The administration at the University of Idaho, College of Law, is dealing with a spate of hate inspired incidents. The news coming out from Idaho is all fairly grotesque; federal authorities have been alerted to the potentially dangerous problems on campus.
In an email to all Idaho law students, associate dean Elizabeth Brandt explains that the problems started in August:
Dear Students,
I am writing to give you the details of a series of events that have occurred in the law building since last August.
The first incident occurred shortly before school started in August. At that time, students discovered that someone had gouged out the eyes of a student in a photo posted on the ACLU bulletin board next to the elevator on the ground floor near the café. The person whose picture was defaced is an LGBT rights and ACLU activist. At the time, we believed that this might be a prank, but that it also might be malicious. Dean Albertson-Ploucha and I sent an email at the time letting you know that items on the ACLU bulletin board had been defaced, cautioning that such conduct was unprofessional, threatening and potentially illegal, and encouraging support for the diverse law school community.
As we understand it, there is no evidence that the tasteless acts were committed by Idaho law students.
But sadly, whoever is frightening the community didn’t stop in August …
The cowards menacing Idaho College of Law are not all that creative:
About three weeks ago, straight pins were stuck into the eyes of two other students (both ACLU activist, and one also an LGBT rights activist) in photographs on the same bulletin board. Given the similarity of the two events, we believed they may be linked. Dean Burnet, Dean Albertson-Ploucha and I met with the ACLU and outLaw leaders. Dean Burnett sent a strongly worded email to the entire law school community. In addition, the ACLU and outLaw students received permission for the lobby display advocating a supportive and inclusive community at the law school. Finally, students began working with the Diversity Committee and the Climate Committee to plan a College wide diversity training in the fall semester 2010.
On Tuesday morning, five 8.5×11 computer printed flyers were posted on three bulletin boards in the building – the outLaw board across from Room 108, The ACLU board next to the elevator near the café and the general bulletin board in the stairwell leading from the café. These posters expressed threats toward gays and lesbians including quoting individuals advocating violence against gays and lesbians. In addition the posters portrayed these views as those of the LDS Church and other Christians including Catholics, and implied that that the root of anti-gay sentiment and violence around the world could be found in the actions of the LDS Church. No similar flyers have been reported in any other location on campus. In light of the location of most of the postings the timing (just a week after the dean’s email), the flyers seem to be linked to the prior incidents of defacement.
This doesn’t sound to me like the kind of thing “diversity training” is supposed to handle. We’re not talking about somebody who “tried to be clever” and ended up sounding like John Mayer. We’re talking about assholes threatening to stab out people’s eyes. If these are Idaho law students committing these acts, then it seems like the only people who need diversity training are the people in Idaho’s admission’s office. They need to do a better job screening out the deranged from their applicant pool.
If the people are from outside the law school community, then Idaho needs to learn a little something about campus security. According to associate Dean Brandt, the administration is on it:
In response to the last incident, Campus Risk Management was alerted. Through risk management, local law enforcement was also alerted. A disclosure under the federal Clery Act (requiring disclosure of possible hate crimes to the campus community) was made on Thursday through Risk Management. We also have been working with the UI Human Rights Enforcement Officer and the UI Office of Diversity and Community. On Tuesday student leaders met with me, [Redacted] to discuss the situation. I also met with students on Wednesday to update them on our response.
We will work to ensure that, after break, Dean Burnett and/or other faculty will meet with all students. We are still working out the logistics of how to accomplish these meetings. During spring break Ryan Bertalotto of the Risk Management office and Dave Lehmitz of the Moscow Police will be conducting a security audit of our building and will make recommendations to us to improve safety in the building. Finally, we will continue with renewed urgency to plan a school-wide diversity training for next fall. We are planning Safe Zone training for faculty and staff after spring break and will work with the SBA leaders to make such training available for students also. …
In the meantime, please be conscious of security. Do not prop doors open after hours. Alert the office is you observe anything out of the ordinary during regular school hours. If you observe anything unusual after hours or see anyone defacing items on any bulletin board in the building, please alert campus police by calling 911. And remember – our care and support for each other are the best security we can have.
You really hope that the people who are doing this are random, toothless yokels who dragged their knuckles all the way to the College of Law looking for fresh road kill and water. If the perpetrators are actual law students, I think Idaho has a moral obligation to try to find these people — before they leave school with a J.D. and clean character and fitness marks.
Stay safe, Idaho friends.
FIRST
In almost every case, the perpetrators of these acts are people sympathetic to the would-be victims themselves. In fact, they are often faculty or student leaders who are activists on behalf of the cause being attacked but they just can’t help themselves. After all, the media response is just too easy to obtain. They enjoy the spotlight that comes from massive media coverage. Keep an eye on this. If there is a legitimate ingestigation, I bet it will bear similar fruit. And I hope you will tell us about that too.
