3 Questions For An IP Lawyer Turned MBA

If you are willing to invest in yourself, anything is possible.

David Saenz (screenshot via CoInspire/YouTube)

Sometimes, the happiest lawyers are those who are no longer actively practicing law. It is not often that you hear of an IP litigator who left a Biglaw partnership for business school, and is now an C-level executive at a highly regarded company. Because of the relatively small number of IP litigators I am aware of who have transitioned to the start-up world, I thought it would be interesting to hear from a former colleague who is in the midst of that experience. To that end, I conducted a written interview with David Saenz, the COO of an urban delivery technologies company called Stuart, who graciously agreed to share his perspectives for this column. On top of his astute observations, I offer my brief reactions to his statements below his answers (in brackets).

As background, David and I were colleagues and friends at Greenberg Traurig in New York City. Even though David was more of a trademark and copyright litigator, I was fortunate to work with him on some patent matters, and was likewise fortunate to have had the opportunity to help on some of his trademark and copyright matters. As contemporaries (and Lawyer’s League basketball teammates), we shared many of the same experiences, from being elevated to shareholder (David in 2008, myself in 2009) and starting to build our own respective client bases on top of the institutional clients we serviced. David shared my enthusiasm for clean technology innovation, and was one of the first IP lawyers accredited as a LEED Green Associate.

While his legal career was as promising as they come, David eventually decided to migrate to the business side, moving to London to attend London Business School. After taking his MBA, he co-founded and was CEO of Uncover, a reservations and mobile payments platform that was named a Top 10 app of 2015 by Apple and was acquired by Velocity Mobile. He then joined Stuart as Chief Operating Officer to run their logistics technology platform, which he grew quickly throughout France, the U.K. and Spain. Stuart was acquired by international delivery conglomerate GeoPost in March 2017, and David is now focused on scaling the business across Europe.

Immediately below are my written questions and David’s answers:

GK: You left a partner position at a leading international firm to go to business school. What skills from your life as an IP lawyer translated well in that transition?

DS: IP comes into play a fair bit in my day to day world, from licensing our technology to co-marketing ventures with partners that involve using each other’s trademarks. Having a high level of familiarity with how these deals are structured allows me to get through the contract process much faster, and focus instead on execution and value creation.

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[GK: Because David is a former first-chair trademark and copyright litigator, who I personally worked with on matters for some of the world’s leading brands, I am not surprised that he adds major value in licensing and related trademark matters for Stuart. A good litigator understands that the best disputes are the ones you avoid getting into in the first place, and working at a technology start-up surely presents ample opportunity for David to exhibit his legal judgment — on top of the skills he developed through his business school education and subsequent jobs.]

GK: Since business school, you have been involved with a number of ventures. Your current venture, Stuart, is focused on solving a real-world challenge — getting goods through cities faster. What is most exciting about being on the business side of things, and how has your legal training impacted your relationships with vendors, including your own legal counsel?

DS: Although I loved my practice, I left the law after 12 years because I felt I was counseling from the sidelines rather than jumping in the fray directly. The best part of being on the business side is that I can build something from scratch that is enduring, solves real challenges, and is valued by customers.
As for my relationship with legal counsel, they likely find me quite aggravating as I’m always correcting their work! Joking aside, our conversations are very efficient and to the point; because I understand the legal frameworks underlying any issues that arise, we can focus on finding solutions.

[GK: David’s frustration at the limitations of legal practice, even for someone who was a first-chair IP litigator with a robust and diverse mix of matters, will likely ring true for many readers. Even busy lawyers must sometime ask themselves if the full range of their abilities are being put to work at any given point in their career. This can be a bit of a moving target, considering how inefficient the legal market sometimes is in terms of matching lawyers with the appropriate depth and volume of interesting legal matters at any given point of their career. As to David’s relationship with Stuart’s outside counsel, I think the key point is that lawyers should always appreciate an engaged and cooperative client, which is extra important for those who counsel start-ups and other cost-sensitive legal services customers.]

GK: What advice can you offer to young IP lawyers thinking about making a similar transition from law firm practice to the start-up world?

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DS: Young attorneys can feel pigeonholed when looking to transition to the business side, but a lot of the skills that we develop as lawyers are crucial to business success. To name but a few: negotiation, strategic thinking, business development, risk analysis, and attention to detail. Think about how to re-package the things you do every day as a lawyer and you will become an appealing candidate to companies looking for problem solvers who can get things done.

[GK: What is clear is that David’s investment in securing an MBA was an important move, on at least two levels. First, it allowed him to demonstrate his seriousness about pursuing a business career, and clearly would put the lie to any short-sighted business executives who would dismiss him as “just a lawyer.” Second, the experience of going through the MBA program likely demonstrated to David just where and how to put the skills he had acquired as an IP litigator to work. Any start-up could benefit from the addition of an experienced counselor to their staff, and I think David makes a keen observation on the importance of transitioning lawyers packaging themselves the right way to attract interest as a potential employee in the business world.]

My thanks to David for the insights and cooperation, and best wishes to both him and Stuart going forward. David’s experience shows that if you are willing to invest in yourself, anything is possible, even at a fairly advanced stage of your career. It is important to consider the perspectives of those who have left the practice of law for the business world, and I appreciate David’s willingness to share a bit about his experience. I am always open to conducting interviews of this type with other IP personalities, so feel free to reach out if you have a compelling perspective to offer.

Please feel free to send comments or questions to me at gkroub@kskiplaw.com or via Twitter: @gkroub. Any topic suggestions or thoughts are most welcome.


Gaston Kroub lives in Brooklyn and is a founding partner of Kroub, Silbersher & Kolmykov PLLC, an intellectual property litigation boutique, and Markman Advisors LLC, a leading consultancy on patent issues for the investment community. Gaston’s practice focuses on intellectual property litigation and related counseling, with a strong focus on patent matters. You can reach him at gkroub@kskiplaw.com or follow him on Twitter: @gkroub.