s never the same as getting to know people on a personal level. I felt my personality starting to shrivel away and my usual social outlets had to be sacrificed for the Biglaw hours. As every Biglaw associate knows, we’re anxious when we’re not busy billing hours and we’re exhausted when we are billing hours. A work/life balance or happy medium was impossible. In Biglaw, I began to lose a bit of my enthusiasm and spirit. I’m an extrovert and get much of my energy from interacting with other people. I missed that a lot and it’s a wonderful feeling to have it back.

ATL: Does the legal background help?
The legal background is a huge asset. My major role is to review restaurant contracts and documents and apply for licensing and certifications. My legal training makes it easy to figure out all the steps in the process and most importantly, allows me to complete all the necessary tasks without feeling overwhelmed with all the details. We also have hired legal counsel who has extensive experience in the restaurant industry, but he bills minimal hours and simply points me in the right direction. From there, I can handle the drafting and filing for most of our paperwork.

On a social level, the legal background also helps because people love discussing my Biglaw experience and how I balance a day job along with Scion. It’s a great topic of conversation when I’m working the floor of the restaurant. It also helps when I’m tapping into the Northwestern Law alumni network to set up happy hours, summer associate lunches and firm social events.

ATL: Any tips for lawyers who want to open their own restaurant?
This is a tough question to answer because so much of what we’ve learned about the restaurant industry has come from growing up in our parents’ restaurant. Opening a restaurant is definitely an experience where you’re learning something new every day. In the past six months, I’ve learned more about kitchen equipment, linen pricing and the various kinds of mixed greens than I could have ever hoped to learn.

My first tip is that anyone who wants to open a restaurant must be committed for the long haul and know that there will be a lot of sacrifice in your social life and finances before you’re “living the dream.” Joanne likes to kid that many of her friends are having babies and she decided to give birth to a restaurant. She loses about the same amount of sleep, if not more, and is stuck with it through the good times and bad. Of course, we hope Scion will be profitable sooner than a child would be, but we still have to love it unconditionally while it hasn’t yet given back to us.

My second tip is that as with anything I do in life, you have to have a sense of humor. There’s just nothing you can do when someone sends a dish back because their dog won’t like the leftovers, pukes in your flowers, or bashes you on yelp.com because your cheesecake didn’t taste like what their Mom used to make. Not every dish will come out perfectly and not every customer will love us. We give 110% and want everyone to leave happy, but when things go wrong, you can only laugh about it, support each other and trust that tomorrow is another day.

My final tip is to be flexible. The restaurant industry is unpredictable. You have to be willing to adapt to whatever is thrown at you and survive. We can never tell whether a week will be busy or slow, yet we still have to prepare the right amount of inventory and staff for every shift. I love meetings and agendas and plans of action, but the reality is that everything will not always go according to schedule in a restaurant. Preparation is essential in running a restaurant, but the key to success is being good under pressure and knowing how to handle things when everything goes wrong.

Earlier: Career Alternatives for Attorneys: Entrepreneur / Small (or Not So Small) Business Owner

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  1. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 11:08 AM

    you are not firsty, not ever so firsty

  2. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 11:12 AM

    MOAR KASH

  3. Posted by Affirmative Walrus | January 26, 2010 at 11:14 AM

    Saw picture, not guilty.

  4. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 11:14 AM

    http://abovethelaw.com/2010/01/tamale_maker_nancy_andrade.php
    Generalizing from a data set of two, I am going to assume that all former Katten associates go in the food business.

  5. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 11:15 AM

    Redass Lobster franchises always do well.

  6. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 11:27 AM

    Should have gone to the French Culinary Institute instead of that TTT Northwestern.

  7. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 11:38 AM

    Nice spelling on the title.

  8. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 11:40 AM

    Former government intelligence analyst, current junior associate here. Law = much better. Kick that dream to the curb immediately

  9. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 11:42 AM

    I just don’t understand the lack of homosexual content.

  10. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 11:47 AM

    I’ve eaten at Scion a few times. They have a great beer selection and delicious food. Way to go, Julie!

  11. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 11:47 AM

    Shut up, 9. Your incessant gay comments are much more annoying than any perceived gay slant on this website could ever be.

  12. Posted by Partner Emeritus | January 26, 2010 at 11:48 AM

    Pactitioner’s tip: You don’t need a law degree to open a restaurant in DC or a brothel in Brazil. Skip the $150k of student loans and spare yourself of the embarrassment of obtaining a JD from a non-peer institute. You’ll enjoy life more than your failed counterparts in law school who are paying a handsome sum to hear a monotone oaf being put out to pasture. That is all.

  13. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 11:55 AM

    Spoiled laid off bastards. I’ll never eat at Scion now, knowing it comes from blood money.
    Law firm attorneys may be unemployed but gov’t attorneys will slave forever.