“But sadly, whomever is frightening the community didn’t stop in August …”
Elie, you write for a living. It’s whoever, not whomever. Come on.
This post could have been 90% shorter.
All you’re reporting is that at some school nobody’s heard of, somebody (or some people) have done a few pretty harmless things like defacing posters, sprinkled with lots of action phrase like “safe zone” and “diversity training” and “security audit.” There is no proof of identity or intent — the most recent poster about Mormons could have been put up by an anti-LDS person trying to smear the church, for all you know. It wouldn’t be the first time a student claiming to be the victim of a hate crime turned out to have faked the whole thing.
Lat did it.
This would never happen in Moscow…
Okay, seriously though, please stop making northeasterners come across as elitist pr*cks, elie. Can’t you ever write about a midwest, southern, or rura western state without invoking cruel stereotypes of the general population? I am a lib who grew up in mass, and it pains me to realize that the conservative complants about elitist hypocrite ibs all too often come from arrogant northeasterners. Seriously, does your attitude help in the greater fight againt other forms of ignorance, such as racism? One more thing, I am a centrist lib who loves the 2nd amendment. Stop bashing that, too, please. Tyia.
The part I don’t get:
“In addition the posters portrayed these views as those of the LDS Church and other Christians including Catholics, and implied that that the root of anti-gay sentiment and violence around the world could be found in the actions of the LDS Church.”
Why would someone simultaneously threaten LGBTs and then talk about how the root of anti-gay sentiment stems from the LDS church? It sounds too scripted. If it were an anti-LGBT zealot who is religiously driven, one would think he or she would merely talk about it coming from God or nature, not from a singular institution.
From the sound of it, the posters were probably put up by anti LDS folks. Its just a little too over the top to have been otherwise. “PLEASE NOTE THIS WAS DONE BY THE LDS AND IS SUPPORTED BY THE LDS. PLEASE DIRECT ALL ANGRY RESPONSES TO THE LDS”
Why is everyone so mean to the gays?
“You really hope that the people who are doing this are random, toothless yokels who dragged their knuckles all the way to the College of Law looking for fresh road kill and water. ”
Nice stereotyping, you ignorant whatchamacallit. Your ignorant profiling of the general populace in idaho is no more forgivable than [insert racial ignorance here]
These things never happened when Kagan was dean.
- Nostalgic HLS Stud
This would never happen at SMU.
I suppose I should know the answer to this, but is the University of Idaho College of Law accredited by the American Bar Association and a member in good standing of the Association of American Law Schools?
Well, their sports teams are the Vandals.
I didn’t think I was stereotyping people from Idaho. I thought I was stereotyping people from Idaho who put up hate posters.
I think I would have made a similar joke if I was talking about a law school in update NY that potentially had people from outside the community spamming campus with hate messages. If it happened in Manhattan, I would have gone with slightly different language to describe the dimwitted, but it would have been the same general point.
–Elie
You can take the spuds outta the dirt, but you can’t take the dirt outta the spuds…
I like to draw penises on poster people all the time. Does that mean I hate women because I draw penises on them, implying they should be men instead?
YES! All hail the lucky ones!
“At that time, students discovered that someone had gouged out the eyes of a student.”
That would be a horrible, hateful crime and a major issue and a terrible thing for a law school to deal with.
“At that time, students discovered that someone had gouged out the eyes of a student in a photo posted on the ACLU bulletin board next to the elevator on the ground floor near the café.”
This, on the other hand, happens in most elementary schools every day.
Punish the vandals with potatoes.
What a bunch of pussies. A little eye gouging never hurt anyone.
Most likely sequence of events is: (1) someone pokes holes out of eyes of person on poster, (2) Idaho law faculty overreacts to offended student and needlessly invokes the person’s status as LGBT and ACLU activist by claiming the action was “potentially illegal” in email to whole campus, (3) students sympathetic to LGBT/ACLU cause decide to latch onto the easy reaction by faking similar acts, while unsubtly trying to paint opponents as religiously motivated bigots.
Elie, so if it had been at cornell you would have written “hopefull the people that did this are random hemp wearing hippies who dragged their didgeridoos all the way across campus in search of patchouli and soyjow bars.”
That’s creepy.
When I was at Berkeley, the Federalist Society bulletin board (which was located in the underbelly of the building) was routinely defaced and vandalized. I am quite certain that the assh_oles who committed these crimes left Boalt with “clean character and fitness marks.” The commentary on this site is lame.
