Podcasts

Relationships Over Sales: How Real Connections Build A Legal Practice

Jason Stiehl, a partner at Crowell & Moring, joins the 'Be That Lawyer' podcast.

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In a recent conversation with Jason Stiehl, a partner at Crowell & Moring focused on class action defense, we explored what it actually takes to move from overworked service partner to trusted rainmaker, without it ever feeling like selling.

What Jason shared wasn’t a polished success story. It was an honest account of a strategy that evolved through trial, error, and a major career misstep, one that ultimately reshaped how he thinks about building a practice.

From Hunting Targets to Building a Holistic Practice

When Jason first arrived at a firm that supported his business development, he didn’t walk in with a rigid plan. He had a general direction: focus on food and beverage work in the class action space, an area where he genuinely enjoyed both the clients and the law itself.

From there, he leaned into conferences, getting to know in-house counsel and even his competitors, studying how they had grown their own practices. The shift, he explained, was moving away from a mindset of identifying a target and going out to “hunt for it and kill it.” That approach was failing. What worked instead was a more holistic, relationship-driven way of operating.

Why Podcasts Are an Underused Goldmine for Lawyers

Jason sees podcasts the way he sees speaking engagements: a chance to reach new audiences instead of repeating the same conference circuit year after year.

His point was direct: if your audience stays the same, your practice never grows. Podcasts widen the pool in two important ways. In-house counsel listen to get a sense of the personalities behind the lawyers they’re considering working with, and colleagues, even competitors, listen too. As Jason put it, colleagues often refer more business than anyone else, which makes visibility among peers just as valuable as visibility among prospects.

The Firm Move That Taught Him the Most

Not every part of building a career goes smoothly, and Jason was candid about one decision he got wrong. Leaving a previous firm, he said, was a mistake made for the wrong reasons: chasing growth he hadn’t properly researched and money that ultimately didn’t matter as much as he thought.

What Real Business Development Actually Looks Like

Across all three stories, a consistent theme emerges: business development that lasts isn’t built on aggressive targeting or one-off networking sprints. It’s built on genuine relationships, honest self-assessment, and a willingness to learn from missteps rather than hide them.

“You have to go to different markets,” Jason says. “You have to go to different people. You have to realize that
if the audience you’re reaching is the same all the time, you’re never going to grow.”


Steve Fretzin is a five-time bestselling author, host of the BE THAT LAWYER and Future Rainmakers podcasts, and a business development coach who works exclusively with attorneys. For more than 18 years, he has helped lawyers build strong books of business without selling, pitching, or chasing, using his proven Sales-Free Selling™ approach. His clients consistently become top rainmakers and credit his coaching and systems for driving meaningful, measurable growth. Steve can be reached directly at [email protected], or through his website at www.bethatlawyer.com. Connect with him on LinkedIn at https://www.linkedin.com/in/stevefretzin. His ALL NEW BE THAT LAWYER Community is changing how lawyers develop the skills never taught in law school. Learn more at www.bethatlawyer.com/community.