  14. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 11:55 AM

    11=gay muslim

  15. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 11:56 AM

    Julie here – thanks for the shout-out ATL. D.C. readers – come to Scion tonight and tomorrow! We’re doing “DINE OUT FOR HAITI.” 20% of all food sales will be donated to American Red Cross, Partners in Health or the U.N. World Food Programme (diner choice). Yes, this is a shameless plug, but we’d appreciate your contribution to disaster relief in Haiti. http://www.scionrestaurant.com/Events.html Thanks!

  16. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 11:58 AM

    Whoa, Scion is owned by a Biglaw ex-pat? I don’t believe it – their burgers are too good to be made by a corporate floozy.

  17. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 12:01 PM

    this sounds like a surefire way to blow all your savings. the restaurant industry has huge failure rates and low profitability. pass.

  18. Posted by SarahSmile | January 26, 2010 at 12:04 PM

    Restaurateur? tee hee! More like “would you like fries with that?”

  19. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 12:04 PM

    it’a “making bank” not “making the bank.”

  20. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 12:05 PM

    17 – savings. good one.

  21. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 12:07 PM

    Good for them! Will check out Scion.

  22. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 12:08 PM

    20 – or your severance money, if you prefer.

  23. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 12:14 PM

    I didn’t know Scion was owned by a Big-Law casualty… Good for her. Food is really good- especially the fried pickles.

  24. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 12:17 PM

    It didn’t work for Michael Clayton…

  25. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 12:19 PM

    15/Julie – HUGE nistake posting as a “guest” commenter. Now anyone can impersonate you. I predict that within a few posts someone will pretend to be you in a follow-up, and offer free open bar from 6-8 pm to further promote your haiti event. Sheesh, this could be expensive mistake!

  26. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 12:23 PM

    WHOAH! 20% OF ALL SALES!?! Usually people just do 20% of all PROFIT! Does your sister know about this? 20% of sales is actually pretty generous. Say, are you doing any happy hour drink specials or promotions? Perhaps some free sliders or drinks?

  27. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 12:24 PM

    Kash
    This post is very selfish of you. You should have given this story to Elie. He could have scored free samples. You know how much he likes to eat.

  28. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 12:35 PM

    As someone else mentioned, she is far from the first Katten associate to do this – way back in the 80’s, a couple of Katten associates in Chicago left and started an Italian restaurant, which actually turned out to be quite successful – two guys, one was Larry and I forget the other guy’s name. Larry was always a total gem, not at all cut out for law firm life.

  29. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 12:36 PM

    my parents are in the restaurant business and made me swear I never would be–high chance of failure, super crazy hours–biglaw hours may suck just as much, but generally you make more $

  30. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 12:37 PM

    To be a great restaurateur, you need to know how to run a good restaurat. It is not just being able to know how to cook restaurat style dishes. There is a certain level of knowledge that is required to properly run a restaurat. You need to know how to deal with distibutors, how to balance waites and batenders. It’s a lot of work, running a restaurat. I would think anyway. Not being in the restaurat business.

  31. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 12:39 PM

    pussy pass?

  32. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 12:40 PM

    checked out their menu–nice food and fabulous beer list

  33. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 12:41 PM
  34. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 12:42 PM
  35. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 12:42 PM

    checked out the menu on the site–food looks good and great beer list

  36. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 12:55 PM

    congratulations…you will be a success no matter what you do because you know yourself and are true to yourself.

  37. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 12:55 PM

    congratulations…you will be a success no matter what you do because you know yourself and are true to yourself.

  38. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 1:02 PM

    Great Article. It’s amazing how many people hate on somebody who is living their dream. Pathetic.

  39. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 1:23 PM

    Honestly – who cares?

  40. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 1:32 PM

    A good alternative for lawyers is to see how many times they can run across a crowded freeway without getting hit. Lawyers are scum. They should all be put out of business.

  41. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 1:36 PM

    U.N. World Food Programme? Is that an option for diners who want to make sure Kofi Jr. has the newest Mercedes?

  42. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 1:36 PM

    40= Laid of Lathamite who doesnt have enough money to keep up with his bar dues.

  43. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 1:37 PM

    30 FTW

  44. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 1:39 PM

    Interesting article!! Career alternatives in this down market is something to really think about. I wrote an article about that same topic here http://thelawstreetjournal.com/1l-2l/what-can-i-do-with-my-law-degree-besides-be-a-lawyer/
    Thanks for the great conversation topic.

  45. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 1:44 PM

    44…. no.

  46. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 1:47 PM

    36-37 = fortune cookie writer for Scion.

  47. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 1:51 PM

    46! I was thinking the EXACT same thing… ha, ha, ha…

  48. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 3:46 PM

    Attorneys would make excellent test subjects for a dildo manufacturer. Taking up the ass is what all attorneys deserve, so why not allow a business to use that to it’s advantage.

  49. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 4:08 PM

    You should pay to have your food professionally photographed. It makes a big difference.

  50. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 5:24 PM

    Yes it is true most restaurants don’t fail in the first year. Most restaurants don’t fail until year 4, after they have wiped out their owner’s savings and put them even further in debt with business loans.

  51. Posted by guest | January 26, 2010 at 7:46 PM

    Do they do “Katten Pussy pass” martinis???

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