2 is right, this (potentially fake) stuff happens often, see the professor who vandalized her own car at Claremont McKenna, or the Columbia professor who put up the noose on her door, why does it happen?:
1) Chances of getting caught are quite low (notwithstanding the examples above)
2) Easy way to get the campus united in favor of whatever targeted group, or in some cases personal gain (see Daisy Lundy at UVA a few years ago)
3) Even if you get caught in many cases the punishment is a slap on the wrist and the campus is still united as the facts don’t matter but rather the narrative, and it is further evidence that “hate” is a problem if students/professors feel discriminated to the point that they do something so desperate.
25, of course we should ignore the actual facts if they don’t fit within the narrative. Reality has an anti-liberal bias.
“Nice stereotyping, you ignorant whatchamacallit. Your ignorant profiling of the general populace in idaho is no more forgivable than [insert racial ignorance here]”
No, stereotyping would have been to say something like, “but what do you expect — it’s Idaho!” Instead, Elie said he hopes the predator is some crazy deranged toothless person. If in YOUR mind, this is the same thing as indicting all Idahoans, I’d say you’re the one with stereotyping problems.
So, if someone writes “I hate gays” on a bathroom wall in the law school, are we to contact the Moscow Police (I thought the KGB handled thought crime?) and put the school on lockdown? This strikes me as much ado about nothing. Certainly nothing that would make a gay person fear for his life.
This post could have been a lot shorter. It took me so long to see what was going on that I gave up. What happened?
I love it when the liberals support the Freedom of Speech only when they agree with it, yet when you try to speak about something they do not agree with, it’s wrong.
I don’t support a hate-filled life or such actions, but it is only fair to let them speak.
I just wonder what would happen if I sponsored a straight-pride march? It seems that a gay-pride march is ok, but if my idea were put into action, the supporters would be called nazis, biggots, and homophobics.
Ironically, a “phobia” is a fear of something. Most anti-gay people hate gays, not fear them. So calling them homophobic is misleading.
Straight, white, and solo secure.
You have got to be kidding me. I was hoping, very sincerely, that this was a bad joke from Elie, but he is actually being serious.
My three year old used a pen to scratch out the eyes of some people in pictures this morning. I am going to call social services and have the child committed for this “fairly grotesque” act…
Elie, this is a new low for you. Don’t take solace that some hyper-sensitive ACLU kid from Idaho managed to convince his/her school’s administrators to overreact…
Big Deal. Stuff like this happens all the time at BYU. Of course, it is sanctioned by the mormon church there.
32,
nice example of 8’s argument
The flyers referencing LDS probably are not the work of the anti-LGBT bigots. I’d like to see the actual content of the flyers to be sure, but my guess is that they don’t even imply that the creator intended to express an anti-LGBT viewpoint, but instead sought to expose fanatical attitudes of the opposition.
The rest of the story is sad, but not necessarily indicative of anti-LGBT behavior. I would wait to see what additional facts are brought to light before jumping to conclusions.
33 – what a white and delightsome comment
Why is everyone afraid of a little sodomy? Its nothing to be scared of.
-Gomorrah
This would have never happened at UPenn/Dickinson
I’m not sure what happened but, as many of commenters above noted, the story seems quite a bit more complex than “hate abounds” at this law school.
Elie, look, I’ve got your back. I appreciate your often-obscure pop culture throwbacks and think you have a funny sense of humor and a keen nose for detecting BS, but I am frequently disappointed that you seem to turn off your otherwise-omnipresent skepticism whenever events or arguments are consistent with your personal worldview.
In a post this long, I was disappointed that you rolled right by the supposedly anti-gay pamphleteering explicitly supporting violence against gays (seriously, who genuinely does that?) that included the suggestion that “the root of anti-gay sentiment and violence around the world could be found in the actions of the LDS Church,” without questioning whether at least some of this was a set-up. Just sayin’.
38
where did you serve your mission?
39 – L, G, B, or T?
I think that taking the fear level way high because of what is highly likely to be juvenile activity (um, the acts, not the age of the people doing it) does more damage than the defacement itself.
I mean if someone drew fangs on a Federalist Society member on a poster, would the whole campus be on a wooden-stake alert?
If I was the person whose image was defaced, I would be upset. But other people are supposed to be thinking more clearly.
Idaho is full of rednecks. I was in Boise recently and saw the best it had to offer. Unimpressed.
Although the natural beauty is breathtaking.
35,
Go back 150 years in the history of most any organization (including all branches of the US government, most all Christian churches that were around) and you are going to find some historical tidbits that seem screwed up under today’s standards and that took a long time to correct. That doesn’t mean that the institutions haven’t corrected their courses.
You just take comfort in trying to make them seem presently bigoted because it justifies your own bigotry and lack of concern for the truth. If you honestly think that BYU is a hate filled campus, you are beyond reason. Of course, so was the idiot that wrote these flyers. Correlation?
I don’t even know how to respond to Elie anymore, but I will try.
1) When is defacing a poster such a horrible act? I am sure that Elie was very pissed when posters or images of Bush were defaced / destroyed. Wait, that’s wrong — I’m sure he interpreted that as an act of free speech.
2) Elie – your response to the comment was pathetic. What if this happened in a predominantly black area / city? Would you hope that it was a bunch of ***** with no education who just left the basketball court on their way to mug someone? No, I doubt that you would do that because it would be wrong and unfair to that community. Your comments about Iowa is the same. The description of “toothless, yokels who dragged their knuckles” is obviously a racist reference to poor white people in Iowa. Get a life jackass.
I don’t even know how to respond to Elie anymore, but I will try.
1) When is defacing a poster such a horrible act? I am sure that Elie was very pissed when posters or images of Bush were defaced / destroyed. Wait, that’s wrong — I’m sure he interpreted that as an act of free speech.
2) Elie – your response to the comment was pathetic. What if this happened in a predominantly black area / city? Would you hope that it was a bunch of ***** with no education who just left the basketball court on their way to mug someone? No, I doubt that you would do that because it would be wrong and unfair to that community. Your comments about Iowa is the same. The description of “toothless, yokels who dragged their knuckles” is obviously a racist reference to poor white people in Iowa. Get a life jackass.
funny how the result of this post is lots of hate to mormons
46 – its sad actually
43,
Don’t bunch up your garmies. I am not trying to keep you from the (in)celestial kingdom. Good luck on your path to become the prophet, seer, and revelator. In the meantime, keep on sending your money to SLC. The city creek project is already 2.5B over budget. Need more tithings from mindless drones.
Have a great day!
Mormons = TTT
DId this get posted on Drudge or something? Is there a class in LDS schools about blaming bias speech on the purported victim of that speech?
Hmm… maybe Prop 8 was actually supported by the LGBT community as a way to raise awareness of the plight of gay people.
Why is it that liberals are so incapable of spotting these obvious fake “hate crime” attempts?
After the first dozen times they’ve been fooled, you would think they would develop a better sense of credulity. But no, to these left wing idiots it’s a perfectly reasonable for example story for a KKK member to sneak into bowels an ivy league campus to hang a noose on a social science professors door. Yes, makes perfect sense.
Get a clue morons. This is fake, like the last hundred times a hate hoax happen on a university campus and the next hundred times will be too. It’s only the journalists who are too dumb to realize when it happens and too biased to correct it when the rest of the world figures it out.
48
yup, those mormons sure are mindless…
keep it classy
Speaking of Mormons – has the church lost its tax exempt status yet?
Just checking.
27 – you must be a legacy admit, at cooley. The word “yoke” does in fact have a definition, and clearly elie was making ignorant jokes at the expense of rural idahoans (let’s be honest, most idahoans are rurally situated).
Law students in Idaho are the biggest bunch of pussies if they are walking around campus scared out of their minds because someone removed the eyes from a POSTER.
52nd to say this is obviously a fake perpetrated either by the supposed victims themselves or people sympathetic to their issues. Yes there may be lots of gay haters in Idaho but it is highly unlikely that they go to the law school and are willing to gamble their good name and future by doing things like this even as a bad prank.
of course Mystal is quick to sensationalize this as motivated by “hate.” A lot of people — especially people in Idaho — really dislike the ACLU.
And even if this was a real “hate” crime it is still slanderous for Elie to post his rediculous headline that hate “abounds” at Idaho law. There is simply no proof that this was anything more than an isolated case of a single perpetrator trying to cause some trouble, if even that.
44 nailed it.
LOL @ lawyers and law students. Just LOL.
Simple rule for whoever/whomever. Substitute he him. If he is grammatical, go with whoever. If him is grammatical, go with whomever.
For example:
But sadly, him is frightening the community – wrong, so not whomever
But sadly, he is frightening the community – right, so whoever
21 seems to have it right.
44 its Idaho not Iowa… don’t worry Elie needs an Atlas to tell them apart too
21 seems to have it right.
Elie, do you actually think that putting a hole in the poster is a threat to gauge out someone’s eyes? Really? I hope you realize that, sometimes, people use the images of others as symbolism.
Maybe Elie thinks that a picture captures the soul of the person.
lock down all yearbook signings! Some kids drew mean pictures on other kids’ faces!
So its all a Big Liberal Conspiracy? Really?
Please.
there is no doubt in my mind that this is another campus hate crime hoax. we’ve seen dozens of these over the past few years including one at UCSD just a couple weeks ago.
http://www.originaldissent.com/forums/showthread.php?14752-Diversity-Is-Strength!-It%92s-Also%85The-Incredible-UCSD-Hate-Crime-Hoax
68 – nice link to a web site subtitled “A Symposium for the Anglo-European Common Man”.
67,
no idiot, its probably just one or two stupid kids. Get over it.
49
lol
“Hate abounds at Above the Law, and in the legal profession generally.”
How about a story about all the racism and antisemitsm here and over on xoxohth.com? Tie it together with the diversity numbers at top law firms. How is that any different than this “headline”? Do you dismiss the atl comments as jokes? Why? How to you distinguish between your reader comments, and the comments on a u idaho board? Also, if you think the school has a duty to act, do you have a duty to check ip logs for racist comments on atl, and report the ones that come from .edu addresses, to keep these people from sneaking past c&f?? Do tell.
Quit being so mean to Elie. He can’t help it. After all, he has the mark of cain.
68, I read that same story in “Delusional Straight White Men Paranoid About the Changing Power Structure Monthly” but I let my subscription expire.
* Parents in Las Vegas don’t want their children to perform a version of Rent as a school play. You live in Las Vegas and you’re worried about what a Bohemian musical is going to do to your kids? That’s like living in Mississippi and wondering if Jackass: The Movie is going to make your kids dumb. [Legally Unbound]
A previous Elie comment on people from other places.
@72 Or about the overt racism of AA and having groups rally around their race (except those evil whites) on every campus in the US?
Ohh wait, according to the kings of hypocrisy its only racist when white people do it…
@76 – well. I have heard it said that “racism” is prejudice plus power. So, yes, generally it is mostly the white folk who have the power. That doesn’t mean that the actions of minorities can’t also be bigoted or prejudiced.
If they had actually stuck pins in the eyes of LGBT students, that would be newsworthy. If they had locked the doors on an LGBT event from the outside and thrown molotov cocktails through the windows, that would be newsworthy.
Putting up some seemingly incoherant posters and sticking pins in a corkboard are NOT newsworthy.
75:
Mississippi ranked number 49 on the “Best Educated” Index, 49th in “Library Visits per Capita,” 49th in “Bachelors Degree or Higher” and in the absolute bottom of almost every Education statistic, according to StateMaster.com.
Just because a state or region has a negative stereotype that Elie mentions doesn’t mean that the stereotype is untrue or not warranted.
Dumb Country Law Students Association pwned.
“@72 Or about the overt racism of AA and having groups rally around their race (except those evil whites) on every campus in the US?”
Whites do that too – they’re called Tea Parties.
Yes. No doubt Mississippians are undereducated compared to the US as a whole. That does not mean that they are “dumb” (or stupid, as I assume Elie meant to say) — only that they are undereducated. For instance, Helen Keller (who actually was dumb) was vastly undereducated in her youth but she was brilliant. Once she was educated, she far surpassed most hearing and speaking persons. No?
82 – you are right. Mississippi is a vast undiscovered state of very intelligent but under-educated citizens. If only there were a way to educate these people – surely cancer would have been cured long before now.
@83 – thanks for they sarcasm, it always brightens my day. But no – that isn’t what I was saying at all, as you know. But I would argue that the percentage of stupid people in Mississippi, while probably high, is no higher than the percentage of stupid people in the population in general. And the truth is — if we were to educate all of the undereducated people in the US (including those in the Bronx and Peabody, Mass., then perhaps cancer would be cured. We spend a great deal of money educating people with precious little in the way of raw talent.
75: Do you actually want to take the angle that statistics about education may be used to justify stereotypes? It may lead to logical conclusions that you are uncomfortable with.
79 – “Just because a state or region has a negative stereotype that Elie mentions doesn’t mean that the stereotype is untrue or not warranted.”
Substitute “race” for “a state or region” and you can see why using a stereo type, even one that can be supported with statistical evidence, can be offensive.
@85 – I’m pretty sure I didn’t say that. Are you sure that you’re reading my post? — 75
83,
Perhaps Mississippi ranks so low is that it is POOR! I am talking ramshackle tin huts for houses poor (as are parts of Louisana, Arkansas, and Alabama). Have you ever been there? Driving through or spending some time down there would give you a much better appreciation for the things you had in whatever fuckhole douchtastic Northeastern place you grew up.
-A damn Yankee in the know
Identity of anti-Mormon/LGBT sympathizer being revealed as the perpetrator of yet another hoax (and the story being quietly swept under the rug) in 3, 2, 1…
Wow, the teabaggers are out in force today. 9/11 was a liberal conspiracy as well, you know. As was two terms of W.
Oh, and black people are racist for making jokes about unsophisticated rural folks (as most teabaggers self-identify).
- 90.
86 – “Just because a given race has a negative stereotype doesn’t mean it’s untrue or unwarranted.” What exactly is offensive about that? It’s not offensive; it’s largely a truism. Steretotypes, as they say, exist for a reason.
91,
Sad, but when white people make jokes about unsophisticated urban folks (as most black people identify), they are considered racist. There’s two sides to that coin.
Personally, I don’t believe either of those two circumstances exhibit racism….just saying. It’s calling a duck a duck, whether that duck is a redneck or a ghetto rat.
Couldn’t they just put up hidden cameras until they catch them?
93 – Can we just agree it’s OK to make fun of unsophisticated folk, without regard to geography or race?
- 91
92 – What is offensive about stereotypes is that their purveyors rarely admit that they are stereotypes. You hear “Mississippians are stupid,” or “Black people are [fill in the blank].” You don’t hear “Some Mississippians are stupid” or the like. Stereotypes are both overinclusive and underinclusive – and therefore they’re useless other than as bait. Sure – some Mississippians are stupid. Some New Yorkers are stupid also. Stating that Mississippians are stupid doesn’t include all the stupid people and includes many people who are not. How is that helpful to any informed, intelligent discussion?
95,
Yes. That was the gist of my post…I was just pointing out to you that people on both sides cry racism in regards to your post at 91.
Sounds good. Have a nice night.
@ 54: If it makes you feel better to pick a random tier 3 or 4 school and yell about how I must have graduated from that school, knock yourself out.
However, I repeat — though I will try to use small words so that you can understand — a reference to “yokel” does not imply all or most Idahoans are ignorant, toothless, etc. It seemed pretty clear to me Elie was making a point that he hopes this act is something *uncommon* to the school and the area — that area being Idaho, in case you missed it. To get up in arms that he’s calling all Idahoans these names is silly.
@96
So what is your point?
The purveyors of stereotypes don’t admit they are stereotypes because it’s obvious to anyone with half a brain that people frequently speak in general terms.
For example, if I said “basketball players are tall.” It doesn’t mean that I think they every basketball player in history is tall, and no one would take it that way. It just means that on average basketball players are taller than the rest of use. Imagine how tedious conversation would be if every statement had to be qualified.
Stereotypes are useful for informed intelligent discussion because they convey a lot of accurate information, especially the kind you and your ilk like to sweep under the carpet. If anyone listened to people like you, they would think that the middle of the ghetto would have the best society and schools in the world because of all the wonderful diversity. Fortunately the stereotype is that ghettos are violent shit holes with awful schools. So except for some terminally stupid libs no one would actually voluntarily move there.
Wow, poor reading comprehension on this site today.
People, it’s not just pins in the eyeballs of posters. Read the *whole* post, and then comment, mmk? The problem is that flyers explicitly containing violent threats were hung at the school as well.
You can still argue that this is a hoax, of course. But if so it is a hoax that involves actual threats. Read the article next time.
@99 — very nice. Now I see what a truly intelligent person is capable of. I’m humbled by the depth and breadth of your grasp of all that is true and good. Thanks.
@100
Your retarded. Next time try a better scam.
99 – Unfortunately the ghettos are rarely if ever diverse, contrary to your apparent belief and present assertions.
CHECK YOU DICTIONARY DEFINITION OF A GHETTO, AS WELL AS YOU REALITY OF INNER CITY LIFE
@101
Defeated by logic they trudge to the sarcasm department…
bye bye!
Logic? Was that logic? I thought it was vitriol. My mistake.
Steretotypes aren’t just dreamt up out of nowhere. A disproportionately large number of Jews are cheap; a disproportionately large number of Irish are drunks; a disproportionately large number of South Asians don’t bathe; a disproportionately large number of gays like Lady Gaga. They’re not arbitrarily assigned positive or negative attributes; they’re not supposed to be universal to every member of the group; they just happen to be true.
@103 I’m talking about the modern definition of diversity which simply means NAMs. It has nothing to do with real diversity.
107 – No it doesn’t, which I suppose is terribly inconvenient for your credibility. No one who advocates diversity in the workplace is talking about only hiring minorities. No college diversity plan calls for only admitting minorities. Only in your cramped teabagging mind does diversity = minorities.
- 103
Those LGBT kids aren’t even good enough for Cooley in my book.
So, the idiot posters here are just convinced that it’s gays or gay friendly people doing this without any evidence. At all.
Makes me want to punch a Mormon and shout anti-LDS stuff at him. Because I’m sure y’all claim it was just another Mormon. Because they are all like that. *snort*
– Lawyer Gay (looking for Mormons)
I love being a Mormon. I am truly happy. I wake up every day and feel great. I have a beautiful wife, loving parents, lots of automatic friends whereever I go.
People should think harder about the mormon life. Get to know some mormons. Examine how they live. Ask them questions about their faith. You may be surprised. Among lawyers, you’ll find lots of bitter ex-mormons who couldn’t stand the cognative dissonance in law school and cratered to the idea that they were shamefully unprogressive, etc. But if you look at current LDS teachings and lifestyle, you find other-directed, happy people.
I have questions, of course, about how to square all the doctrines taught over the years. But I’ve tried the other routes, and they never bring as much happiness as following the church’s teachings. Mock away.
HYS LDS secure
“So, the idiot posters here are just convinced that it’s gays or gay friendly people doing this without any evidence. At all.”
The idiot is the one that assumes automatically that isn’t a hoax without any evidence, given the numerous instances of campus “hate hoaxes” in the past (some more notorious than others). It doesn’t take a “teabagger” to not jump to conclusions, like many so called liberals (in reality they are just morons) did in the Duke lacrosse hate-rape hoax.
111 – that’s great that you are happy and I would never want to discredit someone’s faith, especially if its bringing you happiness.
However, I think the outcome is a bit different if you speak to someone trying to openly and honestly live their life within the Mormon church if they also happen to have had the fortune to be born as a gay man or woman.
Also, as a gay man who was not born a Mormon, I take significant issue with the Mormon church’s role in Proposition 8.
True story:
Back in the 80s, the women’s volleyball coach was fired during mid-season because she was discriminating against the straight women players. If you weren’t a lesbian, you didn’t make the travelling team.
During parents weekend, a player’s dad noticed that her daughter was much better than some of the girls that played most of the time. When questioned, his daughter finally told him it was because she wasn’t a lesbian. Dad went directly to the President of the U of Idaho and the coach was gone by close of business the following Monday.
112 – I think its a safe assumption that the number if incidences of actual hate speech directed at gays and lesbians in this country is far, far higher than the number of “hate hoaxes”.
So, please provide some evidence that this case is a “hoax”. In the absence thereof, lets assume that this incident follows the (vast) majority of cases and not the (vast) minority. Cool?
101,
Intelligent people do not end sentences with a preposition. Thank you. Goodbye.
113,
I’m not a Mormon and believe it is a cult.
On the other hand, why do you have a problem with the Mormon’s participating in the political process regarding Prop 8.
Why can’t the Mormon church not also have “significant isues” with the pro-homosexual groups’ involvement with Prop. 8, or do only homosexuals have political rights?
Dear Idaho Law morons with pushpins and flyers,
Please stop embarassing the rest of us. That is all.
Love,
Idaho Alum
116,
Have you ever listened to an Obama speech? Based on your standard, Obama is really stupid.
117 – the pro-gay rights groups do not classify themselves as a church and, thus, receive tax exempt status for federal tax purposes.
@108
Fine, define “diversity.”
Section 501(c)(3) of US Code Title 26, which governs tax-exempt organizations, reads”
(3) …no substantial part of the activities of which is carrying on propaganda, or otherwise attempting, to influence legislation
@ 122 – agreed.
SALT LAKE CITY 30 June 2008 The following letter was sent from the First Presidency of The Church of Jesus
Christ of Latter-day Saints to Church leaders in California to be read to all congregations on 29 June 2008:
_____
A broad-based coalition of churches and other organizations placed the proposed amendment on the ballot. The Church will participate with this coalition in seeking its passage. Local Church leaders will provide information about how you may
become involved in this important cause.
@122
Like ACORN?
Big fucking deal.
Every fucking billboard at every train stop in every city of the U.S. has people with their eyes “gouged” out. Some of them even have fake moustaches! Or their teeth “punched” out by coloring them with a black marker.
Call the ACLU!!!
Ls, Gs, Bs, and Ts,
This situation is similar to one that I encounter everytime I am on the road and I have to take a dump and the only place to stop is a foul gas station:
When I read on the bathroom wall that another man wants to pleasure me orally while I poop, did an actual gay man write his desire on the wall? Did a straight man write it to mock gay men? Was a gay man writing something that wasn’t actually his desire to raise awareness that gay people do, in fact, exist?
Please advise.
- Bathroom Stall Confused
122 – You have to read subsection (h); the rule isn’t so simple.
And do we really want government deciding which churches are “worthy” of tax-exempt status based on political winds?
113 = flame. No one has the fortune to be born a gay adult.
122
This is definitely not my legal area of strength but I do know how to look up and read a statute, so I thought I would post the rest of the statute that you “overlooked.”
(h) Expenditures by public charities to influence legislation.–
(1) General rule.–In the case of an organization to which this subsection applies, exemption from taxation under subsection (a) shall be denied because a substantial part of the activities of such organization consists of carrying on propaganda, or otherwise attempting, to influence legislation, but only if such organization normally–
(A) makes lobbying expenditures in excess of the lobbying ceiling amount for such organization for each taxable year, or
(B) makes grass roots expenditures in excess of the grass roots ceiling amount for such organization for each taxable year.
I left out the definitions section to avoid taking up too much room. Suffice it to say it is a little more complicated then you originally inferred.
119,
I’m talking about writing.
To 122 and anyone else claiming that the Mormon church somehow has violated its 501(c)(3) status, I suggest that you learn how to read a statute.
I tried to preview but accidentally hit post. I apologize for the missing comma and for using “then” instead of “than.”
@122 and @123:
Notice that Section 501(c)(3) of US Code Title 26, which you quote, reads: ” no *substantial part* of the activities of which is carrying on propaganda, or otherwise attempting, to influence legislation.”
I actually practice in this area of the law (though simple statutory interpretation goes a long way). The key to Section 501(c)(3) is the word substantial. Tax exempt charities can “carry[] on propaganda” and “attempt[] to influence legislation” so long as it is not a “substantial part” of the organization’s activities. The money the LDS Church spent on Prop. 8 is a drop in the bucket compared to their charitable activities, thus they do not risk losing their 501(c)(3) status.
As a side note, a huge majority of 501(c)(3) institutions (including every major church, and, yes groups like ACORN) advocate or attempt to influence legislation. This is a major practice area for lawyers who do 501(c)(3) work. You have no idea what you’re talking about.
133 = Game. Set. Match.
130,
Why are you making excuses for Obama’s verbal use of the English language. What is the difference in ending an oral statement with a prepososition and a written statement doing the same?
If Obama is a fair example of the quality produced by Harvard Law School, only a Harvard Law alumnae would hire its graduates.
120,
Reread your post. It’s written with less clarity than Elie’s writings. On the other hand, you may be Elie.
117
Really, Elie, you take pins in the eyes of a poster as a threat to stab out the eyes of gay black dudes?
Very Al Sharpton-esque, Elie …
120, I’m not sure that your argument has anything to do with the 501(c)(3) requirements. No, I take that back. I am sure that your argument has nothing to do with the 501(c)(3) requirements.
113 is gay.
135: your argument is bogus, because you refer to alumnae (the feminine form). obviously no woman would ever be trusted with the responsibility to hire/fire.
What percentage of these have turned out to be hoaxes? 99.99%? Or is it only 95%?
just think — all of the energy of writing this post, the comments, and all the effort of the school and law enforcement could have been avoided with one of those boards COVERED IN PLEXIGLASS WITH A KEY LOCK — come on people — stop chasing problems and think ahead to prevent them
@140 Shh! You know how much liberals hate reality! You’re going to confuse them with facts.
Guys in my high school used to deface posters all the time. It was no big deal.
This is ridiculous. The school and Elie are giving these idiots exactly what they want, which is attention. And I wouldn’t hold my breath on seeing them kicked out. After all, SIU gave Matt Hale a degree.
The biggest hate-mongers at UC Berkeley School of Law were and probably still are the homosexual advocacy groups. They protested during classes, defaced bulletin boards, harrassed the JAG recruiters, etc. Why no media love/hate for them?
I check this board maybe once a month, but I’m always surprised to see the level of hatred and ignorance out there from those who defend hate speech against gays. Sure there’s a constitutional right to disseminate some form of hateful speech, but that doesn’t make it right or good for society (and indeed, if it incites violence, it may not even be legal).
What if it had been push-pins in the eyes of black or hispanic students (also largely despised minorities in Idaho)? Or Jews? Would you blame those groups there as well rather than the people who are defacing their photos? To infer that this incident means that a minority is somehow responsible for inciting violence against them is a dangerous position.
Let’s stop blaming the victim, and focus on respecting the rights of others to maximize their full potential, whether gay or straight.
What? I post a comment as an actual Mormon U of I grad and it gets deleted? Apparently ATL only wants commentary from people who have no actual insight or experience.
I graduated from there in 1987. What's amazing to me is that this writer uses a lot of hyperbole and assumes some facts — but making something sensational often requires that kind of writing. My experience back then was that it was undergrads coming into the building who did this sort of silliness. They were mainly religious zealots and homophobes although there were incidents of liberal extremists as well. The student body requested better access control but the administration didn't like that so things continued every so often depending on the season. I'm not surprised the current administration didn't have the sense to spend a few dollars to get some hallway security cameras up. Evidence obtained, convictions sought, problem solved.
You must be an idiot from University of Idaho or Western State University College of Law. If you have affiliations with both, may God help you.